Car Forum / BMW Cars / August 2006
how far can you drive bmw without stopping?
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aagastya@gmail.com - 17 Aug 2006 16:18 GMT it's a fair question, i think. could someone point me in the right direction?
i'm gonna be moving home for good. it's a 12.5 hour drive (roughly 850 miles). so, i'd like to know if there's a recommended way of handling the drive.
i have a 1999 323i.
if this has been covered somewhere else already, could you post the link here please? or you could directly email me: aagastya@gmail.com
Thanks.
Pete - 17 Aug 2006 16:25 GMT > i'm gonna be moving home for good. it's a 12.5 hour drive (roughly 850 > miles). so, i'd like to know if there's a recommended way of handling > the drive. > > i have a 1999 323i. If you're planning on doing it in 1 day, get a second driver to help you out. I've done 900 miles in one day (took about 15 hours), and it can be tiring, regardless how much you love driving. If you don't have a second driver, split it in two days - your drive will be much more enjoyable, not to mention safer.
Cheers,
Pete
Richard Sexton - 17 Aug 2006 16:34 GMT This depends more on your bladder than the car. It doesn't need to stop.
You might though.
 Signature Need Mercedes parts? http://parts.mbz.org Richard Sexton | Mercedes stuff: http://mbz.org 1970 280SE, 72 280SE | Home pages: http://rs79.vrx.net 633CSi 250SE/C 300SD | http://aquaria.net http://killi.net
Dave Plowman (News) - 18 Aug 2006 18:47 GMT > This depends more on your bladder than the car. It doesn't need to stop. I doubt a 323 will do 850 miles without re-fuelling.
 Signature *Life is hard; then you nap
Dave Plowman dave@davenoise.co.uk London SW To e-mail, change noise into sound.
clifffreeling@yahoo.com - 17 Aug 2006 16:39 GMT > it's a fair question, i think. could someone point me in the right > direction? Do you mean, "how far can I get on one tank of gas?" or "how long can *I* drive without rest?"
> i'm gonna be moving home for good. it's a 12.5 hour drive (roughly 850 > miles). so, i'd like to know if there's a recommended way of handling > the drive. Okay, it's the latter. Only you can answer that question. Why ask us? A 12½ hour drive in one day shouldn't be a big deal for a grown man. I've had more grueling drives in my time.
----- Kill ratio of Palestinian children to Israeli children 5.7-to-1, Israel's favor. Kill ratio of all Palestinians to Israelis: over 3-to-1. --------- http://www.lrb.co.uk/v28/n06/print/mear01_.html ---------- "Don't worry about American pressure on Israel. We, the Jewish people, control America, and the Americans know it." ---Israeli Prime Minister Ariel Sharon, 2001
 Signature Cliff
aagastya@gmail.com - 17 Aug 2006 16:48 GMT Oh boy. If i'm asking a question about how "I" want to handle the drive, then why the #@$#@$#@ would I post it in "alt.autos.bmw"?
Since i got 3 replies- and none of you got my question, I'll take the blame for not articulating the question properly.
So, here it is: Will there be any problems with my '99 323i car if I drive it continuously for almost 13 hours/roughly 850 miles? There, that's better. Thanks.
Still, I take credit for the post-question- "how far can you drive bmw without stopping?" it wasn't "how far can you drive without stopping?" now, was it???
:) :) :) -A
> > it's a fair question, i think. could someone point me in the right > > direction? [quoted text clipped - 20 lines] > the Jewish people, control America, and the Americans know it." > ---Israeli Prime Minister Ariel Sharon, 2001 aagastya@gmail.com - 17 Aug 2006 16:50 GMT Actually, I think Richard Sexton got it. :) I'll definitely need to stop- for every 3 hours. At least for food. ;-)
aagas...@gmail.com wrote:
> Oh boy. If i'm asking a question about how "I" want to handle the > drive, then why the #@$#@$#@ would I post it in "alt.autos.bmw"? [quoted text clipped - 37 lines] > > the Jewish people, control America, and the Americans know it." > > ---Israeli Prime Minister Ariel Sharon, 2001 joe_tide - 17 Aug 2006 17:05 GMT Richard did get it right.
