Car Forum / Australian Car Forums / General Car Topics (Australian group) / April 2006
So the word "nigger" is not offensive in the world of Usenet?
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Andy - 26 Apr 2006 09:31 GMT 10 From: OzOne - view profile Date: Wed, Apr 26 2006 6:22 pm Email: OzOne <> Groups: aus.cars Not yet ratedRating: hide options
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On Wed, 26 Apr 2006 18:20:21 +1000, "Andy" <Pandermya...@blogmog.com> scribbled thusly:
><OzOne> wrote in message news:4m5u425j8qgo2o7l7o3ofese7df2sf6nm7@4ax.com...
>> I'm still trying to figure ou what it was that offended you this time.
>> Maybe a better solution would be just to ignore him if you get so >> upset.
>Try using the word "ni%^&*" on the street of New York. Then if you live, >you will understand. This isn't NYC
Oz1...of the 3 twins.
I welcome you to crackerbox palace,We've been expecting you.
Usenet does not have national boundaries.
OzOne - 26 Apr 2006 09:52 GMT >10 From: OzOne - view profile >Date: Wed, Apr 26 2006 6:22 pm [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] >Note: The author of this message requested that it not be archived. >This message will be removed from Groups in 6 days (May 3, 6:22 pm). No, I didn't actually. Google wrote all that garbage.
>On Wed, 26 Apr 2006 18:20:21 +1000, "Andy" <Pandermya...@blogmog.com> >scribbled thusly: [quoted text clipped - 16 lines] > >Usenet does not have national boundaries. Oh my, I hadn't realised that you'd get upset for your brothers in NYC. I'll try and remember to get annoyed any time someone uses nigger or spick, or wog, even pom, whitey, skip,leb, lebbo, raghead and so on.
Do you walk out of the movies (god I hate ... sorry, dislike that word) /picture theatre when someone uses language that offends you?
Maybe you could walk out of aus.cars too.
Oz1...of the 3 twins.
I welcome you to crackerbox palace,We've been expecting you.
OzOne - 26 Apr 2006 09:55 GMT >>Try using the word "ni%^&*" on the street of New York. Then if you live, >>you will understand. Andy, can you tell me why you can use "nigger" in a header and yet you can't in tha actual post?
Oz1...of the 3 twins.
I welcome you to crackerbox palace,We've been expecting you.
Andy - 26 Apr 2006 12:30 GMT The topic has changed.
I wanted to test your opinion that the word is not offensive in usenet no matter what group or country the group is addressed to.
But as someone said, try using the word in The Block in Redfern.
Uncle Bully - 26 Apr 2006 12:44 GMT > The topic has changed. > > I wanted to test your opinion that the word is not offensive in usenet > no matter what group or country the group is addressed to. > > But as someone said, try using the word in The Block in Redfern. This isn't The Block in Redfern.
ant - 27 Apr 2006 01:09 GMT > The topic has changed. > > I wanted to test your opinion that the word is not offensive in usenet > no matter what group or country the group is addressed to. > > But as someone said, try using the word in The Block in Redfern. Well, they can call me a Gub.
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John McKenzie - 27 Apr 2006 07:07 GMT > The topic has changed. > > I wanted to test your opinion that the word is not offensive in usenet > no matter what group or country the group is addressed to. Here's something - in the original example, of using the term in NYC, if the speaker was African American, it would probably not be of any newsworthiness. And that in and of itself is racist, is it not?
Me? I've got close friends who are black, white, gay, disabled (even Noddy) - hell I've even got a cousin who won numerous gold medals at the Sydney special Olypics) and I use all sorts of such words around them. I'd be being a racist if I didn't, because in the context I use them in, if I were to speak differently around my friends, it would be totally disingenuous and promot the idea that people really are different because of skin colour or other physical or mental attribute or disability. which is manifestly ridiculous. Furthermore, it would be to suggest that somehow nobody from another culture is adult or 'tough' enough to handle ridiculous commentary. Is anyone seriously going to suggest that an indigenous Australian 'needs' 'wants' (or any variation thereof) special consideration or treatment or acceptance to get by? Bullshit to that, by and large anyone worth being a friend with is strong enough to stand on their own feet and cheerfully say 'get f.cked' to any bullshit abuse.
On which note, the only thing I've got against the movement for reconciliation and the official 'sorry' from govco is not that it's undeserved, but that it's bloody insulting to suggest that indigenous Australians aren't capable of standing tall without some condescending and probably transparent apology. It shouldn't be 'thanks for finally saying sorry' it should be 'f.ck you and the horse you rode into town on, we don't need your bullshit patronising crap to stand tall'.
