Home | Contact Us | FAQ | Search & Site Map | Link to Us
Sign In | Join | Other 45 Sites in Network
HomeAnnouncements
Discussion Groups
By Brand
BMWChevroletDodgeFordGMHondaLexusMercedes-BenzNissanPeugeotToyotaVolkswagenOther Brands
By Topic
4x4 CarsRVsDrivingMaintenance & RepairCar AudioCollectible Cars
Country Specific
Australian ForumsUK Forums
ArticlesAuto InsuranceBuyingCars & TechnologyMaintenanceMiscellaneousSafety
DMV Resources
Related Topics
MotorcyclesBoatsMore Topics ...

Car Forum / Driving, Maintenance, Tuning / Driving / February 2006

Tip: Looking for answers? Try searching our database.

Winter Driving

Thread view: 
Enable EMail Alerts  Start New Thread
Thread rating: 
eastwardbound2003@yahoo.com - 31 Dec 2005 07:30 GMT
I was out driving in Kansas this winter and the spray nozzels for the
windshield washer fluid actually froze up.  This prevented me from
washing the road salt off my windshield.  I had to pull over on a busy
interstate to scrape the road salt off my windsheild.

Is there anything to do about this problem?

In the morning during a cold start up the power steering fluid is still
half frozen or something and the steering wheels is stiff.  This
happens in 10 degree temperatures and below.  (Farenheit)  Are there
cars on the market that can heat the fluid using electric resistance
heat or something?

Oh and about the radiator freezing up.  If the coolant gets frozen what
happens to the water pump during cold start up?  Doesn't that break the
water pump since it would be seized in place from the frozen coolant?
That sounds like a very expensive problem to me...
Dave - 31 Dec 2005 14:12 GMT


>I was out driving in Kansas this winter and the spray nozzels for the
> windshield washer fluid actually froze up.  This prevented me from
[quoted text clipped - 13 lines]
> water pump since it would be seized in place from the frozen coolant?
> That sounds like a very expensive problem to me...

Windshield washer fluid can freeze, especially if it is watered down too
much.  If you have your oil changed at many quick-change oil change type
places (you know, the 10 minute places that try to emulate Jiffy Lube) then
your windshield washer reservoir is probably filled with mostly water.
That's why they froze up on you.  You can get winterized windshield washer
fluid cheap at wal-mart or just about any auto parts store.  You should
start adding the winter style windshield wash in October so that you have
the water flushed out of the system before you have to worry about it
freezing.  If your car has the spray nozzles on the hood, then it is
important to also clear the ENTIRE exterior of the car of snow/ice each and
every time you start it.

All power steering fluids will flow easier when they are warm.  When they
get cold, they have a thicker consistency that is harder to pump.  I haven't
noticed a problem with any power steering at temperatures close to Zero F
though.  The last time I can remember a stiff steering problem, the outside
temperature was -35F (wind chill much lower than that).  On a side note,
that was the same day that one of my tires froze to the pavement and ripped
off the wheel, but that's another story.   :)    I think you should have
your power steering fluid flushed, especially if your car is more than 3
years old.  I suspect your fluid may be old or contaminated or something.
It shouldn't be noticeably stiff at ~10F.  But it is POSSIBLE that there is
nothing wrong with the fluid and that it is just stiff at ~10F and under due
to the way that your specific car is engineered.  If there is nothing wrong
with the fluid, you can add an after-market electric engine heater to your
car.  Don't know if that will help, but it won't hurt.  Just remember to
unplug your car before you start it in the  morning.  :)

If you are worried about the engine coolant, the water pump is the least of
your problems.  If the engine coolant freezes, it can crack the block of the
engine.  You think replacing the water pump is expensive?  How about having
the whole engine rebuilt or replaced?  (including the water pump)  If you
are going to be spending any more time in areas with winter weather
conditions, check your engine coolant immediately to make sure that it is
good down to AT LEAST -25F.  To test the freeze point, you can get a tester
at wal-mart or any auto parts store for about $5.  Wait until the engine is
completely cool, then remove the radiator cap and test the fluid in the
radiator.  Remember that you are hoping for the LOWEST number possible,
so -40 is better than -10.  If your radiator fluid doesn't test to -25 or
lower, flush your cooling system and replace all the coolant with a mix of
coolant and water according to the directions on the bottle(s) of engine
coolant.  Typically, you want about a 50/50 mix of engine coolant and water
in the radiator, but this varies by type of engine coolant, so read the
directions on the bottle.  -Dave


John Smith - 31 Dec 2005 17:22 GMT
>I was out driving in Kansas this winter and the spray nozzels for the
> windshield washer fluid actually froze up.  This prevented me from
> washing the road salt off my windshield.  I had to pull over on a busy
> interstate to scrape the road salt off my windsheild.
>
> Is there anything to do about this problem?