I've driven straight through from Pennsylvania to Alabama (about 900 miles / 13 hours) - non-stop except for restroom stops and gas. The car seemed to want to go on, but I was getting a little tired by then. ;-)
Actually, I think Richard Sexton got it. :) I'll definitely need to stop- for every 3 hours. At least for food. ;-)
aagas...@gmail.com wrote:
> Oh boy. If i'm asking a question about how "I" want to handle the > drive, then why the #@$#@$#@ would I post it in "alt.autos.bmw"? [quoted text clipped - 39 lines] > > the Jewish people, control America, and the Americans know it." > > ---Israeli Prime Minister Ariel Sharon, 2001 Fred W - 17 Aug 2006 16:55 GMT > Oh boy. If i'm asking a question about how "I" want to handle the > drive, then why the #@$#@$#@ would I post it in "alt.autos.bmw"? [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > drive it continuously for almost 13 hours/roughly 850 miles? There, > that's better. Thanks. No. Absolutely not a problem due to continuous use. That is, no problems that wouldn't have happened in the next 850 miles of normal use. In fact, continuous use is easier on the car than the normal stopping and starting we put our cars through on a regular basis.
Hope that answers your *real* question.
 Signature -Fred W
Pete - 17 Aug 2006 17:00 GMT > So, here it is: Will there be any problems with my '99 323i car if I > drive it continuously for almost 13 hours/roughly 850 miles? In that case, no.
Pete
clifffreeling@yahoo.com - 17 Aug 2006 17:15 GMT > Oh boy. If i'm asking a question about how "I" want to handle the > drive, then why the #@$#@$#@ would I post it in "alt.autos.bmw"? I really have no real idea why you asked the question in the first place.
> So, here it is: Will there be any problems with my '99 323i car if I > drive it continuously for almost 13 hours/roughly 850 miles? There, > that's better. Thanks. You can't be serious. Are you thinking that the car will need to take rest breaks or something? It should only need gas a couple of times, assuming it's been checked out for a long trip, e.g. proper levels of vital fluids with no leaks; no neglected simmering problems otherwise with the car that could leave you sitting on the side of the road....
----- Kill ratio of Palestinian children to Israeli children 5.7-to-1, Israel's favor. Kill ratio of all Palestinians to Israelis: over 3-to-1. --------- http://www.lrb.co.uk/v28/n06/print/mear01_.html ---------- "Don't worry about American pressure on Israel. We, the Jewish people, control America, and the Americans know it." ---Israeli Prime Minister Ariel Sharon, 2001
 Signature Cliff
David Z - 17 Aug 2006 17:39 GMT > > The quote in your sig is fabricated by liars, you a.shole!!!!!! > > > > The quote is attributed to a reporter who says it's a FABRICATED > > LIE!!!!!!! > > > > What's your source, a.shole?????!!!!!!! (more nonresponse responses)
Well, a.shole...WHAT'S YOUR SOURCE???????!!!!!!!!
Toby - 17 Aug 2006 22:29 GMT >> > The quote in your sig is fabricated by liars, you a.shole!!!!!! >> > [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > >Well, a.shole...WHAT'S YOUR SOURCE???????!!!!!!!! It's STFU.
Psycho - 18 Aug 2006 12:17 GMT David, first off, Cliff is gone. He hates it when someone knows who he is. He has posted here before under many names. His favorite one I won't mention but someone else might. Let it go, you're getting to be almost as annoying as the troll...
>> > The quote in your sig is fabricated by liars, you a.shole!!!!!! >> > [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > >Well, a.shole...WHAT'S YOUR SOURCE???????!!!!!!!! Floyd Rogers - 17 Aug 2006 17:38 GMT >So, here it is: Will there be any problems with my '99 323i car if I >drive it continuously for almost 13 hours/roughly 850 miles? There, >that's better. Thanks. 4 Things: 1) Please turn off the HTML. Newsgroup posting should be plain text. 2) Be sure your windshield washer reservoir (and other fluids FTM) is full. 3) Coke (or any other sugared and caffeinated beverage) is my choice for drinks when you get sleepy: just the act of reaching and sipping helps keep you alert.