> But as someone said, try using the word in The Block in Redfern. Just because some take offense to something doesn't mean it's inherently offensive. Once apon a time one would be considered offensive if even joking about the possibility of evolution, or that the world was flat.
I'm not 'proud' of being white, I'm not ashamed either (though that seems to be a rarity). For the very simple fact that the colour of my skin has nothing to do with my character or my heart.
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Michael C - 27 Apr 2006 13:54 GMT > Me? I've got close friends who are black, white, gay, disabled (even > Noddy) - hell I've even got a cousin who won numerous gold medals at the [quoted text clipped - 11 lines] > strong enough to stand on their own feet and cheerfully say 'get f.cked' > to any bullshit abuse. There's a big difference between a bit of friendly bullshit and unfriendly.
Michael
John McKenzie - 27 Apr 2006 22:05 GMT > There's a big difference between a bit of friendly bullshit and unfriendly. yes there is indeed. But I feel that there's a disparity between what's ok based on colour. It probably was completely the opposite in another place and time, but currently a black person using a term for a white person which has negative connotations is probably not going to face any complaints, but the reverse is not likely. That's _real_ racism right there, and until we tackle that (and the fact that the specific racial 'groups' (and god I hate that sort of sh.t anyway) were black and white is as far as progress goes irrelevant, it's a 'problem' no matter which way the inequity of acceptable commentary exists) all other paradigm shifts are almost wholly bullshit.
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Michael C - 28 Apr 2006 02:00 GMT > yes there is indeed. But I feel that there's a disparity between what's > ok based on colour. It probably was completely the opposite in another > place and time, but currently a black person using a term for a white > person which has negative connotations is probably not going to face any > complaints, but the reverse is not likely. That's _real_ racism right > there, Maybe it is but that still doesn't make using a negative term to refer to a black person any less racist.
Michael
John McKenzie - 28 Apr 2006 07:17 GMT > > yes there is indeed. But I feel that there's a disparity between what's > > ok based on colour. It probably was completely the opposite in another [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > Maybe it is but that still doesn't make using a negative term to refer to a > black person any less racist. It's the sort of fodder though, that keeps us from really moving forward as a species. We waste so much time (as this thread has ironically illustrated) on semantic crap (and for the morons, that doesn't mean I hate jewish people) rather than real progress. I really couldn't give a sh.t what _anyone_ calls me, in any context. I don't hate certain people here who have used disparaging terms after a post I made to Hatz ages ago when he was sprouting anti-gay sh.t. I didn't find the terms offensive in any way, I just couldn't care less. But I do think it's telling when the underlying reason (which is where I'm sure you and I do concur) behind the term is the speakers belief that there actually _is_ something inferior about being black, white, gay, whatever.
 Signature John McKenzie
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athol - 28 Apr 2006 09:15 GMT > We waste so much time (as this thread has ironically > illustrated) on semantic crap (and for the morons, that doesn't mean I > hate jewish people) rather than real progress. That'd be anti-semantic. :-p
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ant - 29 Apr 2006 01:26 GMT >> We waste so much time (as this thread has ironically >> illustrated) on semantic crap (and for the morons, that doesn't mean >> I hate jewish people) rather than real progress. > > That'd be anti-semantic. :-p It scares me that I was just contemplating making the same joke!
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Toby Ponsenby - 28 Apr 2006 09:46 GMT >>> yes there is indeed. But I feel that there's a disparity between what's >>> ok based on colour. It probably was completely the opposite in another [quoted text clipped - 17 lines] > concur) behind the term is the speakers belief that there actually _is_ > something inferior about being black, white, gay, whatever. But that's the point, init? There's nothing inferior about any of it. But there is a difference. And the PC thing has managed (probably deliberately) to get that magnificently confused. However, the whole thing seemed to start with the Yankee blacks getting uppity about being called that, and having enough power in the community to actually do something about it. And they've had a bit of a win..... Ripper - they were owed that win. In spades;-)
P
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Serialpest - 28 Apr 2006 10:56 GMT >>>yes there is indeed. But I feel that there's a disparity between what's >>>ok based on colour. It probably was completely the opposite in another [quoted text clipped - 17 lines] > concur) behind the term is the speakers belief that there actually _is_ > something inferior about being black, white, gay, whatever. Blacks are inferior. Humans evolved to whiteness. Niggers are a sub-human species barely different from primate animals.