Use winter windshield washer fluid, rated for -40 or so.

> In the morning during a cold start up the power steering fluid is still
> half frozen or something and the steering wheels is stiff.  This
> happens in 10 degree temperatures and below.  (Farenheit)  Are there
> cars on the market that can heat the fluid using electric resistance
> heat or something?

Just drive around and wait for it to warm up.

> Oh and about the radiator freezing up.  If the coolant gets frozen what
> happens to the water pump during cold start up?  Doesn't that break the
> water pump since it would be seized in place from the frozen coolant?
> That sounds like a very expensive problem to me...

There are meters that will check the mix of the engine coolant. If it's a
proper 50/50 mix, it will freeze at -40 or so, so it shouldn't be an issue.
Laura Bush murdered her boy friend - 31 Dec 2005 18:04 GMT
> I was out driving in Kansas this winter and the spray nozzels for the
> windshield washer fluid actually froze up.  This prevented me from
[quoted text clipped - 13 lines]
> water pump since it would be seized in place from the frozen coolant?
> That sounds like a very expensive problem to me...

You don't know a damn thing about cars do you?.  You'll like it here.
Matthew Russotto - 31 Dec 2005 18:39 GMT
>I was out driving in Kansas this winter and the spray nozzels for the
>windshield washer fluid actually froze up.  This prevented me from
>washing the road salt off my windshield.  I had to pull over on a busy
>interstate to scrape the road salt off my windsheild.
>
>Is there anything to do about this problem?

Use the appropriate antifreeze in your windshield washer reservoir.
If it froze up from precipitation rather from the inside, there's
little you can do about that; some cars have heated washer nozzles, I
believe.

>Oh and about the radiator freezing up.  If the coolant gets frozen what
>happens to the water pump during cold start up?  Doesn't that break the
>water pump since it would be seized in place from the frozen coolant?
>That sounds like a very expensive problem to me...

You should be using appropriate antifreeze in the radiator also, and a
block heater in some climates.  The radiator will freeze first for
various reasons, but if you let all the coolant in your engine freeze,
it will likely be expensive.

Signature

 There's no such thing as a free lunch, but certain accounting practices can
 result in a fully-depreciated one.

Ulf - 01 Jan 2006 16:32 GMT
> I was out driving in Kansas this winter and the spray nozzels for the
> windshield washer fluid actually froze up.  This prevented me from
> washing the road salt off my windshield.  I had to pull over on a busy
> interstate to scrape the road salt off my windsheild.
>
> Is there anything to do about this problem?

Yeah, I remember having this problem a few years ago when my washer
fluid froze, and remained frozen for a several weeks until the weather
warmed up. What I did was to drive really close to the car in front,
that way the spray was enough to clean the windshield using the wipers,
and on a few occasions the driver even used their washers. When that
didn't work I just pulled over and used snow to clean it, worked great.
My winter car, a '92 BMW 535, has heated nozzles (and mirrors and key
lock) so that's never been a problem. Of course, I also have the correct
mix of antifreeze and water.

> In the morning during a cold start up the power steering fluid is still
> half frozen or something and the steering wheels is stiff.  This
> happens in 10 degree temperatures and below.  (Farenheit)  Are there
> cars on the market that can heat the fluid using electric resistance
> heat or something?

No, but just take it easy until everything is up to operating temperature.

> Oh and about the radiator freezing up.  If the coolant gets frozen what
> happens to the water pump during cold start up?  Doesn't that break the
> water pump since it would be seized in place from the frozen coolant?
> That sounds like a very expensive problem to me...

That's why you should have a 50/50 mix of coolant and water in the
system. Then it won't freeze until the temperature hits 40 below, and if
it's colder than that you shouldn't be driving anyway.

Ulf
eastwardbound2003@yahoo.com - 02 Jan 2006 07:41 GMT
> > I was out driving in Kansas this winter and the spray nozzels for the
> > windshield washer fluid actually froze up.  This prevented me from
[quoted text clipped - 29 lines]
> system. Then it won't freeze until the temperature hits 40 below, and if
> it's colder than that you shouldn't be driving anyway.

> Ulf

Why can't people drive around in -40 weather?  Don't Alaskans,
Canadians, Swedens, and Scandanavians do this all the time?  I believe
the one's up north use engine blocks and people are able to plug their
cars in when parked at the grocery store parking lot.

I'm no expert in this area but I'm sure there are a host of things that
can go wrong with a car at such severe temperatures.  I've heard of
rear differentials freezing up.  Gear oil gets too thick.  Maybe
something happens to the wheel bearings.  Gas lines can freeze.  The
army corps of engineers who built the Alaskan Highway for example ran
into all sorts of problems.
Floyd L. Davidson - 05 Jan 2006 03:08 GMT
>> > I was out driving in Kansas this winter and the spray nozzels for the
>> > windshield washer fluid actually froze up.  This prevented me from
...
>> > Is there anything to do about this problem?

