Time for a new set of rubber on my 156 2.0L. All 4 tyres (205/60/R15 V)
are hitting the wear marks. Up to now I've always used Michelin Pilot
Primacy, these being the original equipment on my year 2000 car. But now
I have the chance to try something else as the whole set need swapping.
The Michelins have astounded me with their longevity: the front two have
gone from new to wear marks in 26,000 miles. Now I know that might be
because I drive like an old lady, but I wonder if it is also a Michelin
characteristic to repay their price premium with a longer life?
I've looked at previous posts on tyres and read with amazement that some
have wiped a pair of fronts in as little as 6000 miles.
However, the Dunlop SP300s undercut the Michelins by a considerable
margin, and the Pirelli P7s are Italian. Two good reasons to give them a
long hard look. Any experience/thoughts on these three (or others) for a
non-sport pack early 2.0l 156? I value ride comfort as much as grip and
low noise- not least because the suspension bushes need all the help
they can get to survive for more than 20,000 miles!!!
Barry
Tony Rickard - 24 Dec 2005 16:28 GMT
> Time for a new set of rubber on my 156 2.0L. All 4 tyres (205/60/R15 V)
> are hitting the wear marks. Up to now I've always used Michelin Pilot
> Primacy, these being the original equipment on my year 2000 car. But now
> I have the chance to try something else as the whole set need swapping.
The Michelins are good tyres but in my view nothing special compared
with other premium tyres to justify their significant additional cost. I
would believe any premium tyre from Pirelli, Goodyear, Bridgestone,
Avon, Continental etc. would give similar performance and wear depending
upon your preference of tyre type from these manufacturers (be it max
performance or something more conservative) so it will come down to what
is on offer, paying 20% more for a tyre that lasts 20% longer just saves
you the hassle of changing tyres sooner.
> The Michelins have astounded me with their longevity: the front two have
> gone from new to wear marks in 26,000 miles. Now I know that might be
> because I drive like an old lady, but I wonder if it is also a Michelin
> characteristic to repay their price premium with a longer life?
26,000 without rotating the tyres - yes you must drive like an old lady!
Any performance front wheel drive car wheel get through fronts in in
half that mileage with spirited driving. A softer tyre like a Pirelli
PZero Assimetrico lasted 6000 miles on the front of my wife's GTV with
the same 2.0TS engine.
> I've looked at previous posts on tyres and read with amazement that some
> have wiped a pair of fronts in as little as 6000 miles.
See above!
> However, the Dunlop SP300s undercut the Michelins by a considerable
> margin, and the Pirelli P7s are Italian. Two good reasons to give them a
> long hard look. Any experience/thoughts on these three (or others) for a
> non-sport pack early 2.0l 156? I value ride comfort as much as grip and
> low noise- not least because the suspension bushes need all the help
> they can get to survive for more than 20,000 miles!!!
I replaced my Contisports with Bridgestone Potenza S-03s. Very pleased
with the significantly increased grip in the wet, however a minor
increase in noise (which may not be so minor to you). Dunlops are harder
tyres - long lasting but lower grip.
A good site to compare tyre performance is here:
http://www.tirerack.com/tires/surveyresults/index.jsp
It contains surveys from the public. Remember despite the UK weather we
use summer tyres all year around when comparing.
Hope this helps
Cheers
Tony
Domestos - 24 Dec 2005 18:18 GMT
> The Michelins have astounded me with their longevity: the front two have
> gone from new to wear marks in 26,000 miles. Now I know that might be
> because I drive like an old lady, but I wonder if it is also a Michelin
> characteristic to repay their price premium with a longer life?
I drive on cheap makes (TURBO and FIREBIRD) like a buffoon, get mega grip
and my tyres last well over 35000 miles... my car has now only done 51,000
miles and is only half way through its second set of tyres....
alfistagj - 24 Dec 2005 18:55 GMT
Here we go again........
What kind of driver are you? (lazy, sporty, wild, comfort, high speed....)
What kind of roads do you frequent? (..% motorway. ..% city, ..% country,
..% etc)
Where to you drive? (temperature/dry/wet etc)
What tyre size?
Lowered suspension?
Every tyre has it's own "signature" and in my experience all "brand" tyres
will do the same mileage per penny spent, so what you seem to save in the
beginning will get back to you later.
And when you calculate the tyre costs by the mile, you will only see a
difference in the 4th, 5th digit......
From the factory, Alfa are set up for the tyres mentioned in the manual
which usually is Michelin/Pirelli and in some countries Firestone.