Knobdoodle - 28 Apr 2006 11:34 GMT > Blacks are inferior. Humans evolved to whiteness. Niggers are a sub-human > species barely different from primate animals. ~ So if they're smart and they try really hard they can whiten-up? I dunno' if I really believe this though... The absolutely most moRonic posters in aus.cars are whiteys.... -- Knob
Serialpest - 28 Apr 2006 22:16 GMT >>Blacks are inferior. Humans evolved to whiteness. Niggers are a sub-human >>species barely different from primate animals. [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > -- > Knob For sure. Take a look at African-Americans. They are one of the few black people that actually try and I admire them for that. The rest of them are just foul, filthy trash. Australian abbos, NZ abbos, Nigerians (vile creatures) and the rest from Africa, Most mud races from Asia like Indonesians, Pinoys. As for the moronic white posters here like "no nuts" Mcgrice, Blackturd, "the 'tard" noddy and "I heard from a mate of a mate at the pub" Dan, they have unfortunately got baby brains which results in their aborigine mentality and their inability to be normal. Call them white niggers if you will. They're the type of people that are so stupid that you could flog them every day with a lash and it would make no difference.
ant - 29 Apr 2006 01:28 GMT > For sure. Take a look at African-Americans. They are one of the few > black people that actually try and I admire them for that. The rest of > them are just foul, filthy trash. Australian abbos, NZ abbos, > Nigerians (vile creatures) and the rest from Africa, (etcetera)
Darkie, is that you?
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Smee R11S - 28 Apr 2006 14:10 GMT > Blacks are inferior. Humans evolved to whiteness. Niggers are a > sub-human species barely different from primate animals. sh.t! Then this newsgroup is full of black people!
Serialpest - 28 Apr 2006 22:17 GMT >> Blacks are inferior. Humans evolved to whiteness. Niggers are a >> sub-human species barely different from primate animals. [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > Inviato da X-Privat.Org - Registrazione gratuita > http://www.x-privat.org/join.php White niggers mostly with baby brains.
Andy - 28 Apr 2006 14:34 GMT Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2006 19:56:34 +1000 From: Serialpest <m...@mitsubishi.com> User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird 1.0.6 (Macintosh/20050716) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 Newsgroups: aus.cars Subject: Re: So the word "nigger" is not offensive in the world of Usenet? References: <1146040276.345621.250670@v46g2000cwv.googlegroups.com> <69du429fg5e8vrnj3hibd44nuak3p5fpt0@4ax.com> <1146051023.973332.15830@u72g2000cwu.googlegroups.com> <44505F90.3ACF@alphalink.com.au> <4450bf06$0$19831$afc38c87@news.optusnet.com.au> <4451321E.4D0F@alphalink.com.au> <4451690e$0$9697$afc38c87@news.optusnet.com.au> <4451B369.646D@alphalink.com.au> In-Reply-To: <4451B369.646D@alphalink.com.au> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit NNTP-Posting-Host: 203.219.26.36 X-Original-NNTP-Posting-Host: 203.219.26.36 Message-ID: <4451e6b6@dnews.tpgi.com.au> X-Trace: dnews.tpgi.com.au!tpg.com.au 1146218166 203.219.26.36 (28 Apr 2006 19:56:06 +1100) Lines: 32 Path: g2news2.google.com!news4.google.com!news3.google.com!news.glorb.com!proxad.net!212.101.4.254.MISMATCH!solnet.ch!solnet.ch!nntp.gblx.net!nntp3.phx1!dnews.tpgi.com.au!tpg.com.au!not-for-mail
John McKenzie wrote:
> Michael C wrote: > [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] >>>complaints, but the reverse is not likely. That's _real_ racism right >>>there, F@alphalink.com.au...
>>>yes there is >>Maybe it is but that still doesn't make using a negative >>>term to refer to a [quoted text clipped - 11 lines] > concur) behind the term is the speakers belief that there actually _is_ > something inferior about being black, white, gay, whatever. Blacks are inferior. Humans evolved to whiteness. Niggers are a sub-human species barely different from primate animals.
Serialpest - 28 Apr 2006 22:34 GMT > Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2006 19:56:34 +1000 > From: Serialpest <m...@mitsubishi.com> [quoted text clipped - 58 lines] > Blacks are inferior. Humans evolved to whiteness. Niggers are a > sub-human species barely different from primate animals. Awww have another cry because I used the nigger word. Grow up you fool.
Andy - 29 Apr 2006 00:35 GMT > Awww have another cry because I used the nigger word. Grow up you fool. How is the 380 going these days?
John McKenzie - 29 Apr 2006 08:36 GMT > How is the 380 going these days? Any answer you provide him is the only thing keeping the razor from it's inevitable descent onto his wrist. I implore you, ignore him.
