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Car Forum / Driving, Maintenance, Tuning / Driving / December 2005Careless Driving in NJ
I was in an accident last week. I was driving in heavy rain. I was not speeding. I saw the truck in front of me stopping or stopped. I started to break realized I was not stopping so I slammed on the brakes and then I knew I was going to hit. I rear ended the truck which totaled my car. The truck got away with some bumper damage. No one was hurt and the truck was not right in front of me when I noticed it stopping. I just could not stop in the rain. After the police arrived and checked the scene the officer came up to the window and would not look at me while he said "Unfortunately do to the amount of damage to your vehicle. I have to give you a ticket for careless driving. It is a 2 point ticket. Plead not guilty and on the court date come and see me and we will try to get it down to zero points." Now I know I am at fault for rear ending someone. In NJ at least you are automatically at fault in a rear end situation. I just am trying to figure out if I should get a lawyer or if I should just show up and talk to the officer and prosecutor like the officer said. I have gotten advice in both directions and right now am very confused. > I was in an accident last week. I was driving in heavy rain. I was not > speeding. I saw the truck in front of me stopping or stopped. I started [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > truck was not right in front of me when I noticed it stopping. I just > could not stop in the rain. Next time, be sure to get better tires and leave plenty of following distance. Also, make sure you have a good set of wiper blades and consider using Rain-x for better visibility. > I just am trying to figure out if I should get a lawyer or if I should > just show up and talk to the officer and prosecutor like the officer > said. I have gotten advice in both directions and right now am very > confused. Compare the cost of the ticket plus insurance surcharges versus the lawyer's fee plus the no point violation cost. You should go to court before the court date to get an idea of how cases are handled before your turn comes up. It may turn out that you won't need a lawyer to plea down to a no points violation. > I was in an accident last week. I was driving in heavy rain. I was not > speeding. I saw the truck in front of me stopping or stopped. I started > to break realized I was not stopping so I slammed on the brakes and then > I knew I was going to hit. I rear ended the truck But, you *were* speeding. Speeding doesn't just mean going faster than a number on a sign, it means going too fast for prevailing conditions. There are times when 15mph is too fast for prevailing conditions! > I just could not stop in the rain. You just could not stop because you were skidding or aquaplaning, because you were going too fast for conditions, on unsuitable tires, and not leaving enough space between yourself and the vehicle. > After the police arrived and checked the scene the officer came up to > the window and would not look at me while he said "Unfortunately do to > the amount of damage to your vehicle. I have to give you a ticket for > careless driving. Sounds like an appropriate and deserved citation, to me. You were several different kinds of careless. > It is a 2 point ticket. Plead not guilty and on the court date come and > see me and we will try to get it down to zero points." Here's hoping the judge or magistrate won't have it. > Now I know I am at fault for rear ending someone. In NJ at least you are > automatically at fault in a rear end situation. This isn't a matter of what NJ law says, it's a matter of you being careless. > I just am trying to figure out if I should get a lawyer or if I should > just show up and talk to the officer and prosecutor like the officer > said. I have gotten advice in both directions and right now am very > confused. "Right now"? >> I was in an accident last week. I was driving in heavy rain. I was not >> speeding. I saw the truck in front of me stopping or stopped. I started [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] >number on a sign, it means going too fast for prevailing conditions. There >are times when 15mph is too fast for prevailing conditions! But he _wasn't_ "speeding". "Speeding" _is_ going faster than the numbers on the sign. He was "Driving too fast for conditions" which is what a ticket would say if he got it just for going too fast for conditions. >> I just could not stop in the rain. > >You just could not stop because you were skidding or aquaplaning, because >you were going too fast for conditions, on unsuitable tires, and not >leaving enough space between yourself and the vehicle. You have to be able to _see_ the car in front before you know you're too close to it. In heavy rain, U can get too close to it before you can actually see it. In those conditions, its _also_ equally dangerous to go very slow, as you may