FloydR
Rex B - 17 Aug 2006 18:18 GMT > Oh boy. If i'm asking a question about how "I" want to handle the > drive, then why the #@$#@$#@ would I post it in "alt.autos.bmw"? > > Since i got 3 replies- and none of you got my question, I'll take the > blame for not articulating the question properly. As well you should
> So, here it is: Will there be any problems with my '99 323i car if I > drive it continuously for almost 13 hours/roughly 850 miles? There, > that's better. Thanks. well, no, of course not.
> Still, I take credit for the post-question- "how far can you drive bmw > without stopping?" it wasn't "how far can you drive without stopping?" > now, was it??? No, it was "How far can YOU drive..." You introduced a human elemt into a mechanical question and muddied the water. Your original question could be taken at least 3 ways that I can think of. My first reaction was "Damn, can this boy not do simple math?" But any of the 3 possibilities seemed pretty silly to me, so I didn't answer ;)
As they say, YMMV
aagastya@gmail.com - 17 Aug 2006 19:52 GMT uh huh. very funny you guys. 1. Floyd - don't know how to turn off the html-tag feature. i didn't know i was/am doing that. i'm posting via a mosiac-type browser and i see no option to turn off htm-tags. thanks for the other suggestions. 2. Rex - "you" is such a generic term. americans use it all the time. so american aesthetics (given that i'm american..or a little americanized, depending on how you look at it) made me use that term. or i'd have posted using the phrase "how far can one drive...?" ok? period. or in your case, "full stop". what's YMMV? 3. David - thanks for the "a.shole" message. it gave me a kick ;-) 4. Jeremy - i listen to a variety of songs, in various languages. and at times, sing out loud. that's how i stay awake, usually. and i eat light. that way, all the oxygen stays in my head :) 5. Tom - thanks for that suggestion, but cruise control gets boring, no? also, i could get sleepy ;-) 6. Cliff - I was being serious with my question. i wanted to know if a 99 model would have any problems if it were to run for that long. any trip over 300 or 500 miles? it's wise to ask a few silly questions. thanks for the tips. i got a full service a coupla months ago- and a 3-hour trip to baltimore went fine. so, i think i'm good :) 7. Fred, Pete & Joe - thanks to both of you.
> No, it was "How far can YOU drive..." You introduced a human elemt into > a mechanical question and muddied the water. [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > > As they say, YMMV Rex B - 17 Aug 2006 21:53 GMT > what's YMMV? Your Mileage May Vary
> 3. David - thanks for the "a.shole" message. it gave me a kick ;-) > 4. Jeremy - i listen to a variety of songs, in various languages. and > at times, sing out loud. that's how i stay awake, usually. and i eat > light. What does light taste like?
Jim - 17 Aug 2006 20:03 GMT Oh boy. If i'm asking a question about how "I" want to handle the drive, then why the #@$#@$#@ would I post it in "alt.autos.bmw"?
Since i got 3 replies- and none of you got my question, I'll take the blame for not articulating the question properly.
So, here it is: Will there be any problems with my '99 323i car if I drive it continuously for almost 13 hours/roughly 850 miles? There, that's better. Thanks.
Still, I take credit for the post-question- "how far can you drive bmw without stopping?" it wasn't "how far can you drive without stopping?" now, was it???
:) :) :) -A
As my 325 gets about 32 mpg at 60 mph, and as the gasoline tank holds about 16 gallons, it will not go 850 miles without stopping. Ignoring the gasoline stop because there aren't many cars that can go 850 miles on a single tank of gasoline, of course my 325 will go 850 miles without fear of failure. Jim
clifffreeling@yahoo.com wrote:
> aagastya@gmail.com wrote: > > it's a fair question, i think. could someone point me in the right [quoted text clipped - 21 lines] > the Jewish people, control America, and the Americans know it." > ---Israeli Prime Minister Ariel Sharon, 2001 Tom Sanderson - 17 Aug 2006 16:55 GMT > how far can you drive bmw without stopping?
> it's a fair question, i think. could someone point me in the right > direction? [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > > i have a 1999 323i. Well, when I had to go cross country with my '97 318i, I could get 600 miles per tank if I sucked it nearly dry. That's on open Internstate, cruisecontrol at 70 mph the whole time.
If your 323i has an instantaneous fuel economy display, get yourself in a nice level open road, put it in cruise at the speed you're going to do your trip, and see what you're getting. Then just multiply that by your tank capacity and you should be close.
Tom.
