Car Forum / Driving, Maintenance, Tuning / Driving / June 2006
85 MPH speedometers
|
|
Thread rating:  |
Ronnie Dobbs - 31 May 2006 11:26 GMT In the late 70s and 80s, most (all?) cars had speedometers that would only go up to 85. Were they mandated by the government? What year did they come out? Why 85? At the time the maximum speed limit was 55.
SP Cook - 31 May 2006 12:18 GMT > In the late 70s and 80s, most (all?) cars had speedometers that would only > go up to 85. Were they mandated by the government? What year did they come > out? Why 85? At the time the maximum speed limit was 55. A product of the Naderite know-nothings that controled the Carter mis-administration. Mandated that a speedometers read 85 and note 55 in some way (usually its orange when the other numbers are white). Speedshops did a brisk business in replacing these with ether Canadian spec (which were metric, but still went up to the top speed of the car) or cop car spec.
Then the NMSL was repealed, Joanie Claybrooke ceased to be listened to, and TRAFFIC MORTALITY WENT DOWN. Just like we said it would. Because underposted speed limts and over and selective enforcement of them never saved one life or one drop of oil.
Now the irresponsible voices of stupidity are again resuming their war on motorist's rights. Fight them.
Join the NMA.
SP Cook
Timothy J. Lee - 31 May 2006 19:03 GMT >A product of the Naderite know-nothings that controled the Carter >mis-administration. Mandated that a speedometers read 85 and note 55 >in some way (usually its orange when the other numbers are white). >Speedshops did a brisk business in replacing these with ether Canadian >spec (which were metric, but still went up to the top speed of the car) Given the cars of the 1970s / 1980s, were the top speeds of most of the cars of the time significantly higher than 85mph? Or were the higher speedometer speeds just optimistic numbers for people to brag about (like the 160mph speedometer I saw in a new, but non-sporty, car)?
 Signature ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Timothy J. Lee Unsolicited bulk or commercial email is not welcome. No warranty of any kind is provided with this message.
Garth Almgren - 01 Jun 2006 01:49 GMT > Given the cars of the 1970s / 1980s, were the top speeds of most of the > cars of the time significantly higher than 85mph? Or were the higher > speedometer speeds just optimistic numbers for people to brag about > (like the 160mph speedometer I saw in a new, but non-sporty, car)? Certainly there's quite a bit of the latter, but as to the former there were few if any cars that wouldn't do more than 85, even back in the darkest years of the automotive industry. The SSP Mustangs (police specials) of the 80s came from the factory with a 140 MPH speedometer, and they needed it.
My '83 Mustang would theoretically top out at about 115 (gear limited), so a 120 MPH speedometer would not have been inappropriate, but alas no: it's stuck with an 85 MPH speedometer (unless I want to upgrade it to a SSP instrument cluster. Which I don't, because a) it'd be rather pointless, and b) relatively expensive).
 Signature ~/Garth |"I believe that it is better to tell the truth than a lie. Almgren | I believe it is better to be free than to be a slave. ******* | And I believe it is better to know than to be ignorant." (pgp@v6stang.com for secure mail info) --H.L. Mencken (1880-1956)
Timothy J. Lee - 01 Jun 2006 19:02 GMT >My '83 Mustang would theoretically top out at about 115 (gear limited), >so a 120 MPH speedometer would not have been inappropriate, but alas no: >it's stuck with an 85 MPH speedometer (unless I want to upgrade it to a >SSP instrument cluster. Which I don't, because a) it'd be rather >pointless, and b) relatively expensive). Weren't there some Mustangs during the 85mph speedometer years that had 120mph (or something) speedometers with no numbers or decals beyond 85mph?
 Signature ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Timothy J. Lee Unsolicited bulk or commercial email is not welcome. No warranty of any kind is provided with this message.
