Car Forum / Acura Cars / October 2007
S2000 a $34K car ????
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userjohn - 10 Oct 2007 05:19 GMT I'm wondering:
what makes the S2000 a $34K car ???? It's a 4-banger with only 237 HP and for that price you don't even get Navigation. What gives ?
ACAR - 10 Oct 2007 12:19 GMT > I'm wondering: > > what makes the S2000 a $34K car ???? > It's a 4-banger with only 237 HP and for that price you don't even get > Navigation. > What gives ? Review S2000 sales figures. Notice that very few disagree with you. Although the S2000 is a lot more fun to drive than 237HP seems to indicate, Honda hasn't done much with the car since it's introduction and sales are in the dumpster.
camgere@earthlink.net - 10 Oct 2007 15:25 GMT > I'm wondering: > > what makes the S2000 a $34K car ???? > It's a 4-banger with only 237 HP and for that price you don't even get > Navigation. > What gives ? There are people who actually enjoy the thrill of driving. I think the modern word for them is "motorcyclist". It's obvious low inertia (weight) cars can be accelerated and turned faster. So small is good for performance. Public streets aren't race tracks anyway. You can only use so much horsepower. Try to keep a Z06 Corvette at redline in the twisties and you'll probably wreck in less than a mile. A Honda Civic is quite doable however. An S2000 has close to double the horsepower of the Civic.
Breaking marker, hit the brakes, double clutch downshift, Corner entry, get mostly off the brakes and trail brake up to the apex, get back slightly on the throttle out to corner exit, straighten the wheel and accelerate hard from the corner exit to the next braking marker upshifting as necessary. Next turn has a slight crest of hill, reduce the corner entry speed, move the corner entry a bit earlier, you want the car turned more than normal at the peak of the hill as you'll have less traction than normal, back on the throttle to corner exit and accelerate down the straight,
No brain power left over to think about nagging wives or obnoxious bosses. Nirvana!
Jim Yanik - 11 Oct 2007 01:45 GMT >> I'm wondering: >> [quoted text clipped - 11 lines] > Civic is quite doable however. An S2000 has close to double the > horsepower of the Civic. snip for brevity..
my local auto ads usually have several used S2000s for sale,but no last model Preludes.
 Signature Jim Yanik jyanik at kua.net
Gordon McGrew - 11 Oct 2007 00:36 GMT >I'm wondering: > >what makes the S2000 a $34K car ???? >It's a 4-banger with only 237 HP and for that price you don't even get >Navigation. >What gives ? It is a purpose-built sports car. It was never intended to sell in the volumes of a Civic or Accord and therefore the development costs are amortized over a much smaller number of vehicles.
Jim Yanik - 11 Oct 2007 01:46 GMT >>I'm wondering: >> [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > the volumes of a Civic or Accord and therefore the development costs > are amortized over a much smaller number of vehicles. OR,it's priced similar to the Porsche Boxster.(but not equivalent)
 Signature Jim Yanik jyanik at kua.net
Larry in AZ - 11 Oct 2007 07:27 GMT Waiving the right to remain silent, Jim Yanik <jyanik@abuse.gov> said:
>>>I'm wondering: >>> [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > > OR,it's priced similar to the Porsche Boxster.(but not equivalent) The Boxter's base price is $45,600. The S2000 is $34,300. Bit of a difference...
 Signature Larry J. - Remove spamtrap in ALLCAPS to e-mail
"A lack of common sense is now considered a disability, with all the privileges that this entails."
Jim Yanik - 11 Oct 2007 15:45 GMT > Waiving the right to remain silent, Jim Yanik <jyanik@abuse.gov> said: > [quoted text clipped - 13 lines] > The Boxter's base price is $45,600. The S2000 is $34,300. Bit of a > difference... well,of course,you would pay more for the PORSCHE name and quality.... [sarcasm]
plus the Boxster engine has more HP,doesn't it? (and it's a flat-6 cyl. gotta pay more for a 6 cyl.)
 Signature Jim Yanik jyanik at kua.net
tww1491 - 12 Oct 2007 23:19 GMT > I'm wondering: > > what makes the S2000 a $34K car ???? > It's a 4-banger with only 237 HP and for that price you don't even get > Navigation. > What gives ? I have wondered that about the Pontiac Soltices a local dealer advertises at a bargain 31k. If you want cheap fun the Civic Si coupe or sedan gives a lot of bang for the buck.
