Car Forum / Pontiac / Pontiac Fiero / December 2005
Going to look at car
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David Bosworth - 07 Dec 2005 20:48 GMT I found a potential Fiero and am going out to see it this afternoon or in the morning. It is an 85 GT manual trans with around 60,000 miles new clutch and the car has been lowered.
Any special points of interest to pay close attention too, any advice greatly appreciated!
Thanks for the space.
-- From the rocky shores of the Skykomish river David Bosworth http://www.premier1.net/~daveb/hovercrafts.html
Phil Randolph - 07 Dec 2005 21:39 GMT Check for rust - one primary place is behind the trunk carpet on the sides of the trunk
> I found a potential Fiero and am going out to see it this afternoon or in > the morning. It is an 85 GT manual trans with around 60,000 miles new [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > David Bosworth > http://www.premier1.net/~daveb/hovercrafts.html Mr Potatohead - 07 Dec 2005 22:02 GMT > I found a potential Fiero and am going out to see it this afternoon or in > the morning. It is an 85 GT manual trans with around 60,000 miles new [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > David Bosworth > http://www.premier1.net/~daveb/hovercrafts.html Skykomish? Is that the place with the big falls? I was there once and impressed with the old steam trains just sitting there rusting. I gather they were lumber trains because some were hill-climbers (built at an angle). Anyway, the tracks are along the road to the falls we were going to see and they had a name something like that.
Pretty place, but like Philo says, check your trunk area for rust. That's one damp place. :-)
David Bosworth - 07 Dec 2005 22:07 GMT What is the recommended interval for the timing belt. or is it a chain?
-- From the rocky shores of the Skykomish river David Bosworth http://www.premier1.net/~daveb/hovercrafts.html
> > I found a potential Fiero and am going out to see it this afternoon or in > > the morning. It is an 85 GT manual trans with around 60,000 miles new [quoted text clipped - 18 lines] > Pretty place, but like Philo says, check your trunk area for rust. > That's one damp place. :-) Phil Randolph - 08 Dec 2005 00:25 GMT > What is the recommended interval for the timing belt. or is it a chain? > [quoted text clipped - 28 lines] >>Pretty place, but like Philo says, check your trunk area for rust. >>That's one damp place. :-) It's a chain should last just short of forever
David Bosworth - 08 Dec 2005 07:05 GMT Thanks Phil
-- From the rocky shores of the Skykomish river David Bosworth http://www.premier1.net/~daveb/hovercrafts.html
> > What is the recommended interval for the timing belt. or is it a chain? > > [quoted text clipped - 30 lines] > > > It's a chain should last just short of forever David Bosworth - 07 Dec 2005 22:08 GMT Oh, that would be Snoqualmie falls, that is around 30 miles south of me.
-- From the rocky shores of the Skykomish river David Bosworth http://www.premier1.net/~daveb/hovercrafts.html
> > I found a potential Fiero and am going out to see it this afternoon or in > > the morning. It is an 85 GT manual trans with around 60,000 miles new [quoted text clipped - 18 lines] > Pretty place, but like Philo says, check your trunk area for rust. > That's one damp place. :-) JazzMan - 08 Dec 2005 01:34 GMT > I found a potential Fiero and am going out to see it this afternoon or in > the morning. It is an 85 GT manual trans with around 60,000 miles new [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > > Thanks for the space. Get the VIN and run a carfax. Look under the car at the rocker panels, that's the area under the doors from wheel to wheel, there's a metal tube about an inch and a quarter in diameter along each side of the car, Follow the tubes back and make sure they are not crushed or smashed, especially back around the rear of the car. This is a common result of improper jacking by inattentive mechanics.
As mentioned before, check for rust. Fieros have a normal metal structure under the plastic skin and can rust out.
Get under the driver's side dash and pull the carpet back from the firewall just behind the clutch pedal, check for brake fluid, that indicates that the master cylinder needs replacement.