Garth Almgren - 02 Jun 2006 03:18 GMT >> My '83 Mustang would theoretically top out at about 115 (gear limited), >> so a 120 MPH speedometer would not have been inappropriate, but alas no: [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > Weren't there some Mustangs during the 85mph speedometer years that had > 120mph (or something) speedometers with no numbers or decals beyond 85mph? Maybe on the SVO, but as far as I know for sure, there was only the 85 and the 140.
 Signature ~/Garth |"I believe that it is better to tell the truth than a lie. Almgren | I believe it is better to be free than to be a slave. ******* | And I believe it is better to know than to be ignorant." (pgp@v6stang.com for secure mail info) --H.L. Mencken (1880-1956)
Pooh Bear - 01 Jun 2006 05:50 GMT > >A product of the Naderite know-nothings that controled the Carter > >mis-administration. Mandated that a speedometers read 85 and note 55 [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > Given the cars of the 1970s / 1980s, were the top speeds of most of the > cars of the time significantly higher than 85mph? Of course. My first car ever was a Ford Cortina estate with a 1500cc engine that was capable of 100 mph. It was built in 1966. My next car ( a Rover 2000 TC ) built in 1970 was good for 115. my Dad's Jaguar ( 1967 model ) reached 120 mph once but was probably capable of more.
> Or were the higher > speedometer speeds just optimistic numbers for people to brag about > (like the 160mph speedometer I saw in a new, but non-sporty, car)? Most have a top speed well in excess of what the car's capable of but sometimes the high-end models will really reach the numbers indicated.
Graham
bernard farquart - 01 Jun 2006 06:08 GMT > Of course. My first car ever was a Ford Cortina estate with a 1500cc > engine that > was capable of 100 mph. It was built in 1966. My next car ( a Rover 2000 > TC ) > built in 1970 was good for 115. I had a TC, I loved that car, but it had massive electrical problems,(duh, British) and parts were very hard to come by, since it was grey(ish) market here in the US. Great ride for the size, though.
Bernard
Pooh Bear - 02 Jun 2006 09:38 GMT > > Of course. My first car ever was a Ford Cortina estate with a 1500cc > > engine that [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > I had a TC, I loved that car, but it had massive electrical > problems, What sort of problems ?
> (duh, British) and parts were very hard > to come by, since it was grey(ish) market here in > the US. Great ride for the size, though. The ride was superb. Don't think I've had anything since that matches it, even my Saabs ( good but somewhat firmer )..
Graham
laura bush - VEHICULAR HOMICIDE - 31 May 2006 16:08 GMT >In the late 70s and 80s, most (all?) cars had speedometers that would only >go up to 85. Were they mandated by the government? What year did they come >out? Why 85? At the time the maximum speed limit was 55. It's insane that they read anything over 60. Someday GM is gonna get sued over this. Somebody will get killed by a speeder doing 80 and the victim's family will sue GM for selling cars that encourage speeding.
N8N - 31 May 2006 16:10 GMT > >In the late 70s and 80s, most (all?) cars had speedometers that would only > >go up to 85. Were they mandated by the government? What year did they come [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > the victim's family will sue GM for selling cars that encourage > speeding. Seeing as there are roads with 70 MPH speed limits within a few hours' drive from my house, how would I be able to tell whether or not I was speeding?
