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Car Forum / BMW Cars / June 20062-Day Performance Center School Experience
Hi all, Just wanted to relate that I recently attended the 2-Day school at the Performance Center in Spartanburg and learned a LOT. After I hit my second deer in a year with the 328 I convinced myself that I needed to become a bit more comfortable with the vehicle at and beyond its limits. I've always had fun driving the 328, but I must admit I've never had the nads to risk my $40K investment to really learn how to drive it. When I picked up the 330ci ZHP last month and realized its performance potential, I knew I needed to get some professional instruction or I was going to roll it up in a ball (maybe not with DSC on, but how do you test limits with it on?) All I can say is that if you're like me and have never had any formal driving instruction I can wholeheartedly recommend you attend the 2 day school. The instructors are all top-shelf people, and the class is quite reasonably priced. If you're going to the trouble of going there, I'd recommend you NOT just take the 1 day school because a bunch of the fun that separates this course from a garden variety CCA course is on day 2. You could probably do an CCA event or something similar for a lot less, but then you'd be beating on your own car, and you wouldn't get to drive all the cars we did. M5, M3, Z4M Roadster, X5 4.8, 650ci and the luxo cruser 760i. Well worth the $$$ I think. It's amazing how much the course had an impact on my driving habits and my comfort zone. Everything from setting the mirrors and seating position to how to hold (and rapidly turn) the wheel. Stupid easy stuff that I was never taught before now. I wrote up a full review on my site if you want to know the details. Click through: BMW->Articles->Performance Center School Safe driving, -Doug -------------------- Doug Vetter, ATP/CFI dwvcfii@yahoo.com http://www.dvatp.com -------------------- > Hi all, > > Just wanted to relate that I recently attended the 2-Day school at the > Performance Center in Spartanburg and learned a LOT. 8< snip 8< snip 8< snip 8< snip 8< > It's amazing how much the course had an impact on my driving habits and > my comfort zone. Everything from setting the mirrors and seating [quoted text clipped - 15 lines] > http://www.dvatp.com > -------------------- Thanks for the review, Doug. If ever I get the chance I will do likewise.  Signature-Fred W Good review. What was the cost of your two days training? Thanks, John > Hi all, > [quoted text clipped - 44 lines] > http://www.dvatp.com > -------------------- > Good review. What was the cost of your two days training? $895. For more info on the courses, check out: http://www.bmwusa.com/bmwexperience/PerformanceCenter/school.htm -Doug -------------------- Doug Vetter, ATP/CFI dwvcfii@yahoo.com http://www.dvatp.com -------------------- Thanks for writing all that! One question: why is it wrong to adjust the mirrors so that you can barely see the side of the car? I've always thought that it's pointless to look at the side of your car - you want to see as much of what's going on around the car as possible, retaining only a bit of the car itself for orientation. > Thanks for writing all that! One question: why is it wrong to adjust > the mirrors so that you can barely see the side of the car? I've always > thought that it's pointless to look at the side of your car - you want > to see as much of what's going on around the car as possible, retaining > only a bit of the car itself for orientation. To put it simply, you have three mirrors so they can be oriented such that they form one large mirror. There is no point to setting your mirrors so that you can just barely see either side of the car from the vantage point of the driver's seat because if you do that it means they are overlapping coverage with the rear view mirror. Not only is that a waste of mirror real estate, it also produces blind spots. What you want to achieve is to set the side mirrors so they provide a clear view of the adjacent lanes. While some driving on a multi-lane highway will help you fine tune things, you can ballpark the side view mirrors by doing the following: Left: Open the window and put your head where the window would be. Adjust the mirror so you can just barely see the side of the car. Right: Put your head in the center of the car and adjust the mirror so you can barely see the side of the car. When you return to your normal seating position and go out and drive a bit, watch cars in the mirrors as they approach you from the rear. You'll see them first in the rear view mirror and then transition (with the slightest bit of overlap) to the adjacent side view mirror. If you've set things up correctly, in this scenario you'll never lose sight of the vehicle. Long winded, but I hope that explains it. -Doug -------------------- Doug Vetter, ATP/CFI dwvcfii@yahoo.com http://www.dvatp.com -------------------- >> Thanks for writing all that! One question: why is it wrong to adjust >> the mirrors so that you can barely see the side of the car? I've [quoted text clipped - 26 lines] > you've set things up correctly, in this scenario you'll never lose sight > of the vehicle. That is not what I have learned in professionally administered driving safety courses. They have always stressed that the passenger (right in US) side mirror, which is convex, should be adjusted so that you can barely see side of the car and the rear view mirror should be biased toward that side also (not straight back). That way, the blind spot on that side of the car can be virtually eliminated by overlapping the mirrors. The drivers side mirror then also has to be adjusted tight to the side of the car (barely see the side) since the center mirror is biased away from it. There will still be a small blind spot on the drivers side but you can do a quick head-turn check before making lane changes in that direction. Of course a good driver maintains an awareness of the surrounding traffic at all times and so you should already know if a car has entered the blind spot, but we all get distracted from time to time... Signature-Fred W > That is not what I have learned in professionally administered driving > safety courses. Me neither! Oh well, I guess we'll all have those newfangled radar systems soon, with a heads-up display to say whether it's safe to change lanes. > That is not what I have learned in professionally administered driving > safety courses. They have always stressed that the passenger (right in [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > can do a quick head-turn check before making lane changes in that > direction. However, for those of us old coots who don't have the mobility for a complete "quick head-turn check" anymore, the wider field mirror spacing does work better. I suggest trying it both ways. > Of course a good driver maintains an awareness of the surrounding traffic > at all times and so you should already know if a car has entered the blind > spot, but we all get distracted from time to time... You mean we have to put down the drink, hang up the phone, turn off the TV and really pay attention to driving??? Tom K. > However, for those of us old coots who don't have the mobility for a > complete "quick head-turn check" anymore, the wider field mirror spacing > does work better. I suggest trying it both ways. I'm a pretty old coot too, Tom. I'd suggest that if you can't turn your head and neck 90 degrees to look out the side window it's time to hang up the driving gloves... ;-) > You mean we have to put down the drink, hang up the phone, turn off the TV > and really pay attention to driving??? Yes, exactly. Signature-Fred W >> However, for those of us old coots who don't have the mobility for a >> complete "quick head-turn check" anymore, the wider field mirror spacing [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > head and neck 90 degrees to look out the side window it's time to hang up > the driving gloves... ;-) Hell no! Seriously, after a couple of back surgeries, I can do 75o, but 90 or more causes pain, so the suggested mirror method does seem to add a margin of safety for me. I also tend to back into parking spaces so as to be safer when coming out, but this is partly based on the principle that one may have to leave in a hurry. >> You mean we have to put down the drink, hang up the phone, turn off the >> TV and really pay attention to driving??? > > Yes, exactly. But that is positively un-American!! Doesn't the Bill of Rights guarantee the right to multifunction while driving?-) Tom K. The UK Highway Code actually specifies that one should back into drives etc on the basis that one should not back into higher priority roads. http://www.highwaycode.gov.uk/19.htm#176 (Rule 177) DAS For direct contact replace nospam with schmetterling --- [...] > margin of safety for me. I also tend to back into parking spaces so as > to be safer when coming out, but this is partly based on the principle > that one may have to leave in a hurry. [...] > The UK Highway Code actually specifies that one should back into drives > etc on the basis that one should not back into higher priority roads. > > http://www.highwaycode.gov.uk/19.htm#176 > > (Rule 177) That makes a lot of sense, although I doubt that any U.S. states/localities have a similar statute - thanks for the link. Tom K. It does (make sense) but the rule is largely observed in the breach, even in (right-angle) spaces next to very busy roads. DAS For direct contact replace nospam with schmetterling --- [...] > That makes a lot of sense, although I doubt that any U.S. > states/localities have a similar statute - thanks for the link. > > Tom K. > > However, for those of us old coots who don't have the mobility for a > > complete "quick head-turn check" anymore, the wider field mirror spacing [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > head and neck 90 degrees to look out the side window it's time to hang > up the driving gloves... ;-) OTOH, I'd suggest that if you can't set your mirrors so a 90º turn is not needed, maybe *you* ought to hang 'em up. ;^) Remember, as I turn about 30º to look directly into my driver side mirror, my ~180º peripheral vision is covering everything that's beside me back to about 8:00 and my mirror is telling me that there's nothing immediately behind that. -- C.R. Krieger (Been there; taught that) >>>However, for those of us old coots who don't have the mobility for a >>>complete "quick head-turn check" anymore, the wider field mirror spacing [quoted text clipped - 11 lines] > beside me back to about 8:00 and my mirror is telling me that there's > nothing immediately behind that. I know you are just being you Krieger, which is to say argumentative, but anyone that drives and doesn't glance over their shoulder (using peripheral vision or not) when they are changing lanes is not a safe driver. Signature-Fred W > > Remember, as I turn about 30º to look directly into my driver side > > mirror, my ~180º peripheral vision is covering everything that's [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > but anyone that drives and doesn't glance over their shoulder (using > peripheral vision or not) when they are changing lanes is not a safe driver. Think of it as 'Devil's Advocacy'. ;^) Nonetheless, that's my story and I'm stickin' to it. I look to the mirror and depend on peripheral vision to cover the space back to the mirror's view. If you look at the area covered, you can see that my peripheral vision *does* go behind my shoulders. Adding this to my usual high level of situational awareness (I note and remember what's back there.), I can safely drive through a whole city without ever using my 2º or 3º of focused vision any farther back than my outside mirrors. -- C.R. Krieger (Been there; seen that) > That is not what I have learned in professionally administered driving > safety courses. They have always stressed that the passenger (right in > US) side mirror, which is convex, should be adjusted so that you can > barely see side of the car So far, I can agree. A convex mirror covers more area, so it can be set to barely see the side surface of the car; but slightly further out isn't a bad idea either. > and the rear view mirror should be biased > toward that side also (not straight back). That way, the blind spot on > that side of the car can be virtually eliminated by overlapping the > mirrors. Here's where I have to start disagreeing. You never need to 'overlap' two mirrors' coverage areas. Why do you need to see the same stuff twice? You not only don't need an overlap, you don't need *continuity*. Remember what hazards exist in your 'blind spot'. You're not worried about telephone poles sneaking up in there; you're concerned about vehicles! No vehicle you encounter on the road will take up less than 3 feet in width (a motorcycle/scooter) or less than at least 6 feet in length (again, a scooter). Your mirrors need to be this close *and no closer* to eliminate the blind spot. A properly adjusted passenger side mirror and a 'straight back' inside mirror accomplish this. Now we move on to the third mirror: > The drivers side mirror then also has to be adjusted tight to the side > of the car (barely see the side) since the center mirror is biased away > from it. There will still be a small blind spot on the drivers side but > you can do a quick head-turn check before making lane changes in that > direction. Sorry; but this leaves a huge blind spot right where you need it least: right beside you, but out of your peripheral vision. If you follow the aiming concept from the other side, you can set your driver side mirror so that it catches the *outside front* of any vehicle as its *inside rear* leaves your inside mirror's view. Yes; there's a blind spot between them. [Watch out for cruising telephone poles and signposts!] However, by the time a passing vehicle is leaving the viewing area of your side mirror, it should already be in your peripheral view as it passes. In the end, no head-turning (at least not more than a few dozen degrees) is needed. [Did you know that most people steer in the direction they turn their heads to look behind them?] To sum up my rules most simply: 1.) You don't need to see anything twice. 2.) The spaces between your mirrors' coverage areas are necessary because of 1.) 