Check the oil. Do not check coolant by opening the radiator cap in the front, instead, look in the overflow reservoir. If that's dry, then remove the thermostat housing cap in the rear to see if it's got coolant.
Regarding heater cores, for some odd reason that always comes up this time of the year, don't worry, it's incredibly easy to change one out. I did mine on my hour lunchbreak and still had to heat and eat lunch. :)
Once you get the car, and even if you don't you should tell the owner this, under the front hood in the middle of the plastic air box there is a three or four wire connector that plugs onto a part that's held into the air box with a couple 7mm screws, that's the resistor pack for the heater blower fan. Leaves and debris fall down into the air box and this resistor pack will ignite those leaves and burn down a car. Removing the two screws and pulling the resistor pack out allows easy access to clean out twenty years accumulation of leaves.
In the engine compartment clean out all leaves, especially any that have accumulated on the forward exhaust manifold just under the rear window, this has been a source of fires as well.
Common problems with the motor are relatively few. The distributor has an O-ring where it enters the block, this gets old and cracks with age and produces a heck of an oil leak. They're not hard to replace, use only the tan fluorelastomer ring from GM or http://www.rodneydickman.com for best life. The timing chain will last the life of the engine with just routine oil changes. The rod bearings are perhaps the only real weak point of the 2.8 V6 engines. If the engine is well maintain and not abused they will last well over 100k miles, but skip changes and beat on the engine and the #3 and/or #4 rod bearing will stack and spin, and that means new engine time. The forward spark plugs are hard to get to for someone without good spacial visualization skills, so I've seen 120k mile engines with the original forward plugs still in place. Yikes!
A good forum for Fieros is http://www.fiero.nl and click through to the Forums section. You can read without registering but will need to register to post replys and new topics. Cliff, the moderator, is a stand-up guy and does not allow access to his registration database by anyone under any circumstances.
If you have a basic set of hand tools and some minimal mechanical aptitude then most problems in a 20 year old Fiero are easy to repair.
JazzMan
 Signature ********************************************************** Please reply to jsavage"at"airmail.net. Curse those darned bulk e-mailers! ********************************************************** "Rats and roaches live by competition under the laws of supply and demand. It is the privilege of human beings to live under the laws of justice and mercy." - Wendell Berry **********************************************************
David Bosworth - 08 Dec 2005 07:35 GMT -- From the rocky shores of the Skykomish river David Bosworth http://www.premier1.net/~daveb/hovercrafts.html
> > I found a potential Fiero and am going out to see it this afternoon or in > > the morning. It is an 85 GT manual trans with around 60,000 miles new [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] > especially back around the rear of the car. This is a common > result of improper jacking by inattentive mechanics. Going to sign up for that service in the morn. I got the vin# Ok so what exactly are these tube for? and what if they are crushed? It was very hard to see much under the car but what I did see looked very good. Time was short because of light issues, to late in the day. I wish I had received this post before I left! The car is rougher than I really want to deal with but I am still considering it. The paint is totally shot and the interior is in pretty sad shape, upholstery is shot, headliner hanging some loose interior pieces etc. but the body is straight and everything works, Panels line up, doors and hatches worked smooth and tight, runs well, shifts tight and she handled GREAT!. The guy is going to give me the original owners phone# so I can talk to him about the suspension modifications he did or had done.
Any idea what an 85 GT should sell for if it was in reasonable condition? ballpark?
> As mentioned before, check for rust. Fieros have a normal metal > structure under the plastic skin and can rust out. [quoted text clipped - 24 lines] > and pulling the resistor pack out allows easy access to > clean out twenty years accumulation of leaves. That is very interesting, thank you!
> In the engine compartment clean out all leaves, especially > any that have accumulated on the forward exhaust manifold [quoted text clipped - 29 lines] > > JazzMan Thanks so much, lot's of great info in this reply! I will save this one for sure.