Jim Yanik - 13 Oct 2007 02:21 GMT >> I'm wondering: >> [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > advertises at a bargain 31k. If you want cheap fun the Civic Si coupe > or sedan gives a lot of bang for the buck. But not a drop-top.
how long will a Solstice hold up compared to the Honda? Hondas/Acuras have excellent reliability,and IMO,the domestic brands do not have such a good rep.
 Signature Jim Yanik jyanik at kua.net
tww1491 - 13 Oct 2007 03:54 GMT >>> I'm wondering: >>> [quoted text clipped - 13 lines] > not > have such a good rep. Actually, the Soltices I see just sit at the local GM dealer. As an old roadster type -- 1960 era -- Sunbeam Tiger, 64 XKE, MBG, TR4 -- and even a couple of early C3 Vettes, the S2000 fits the bill better for the money. I became a Honda fan in the 60s with a CL77 305 and later CB750 when they came out.
userjohn - 15 Oct 2007 02:33 GMT "tww1491"
> I became a Honda fan in the 60s with a CL77 305 and later CB750 when they > came out. wow hahaha ! I didn't even know the's Honda in the US in the 60s
Jim Yanik - 15 Oct 2007 03:02 GMT > "tww1491" >> I became a Honda fan in the 60s with a CL77 305 and later CB750 when >> they >> came out. > > wow hahaha ! I didn't even know the's Honda in the US in the 60s I think he's referring to motorcycles. AFAIK,the first Honda motorCAR in the US was the Honda 600. IIRC,followed by the Civic CVCC?
 Signature Jim Yanik jyanik at kua.net
tww1491 - 17 Oct 2007 00:20 GMT >> "tww1491" >>> I became a Honda fan in the 60s with a CL77 305 and later CB750 when [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > AFAIK,the first Honda motorCAR in the US was the Honda 600. > IIRC,followed by the Civic CVCC? Yes. Bought the 305 scrambler in Tokyo at Curly's by Yokota AB and rode it for the two year I was stationed there -- 67-69. Saw the 750 at the Tokyo Motor Show in Dec 68 and bought one in 1970 after I returned to the States. Honda bikes were bulletproof.
Jim Yanik - 17 Oct 2007 00:51 GMT >>> "tww1491" >>>> I became a Honda fan in the 60s with a CL77 305 and later CB750 [quoted text clipped - 11 lines] > at the Tokyo Motor Show in Dec 68 and bought one in 1970 after I > returned to the States. Honda bikes were bulletproof. Interestingly,Honda's motorcycle production moved to the US(Ohio),and that led to US production of Honda automobiles;non-union,and keeping high quality. The first Japanese cars built in America(including engines!).
 Signature Jim Yanik jyanik at kua.net
Larry in AZ - 17 Oct 2007 02:57 GMT >>> "tww1491" >>>> I became a Honda fan in the 60s with a CL77 305 and later CB750 when [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] >> AFAIK,the first Honda motorCAR in the US was the Honda 600. >> IIRC,followed by the Civic CVCC? My Honda AN-600...
http://www.flickr.com/photos/larrythefrog/477777904/
 Signature Larry J. - Remove spamtrap in ALLCAPS to e-mail
"A lack of common sense is now considered a disability, with all the privileges that this entails."
tww1491 - 18 Oct 2007 00:23 GMT >>>> "tww1491" >>>>> I became a Honda fan in the 60s with a CL77 305 and later CB750 when [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > > My Honda AN-600... When I was in Japan 67-69 Honda sold a very small roadster -- the S600 followed by the S800. It was chain driven with a DOHC 4 banger. A few folk autocrossed them but their competition generally was in the Datsun 1600 class, so they were'nt competitive. At the time, I ran a modified Sunbeam Tiger which produced around 220 hp out of its 260 cu in Ford V8. I ran in a class that included the Prince Skyline 2000 GT (later bought out by Datsun) and the modified Datsun 2000 roadsters. Austin Healeys just were not competitive as I recollect.
> http://www.flickr.com/photos/larrythefrog/477777904/ Larry in AZ - 18 Oct 2007 00:50 GMT Waiving the right to remain silent, "tww1491" <twaugh5@cox.net> said:
>>>>> "tww1491" >>>>>> I became a Honda fan in the 60s with a CL77 305 and later CB750 [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > When I was in Japan 67-69 Honda sold a very small roadster -- the S600 > followed by the S800. It was chain driven with a DOHC 4 banger. My AN-600 was two cylinders, 598cc, to be exact. IIRC, it was essentially a motorcycle engine. In Japan, the car was chain drive, but that wasn't approved for export to the US, and the car had to wait for a real transmission.
