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Car Forum / Alfa Romeo Cars / October 2005

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Contaminated fuel in  156 JTD 20V

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Bill - 15 Oct 2005 21:28 GMT
Guys

Go easy on me.

Decided to fill the cage prior to a run to the Airport tomorrow. Got 20
litres worth in the tank before I realised it was unleaded. Realising what
I'd done I filled the rest of the tank with diesel. Reckon I've got maybe
30% unleaded and 70% diesel in the Alfa 156's tank.
There must be someone on here done the same so whats likely to happen, will
I get away with running it or is it a drain the tank job and eat humble pie.
Catman - 15 Oct 2005 21:35 GMT
> Guys
>
[quoted text clipped - 7 lines]
> will I get away with running it or is it a drain the tank job and eat
> humble pie.

Normal advice is stop *now*

The fuel pump needs the lubrication from diesel fuel and will be buggered if
it gets just unleaded.

Now bearing in mind that I've partekn of the fruit of the vine this evening:

Diesel is heavier than petrol so you're probably OK for a *while* But IIWY
I'd be calling the AA or whatever before I went anywhere........
Signature

Catman MIB#14 SKoGA#6 TEAR#4 BOTAFOF#38 Apostle#21 COSOC#3
Tyger, Tyger Burning Bright (Remove rust to reply)
Alfa 116 Giulietta 3.0l (Really) Sprint 1.7 156 TS S2
Triumph Speed Triple: Black with extra black bits
www.cuore-sportivo.co.uk

Bill - 15 Oct 2005 22:22 GMT
OK your advice is taken
After some more research around the net the consensus seems to be that the
fuel pump is definitely at risk due to lubrication issues.

Plan A
Drain the tank and then refill with diesel. With this in mind how do I drain
the tank other than in the time old fashion of siphoning it.
Secondly is any residual fuel left in the lines going to be an issue?

Plan B
Let my local Alfa specialist do it

What say you people?

>> Guys
>>
[quoted text clipped - 20 lines]
> Diesel is heavier than petrol so you're probably OK for a *while* But IIWY
> I'd be calling the AA or whatever before I went anywhere........
alfistagj - 16 Oct 2005 00:48 GMT
Take a taxi to the airport!
Signature

Ciao from The Netherlands
alfistagj (aka Gert-Jan)
GT 2.0 (2005)
Montreal (1973/4)

> OK your advice is taken
> After some more research around the net the consensus seems to be that the
[quoted text clipped - 36 lines]
>> IIWY
>> I'd be calling the AA or whatever before I went anywhere........
Catman - 16 Oct 2005 09:52 GMT
> OK your advice is taken
> After some more research around the net the consensus seems to be that the
[quoted text clipped - 7 lines]
> Plan B
> Let my local Alfa specialist do it

If it was *my* engine, I'd be taking column 'B'

C
> What say you people?
>
[quoted text clipped - 28 lines]
>> Triumph Speed Triple: Black with extra black bits
>> www.cuore-sportivo.co.uk

Signature

Catman MIB#14 SKoGA#6 TEAR#4 BOTAFOF#38 Apostle#21 COSOC#3
Tyger, Tyger Burning Bright (Remove rust to reply)
Alfa 116 Giulietta 3.0l (Really) Sprint 1.7 156 TS S2
Triumph Speed Triple: Black with extra black bits
www.cuore-sportivo.co.uk

Tony Rickard - 16 Oct 2005 11:51 GMT
> OK your advice is taken
> After some more research around the net the consensus seems to be that the
[quoted text clipped - 9 lines]
>
> What say you people?

Without wishing to scare you read this:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/motoring/main.jhtml?xml=/motoring/2005/08/27/mfdies27.xml

A guy at work did the same with his Audi and had it trailered from the
station to the Audi dealers to drain and flush it out.

Though as you had only part filled it then it may not be as severe as
the article suggests

Cheers
Tony
Bill - 16 Oct 2005 14:03 GMT
> Without wishing to scare you read this:
>
> http://www.telegraph.co.uk/motoring/main.jhtml?xml=/motoring/2005/08/27/mfdies27.xml

Yeah I read that before I posted to the group. Scary stuff.

If luck is on my side and as the tank was already quarter full of diesel
before I added  the petrol, the lines and injection system may have had
enough diesel in to 'get me home' before the contaminated fuel worked its
way through.