Jeremy - 17 Aug 2006 17:30 GMT > > how far can you drive bmw without stopping? > [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > per tank if I sucked it nearly dry. That's on open Internstate, > cruisecontrol at 70 mph the whole time. How *do* you stay awake?
 Signature jeremy ['01 BMW 530iA SE Touring]
perry lee - 17 Aug 2006 21:44 GMT > Well, when I had to go cross country with my '97 318i, I could get 600 miles > per tank if I sucked it nearly dry. That's on open Internstate, [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > > Tom. There is a "miles remaining" display on our Z3, that tells me how many miles are left on the current tank if I maintain my present speed. Very handy for those times when you know there isn't any gas for the next hundred or so miles. I would assume this is a standard feature of the obc.
Jeff Strickland - 18 Aug 2006 01:35 GMT I live near San Diego. I took myself, my wife, and two other adults in a 325i from our home to the Grand Canyon in a day. We stopped for a few photos, lunch and gas. It is something on the order of 600 miles from my house to The Hole.
If you take the required potty breaks, and get some food when you fill the tank, I see no reason why you couldn't make the journey without hitting a hotel, especially if you have another driver.
> it's a fair question, i think. could someone point me in the right > direction? [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > > Thanks. ggslash - 18 Aug 2006 03:20 GMT this post is funny,
my advice is i agree with Rex, thats just the easier and safest way, you will barely lose a drop from the trip. unless theirs hills which you will burn more, but i doubt it.
and i think you can stay awake for 12 13 hours, just dont get to bored. your going to need a crap load of cd's
R. Mark Clayton - 18 Aug 2006 13:15 GMT > it's a fair question, i think. could someone point me in the right > direction? [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > > Thanks. Check all the fluids and tyres thoroughly.
Get a good night's sleep beforehand (although better IMHO to split the trip over two days).
The UK TV program managed to drive and Audi A8 diesel from London to Edinburgh and back (~800miles) on a tankful, but this probably means cruising at 56mph (90kmph), which makes for even more time behind the wheel.
ggslash - 18 Aug 2006 16:06 GMT > Check all the fluids and tyres thoroughly. > [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > Edinburgh and back (~800miles) on a tankful, but this probably means > cruising at 56mph (90kmph), which makes for even more time behind the wheel. doesn't matter how fast or slow you go, if you can keep the car at a good pace burning less petrol you'll be fine.
It shows on the economic display under the speedo
R. Mark Clayton - 18 Aug 2006 18:19 GMT >> Check all the fluids and tyres thoroughly. >> [quoted text clipped - 11 lines] > > It shows on the economic display under the speedo Yes it does.
The most economic speed is normally 56mph. On big BMW's the auto boxes change up into top at this speed in part because this is the speed that EU consumption figures are given for.
If you go slower a lower gear will be selected, giving more revs and higher consumption.
If you go faster then you just use more fuel.
Interestingly on the 735i that I had cruise control on, it used to do better with cruise set than with me holding a steady speed with the accelerator.
perry lee - 19 Aug 2006 11:10 GMT > The most economic speed is normally 56mph. On big BMW's the auto boxes > change up into top at this speed in part because this is the speed that EU [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > Interestingly on the 735i that I had cruise control on, it used to do better > with cruise set than with me holding a steady speed with the accelerator. I have a '98 Z3, 2.8 litre 5-speed. 55 - 65 mph in 5th gear, cruise control and top down highway driving gives me 25 to 26 mpg. 75 to 85 mph, same conditions gives me 28.5 to 30 mpg.
Tom K. - 19 Aug 2006 19:05 GMT >> The most economic speed is normally 56mph. On big BMW's the auto boxes >> change up into top at this speed in part because this is the speed that [quoted text clipped - 14 lines] > control and top down highway driving gives me 25 to 26 mpg. 75 to 85 > mph, same conditions gives me 28.5 to 30 mpg. Interesting. My '97 Z3, 2.8 5-speed averaged 30 to 32 mpg at 55~65 and about 28 to 29 mpg at 75~85. Are you measuring actual miles driven divided by gallons used, or are you relying on the OBC?
Tom K.
R. Mark Clayton - 19 Aug 2006 19:28 GMT >>> The most economic speed is normally 56mph. On big BMW's the auto boxes >>> change up into top at this speed in part because this is the speed that [quoted text clipped - 21 lines] > > Tom K. And what sort of gearbox?