nate
Mike T. - 31 May 2006 16:24 GMT > Seeing as there are roads with 70 MPH speed limits within a few hours' > drive from my house, how would I be able to tell whether or not I was > speeding? > > nate Hey, I think you've got something there. I say all speedometers should read 25MPH, maximum. Then you would have an iron-clad defense against roadside tax collection activity. You can't be charged for defective equipment if the factory installed it. You can't be charged for speeding if you honestly have no idea how fast you are going. :) Oh, and speed limits below 35MPH are rarely (like, almost never) enforced. -Dave
Sir Ray - 31 May 2006 16:56 GMT > > Seeing as there are roads with 70 MPH speed limits within a few hours' > > drive from my house, how would I be able to tell whether or not I was [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > have no idea how fast you are going. :) Oh, and speed limits below 35MPH > are rarely (like, almost never) enforced. -Dave I think speedometers are pretty useless, since quite frankly most sane people drive the speed they are comfortable for road and weather conditions (the one usenet troll this is geared to will invariable fair to understand that). Ideally, lose all speed limits, lose the speedometers, lose the false science and ad-hoc revenue generation, clearly mark areas where caution is required (and hey, if there are inherent dangers, use zig-zag road markings or rumble strips or some equivalent as approipiate - but no freaking traffic blocking...I mean traffic 'calming' ), and use the space on the dashboard for larger turn signal indicators (so the ol' and not so ol' folks won't be driving 2km signalling for a turn). Cops could still give out their tickets for reckless driving, and 'agressive driving' wouldn't be a crock offense based on speed + one other offense, but would actually mean something (like weaving in and out without signalling and tailgating agressively whenever they can't weave). And instead of wasting time hiding in speed traps, cops could actually patrol for real safety violations and... Eh, we all know this already (except for one troll, who refuses to accept reality). "Speed kills nobody, Stupidity kills millions"
Mike T. - 31 May 2006 17:42 GMT > I think speedometers are pretty useless, since quite frankly most sane > people drive the speed they are comfortable for road and weather > conditions (the one usenet troll this is geared to will invariable fair > to understand that). Ideally, lose all speed limits, lose the > speedometers, I've said many times that speedometers have NOTHING to do with driving. Nobody is able to refute that statement without mentioning OTHER things that ALSO have NOTHING to do with DRIVING. (example, cops, speed limits, traffic tickets, etc.) -Dave
Garth Almgren - 31 May 2006 19:01 GMT > > I think speedometers are pretty useless, since quite frankly most sane > > people drive the speed they are comfortable for road and weather [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > ALSO have NOTHING to do with DRIVING. (example, cops, speed limits, traffic > tickets, etc.) -Dave I don't know if I've mentioned it here, but I've got a '93 Wrangler that I've had for about two months. When I bought it, the speedometer didn't work, and I was fine with that. I used a GPS for a week to figure what RPM translates to what taxation guide signs, and drove that way until two weeks ago when I repaired the corroded PCB behind the gauge cluster. The only reason I wanted to fix it (besides the feeling of completeness that comes from a fully functioning set of gauges) was so that the odometer and trip odometer would start working again. Unlike the speedometer, the odometer is a highly useful device.
 Signature ~/Garth (via Google)
Bo Raxo - 31 May 2006 21:41 GMT > I've said many times that speedometers have NOTHING to do with driving. > Nobody is able to refute that statement without mentioning OTHER things that > ALSO have NOTHING to do with DRIVING. (example, cops, speed limits, traffic > tickets, etc.) -Dave I used to have a 64 1/2 Mustang with a factory four speed manual, and no tach. The speedometer was handy for being able to determine and hit the shift points where horsepower had reached it's peak. I'd say that has to do with driving.
Mike T. - 01 Jun 2006 15:22 GMT >> I've said many times that speedometers have NOTHING to do with driving. >> Nobody is able to refute that statement without mentioning OTHER things [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > the shift points where horsepower had reached it's peak. I'd say that > has to do with driving. Ummmm . . . no. In the first place, your mustang wasn't properly equipped. If it had been, you wouldn't have felt you needed to use the speedometer. But manual tranny drivers don't use the tachometer to shift anyway. They generally go by the sound of the engine, when deciding when to upshift or downshift. So you shouldn't have been substituting anything for an instrument that you shouldn't have been using. -Dave
Stephen Dailey - 02 Jun 2006 04:13 GMT >>> I've said many times that speedometers have NOTHING to do with driving. >>> Nobody is able to refute that statement without mentioning OTHER things [quoted text clipped - 15 lines] > downshift. So you shouldn't have been substituting anything for an > instrument that you shouldn't have been using. -Dave I've owned six manual-transmission vehicles, only one of which had a tach. It was a nice decoration.