I consider myself a moderately sporty driver, pushing the pedal to the
bottom on good roads, and sticking to the law in city limits, never go for
traffic light sprints (I'm always faster, so what am I to proove...) and
love those curvy country roads.
Many years of Alfa experience (over 1.5 million km's -1 million miles- in
Alfa's since 1972) has put Michelin way in front with a good average on
sportyness, mileage, dry/wet perfomance and noise.
Good second is Pirelli however lower mileage and a lot of noise when they
age and a tendency to "cup"
On my 156SW (215/45*17) I also had a pretty good experience with Dunlop
SP9000 and Goodyear Eagle F1
The original 1st set Pirelli P7000 were gone after 15000km (10000mi) the
second set after 20000km, The Dunlops and GoodYears did 30-35000km!!
Now on my Alfa GT I have Michelin Pilot Sport 225/40*18, a dream to drive I
must say (now 25.000km - 15500mi 4-4½mm profile left so approx 1/3 to go
which is good) which is most likely due to the ASR which perfectly prevents
the front wheels from spinning on acceleration (and a dream in snow as
well).

Signature
Ciao from The Netherlands
alfistagj (aka Gert-Jan)
GT 2.0 JTS (2005)
Montreal 2.6V8 (1428700 - 1973/4)
> Time for a new set of rubber on my 156 2.0L. All 4 tyres (205/60/R15 V)
> are hitting the wear marks. Up to now I've always used Michelin Pilot
[quoted text clipped - 17 lines]
>
> Barry
Tony Rickard - 24 Dec 2005 23:19 GMT
> From the factory, Alfa are set up for the tyres mentioned in the manual
> which usually is Michelin/Pirelli and in some countries Firestone.
Are they really set up for a specific tyre? The Alfas in my local
showroom seem to have a different tyres from month to month. I believe
they buy whatever is the best deal for a batch of cars. My Alfa came
with Contis.
> The original 1st set Pirelli P7000 were gone after 15000km (10000mi) the
> second set after 20000km, The Dunlops and GoodYears did 30-35000km!!
[quoted text clipped - 3 lines]
> the front wheels from spinning on acceleration (and a dream in snow as
> well).
Compared with the Contisports fitted to my 156 V6, the replacement
Bridgestone S03s have loads more grip in the wet and the ASR light is
seldom if ever seen. In fact when I had them fitted I had to really
abuse the throttle to check it was still working!
I wouldn't get the Contis again but the mainstream manufacturers all
produce an excellent range of tyres. Comes down to preference (some
tread patterns seem to suit certain cars better than others) and what
deals are on at the car dealer.
Cheers
Tony
Zathras - 26 Dec 2005 13:45 GMT
>> From the factory, Alfa are set up for the tyres mentioned in the manual
>> which usually is Michelin/Pirelli and in some countries Firestone.
[quoted text clipped - 3 lines]
>they buy whatever is the best deal for a batch of cars. My Alfa came
>with Contis.
So did mine (an import from Europe).
If Alfa didn't see fit to test the 156 satisfactorily in the UK I
wonder if they even tested on a large range of tyres! It wouldn't
surprise me if they had only tested on Michelin/Pirelli. After all
Fiat was short of cash when the 156 was being developed and this
usually means corners get cut. Come to think of it, Fiat are still
short of cash..
My prediction for Alfa is a tough one..the 159 doesn't have the vastly
superior looks that the 156 had that captivated the customers of its
day. Lots of 156 customers will be looking elsewhere after their
experiences - indeed there's now a saying in the UK that "you only buy
*one* 156". If the 159 doesn't fly out of the showrooms even better
than the 156 did (a very tall order) then it could be curtains for
Alfa - this time there's no GM lurking in the wings with an open
cheque book.

Signature
Z
Scotland
Alfa Romeo 156 2.4JTD Veloce Leather
'Oil' be seeing you..
(Email without 'Alfa' in subject are auto-deleted..sorry!)
SteveH - 24 Dec 2005 23:55 GMT
> Time for a new set of rubber on my 156 2.0L. All 4 tyres (205/60/R15 V)
> are hitting the wear marks. Up to now I've always used Michelin Pilot
[quoted text clipped - 15 lines]
> low noise- not least because the suspension bushes need all the help
> they can get to survive for more than 20,000 miles!!!
Pirelli P6000. I've had them on several cars now and, IMHO, they can't
be faulted.
Second choice would be Goodyear Eagle Venturer (worked well on my
155),or Goodyear NCT5 (ditto).