It probably still stands as one of the highest mileage cars ever seen here. It routinely got 50-55 mpg. On a bad day it got 45 mpg.
It would easily do 80 mph on a straight road - 90 or better, downhill with a good tail wind. ;-)
 Signature Larry J. - Remove spamtrap in ALLCAPS to e-mail
"A lack of common sense is now considered a disability, with all the privileges that this entails."
tww1491 - 18 Oct 2007 02:21 GMT > Waiving the right to remain silent, "tww1491" <twaugh5@cox.net> said: > [quoted text clipped - 23 lines] > It would easily do 80 mph on a straight road - 90 or better, downhill with > a good tail wind. ;-) Most people underestimated Hondas in those days.
Larry in AZ - 18 Oct 2007 19:53 GMT Waiving the right to remain silent, "tww1491" <twaugh5@cox.net> said:
>> My AN-600 was two cylinders, 598cc, to be exact. IIRC, it was essentially >> a motorcycle engine. In Japan, the car was chain drive, but that wasn't [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] >> > Most people underestimated Hondas in those days. Most people hadn't heard of Honda cars in those days...
 Signature Larry J. - Remove spamtrap in ALLCAPS to e-mail
"A lack of common sense is now considered a disability, with all the privileges that this entails."
Gordon McGrew - 18 Oct 2007 23:59 GMT >Waiving the right to remain silent, "tww1491" <twaugh5@cox.net> said: > [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] > >Most people hadn't heard of Honda cars in those days... They had certainly heard of Honda motorcycles. I know my '74 Civic surprised a lot of people driving the modestly powered cars of the day. In a drag race it could easily smoke those MG roadsters and most anything that passed as an economy car.
Larry in AZ - 19 Oct 2007 00:21 GMT Waiving the right to remain silent, Gordon McGrew <gmcgrew@mindspring.com> said:
>>Waiving the right to remain silent, "tww1491" <twaugh5@cox.net> said: >> [quoted text clipped - 17 lines] > day. In a drag race it could easily smoke those MG roadsters and most > anything that passed as an economy car. I also had a 74 Civic, right after the 71 AN-600. By then, Hondas were everywhere.
In the summer of 72, I towed the 600 across the US from LA to Cape Cod. We spent a lot of time explaining to the locals everywhere along the trip what it was.
 Signature Larry J. - Remove spamtrap in ALLCAPS to e-mail
"A lack of common sense is now considered a disability, with all the privileges that this entails."
tww1491 - 19 Oct 2007 23:18 GMT >>Waiving the right to remain silent, "tww1491" <twaugh5@cox.net> said: >> [quoted text clipped - 20 lines] > day. In a drag race it could easily smoke those MG roadsters and most > anything that passed as an economy car. When I returned from Japan in 1969, I sold my 305 and bought the new 350 (325cc) scambler which I shipped to the US. Recollect the redline was around 9k or so. Rode with a bunch of big bike drivers (Nortons, Hogs and and so forth) in San Antonio, who were constantly surprised by this screaming "tiddler" that could keep up with them and even do around 100 mph. They could understand how it stayed together. The CB 750 (later owned) was amazing for the time. A mc mag tested one when they came out by riding it coast to coast -- without any breakdowns and just a couple of chain adjustments -- an amazing feat for the time for a bike. As I said, Honda made its rep on motorcycles which laid the way for their cars. I also had a Triumph Bonneville for about a year before it was stolen (circa 1970) -- two hours of maintenance for every hour on the road and remember to tape spare cables to your handlebars because you'll need em.
Gordon McGrew - 18 Oct 2007 23:55 GMT >Waiving the right to remain silent, "tww1491" <twaugh5@cox.net> said: > [quoted text clipped - 17 lines] >approved for export to the US, and the car had to wait for a real >transmission. I have a chilton manual that I bought for my '74 Civic. It covers the Civic and the 600s. The drive shaft of the engine drives the transmission shaft via two(?) internal chains. (I am going on memory but this is obviously a feature I noted.)