=== Steve Shoreline, Washington USA smdailey@seanet.com 1 Jun 2006, 2013 PDT
Bo Raxo - 31 May 2006 21:41 GMT > I've said many times that speedometers have NOTHING to do with driving. > Nobody is able to refute that statement without mentioning OTHER things that > ALSO have NOTHING to do with DRIVING. (example, cops, speed limits, traffic > tickets, etc.) -Dave I used to have a 64 1/2 Mustang with a factory four speed manual, and no tach. The speedometer was handy for being able to determine and hit the shift points where horsepower had reached it's peak. I'd say that has to do with driving.
Stephen Dailey - 01 Jun 2006 04:51 GMT >> I've said many times that speedometers have NOTHING to do with driving. >> Nobody is able to refute that statement without mentioning OTHER things [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > the shift points where horsepower had reached it's peak. I'd say that > has to do with driving. My late grandfather had an Opel Kadett station wagon that had sets of dots on the edge of the speedometer dial at the optimum shift points: one for 1st-2nd, two for 2nd-3rd, three for 3rd-4th. Nice touch.
=== Steve Shoreline, Washington USA smdailey@seanet.com 31 May 2006, 2051 PDT
Brent P - 01 Jun 2006 05:18 GMT >> no tach. The speedometer was handy for being able to determine and hit >> the shift points where horsepower had reached it's peak. I'd say that >> has to do with driving.
> My late grandfather had an Opel Kadett station wagon that had sets of dots > on the edge of the speedometer dial at the optimum shift points: one for > 1st-2nd, two for 2nd-3rd, three for 3rd-4th. Nice touch. The '86 mazda had a little upshift light that would come on based on load and speed...
Mike T. - 01 Jun 2006 15:24 GMT >> My late grandfather had an Opel Kadett station wagon that had sets of >> dots [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > The '86 mazda had a little upshift light that would come on based on load > and speed... The only vehicles I've driven with those upshift lights, the upshift light was ALWAYS on, so was not helpful at all. That is, you would get the clutch out all the way in 2nd gear and immediately the light would come on asking for 3rd gear. Ummmmm . . . NO, only an idiot would upshift that quick. -Dave
Stephen Dailey - 02 Jun 2006 04:03 GMT >>> My late grandfather had an Opel Kadett station wagon that had sets of >>> dots [quoted text clipped - 13 lines] > asking for 3rd gear. Ummmmm . . . NO, only an idiot would upshift that > quick. -Dave Amen to that. I had an '88 S-10 with an upshift light, and as you're describing, the upshift light would come on as soon as the clutch was fully engaged after a shift. I solved that problem by removing the bulb from the upshift light.
=== Steve Shoreline, Washington USA smdailey@seanet.com 1 Jun 2006, 2003 PDT
Brent P - 02 Jun 2006 06:22 GMT > The only vehicles I've driven with those upshift lights, the upshift light > was ALWAYS on, so was not helpful at all. That is, you would get the > clutch out all the way in 2nd gear and immediately the light would come on > asking for 3rd gear. Ummmmm . . . NO, only an idiot would upshift that > quick. -Dave The one on the mazda actually seemed rather reasonable and generally only came on when I was intentionally getting the car up into the revs.
Garth Almgren - 02 Jun 2006 03:21 GMT >>> no tach. The speedometer was handy for being able to determine and hit >>> the shift points where horsepower had reached it's peak. I'd say that [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > The '86 mazda had a little upshift light that would come on based on load > and speed... That's funny; my Wrangler's shift light seems to be based on almost entirely random factors. :)
 Signature ~/Garth |"I believe that it is better to tell the truth than a lie. Almgren | I believe it is better to be free than to be a slave. ******* | And I believe it is better to know than to be ignorant." (pgp@v6stang.com for secure mail info) --H.L. Mencken (1880-1956)
Ronnie Dobbs - 01 Jun 2006 05:41 GMT >> I used to have a 64 1/2 Mustang with a factory four speed manual, and >> no tach. The speedometer was handy for being able to determine and [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > dots on the edge of the speedometer dial at the optimum shift points: > one for 1st-2nd, two for 2nd-3rd, three for 3rd-4th. Nice touch. Volkswagen Beetles had similar markings on the speedometer. Must have been a German thing.