Tom K. - 19 Aug 2006 20:15 GMT >>>> The most economic speed is normally 56mph. On big BMW's the auto boxes >>>> change up into top at this speed in part because this is the speed that [quoted text clipped - 23 lines] > > And what sort of gearbox? Believe I wrote "5-speed" (meaning manual) with stock 3.15 differential.
Tom K.
perry lee - 20 Aug 2006 02:08 GMT > > I have a '98 Z3, 2.8 litre 5-speed. 55 - 65 mph in 5th gear, cruise > > control and top down highway driving gives me 25 to 26 mpg. 75 to 85 [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > > Tom K. Mostly the obc. I did the math when we first had the car, but /I gave it up when I realized the OBC was accurate, at least on a long trip with steady driving between fillups.
aagastya@gmail.com - 18 Aug 2006 19:34 GMT thanks everyone, for posting ;-) turns out- i'm *terrible* at articulating a question. gas/petrol prices, gas mileage, stops for gas, stops for breaks, etc weren't even my concern(s).
every car has got a capacity, right? a capacity that says 'ok, it can go only so far/long (distance-wise and time-wise) before it needs a solid break'. that's the capacity i was talking about when i was talking about my 99 323i ;-) it's an old car, has 78K on it, and is generally well maintained, but y'know, i've never taken on such a long trip before, so i thought i'd ask. i guess a 900-mile trip is nothing.
thanks again for sharing your experiences and adding your thoughts to my concern. i definitely feel much better now ;-)
btw, go through this link when you get a chance (i'm sure it's been posted elsewhere too, but it still gave me a kick; there was another link on bbc that i can't find now- that's even funnier, htis one is ok): http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml;jsessionid=VZO1H5C3MVIJLQFIQMGSFFOAVC BQWIV0?xml=/news/2006/03/11/ntrapped11.xml&sSheet=/portal/2006/03/11/ixportaltop .html
-A
> > Check all the fluids and tyres thoroughly. > > [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > > It shows on the economic display under the speedo Richard Sexton - 18 Aug 2006 19:49 GMT >every car has got a capacity, right? a capacity that says 'ok, it can >go only so far/long (distance-wise and time-wise) before it needs a >solid break'. Other cars can be like that. German cars are designed to keep going.
 Signature Need Mercedes parts? http://parts.mbz.org Richard Sexton | Mercedes stuff: http://mbz.org 1970 280SE, 72 280SE | Home pages: http://rs79.vrx.net 633CSi 250SE/C 300SD | http://aquaria.net http://killi.net
R. Mark Clayton - 18 Aug 2006 19:50 GMT > thanks everyone, for posting ;-) > turns out- i'm *terrible* at articulating a question. [quoted text clipped - 15 lines] > link on bbc that i can't find now- that's even funnier, htis one is > ok): BMW's almost uniquely have a little indicator that tells you when it needs a service (and what sort). Driven gently you can go ~15,000 miles before the orange light comes on.
Pete - 18 Aug 2006 19:50 GMT > every car has got a capacity, right? a capacity that says 'ok, it can > go only so far/long (distance-wise and time-wise) before it needs a > solid break'. No, not really. It's acutally the driver who needs a "solid break," not the car. Casual hwy driving is very easy on a car and it can pretty much go on forever if not for the fact that you need to add gas, use a restroom, or feed yourself. The startup of a cold engine is what generates the biggest wear and tear.
> that's the capacity i was talking about when i was > talking about my 99 323i ;-) it's an old car, has 78K on it, and is > generally well maintained, Ehh.. it's not really that old and 78K miles is nothing if it was well maintained like you said it was. Enjoy the drive.
Cheers,
Pete
SBS - 20 Aug 2006 23:57 GMT No a car doesn't have a capacity before needing a rest. Machines don't need rest. As long as the fluids are maintained it will run until it wears out, maybe 500k for a BMW.
> thanks everyone, for posting ;-) > turns out- i'm *terrible* at articulating a question. [quoted text clipped - 37 lines] > > > > It shows on the economic display under the speedo Dave Plowman (News) - 21 Aug 2006 10:02 GMT > No a car doesn't have a capacity before needing a rest. Machines > don't need rest. As long as the fluids are maintained it will run > until it wears out, maybe 500k for a BMW. Didn't BMW run one (engine) continuously for over a million miles?