Avoid, at all costs, anything unknown - I've bought used cars with all
sorts of crap on them, and nearly paid the price several times. Can't
remember what the 155 had on it when I bought it, but they were leathal.
My Marea has 'Roadstone Dark Horse' on the back.... yes, I laughed too.
They need to go ASAP.
Our 156 has P6000s on the front and the Michelin Premacys on the back.
My 75 has P6000s on the back and Dunlop SP200s on the front.
I'm pretty happy with the tyres on the Alfas, but the Pirellis are still
my favourite choice.
If you fancy a gamble on something a bit cheaper, and can find someone
who stocks them, Marangoni have had decent reviews in AutoItalia, and
Cooper (parent company of Avon) do some decent tyres, too (we ran our
Cinq. Sporting on them). To really do it on a budget, Colway remoulds
have an awesome reputation in competition and are on my 'try it' list
for the 75 when I get some track days under my belt next year.
On the other hand, if wear rates don't really matter.... Yokohama. Just
avoid the Novaboy special S309s. ISTR my last set were A539, but I could
be wrong, however my 33 16v stuck like the proverbial with them on it.
Wore 'em out in 3k miles on the front, though.....

Signature
Steve H 'You're not a real petrolhead unless you've owned an Alfa Romeo'
http://www.italiancar.co.uk - Honda VFR800 - MZ ETZ300 - Alfa 75 TSpark
Alfa 156 2.0 TSpark Lusso - Fiat Marea 20v HLX - COSOC KOTL
BoTAFOT #87 - BoTAFOF #18 - MRO # - UKRMSBC #7 - Apostle #2 - YTC #
Flavio - 25 Dec 2005 00:56 GMT
I used all of them and the one I prefer now is the Pirelli P7.
Good grip, also with wet road, and a good life. I am not able to judge
"sound" since for me it's not relevant. :)
I have to say that I used Pirelli (P6000) and Dunlop with my old 147 and I
preferred the Dunlop but now that Pirelli introduced the P7... well, much
better!
My GT loves them too! ;)
Don't even think about buying Goodyear Eagle!!! Terrible!!!
Ciao, Flavio
> Time for a new set of rubber on my 156 2.0L. All 4 tyres (205/60/R15 V)
> are hitting the wear marks. Up to now I've always used Michelin Pilot
[quoted text clipped - 17 lines]
>
> Barry
Barry Bingham - 26 Dec 2005 10:04 GMT
Thanks guys. I can make a more informed decision in next few days: not
that it looks like any of my three finalists would be a wrong choice:
they just have different strengths (although in the Dunlop's case that's
probably just £50 still in my pocket!)
Happy Christmas
Barry
Zathras - 26 Dec 2005 14:04 GMT
>The Michelins have astounded me with their longevity: the front two have
>gone from new to wear marks in 26,000 miles. Now I know that might be
>because I drive like an old lady,
An alternative interpretation might be that you are a driver of some
quality who appreciates what tyres do on tarmac and that loosing grip,
shredding or being very heavy on them is never a sign of a genuinely
quick driver - just somebody that can press the brake and/or
accelerator hard and who is unlikely to corner at the quickest
possible speed.
An old lady/gent would be through about 6 clutches at your
mileage..have you? ;-)

Signature
Z
Scotland
Alfa Romeo 156 2.4JTD Veloce Leather
'Oil' be seeing you..
(Email without 'Alfa' in subject are auto-deleted..sorry!)
David A Smith - 26 Dec 2005 20:36 GMT
>>The Michelins have astounded me with their longevity: the front two have
>>gone from new to wear marks in 26,000 miles. Now I know that might be
[quoted text clipped - 9 lines]
> An old lady/gent would be through about 6 clutches at your
> mileage..have you? ;-)
Belated Merry Christmas....
and to add my 2 penn'orth
34000 on the same set of Contis. So where do I come on the 'Old Lady'
scale.
Have you seen the comparison in AutoExpress?
http://www.autoexpress.co.uk/website/?ae_data/special_features/tyretest2005/
10MB pdf file. Worth a look.
Dave
147 and Minari.
Barry Bingham - 27 Dec 2005 07:31 GMT
> "Zathras" <webnewsgroup@nospamthanks.hotmail.com> wrote in message
>>An alternative interpretation might be that you are a driver of some
>>quality who appreciates what tyres do on tarmac and that loosing grip,
>>shredding or being very heavy on them is never a sign of a genuinely
>>quick driver - just somebody that can press the brake and/or
>>accelerator hard and who is unlikely to corner at the quickest
>>possible speed.