Larry Bud - 31 May 2006 19:49 GMT > > > Seeing as there are roads with 70 MPH speed limits within a few hours' > > > drive from my house, how would I be able to tell whether or not I was [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > > have no idea how fast you are going. :) Oh, and speed limits below 35MPH > > are rarely (like, almost never) enforced. -Dave
> I think speedometers are pretty useless, since quite frankly most sane > people drive the speed they are comfortable for road and weather > conditions (the one usenet troll this is geared to will invariable fair > to understand that). This might be true on the highway, but pretty wasteful on road with lights, since they are generally timed to a specific speed.
Sir Ray - 31 May 2006 20:41 GMT > This might be true on the highway, but pretty wasteful on road with > lights, since they are generally timed to a specific speed. Yes, I see where you are going with this logic, and it's a fair concept; but you can also use the reverse logic, in that the lights should be synchronized to move packs of traffic at the normal speed of travel (and here we can have all kinds of 'intellegant light timing' debate), so that a vehicle stops at one light, and when that's green the vehicle moves through a set of well-timed lights almost naturally (i.e. the normal rate of vehicle travel sets the light timing parameters, not the other way around), without worrying about a set speed number - this requires a DOT staff smarter and better trained (but not necessarily better paid) than the usual '3 political appointees and one well-connected PE staff consultant' that most muncipalities maintain around here.
Larry Bud - 01 Jun 2006 17:43 GMT > > This might be true on the highway, but pretty wasteful on road with > > lights, since they are generally timed to a specific speed. [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > parameters, not the other way around), without worrying about a set > speed number Fair enough. However, moving people at the fastest speed on surface streets isn't the only issue when discussing speed limits when you have driveways for businesses and/or developments that need to be able to turn onto those streets. The faster the traffic, the less time they have to blend in.
In addition, timed lights DO affect the opposing traffic, remember!
B1ackwater - 02 Jun 2006 03:59 GMT >> > This might be true on the highway, but pretty wasteful on road with >> > lights, since they are generally timed to a specific speed. [quoted text clipped - 16 lines] > >In addition, timed lights DO affect the opposing traffic, remember! There's an even more evil issue ... many businesses want a slow speed, even stops, in front of their places under the theory that people will NOTICE their shops and come back to spend money.
Frankly, if the road is sucky, I try to never come that way again ...
Pooh Bear - 31 May 2006 17:18 GMT > Oh, and speed limits below 35MPH are rarely (like, almost never) enforced. > -Dave Wouldn't it be nice if that were true in the UK.
Graham
TeeTeeplz@gmail.com - 01 Jun 2006 21:42 GMT > > Seeing as there are roads with 70 MPH speed limits within a few hours' > > drive from my house, how would I be able to tell whether or not I was [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > have no idea how fast you are going. :) Oh, and speed limits below 35MPH > are rarely (like, almost never) enforced. -Dave Both my brother and my dad got a ticket for a 25 mph zone. IT wasnt even a school zone or near a school either. Fuckin Carrolton cops....
Laura Bush murdered her boy friend - 31 May 2006 18:59 GMT > > >In the late 70s and 80s, most (all?) cars had speedometers that would only > > >go up to 85. Were they mandated by the government? What year did they come [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > > nate Keep it under 60 and you'll know you're not speeding. Next question.
N8N - 31 May 2006 20:23 GMT > > > >In the late 70s and 80s, most (all?) cars had speedometers that would only > > > >go up to 85. Were they mandated by the government? What year did they come [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] > > Keep it under 60 and you'll know you're not speeding. Next question. isn't that just a little bit unsafe, o safety nazi?
nate
laura bush - VEHICULAR HOMICIDE - 01 Jun 2006 06:56 GMT >> > > >In the late 70s and 80s, most (all?) cars had speedometers that would only >> > > >go up to 85. Were they mandated by the government? What year did they come [quoted text clipped - 16 lines] > >nate Slower is always safer. Next question, o psychopath.