There are "low temperature" washer fluids available.  I'm not
sure just how low they go before freezing.  Here we don't worry
about it too much, because once it gets below freezing about the
first of October it doesn't get warm enough to be a problem
again until May.  Road spray only happens very close to freezing
or warmer, and right now it is -20F.

>> > In the morning during a cold start up the power steering fluid is still
>> > half frozen or something and the steering wheels is stiff.  This
[quoted text clipped - 3 lines]
>>
>> No, but just take it easy until everything is up to operating temperature.

That is a serious problem with some vehicles, though I don't
think it generally is until the temperature is significantly low
(-30F at least).  On some vehicles, before the steering fluid
has a chance to warm up, the first few turns generates enough
pressure to burst seals or hose fittings.  One solution is
indeed to warm up the vehicle for 15 or 20 minutes before moving
it, and that is a good idea for many reasons.  But people who
are on-call for emergencies (volunteer EMT's and firemen for
example) can't do that.  I know one guy that put a 25 watt heat
pad on his power steering pump because he got tired of buying
two or three hoses every year.

>> > Oh and about the radiator freezing up.  If the coolant gets frozen what
...

Use the proper antifreeze and that won't happen.

>Why can't people drive around in -40 weather?  Don't Alaskans,
>Canadians, Swedens, and Scandanavians do this all the time?  I believe
>the one's up north use engine blocks and people are able to plug their
>cars in when parked at the grocery store parking lot.

Nah.  Not at the grocery store.  But at home and at work, for
sure.  I don't recall ever seeing any place with plugins for
customers though.  But even at -65F you can easily start a car
after it has been sitting for 2 or 3 hours.  (Wait 4-5, and you
might need to call a cab.)

>I'm no expert in this area but I'm sure there are a host of things that
>can go wrong with a car at such severe temperatures.  I've heard of
>rear differentials freezing up.  Gear oil gets too thick.  Maybe
>something happens to the wheel bearings.

Drive a car from the Lower-48 to Fairbanks in January, and the
first cold spell you see will put the car out of commission.
The gear lube and the axle grease normally used in warm places
will be solid as a rock at about -45F or so.  And regular engine
oil (not synthetic) will look like Jello at only -10 or -20F.

> Gas lines can freeze.  The

Not really... but any water in the gas will.  And actually any
moisture in the tank, even if it is in the air, will crystallize
and plug up the gas line.  Some cars have more trouble than
others, but almost everyone carries a jug of gas line deicer
(methanol) around.

>army corps of engineers who built the Alaskan Highway for example ran
>into all sorts of problems.

Back then they did not have cold weather synthetic oil, for
example.  Instead, if a vehicle was going to be turned off in
the cold, they would drain the oil and take oil and battery
inside.  When the vehicle was to be started, they'd put a heater
on the engine compartment for an hour or two, and then pour in
warm oil and install the warm battery to start it.

Today we use synthetic oil, we have block heaters on the engine,
heat pads on the battery, the transmission, and on the oil pan;
and we have a heater inside to keep the interior up to at least
a temperature where the seat isn't a block of ice and hard as a
rock.

Not everyone does all of that though.  And what with the warmer
winters we've been having I have only a block heater and an
interior heater.  But I always have the option of either not
going anywhere in the first place, or of letting the vehicle run
for 15 minutes first.

Signature

Floyd L. Davidson            <http://www.apaflo.com/floyd_davidson>
Ukpeagvik (Barrow, Alaska)                         floyd@apaflo.com

zx2guy - 25 Jan 2006 01:49 GMT
eastwardbound2003@yahoo.com Wrote:
> I was out driving in Kansas this winter and the spray nozzels for the
> windshield washer fluid actually froze up. This prevented me from
[quoted text clipped - 19 lines]
> have it start at about midnight  for anhour, and again about an hour or
> 2 before you drive so its not so hard on your motor.

Signature

zx2guy

http://www.automotiveforums.com

cody_e - 02 Feb 2006 04:57 GMT
It was windy and slick today. I was going about 45-50 in a 55 (it was
really icy). A big gust pushed my car on some ice and I could feel it
slide a bit towards the ditch. I thought I was going in for a second.

Signature

cody_e

http://www.automotiveforums.com

 
Sign In
Join
My Latest Posts
My Monitored Threads
My Blog
My Photo Gallery
My Profile
My Homepage

Start New Thread
Enable EMail Alerts
Rate this Thread



©2008 Advenet LLC   Privacy Policy - Terms of Use
This website includes both content owned or controlled by Advenet as well as content owned or controlled by third parties.