3.) Those necessary spaces need to be small enough to reveal *part of* a vehicle in both adjacent mirrors, but *not* the whole vehicle. > Of course a good driver maintains an awareness of the surrounding > traffic at all times and so you should already know if a car has entered > the blind spot, but we all get distracted from time to time... Never a problem for me. Although I *do* have blind spots between my mirrors' coverages, they are precisely sized so nothing that can hurt me will fit into them. One of these days, I'll get around to sticking that Wink mirror in ... -- C.R. Krieger (Been there; taught that) > twice? You not only don't need an overlap, you don't need > *continuity*. Remember what hazards exist in your 'blind spot'. > You're not worried about telephone poles sneaking up in there; you're > concerned about vehicles! No vehicle you encounter on the road will > take up less than 3 feet in width (a motorcycle/scooter) Except a bicycle. Let's not forget them. Continuity in the field of view is desirable and necessary. So are proper shoulder checks. > > twice? You not only don't need an overlap, you don't need > > *continuity*. Remember what hazards exist in your 'blind spot'. [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > Except a bicycle. Let's not forget them. Continuity in the field of > view is desirable and necessary. So are proper shoulder checks. No bicycle catches up to me or matches my speed unless I'm virtually stopped. If there is a bicycle in my very small blind spots, it entered the street in them and somehow managed to match my speed for some distance. This is a virtual impossibility. When driving, I am much more acutely aware of my surroundings (including bicycles) than anyone you know. -- C.R. Krieger (Drove around that) >>>twice? You not only don't need an overlap, you don't need >>>*continuity*. Remember what hazards exist in your 'blind spot'. [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > entered the street in them and somehow managed to match my speed for > some distance. This is a virtual impossibility. Mopeds or scooters can easily match your speed and even exceed it in town, yet they are just as easy to overlook as bicycles. > Mopeds or scooters can easily match your speed and even exceed it in > town, yet they are just as easy to overlook as bicycles. You obviously don't know my town. The only mopeds I run over are the ones that are asking for it ... =:^D -- C.R. Krieger (Been there; drove that) > No bicycle catches up to me or matches my speed unless I'm virtually > stopped. If there is a bicycle in my very small blind spots, it > entered the street in them and somehow managed to match my speed for > some distance. This is a virtual impossibility. You obviously don't drive in the city. For most of us city-dwellers, bikes are perfectly capable of matching and even exceeding a car's speed in the downtown core. It would be a real shame to kill someone because you're so committed to having your blind spots. > That is not what I have learned in professionally administered driving > safety courses. They have always stressed that the passenger (right in [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > that side of the car can be virtually eliminated by overlapping the > mirrors. I would suggest these professionally administered (by whom?) driving safety courses were in error. EVERY course I have heard of in the past 10 years has taught that SIDE VIEW mirrors are for viewing what is alongside you and REAR VIEW for what is behind you. Take any "50 Alive" course - usually taught by State Police in NJ (who are professionals of a sort) - and you'll hear EXACTLY the technique suggested by Doug. They reinforce it for the drivers by having them sit in a car and having someone else walk around the car. With the mirrors correctly adjusted the driver can keep track of the person walking around the car - all 360 degrees without EVER turning their head. > Of course a good driver maintains an awareness of the surrounding > traffic at all times and so you should already know if a car has entered > the blind spot, but we all get distracted from time to time... If you set your mirrors as Doug suggested - there is NO blind spot. And that's the important point. NO blind spot. Think on that for a while. Why in the world would you want a blind spot? Really Fred - try it. Drive with them that way for 30 minutes in different road conditions. I'll guarantee you won't go back to how you have them adjusted now.. and you'll be a safer driver. Thanks for the review. I signed up for this class the week of July 4th a few weeks ago and was not sure what to expect. Sounds like it could be fun. John > To put it simply, you have three mirrors so they can be oriented such > that they form one large mirror. There is no point to setting your [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > Left: Open the window and put your head where the window would be. > Adjust the mirror so you can just barely see the side of the car. Hell, I tried this, but my mirror doesn't even go that far! > Right: Put your head in the center of the car and adjust the mirror so > you can barely see the side of the car. > Hell, I tried this, but my mirror doesn't even go that far! Then your mirror is broken. I've never seen a BMW mirror that couldn't be adjusted like this. |
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