 Signature John McKenzie
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Serialpest - 29 Apr 2006 10:55 GMT >>Awww have another cry because I used the nigger word. Grow up you fool. > > How is the 380 going these days? Fine thanks. Hows the Astra going poof?
aa-bne-1 - 29 Apr 2006 01:28 GMT >>It's the sort of fodder though, that keeps us from really moving forward >>as a species. We waste so much time (as this thread has ironically [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > Blacks are inferior. Humans evolved to whiteness. Niggers are a > sub-human species barely different from primate animals. In my opinion, the order of racial superiority goes like this: East Asians are the most advanced (Japanese, Chinese etc), whites are second.
At the very bottom of the list are blacks.
And I am not being biased, I'm not asian.
Serialpest - 29 Apr 2006 11:00 GMT >>> It's the sort of fodder though, that keeps us from really moving forward >>> as a species. We waste so much time (as this thread has ironically [quoted text clipped - 17 lines] > > And I am not being biased, I'm not asian. I'm not biased either. I hate asians and blacks equally.
damnfine - 29 Apr 2006 11:10 GMT > Blacks are inferior. Humans evolved to whiteness. Niggers are a > sub-human species barely different from primate animals. Actually whites and blacks are both of the species _Homo sapiens_. Thanks for reading.
-- /^\damnfine/^\ ~ Multiculturalism: Because atheists of all cultures can live together in harmony. ~
D Walford - 28 Apr 2006 23:05 GMT >>>> yes there is indeed. But I feel that there's a disparity between what's >>>> ok based on colour. It probably was completely the opposite in another [quoted text clipped - 22 lines] > Blacks are inferior. Humans evolved to whiteness. Niggers are a > sub-human species barely different from primate animals. So you must be black then. By your reasoning there is no other way you be such a f.cking idiot.
Daryl
Ron - 29 Apr 2006 02:35 GMT D Walford <walford@iprimus.com.au> wrote in news:445291ac$0$490$61c65585@uq-127creek-reader- 03.brisbane.pipenetworks. com.au:
>>>>> yes there is indeed. But I feel that there's a disparity between >>>>> what's ok based on colour. It probably was completely the opposite [quoted text clipped - 28 lines] > > Daryl Spot on :-)
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Michael C - 28 Apr 2006 12:29 GMT > It's the sort of fodder though, that keeps us from really moving forward > as a species. Maybe that's true but the question raised in this thread is whether using a negative term to refer to a group of people is offensive or not.
> We waste so much time (as this thread has ironically > illustrated) on semantic crap (and for the morons, that doesn't mean I [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > ago when he was sprouting anti-gay sh.t. I didn't find the terms > offensive in any way, I just couldn't care less. The fact that you remembered the posts, who said it, when it was (approx) and what it was about indicates otherwise :-) But again that's not relevant to the original question, is the word nigger offensive? I think you partially hit on this before when you said that if you used the term towards one of your friends then it wasn't offensive basically because you are not expressing any hatred. On the other hand if the person is using the term to express hatred then I think it is offensive.
> But I do think it's > telling when the underlying reason (which is where I'm sure you and I do > concur) behind the term is the speakers belief that there actually _is_ > something inferior about being black, white, gay, whatever. I do agree although I don't think they truly believe what they say deep down. If you spoke to a true racist they would use defence mechanisms that gave away that they didn't believe what they were saying, such as getting angry and not letting you speak.
Michael
John McKenzie - 29 Apr 2006 08:43 GMT > > It's the sort of fodder though, that keeps us from really moving forward > > as a species. [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] > The fact that you remembered the posts, who said it, when it was (approx) > and what it was about indicates otherwise :-) To be honest no, I remember because both of the people involved (hatz with his bullshit, then david z with his attempt at comprehension) are both on my shitlist for being cowardly scumbags, who like to use such terms not so much as derogatory, but rather to prop themselves up. They've achieved nothing of any note as far as a contribution to society goes, and never will, useless oxygen thieves. So instead of trying to elevate themselves, they try and put others down with absurd concepts that someone can be inferior based on particular attributes which have absolutely no bearing on character.
I'd dearly love the chance of a cage match with either of them.
But again that's not relevant
> to the original question, is the word nigger offensive? I think you > partially hit on this before when you said that if you used the term towards > one of your friends then it wasn't offensive basically because you are not > expressing any hatred. On the other hand if the person is using the term to > express hatred then I think it is offensive. But one could argue that even when they _didn't_ use it, they still had the hatred, so what's the f.cking difference?
> > But I do think it's > > telling when the underlying reason (which is where I'm sure you and I do [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > gave away that they didn't believe what they were saying, such as getting > angry and not letting you speak. It's not that they believe it or not. It was never meant to be evidenced in any way. they are desperate for such arbitrations because they know they can't compete on level playing field. Which is the whole point of prejudice, putting someone down for illogical reasons, to shift focus from the fact that the person with the prejudices doesn't measure up in areas which really matter.