N8N - 01 Jun 2006 14:06 GMT > >> > > >In the late 70s and 80s, most (all?) cars had speedometers that would only > >> > > >go up to 85. Were they mandated by the government? What year did they come [quoted text clipped - 18 lines] > > Slower is always safer. Next question, o psychopath. If you think that driving 60 MPH in 80 MPH traffic increases safety in any way over keeping up with the rest of the flow, you're either oblivious, an idiot, or both.
nate
Alex Rodriguez - 01 Jun 2006 19:52 GMT >If you think that driving 60 MPH in 80 MPH traffic increases safety in >any way over keeping up with the rest of the flow, you're either >oblivious, an idiot, or both. I think idiot is the appropriate description. --------------- Alex
Garth Almgren - 02 Jun 2006 03:24 GMT > Aunt Judy (Pride of Diarrhea) <http://tinyurl.com/65nqz> wrote: >>> Aunt Judy (Pride of Diarrhea) <http://tinyurl.com/65nqz> wrote: [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > any way over keeping up with the rest of the flow, you're either > oblivious, an idiot, or both. Thank you, Captain Obvious!
</good natured sarcasm>
 Signature ~/Garth |"I believe that it is better to tell the truth than a lie. Almgren | I believe it is better to be free than to be a slave. ******* | And I believe it is better to know than to be ignorant." (pgp@v6stang.com for secure mail info) --H.L. Mencken (1880-1956)
Paul Hovnanian P.E. - 03 Jun 2006 03:06 GMT [snip]
> Slower is always safer. Next question, o psychopath. You just keep that aluminum walker of yours at 1/2 mph and you'll be as safe as possible.
 Signature Paul Hovnanian mailto:Paul@Hovnanian.com ------------------------------------------------------------------ Sacred cows make the best hamburger. -- Mark Twain
TedKennedyMurderedHisPregnantMistress.dwpj65@spamgourmet.com - 01 Jun 2006 00:37 GMT > Keep it under 60 and you'll know you're not speeding. Next question. And the next question is: is that what you were doing in that 25mph school zone, hypocrite?
necromancer - 01 Jun 2006 05:34 GMT > said in rec.autos.driving: > > > Keep it under 60 and you'll know you're not speeding. Next question. > > And the next question is: is that what you were doing in that 25mph > school zone, hypocrite? IIRC, Loco Laura was "experimenting." Like "Ol Tubby was doing experiments at Chappaqqidick - you know: how long does it take for a woman to drown/suffocate in an Oldsmobile...
 Signature Aunt Judy defends a known *drunk driver*:
"Almost all vehicle 'accidents' are due to driver recklessness but the Chappaquidick incident is one instance where it may really have been no ones fault except the idiot who built the bridge." --"Laura Bush murdered her boyfriend," 11/10/2005 Ref: http://tinyurl.com/9jtjt Msg ID: 1131599968.267321.318380@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com
H.B. Elkins - 01 Jun 2006 19:36 GMT >> >In the late 70s and 80s, most (all?) cars had speedometers that would only >> >go up to 85. Were they mandated by the government? What year did they come [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] >> the victim's family will sue GM for selling cars that encourage >> speeding. If "Laura Bush-Vehicular Homicide" wants to travel so damn slow, let he/she/it walk, ride a bike or ride a horse!
Nate, sorry to piggyback on your post but I have the stupid mindless blob of protoplasm to whom you replied plonked.
 Signature To reply by e-mail, remove the "restrictor plate"
Pooh Bear - 31 May 2006 17:13 GMT > >In the late 70s and 80s, most (all?) cars had speedometers that would only > >go up to 85. Were they mandated by the government? What year did they come > >out? Why 85? At the time the maximum speed limit was 55. > > It's insane that they read anything over 60. 60 is barely moving !