get hit by someone else that also cannot see you in time to be able to stop or slow sufficiently. Some conditions are just too bad to drive in safely. >> After the police arrived and checked the scene the officer came up to >> the window and would not look at me while he said "Unfortunately do to [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] >Sounds like an appropriate and deserved citation, to me. You were several >different kinds of careless. Or maybe simply not experienced enough to be able to recognize this as a dangerous situation. >> It is a 2 point ticket. Plead not guilty and on the court date come and >> see me and we will try to get it down to zero points." > >Here's hoping the judge or magistrate won't have it. I'm surprised someone hasn't jumped in with the standard, "You're too stupid to drive" line, and how he ought to have his licensed revoked forever, etc. This is _not_ the group to come to for rational discussion of a problem, or much of anything else except maybe entertaining rants... >> Now I know I am at fault for rear ending someone. In NJ at least you are >> automatically at fault in a rear end situation. > >This isn't a matter of what NJ law says, it's a matter of you being >careless. Or simply inexperienced enough to not recognize the dangerous situation. >> I just am trying to figure out if I should get a lawyer or if I should >> just show up and talk to the officer and prosecutor like the officer >> said. I have gotten advice in both directions and right now am very >> confused. Get a lawyer. Can't hurt, might help. Dave Head >You have to be able to _see_ the car in front before you know you're too close >to it. In heavy rain, U can get too close to it before you can actually see [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > >Some conditions are just too bad to drive in safely. Which is why it is better to go faster than slower, because then YOU have control over whether YOU have an accident. When you go too slow, you have no control over an accident from behind. >>You have to be able to _see_ the car in front before you know you're too close >>to it. In heavy rain, U can get too close to it before you can actually see [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] >have control over whether YOU have an accident. When you go too slow, >you have no control over an accident from behind. Exactly. But you shouldn't go so fast that you can't avoid a stopped car in the road. If you can't do this, then its just too darn dangerous, indicating that the best course of action is to pull off the road and wait for better conditions. The rain has to let up sometime. Dave Head >Exactly. But you shouldn't go so fast that you can't avoid a stopped car in >the road. If you can't do this, then its just too darn dangerous, indicating >that the best course of action is to pull off the road and wait for better >conditions. The rain has to let up sometime. If one drives as if a parked car will occupy their lane, one will never move. >>Exactly. But you shouldn't go so fast that you can't avoid a stopped car in >>the road. If you can't do this, then its just too darn dangerous, indicating [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] >If one drives as if a parked car will occupy their lane, one will >never move. Well, the OP said that the truck he or she hit might have been stopped. You _should_ be able to see stuff far enough ahead that you can stop for it - that's what "overdriving your headlights" is all about, or slowing down in other poor visibility situations. Its just that if the visibility gets _too_ short, there's no safe way to proceed - any speed you can do in order to be able to stop would be so slow you'd be at great risk from getting hit from behind. That's the time to park it and wait for better conditions. Dave Head >>>Exactly. But you shouldn't go so fast that you can't avoid a stopped car in >>>the road. If you can't do this, then its just too darn dangerous, indicating [quoted text clipped - 11 lines] >able to stop would be so slow you'd be at great risk from getting hit from >behind. That's the time to park it and wait for better conditions. As long as you park it in a parking space and not on the f.cking road, which is what most people do. >>>>Exactly. But you shouldn't go so fast that you can't avoid a stopped car in >>>>the road. If you can't do this, then its just too darn dangerous, indicating [quoted text clipped - 14 lines] > As long as you park it in a parking space and not on the f.cking road, > which is what most people do. You still shouldn't outdrive your headlights or sightlines. Which is why the Fabulous BeaterPorsche has Cibie E-codes and a relay harness. :) Which reminds me... I need to think about making one for the Stude... nate  Signaturereplace "fly" with "com" to reply. http://home.comcast.net/~njnagel > I was in an accident last week. I was driving in heavy rain. I was not > speeding. I saw the truck in front of me stopping or stopped. I started > to break