>It probably still stands as one of the highest mileage cars ever seen >here. It routinely got 50-55 mpg. On a bad day it got 45 mpg. > >It would easily do 80 mph on a straight road - 90 or better, downhill with >a good tail wind. ;-) duckbill - 18 Oct 2007 02:55 GMT I think it's a bargain when you can spend over 30K for a Hyundai. I know of cases where new S2000's have sold for under 30k. I purchased my 05 with 8k miles from a local Honda dealership certified with a free extended warranty up to 7 years and 100,000 miles on the power train from the date of the original sale. I had over a year remaining on the original 3 year warranty and that was bumped to two years as part of the certification process. The car is sheer joy to drive and feels like it has a turbo when you get into the Vtech range between 6 and 8k. Top speed for this "4 wheel superbike" is around 150 mph. The biggest challange is to keep it under the police radar. Gas milage for me in the past 2000 miles is 23 around town and 32.5 highway. Zero to 60 is in the 5 sec. range. I'm told it has the most powerful engine (non-turbo) for it's size in the world (2.2 liter). I came close to purchasing an RX-8 with milage in the mid teens. My local Mazda Dealer told me of all the engine flooding problems, the $50 spark plugs x4, and all the engine replacements for all sorts of reasons. Lastly, many dealers will not let you test drive an S2000 for fear that you will accidently select the wrong gear and damage the engine by severly over reveing it. I have done that a few times but I was way under redline so no harm done. I am getting much better. The 2.2 liter does not need to be downshifted to pass cars on the highway. I am so impressed with this little roadster. And, I don't believe Honda makes money on this car!
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Jim Yanik - 18 Oct 2007 03:56 GMT > Lastly, many dealers will not let you test drive an S2000 for > fear that you will accidently select the wrong gear and damage the [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > I am so impressed with this little roadster. And, I don't believe > Honda makes money on this car! If a dealer will not let me test drive a car,I will not buy anything from them,and go to another dealer.
 Signature Jim Yanik jyanik at kua.net
Gordon McGrew - 19 Oct 2007 00:02 GMT >I think it's a bargain when you can spend over 30K for a Hyundai. I know >of cases where new S2000's have sold for under 30k. I purchased my 05 [quoted text clipped - 17 lines] >to be downshifted to pass cars on the highway. I am so impressed with >this little roadster. And, I don't believe Honda makes money on this car! So... how much did you pay?
I would love to buy one of them.
duckbill - 21 Oct 2007 17:31 GMT First, my previous comment of getting one for under $30k new may be BS. Apperently someone on another web site claimed he could but was never able to back it up with any documentation. How much did I pay? Oh well, I paid the dealer $1,000 less than he wanted, and yet still paid $1,000 more than I wanted (paid $26,995). There were two other people wanting to look at the car. It had no dings or dents......and looked as if it had never been driven....and that was before it was detailed. In 05, the total factory warranty was 3 years, 36k. Buying it from a dealer gave me peace of mind with Honda's Certified 7 year (5 years left) 100,000 mile power train warranty and 2 years or 40,000 miles left on everything else. The car was manufactured in Japan in June 05 and sold in Aug of 05. It was less than 2 years old and it was the last year with the real throttle cable. Some of the 06's are having hesitation problems with their DBW. For some very interesting and detailed comments on the S2000, go to www.s2ki.com; cheers.
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Gordon McGrew - 21 Oct 2007 21:40 GMT >First, my previous comment of getting one for under $30k new may be BS. >Apperently someone on another web site claimed he could but was never able [quoted text clipped - 11 lines] >interesting and detailed comments on the S2000, go to www.s2ki.com; >cheers. Thanks for the info. I think 2005 was the last year for the 9000rpm 2 liter engine which is a plus in my mind as well. Enjoy your S2000.
Tom Simchak - 22 Oct 2007 16:10 GMT >> First, my previous comment of getting one for under $30k new may be BS. >> Apperently someone on another web site claimed he could but was never able [quoted text clipped - 14 lines] > Thanks for the info. I think 2005 was the last year for the 9000rpm 2 > liter engine which is a plus in my mind as well. Enjoy your S2000. Actually, the '05 had the 2.2 liter engine. Red line was either 8000 or 8500. I had one, but don't recall the red line.
Tom S. Houston, TX
duckbill - 23 Oct 2007 00:44 GMT Starting in 04, Honda incresed the diplacement about 10 percent which helped improve low end torque and power which I like. Redline is now 8K, (versus 9K with the older models). It has an 8.2K cut out. Peak horsepower remained the same overall. I'm told people used to pay way over list for the S when it first came out, no more of course. It has gotten me off my motorcycle....with the top down I get the same enjoyment, but know I'm a lot safer. Side impact without airbags is 5 star. Honda did it right...lots of the S crowd want more Horsepower, etc. Me. I'm very satisfied as is.
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