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Car Forum / BMW Cars / November 2008E46 - No Start, Lots of electricity
My daughter's 323 suddenly and without warning has failed to start. There is lots of power. The key is turned to START, but there is no noise from anywhere. I would expect to hear a relay click or something -- my Ford F150 makes all sorts of noises inside the dash from relays and such. My possibilities (the car is not at home yet so I don't have specifics) are the Neutral Safety Switch (NSS), the ignition switch itself, or a relay. According to the fuse panel layout sheet in the glove box, the possible fuses are all good -- I checked fuses that control the engine management and ignition, but if these fuses were the problem the motor would at least turn over. One more thing to look for is that the connection to the starter has not fallen apart. I'm thinking the NSS is my problem. If the car is not in Park or Neutral, the starter will not fire. The NSS can have a failure mode that mimics the gear selector being off of P or N. What I do not know is if the NSS does other jobs too, and what those jobs might be. I have a Bentley manual for my E36, but do not have one for my E46. I would not think the NSS has changed very much in the job it does, but there is no reason to think it is connected the same way. I guess I could do a parts search for the two different models and see if the same part comes up. OR, one of you guys could tell me so I can pick up a part on my way to the book store to get the manual. Do any of you guys know anything about the NSS? Where is is physically mounted -- inside or outside of the transmission -- what other functions it performs that might give a clue about its integrity, those sorts of things. Thanks, > My daughter's 323 suddenly and without warning has failed to start. > There is lots of power. The key is turned to START, but there is no > noise from anywhere. I would expect to hear a relay click or something > -- my Ford F150 makes all sorts of noises inside the dash from relays > and such. > My possibilities (the car is not at home yet so I don't have specifics) > are the Neutral Safety Switch (NSS), the ignition switch itself, or a [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > would at least turn over. One more thing to look for is that the > connection to the starter has not fallen apart. If it follows earlier models a common cause is the fuel pump relay failing.  Signature*Letting a cat out of the bag is easier than putting it back in * Dave Plowman dave@davenoise.co.uk London SW To e-mail, change noise into sound. >> My daughter's 323 suddenly and without warning has failed to start. >> There is lots of power. The key is turned to START, but there is no [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] > If it follows earlier models a common cause is the fuel pump relay > failing. Really! The car is completely dead -- well the starter never kicks in, everything else seems okay. I get no crank, no click, no effort at all when the key gets to RUN. Nothing. The idiot lights turn off as if the starter was cranking, but there is no crank action (that sounds dirty when Bill Clinton says it) at all. I would expect the fuel pump relay to allow the engine to turn over. I lied. When the key is turned to RUN, the lights on the dash do not go off. The lights that go off due to completion of the respective selft test go out, but nothing else happens. > >> My daughter's 323 suddenly and without warning has failed to start. > >> There is lots of power. The key is turned to START, but there is no [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] > > If it follows earlier models a common cause is the fuel pump relay > > failing. > Really! > The car is completely dead -- well the starter never kicks in, > everything else seems okay. Sorry missed that part. Signature*If you ate pasta and anti-pasta, would you still be hungry? Dave Plowman dave@davenoise.co.uk London SW To e-mail, change noise into sound. > My daughter's 323 suddenly and without warning has failed to start. There > is lots of power. The key is turned to START, but there is no noise from [quoted text clipped - 27 lines] > > Thanks, There are no problems with the starter connections. IT'S THE KEY! Crap! We have a valet key and the main key.l The main key has some sort of electronic magic thingie inside that is not speaking the right language for some other magic electronic thingie. The valet key does not have the magic stuff inside, and the car starts when this key is used. Go figure ... >> My daughter's 323 suddenly and without warning has failed to start. There >> is lots of power. The key is turned to START, but there is no noise from [quoted text clipped - 29 lines] > > There are no problems with the starter connections. Had the same problem myself, I think, if I read your post correctly. Firstly, turn the key and no action? On the dash is the little engine symbol on? Last time that happened to me it was the whole ignition loom gone awol - £650!!!, but this time it was the fuel pump! Cos there's no fuel getting to the engine the system shuts down to protect it - no point turning it over when nothing happens. Got it relayed to a friends garage and he replaced the pump, going good style since then. Hope this helps, John > IT'S THE KEY! > [quoted text clipped - 42 lines] > > - Show quoted text - My car (daughter's car) starts and runs fine with the Valet Key, but it's deader than a door nail with the Main Key. The theft deterent system had kicked in because it did not see the main key as a valid option. Had the same problem myself, I think, if I read your post correctly. Firstly, turn the key and no action? On the dash is the little engine symbol on? Last time that happened to me it was the whole ignition loom gone awol - £650!!!, but this time it was the fuel pump! Cos there's no fuel getting to the engine the system shuts down to protect it - no point turning it over when nothing happens. Got it relayed to a friends garage and he replaced the pump, going good style since then. Hope this helps, John My daughter's car now responds to the main key, so I'm a bit confused as to how it really works. Does anybody know what makes the car respondj (or not respond) the key? I get the part about the theft deterent system, what I don't get is how the theft deterent system knows if the key is right or wrong for the car. Clearly the problem my daughtrer is having is key-centric, she can use the main key and the car does not start, she can immediately use the valet key (secondary key) and the car starts fine. Now, the car starts okay with the main key again. She says that sometimes, the main key won't work. > My daughter's 323 suddenly and without warning has failed to start. There > is lots of power. The key is turned to START, but there is no noise from [quoted text clipped - 27 lines] > > Thanks, > My daughter's car now responds to the main key, so I'm a bit confused as > to how it really works. Does anybody know what makes the car respondj (or [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > (secondary key) and the car starts fine. Now, the car starts okay with the > main key again. She says that sometimes, the main key won't work. Not sure how it works for the E46/E90, but with some '06 and newer BMW motorcycles there have been some communication failures between the chip in the key and the receiving antenna on the ignition switch - usually caused by the antenna and resulting in a no start situation and an error message on the dash. Unfortunately, it sounds like the dealer will have to sort it out. Tom K. |
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