 Signature John McKenzie
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Clockmeister - 27 Apr 2006 21:43 GMT >> The topic has changed. >> [quoted text clipped - 38 lines] > seems to be a rarity). For the very simple fact that the colour of my > skin has nothing to do with my character or my heart. A-f.cking-men! Good post!
Uncle Bully - 26 Apr 2006 10:22 GMT Now you get loser of the week award too.
Dirkmonger - 26 Apr 2006 12:29 GMT Is it possible the word 'nigger' comes from the word 'niger' which I think is French for black?
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Knobdoodle - 26 Apr 2006 12:46 GMT > Is it possible the word 'nigger' comes from the word 'niger' which I > think is French for black? Yes but the word is "negro" and it's Spanish. -- Knob ("Nigger" is just how "negro" sounds after semi-literate southern-Americans have slurred it)
gonesailing_gonefishing - 26 Apr 2006 12:47 GMT > Is it possible the word 'nigger' comes from the word 'niger' which I > think is French for black? More likely it's a Southern (American) corruption of "negro." Try saying the word with your mouth half closed ansd try to really slur your speech. and you will probably see what I mean.
ShazWozza - 26 Apr 2006 10:22 GMT <Some crap>
What about Nigeria?
MikL - 26 Apr 2006 13:35 GMT > <Some crap> > > What about Nigeria? I've always suspected it might be because of slaves taken from Nigera to America. Which I guess is another reason why people wouldn't like being called that.
David Z - 26 Apr 2006 16:34 GMT > <Some crap> > > What about Nigeria? Nope. This from Wikipedia:
"The country's name first appeared in print in The Times in 1897 and was suggested by the paper's colonial editor Flora Shaw who would later marry Frederick Lugard, the first Govenor General of the Amalgamated Nigeria. The name comes from a combination of the words "Niger" (the country's longest river) and "Area"."
The word nigger has been used long before 1897.
Jason James - 26 Apr 2006 17:15 GMT > > <Some crap> > > [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > > The word nigger has been used long before 1897. That's correct. The reason the word draws such indignation from Africans against whites who use it, is because it symbolises their slavery at the hands of whites, even tho during that period, black co-conspirators were also guilty of helping round-up their own people for the slave-ships.
OTOH, Black men use the word amongst themselves as a put-down, both in jest and not..but that;s their preroggative.
Jason
Uncle Bully - 26 Apr 2006 23:01 GMT >> <Some crap> >> [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > > The word nigger has been used long before 1897. As Gonesailing said, it is a corruption of the word negro,which is French for black. If you watch Roots, the best dramatization of the American slave period I've seen, the southern accent pronounced negro as nee-gr, which then turned into nee-ger then nigger.
OzOne - 26 Apr 2006 23:25 GMT >If you watch Roots, the best dramatization of the American slave period I've >seen, the southern accent pronounced negro as nee-gr, which then turned into >nee-ger then nigger. Exactly, so calling a nigger a nigger is just calling him a negro and putting on a southern drawl.
Now what about lebbo... :-)
Oz1...of the 3 twins.
I welcome you to crackerbox palace,We've been expecting you.
VYBerlinaV8 - 27 Apr 2006 00:45 GMT I had a black guy call me honky the other day, so I called him nigger back. He was so surprised someone used the term that he didn't do a thing!
As far as I'm concerned, I'm happy to respect any human until they give me trouble, then the respect ends.
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Clockmeister - 27 Apr 2006 21:50 GMT > I had a black guy call me honky the other day, so I called him nigger > back. He was so surprised someone used the term that he didn't do a > thing! I wouldn't care if some black called me a honky. I doubt I would react at all since I don't find it in the slightest bit offensive.
> As far as I'm concerned, I'm happy to respect any human until they give > me trouble, then the respect ends. Call a spade a spade, they need to get over it.
veritas - 27 Apr 2006 03:00 GMT Nigon - Middle English word for black Negro - Black person from the Latin Niger Nigger - A derivation of a Negro person Niger - Latin for Black Negro - Spanish for black Negroid - A person of black race Negre - French for black Nigeria - A country Niger - A river (Africa) Negro - A river (SA) etc - etc
Is a person who's skin is black - really that colour or isn't it - that is the core of the matter. Here we have a minority wanting to destroy the valid language of several countries simply because they stumble over a word. What do they want to be described as - unblanc?
My message to them is 'get over it'. The word has its roots going back for thousands of years.
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