> Someday GM is gonna get sued over this. No they're not.
> Somebody will get killed by a speeder doing 80 and > the victim's family will sue GM for selling cars that encourage > speeding. Go boil your head in a vat of acid you freak.
Graham
necromancer - 31 May 2006 18:38 GMT Pooh Bear said in rec.autos.driving:
> Go boil your head in a vat of acid you freak. Would that be the same acid that Loco Laura drops? ;-)
Laura Bush murdered her boy friend - 31 May 2006 19:02 GMT > > It's insane that they read anything over 60. > > 60 is barely moving ! Only a psychopath with no conception of right and wrong would say that.
Alan Baker - 31 May 2006 20:03 GMT > > > It's insane that they read anything over 60. > > > > 60 is barely moving ! > > Only a psychopath with no conception of right and wrong would say that. Sorry, but it's true.
On German autobahns, they travel far faster -- many up to twice as fast -- and in just as much safety.
There's no magic in a number, "laura".
The Ghost In The Machine - 03 Jun 2006 18:00 GMT >> > > It's insane that they read anything over 60. >> > [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > > There's no magic in a number, "laura". Indeed; around here we drive 80+ routinely -- on a road that's specified 65. (Except when a highway patrol cruiser is wandering about.)
Of course, we do pay for it; accelerating to 80 mph costs half again as much gas, as both initial acceleration (KE = 1/2 m v^2) and drag are proportional to the square of the velocity.
Also, 55 mph did save lives but it annoyed the hell out of everybody for awhile. :-) But if one wants "barely moving", try 5 mph, which is about 2.24 m/s.
 Signature #191, ewill3@earthlink.net It's still legal to go .sigless.
dougwill2001@yahoo.com - 31 May 2006 22:00 GMT > > > It's insane that they read anything over 60. > > > > 60 is barely moving ! > > Only a psychopath with no conception of right and wrong would say that. Depends on the circumstances? Would 55 mph be ok in say an alley?
Douglas A. Willinger Takoma Park Highway Design Studio http://www.HighwaysAndCommunities.com http://www.HighwaysAndCommunities.com/southcapitolstreet http://wwwsouthcapitolstreet.blogspot.com/
Pooh Bear - 01 Jun 2006 05:46 GMT > > > It's insane that they read anything over 60. > > > > 60 is barely moving ! > > Only a psychopath with no conception of right and wrong would say that. You're a clueless twat.
Graham
Paul Hovnanian P.E. - 03 Jun 2006 03:09 GMT > > > It's insane that they read anything over 60. > > > > 60 is barely moving ! > > Only a psychopath with no conception of right and wrong would say that. You just keep that little gray head of yours down below the steering wheel, peering intently at your speedometer. The rest of us are watching traffic.
 Signature Paul Hovnanian mailto:Paul@Hovnanian.com ------------------------------------------------------------------ Applying information technology is simply finding the right wrench to pound in the correct screw.
Allen Seth Dunn - 01 Jun 2006 02:01 GMT >> >In the late 70s and 80s, most (all?) cars had speedometers that would >> >only [quoted text clipped - 15 lines] > > Go boil your head in a vat of acid you freak. Sigh, considering how the idea of personal responsibility has faded over the years, the more likely I think this troll could actually be right. Now I'm not saying that it's right, but there's been a surgeon general's warning on cigarettes for God knows how many years now, and yet people are still suing cigarette makers?
> Graham necromancer - 31 May 2006 19:01 GMT laura bush - VEHICULAR HOMICIDE relaxed its anal sphoncter muscle and this flatulence was smelled by all in rec.autos.driving and unassociated newsgroups:
> It's insane that they read anything over 60. What's insane is that a flatulence cloud emitting piece of sh.t like you is allowed to be among decent people - much less drive.