realized I was not stopping so I slammed on the brakes and then > I knew I was going to hit. I rear ended the truck which totaled my car. When you get a new car, grab some road cones and practice wet-weather braking. Slamming on the brakes is not the right thing to do: the stopping distance for a car sliding over water is much longer than for a car that is braking less heavily but the tyres have maintained traction. > After the police arrived and checked the scene the officer came up to > the window and would not look at me while he said "Unfortunately do to > the amount of damage to your vehicle. I have to give you a ticket for > careless driving. It is a 2 point ticket. Plead not guilty and on the > court date come and see me and we will try to get it down to zero points." Sounds about right to me. Either you weren't keeping a proper following distance (reckless driving), did not notice that the truck stopped when it did (careless driving), or your tyres are too worn (also illegal in most alreas). The only way I can think of that the truck could be held partially responsible, is if its brake lights were not working. > > I was in an accident last week. I was driving in heavy rain. I was not > > speeding. I saw the truck in front of me stopping or stopped. I started [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > much longer than for a car that is braking less heavily but the > tyres have maintained traction. Good advice. Also -steer- out of accidents. There isn't enough information in the OP to tell but there are few places on public roads where you can't take at least some avoidance action. Once you lock up your tires, you have lost all control over your vehicle and you are just going along for the ride. Harry K Always go to court with a lawyer when it has something to do with points or suspension. Always. If his retainer is $500- $1,000 you will saving money in the long run-- especially in NJ. > I was in an accident last week. I was driving in heavy rain. I was not > speeding. I saw the truck in front of me stopping or stopped. I started [quoted text clipped - 17 lines] > said. I have gotten advice in both directions and right now am very > confused. When I was in an accident in Dennis Township in NJ a few years ago, I was given a ticket for improper passing. I clipped a pickup truck while trying to avoid it by driving on the shoulder of a narrow road and I hit a utility pole. My car was not totaled, but the damage was $6K. Since I live more than 50 miles from Dennis Township, I was permitted to argue my case via snail mail even though I am a NJ resident. The cop who cited me said much the same thing you were told. The cop told me I could probably get the points dismissed entirely since this was a freak accident. Not only were the points dismissed, but the judge threw out the ticket entirely, so I also didn't have to pay a fine. Unfortunately, State Farm was not as understanding as the judge. They dropped my policy and I got reamed up the a.s to go into assigned risk. In my situation, the only thing an attorney would have done is lighten my wallet, but I am a very persuasive person and the facts were in my favor. You have to decide if you can persuade a judge to dismiss your ticket? How persuasive are you? In your situation, an attorney might be beneficial, esp. if you are not a persuasive person and since by your own admission, you were driving carelessly (i.e., too fast to come to a safe stop). Good luck! M, <drathar29XXX@netscape.net> was motivated to say this in rec.autos.driving on Mon, 28 Nov 2005 11:50:26 -0500: > I just am trying to figure out if I should get a lawyer or if I should > just show up and talk to the officer and prosecutor like the officer > said. I have gotten advice in both directions and right now am very > confused. If you have to ask, you need a lawyer. The police and prosecutors are counting on you cluelessly going it alone in the kangaroo court so they can screw you for all you are worth to get revenue for the banana republic. >I was in an accident last week. I was driving in heavy rain. I was not >speeding. I saw the truck in front of me stopping or stopped. I started [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] >truck was not right in front of me when I noticed it stopping. I just >could not stop in the rain. You just admitted to tailgating. >After the police arrived and checked the scene the officer came up to >the window and would not look at me while he said "Unfortunately do to [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] >said. I have gotten advice in both directions and right now am very >confused. I would go to court the first time and speak to the officer and prosecutor before you appear in front of a judge. If they offer you a good deal, you are all set. If you don't like the deal they are offering you, go in front of the judge and request a continuance so that you can hire an attorney. --------------- Alex |
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