> -- > ********************************************************** [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > live under the laws of justice and mercy." - Wendell Berry > ********************************************************** David Bosworth - 08 Dec 2005 07:55 GMT I forgot to add that the brakes were weak. Firm pedal but had to press hard and did not stop well. I was thinking old or contaminated fluid and or glazing on the rotors and or pads? I gave the car a once over, drove it and then it was pretty much dark. It was an impulse to look at it this afternoon but at least I kept my money in the old pocket! sign of age I guess.
-- From the rocky shores of the Skykomish river David Bosworth http://www.premier1.net/~daveb/hovercrafts.html
> -- > From the rocky shores of the Skykomish river [quoted text clipped - 114 lines] > > live under the laws of justice and mercy." - Wendell Berry > > ********************************************************** John Craker - 08 Dec 2005 16:01 GMT >>I forgot to add that the brakes were weak. >> The car is rougher than I really want to deal with [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] >> headliner hanging >> some loose interior pieces
>> Any idea what an 85 GT should sell for if it was in reasonable condition? >> ballpark? Maybe when it's laid out this way... ummm..... :) Maybe time to go look at that '87! They have better headlight motors anyhow. (and get almost double the mileage on the hwy)
One with low mileage (which can mean nothing!) and was in GOOD condition overall would have an insurance value up here of about $5000cdn. What you could sell it for? Probably more like 3-4K on a GOOD day. I sold an 85GT a year ago for $3K, and it took me a while to get it. That's with a rebuilt bottom end on a fairly fresh top end with a good cam, ran like a raped ape, etc etc. and had decent interior (since I'd fixed all the broken bits!), etc etc.
David Bosworth - 08 Dec 2005 17:08 GMT Hmmm, thanks. They are asking 2200 and said they would wiggle a couple of hundred but I was thinking more like 1500 at the most. Even at that it may chew up way more cash than I could ever hope to resell it for. I don't want to be insulting so I may not offer anything.
>I sold an 85GT a year ago for $3K, and it took me a while to get it.< Should have given me a call! hehe
-- From the rocky shores of the Skykomish river David Bosworth http://www.premier1.net/~daveb/hovercrafts.html
> >>I forgot to add that the brakes were weak. > >> The car is rougher than I really want to deal with [quoted text clipped - 19 lines] > etc etc. and had decent interior (since I'd fixed all the broken bits!), etc > etc. JazzMan - 09 Dec 2005 04:45 GMT > I forgot to add that the brakes were weak. Firm pedal but had to press hard > and did not stop well. I was thinking old or contaminated fluid and or > glazing on the rotors and or pads? I gave the car a once over, drove it and > then it was pretty much dark. It was an impulse to look at it this afternoon > but at least I kept my money in the old pocket! sign of age I guess. This car sounds to be in fairly rough shape for as low miles as you've been told. With the descriptions you've given so far I would guess this car to be work less than one thousand assuming no significant rust.
The tubes underneath take coolant from the engine to the radiator and back to the engine, if damaged overheating will be a problem.
The brake problem can be the result of a faulty brake booster or vacuum leak in the hose that goes to the booster from the engine. How is the idle? In neutral and warmed up the idle should be just under 1k with no more than 50-75 rpm flucutations.
JazzMan
 Signature ********************************************************** Please reply to jsavage"at"airmail.net. Curse those darned bulk e-mailers! ********************************************************** "Rats and roaches live by competition under the laws of supply and demand. It is the privilege of human beings to live under the laws of justice and mercy." - Wendell Berry **********************************************************
David Bosworth - 09 Dec 2005 15:34 GMT From the rocky shores of the Skykomish river David Bosworth http://www.premier1.net/~daveb/hovercrafts.html
> > I forgot to add that the brakes were weak. Firm pedal but had to press hard > > and did not stop well. I was thinking old or contaminated fluid and or [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > given so far I would guess this car to be work less than > one thousand assuming no significant rust. The mileage checked out with the history report (for whatever that is worth) I guess I forgot to put the price in my initial post, he is asking 2200. I got the impression that around 18 was as low as I would get them down so I bagged it. I would have given 12 for it though. The car is very tight. They said the car has spent a lot of time sitting around.