 Signature *A person who smiles in the face of adversity probably has a scapegoat *
Dave Plowman dave@davenoise.co.uk London SW To e-mail, change noise into sound.
joe_tide - 21 Aug 2006 11:52 GMT Mobil did when they were testing Mobil1 oil. There may be other examples.
http://www.mr2.com/ARTICLE/Mobil1.html
>> No a car doesn't have a capacity before needing a rest. Machines >> don't need rest. As long as the fluids are maintained it will run >> until it wears out, maybe 500k for a BMW. > > Didn't BMW run one (engine) continuously for over a million miles? Fred W - 21 Aug 2006 13:29 GMT > Mobil did when they were testing Mobil1 oil. There may be other examples. > > http://www.mr2.com/ARTICLE/Mobil1.html I wonder what this line in the article is supposed to mean?
"AT THE END of the road, when the engine was taken apart, Mobil's engineers discovered that the wear measurements were the same as the manufacturer's specifications"
Do you think it meant the measurements were within build specs? or that they had reached the manufacturers upper wear limits, or just that it was within the mfr. wear limits?
 Signature -Fred W
joe_tide - 21 Aug 2006 21:22 GMT >> Mobil did when they were testing Mobil1 oil. There may be other examples. >> [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > they had reached the manufacturers upper wear limits, or just that it was > within the mfr. wear limits? Yeah, I stumbled over that myself. I guess the point was that it did do 1,000,000 miles, but it would be interesting to know what they meant.
ggslash - 22 Aug 2006 03:50 GMT > thanks everyone, for posting ;-) > turns out- i'm *terrible* at articulating a question. [quoted text clipped - 15 lines] > link on bbc that i can't find now- that's even funnier, htis one is > ok): http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml;jsessionid=VZO1H5C3MVIJLQFIQMGSFFOAVC BQWIV0?xml=/news/2006/03/11/ntrapped11.xml&sSheet=/portal/2006/03/11/ixportaltop .html
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that was the funniest $hit i ever read.... lolllll
aagastya@gmail.com - 22 Aug 2006 15:33 GMT this thread is still alive? what the heck are some of you guys talking up there? i have no clue. nothing can go for a million miles. i mean, nothing that's mass-produced and commercialized like the bmw. a really high-tech scientific, made-for-space bmw? maybe? come on guys ;-)
> http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml;jsessionid=VZO1H5C3MVIJLQFIQMGSFFOAVC BQWIV0?xml=/news/2006/03/11/ntrapped11.xml&sSheet=/portal/2006/03/11/ixportaltop .html > > ---------------------------------------------------------- > > that was the funniest $hit i ever read.... lolllll Pete - 22 Aug 2006 16:27 GMT > nothing can go for a million miles. i mean, nothing that's > mass-produced and commercialized like the bmw. a really high-tech > scientific, made-for-space bmw? maybe? come on guys ;-) http://www.mbusa.com/heritage/history/news/taxi.do
It went through 3 engines, but still... :)
Pete
Richard Sexton - 22 Aug 2006 17:12 GMT >this thread is still alive? what the heck are some of you guys talking >up there? i have no clue. >nothing can go for a million miles. Look in the guiness book of world records for milage records. I think the current winner is 2.2 million miles for either a volvo or a vw beetle. There was a W123 Mercedes that was on top for a while and many examples exist with 700K Miles on the original car/motor. Mine's at half a million, all original. A millions isn't utterly unreasonable given proper care although this is somewhat easier to do in a diesel than a vergasser.
 Signature Need Mercedes parts? http://parts.mbz.org Richard Sexton | Mercedes stuff: http://mbz.org 1970 280SE, 72 280SE | Home pages: http://rs79.vrx.net 633CSi 250SE/C 300SD | http://aquaria.net http://killi.net
Jeff Strickland - 19 Aug 2006 19:50 GMT How far I can go without stopping has alot to do with the guy in front of me.
ggslash - 24 Aug 2006 16:26 GMT was that meant to sound gay?
Jeff Strickland - 25 Aug 2006 01:15 GMT You're just sick.
> was that meant to sound gay?
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