Thank you for recognising this ;-)
>>An old lady/gent would be through about 6 clutches at your
>>mileage..have you? ;-)
No. In fact I have never in my life had to have a clutch replaced. And
I'm an old geezer.... Always been mystfied by frequent clutch
replacements - all one needs to do is put your foot somewhere other than
on the clutch pedal when not actually using it and acquaint yourself
with the role of the handbrake at lights, junctions and in slow traffic:
i.e., its not just for parking. IME the clutch then lasts the life of
the car.... or at least it did when cars had shorter lives(100,000ish
and 8-10 years). Oh - and keep the racing starts to a minimum.
Of course my 156 is probably listening to this smug statement and will
punish me soon with my first ever failed clutch...
Barry
Stephen Poley - 27 Dec 2005 10:28 GMT
>No. In fact I have never in my life had to have a clutch replaced. And
>I'm an old geezer.... Always been mystfied by frequent clutch
[quoted text clipped - 4 lines]
>the car.... or at least it did when cars had shorter lives(100,000ish
>and 8-10 years). Oh - and keep the racing starts to a minimum.
The one time either of my Alfa's let me down badly was when a clutch
went after less than two years. Chose a good place to do it, as well, in
the middle of the Scottish mountains. But its replacement is still going
fine after 5+ years. And that's the only clutch I've had fail in 20+
years of car ownership. But then I'm not one for racing starts: I think
I'd describe my driving style as 'brisk' rather than 'sporty'. (And I
have a maximum no-claims discount - I don't know if that qualifies me
for the old-lady club around here ;-)
>Of course my 156 is probably listening to this smug statement and will
>punish me soon with my first ever failed clutch...
Of course ...

Signature
Stephen Poley
Barry Bingham - 27 Dec 2005 07:32 GMT
> Belated Merry Christmas....
> and to add my 2 penn'orth
[quoted text clipped - 6 lines]
> Dave
> 147 and Minari.
Thanks David. I now feel that my manhood is less threatened ;-)
Zathras - 27 Dec 2005 09:41 GMT
>Belated Merry Christmas....
Same to you!
>and to add my 2 penn'orth
>34000 on the same set of Contis. So where do I come on the 'Old Lady'
>scale.
I only managed 30,000 on the 'Old Lady' scale (Contis again). Some
here had some difficulty with the concept that this can be done while
also driving quickly and enjoying an Alfa 'properly'.
My only excuse for such a *poor* mileage was the Veloce suspension
'misalignment that nearly trashed my fronts within 12,000 miles but I
honestly doubt I would have got any better mileage anyway! I'm happy
enough with 30,000 miles out of a set to keep to Contis. I think
they're good enough in the wet (well tested in the West Of Scotland I
assure you!) and dry for my cars suspension.

Signature
Z
Scotland
Alfa Romeo 156 2.4JTD Veloce Leather
'Oil' be seeing you..
(Email without 'Alfa' in subject are auto-deleted..sorry!)
alfistagj - 26 Dec 2005 23:27 GMT
Couldn't find the url earlier, but here it is: http://www.tyretest.com
Click on EN for the English site.
> Time for a new set of rubber on my 156 2.0L. All 4 tyres (205/60/R15 V)
> are hitting the wear marks. Up to now I've always used Michelin Pilot
[quoted text clipped - 17 lines]
>
> Barry
David A Smith - 29 Dec 2005 08:59 GMT
> Couldn't find the url earlier, but here it is: http://www.tyretest.com
> Click on EN for the English site.
Strange because I have just gone straight to it using the web site I
suggested as a link
http://www.autoexpress.co.uk/website/?ae_data/special_features/tyretest2005/
I shouldn't have posted here though, as I had just got on to the London
Orbital Car Park (The M 25) on 27th, with a full load of passangers when I
noticed that the car was pulling to the right, was more than usually tyre
noisy and I was being looked at by other motorists. Nice car??? No, flat
tyre. Oh bum!
Changed the tyre for the space saver and was relieved to be able continued
on my way without having been wiped out by others on the road, at a boring
50 mph (speed limit for the space saver).
I have a full set of tyres on order for today, Dunlop SP01 at £ 325 the set
fitted, balanced etc. Bum again!
I wanted to try the Vredesteins which came out top in the Auto Express Tyre
Test, but the size for my 147 isn't available at the UK distributers.
Another bum!
Life is such fun at times.
Happy and safe new year to all.
Dave
2l 147 soon to have nice new boots, & 1.7l Minari