This is kinda funny in a sick way but their story was his girlfriend (the owner) bought the car from her father in-law who bought the car new and did all the custom work on it but got so fat that he could no longer drive it! this was so severe that he ended up having his stomach tied. There's one I had not heard before, heh.
> The tubes underneath take coolant from the engine to > the radiator and back to the engine, if damaged overheating > will be a problem. Ah ha,
> The brake problem can be the result of a faulty brake > booster or vacuum leak in the hose that goes to the > booster from the engine. How is the idle? In neutral > and warmed up the idle should be just under 1k with no > more than 50-75 rpm flucutations. Actually the car ran very well! very smooth, plenty o power and steady rpms. the shift light on the dash was extremely annoying though. I really liked the way the car drove. There was a rhythmic shhhing noise while under way though, not loud but would have needed looking into if I was to pursue it. The noise did not change through the gears or vary engine rpms. He was very into that new clutch! must have been a real pain in the a.s to do, claimed 500 in parts. The rims were tall and the tires very low profile and in good shape ka-ching $$$! Are sway bars standard equipment on GT's? or all Fiero's?
I may check back with them after they have had the car on the market longer and offer a 1 to 12 for it. No reason I can't own more than one of these cars!
David
> JazzMan > -- [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > live under the laws of justice and mercy." - Wendell Berry > ********************************************************** Mr Potatohead - 09 Dec 2005 16:54 GMT > I may check back with them after they have had the car on the market longer > and offer a 1 to 12 for it. No reason I can't own more than one of these > cars! Most of us do. :-)
John Craker - 08 Dec 2005 04:24 GMT Look up front, right in front of the headlights. There should be no signs of warpage in the sheetmetal work. Now look between the rad, and the headlights. You'll see two sheets of metal that go up, and are pinch welded. Make sure there's no seperation of the two.
Either of these are signs that the front end has taken a hit.
Not to say it's a "do not buy" sign, but it's a good indicator of the honesty level of the seller! Needless to say, don't tell him what you're looking for first.... :)
>I found a potential Fiero and am going out to see it this afternoon or in > the morning. It is an 85 GT manual trans with around 60,000 miles new [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > > Thanks for the space. David Bosworth - 08 Dec 2005 07:50 GMT -- From the rocky shores of the Skykomish river David Bosworth http://www.premier1.net/~daveb/hovercrafts.html
> Look up front, right in front of the headlights. There should be no signs > of warpage in the sheetmetal work. Now look between the rad, and the [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > honesty level of the seller! Needless to say, don't tell him what you're > looking for first.... :) The guy told me on the phone that the original owner had hit a guard rail and broken the front bumper cover. It was repaired by a shop and they did a good job, that part had not been color matched so you could definitely see the area. I looked at the radiator and headlight area and things looked ok, to the novice anyways. As usual it really needs a second look. There has been good information passed my way by you kind folks and I have thought of a couple of other things on my own too :-) Imagine that! heh. I am going to check on some parts prices and the cost of painting and think it over. I kinda doubt they are going to move enough for me on the price though. I am going to try and look at an 87 4 banger tomorrow, it's pretty cheap and will make a good exercise if nothing else. Also not knowing much about these cars it will give me an idea if I like the suspension modifications on the one I drove today too.
Thanks again.
> >I found a potential Fiero and am going out to see it this afternoon or in > > the morning. It is an 85 GT manual trans with around 60,000 miles new [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > > > > Thanks for the space. Pegasus #4 - 11 Dec 2005 06:03 GMT Regarding the soft brakes. Ask to see if one of the owners took it to Midas for a brake job. I made that mistake on my previous 88 GT. Later while looking for a fourth Fiero I test drove another 88 GT. When I commented to the owner that the brakes were really weak he confessed that it had Midas brakes on it. I don't know what their problem is but they can't do a Fiero right, or at least our local shop can't.
Marty Wibert
> -- > From the rocky shores of the Skykomish river [quoted text clipped - 38 lines] > > > > > > Thanks for the space.
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