Time will tell no doubt :(

> A guy at work did the same with his Audi and had it trailered from the
> station to the Audi dealers to drain and flush it out.
[quoted text clipped - 4 lines]
> Cheers
> Tony
Catman - 16 Oct 2005 18:34 GMT
>> Without wishing to scare you read this:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/motoring/main.jhtml?xml=/motoring/2005/08/27/mfdies27.xml

> Yeah I read that before I posted to the group. Scary stuff.
>
[quoted text clipped - 4 lines]
>
> Time will tell no doubt :(

Petrol floats on diesel, so fingers crossed

>> A guy at work did the same with his Audi and had it trailered from the
>> station to the Audi dealers to drain and flush it out.
[quoted text clipped - 4 lines]
>> Cheers
>> Tony

Signature

Catman MIB#14 SKoGA#6 TEAR#4 BOTAFOF#38 Apostle#21 COSOC#3
Tyger, Tyger Burning Bright (Remove rust to reply)
Alfa 116 Giulietta 3.0l (Really) Sprint 1.7 156 TS S2
Triumph Speed Triple: Black with extra black bits
www.cuore-sportivo.co.uk

Zathras - 16 Oct 2005 20:13 GMT
>> Without wishing to scare you read this:
>>
[quoted text clipped - 6 lines]
>enough diesel in to 'get me home' before the contaminated fuel worked its
>way through.

Except that in the JTDs fuel is circulated to the engine and back to
the tank in a similar way to petrol injection systems so the fuel will
be fairly well mixed now. One of the benefits of this is a self
bleeding low pressure diesel fuel system which is a joy if you have to
open it up (for example to replace the water trap). There's an
electric lift pump in the tank as well as the high pressure pump at
the engine end. I've never heard the lift pump being activated by the
door locks as part of some fancy pre-flight start up though - maybe
that's a German thing. Also, if it was activated, you wouldn't perhaps
need to crank the engine to bleed the fuel system. It takes 5-10s of
cranking to get fuel from the tank to the engine.

>Time will tell no doubt :(

Certainly. However, my understanding is that, diesels may cope with a
small amount of petrol. I've heard of lorry drivers using 10% petrol
in their diesel in the coldest of winters.

I don't think luck will play much part here - if there's enough diesel
to maintain lubrication over the petrol's cleaning abilities, you'll
come through. If not.... My understanding is that it's the high
pressure diesel pump that gets damaged if anything does but it's eye
wateringly expensive nevertheless.

Signature

Z
Scotland
Alfa Romeo 156 2.4JTD Veloce Leather
'Oil' be seeing you..
(Email without 'Alfa' in subject are auto-deleted..sorry!)

Domestos - 16 Oct 2005 00:58 GMT
How did you do that !!!

Our local unleaded pumps dont fit in the diesel hole !!!

> Guys
>
[quoted text clipped - 7 lines]
> will I get away with running it or is it a drain the tank job and eat
> humble pie.
Bill - 16 Oct 2005 14:10 GMT
You will find that in the UK you cannot fit a diesel nozzle in an unleaded
petrol filler spout but you can fit an unleaded petrol nozzle in a diesel
spout.

Wouldn't you think they would do it the other way round as putting diesel
into a petrol engine is not so disastrous. I can only presume that
statistically there are  more petrol than diesel vehicles and maybe that
influenced the decision.

With the phenomenal growth in diesel powered vehicles its time this problem
was engineered out.

> How did you do that !!!
>
[quoted text clipped - 11 lines]
>> will I get away with running it or is it a drain the tank job and eat
>> humble pie.
Catman - 16 Oct 2005 18:33 GMT
> You will find that in the UK you cannot fit a diesel nozzle in an unleaded
> petrol filler spout but you can fit an unleaded petrol nozzle in a diesel
[quoted text clipped - 7 lines]
> With the phenomenal growth in diesel powered vehicles its time this
> problem was engineered out.

AIUI it was originally to stop people putting 4 star into cat equiped
cars....

C
>> How did you do that !!!
>>
[quoted text clipped - 11 lines]
>>> will I get away with running it or is it a drain the tank job and eat
>>> humble pie.

Signature

Catman MIB#14 SKoGA#6 TEAR#4 BOTAFOF#38 Apostle#21 COSOC#3
Tyger, Tyger Burning Bright (Remove rust to reply)
Alfa 116 Giulietta 3.0l (Really) Sprint 1.7 156 TS S2
Triumph Speed Triple: Black with extra black bits
www.cuore-sportivo.co.uk

 
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