> Someday GM is gonna get > sued over this. Somebody will get killed by a speeder doing 80 and > the victim's family will sue GM for selling cars that encourage > speeding. Ain't happened yet and ain't going to happen. And 80 is a legal speed now. (Cue to the rest of the USA to follow TX's lead).
TedKennedyMurderedHisPregnantMistress.dwpj65@spamgourmet.com - 31 May 2006 20:18 GMT > laura bush - VEHICULAR HOMICIDE relaxed its anal sphoncter muscle and > this flatulence was smelled by all in rec.autos.driving and unassociated [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > What's insane is that a flatulence cloud emitting piece of sh.t like you > is allowed to be among decent people - much less drive. I seriously doubt there's many "decent people" that allows Laura to be in their midst. Can you detect the anger of a social reject in it's posts? Perhaps that's why Laura hangs out at the bath houses drooling over celebrities in homosexual pornography rags.
Larry Bud - 31 May 2006 19:44 GMT > >In the late 70s and 80s, most (all?) cars had speedometers that would only > >go up to 85. Were they mandated by the government? What year did they come [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > the victim's family will sue GM for selling cars that encourage > speeding. If the posted speed limit is 80, how is that person a "speeder"? And since you're such a, ahem, law abiding citizen, how is someone to know accurately they're going 80 without a speedodometer goes to 60?
Alex Rodriguez - 01 Jun 2006 19:51 GMT >It's insane that they read anything over 60. Someday GM is gonna get >sued over this. Somebody will get killed by a speeder doing 80 and >the victim's family will sue GM for selling cars that encourage >speeding. As stupid as this sounds, it could happen. After all some woman sued McD's , and won, for serving hot coffee. ------------- Alex
GK - 02 Jun 2006 05:42 GMT >>In the late 70s and 80s, most (all?) cars had speedometers that would only >>go up to 85. Were they mandated by the government? What year did they come [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > the victim's family will sue GM for selling cars that encourage > speeding. The auto manufacturers can solve the problem in the usual way, mail you a warning notice sticker to be applied next to the speedo dial.
Verbage something like "Warning, even though the speedometer displays ranges of relative velocity measurements, you may be killed, injured or maimed if you operate this vehicle either too fast or too slow for actual road conditions. The speedometer is primarily to be referenced when approaching an area where local law enforcement personnel are holding fundraisers in order to purchase more police state equipment."
GK
Paul Hovnanian P.E. - 03 Jun 2006 03:01 GMT > >>In the late 70s and 80s, most (all?) cars had speedometers that would only > >>go up to 85. Were they mandated by the government? What year did they come [quoted text clipped - 17 lines] > > GK A BIG sticker. Covering the entire speedo dial.
 Signature Paul Hovnanian mailto:Paul@Hovnanian.com ------------------------------------------------------------------ RAM disk is *not* an installation procedure.
Paul Hovnanian P.E. - 03 Jun 2006 03:04 GMT [snip]
> It's insane that they read anything over 60. Someday GM is gonna get > sued over this. Somebody will get killed by a speeder doing 80 and > the victim's family will sue GM for selling cars that encourage > speeding. But how would they know they were speeding if that's all the higher the dial goes?
 Signature Paul Hovnanian mailto:Paul@Hovnanian.com ------------------------------------------------------------------ professor; n, One who talks in someone else's sleep.
The Ghost In The Machine - 03 Jun 2006 18:00 GMT > [snip] > [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > But how would they know they were speeding if that's all the higher the > dial goes? Radar units could be posted in strategic spots around the freeways; these radar units would transmit a signal to a car's throttle/braking controls. The car would be forced to slow down (and in some cases even stop, if an override is present in the system -- e.g., a warrant broadcast as part of an "amber alert"). An "OVERSPEED" warning indicator, black on red or white on red depending on taste (these are commonly known as "idiot lights"), would be mandated on all cars after a certain model year; this indicator would light up and blink to give the driver 10 seconds to slow down to posted speed -- or the car will do it for him, the indicator glowing a steady red in that case. The car would then be forced to drive at the posted speed for the next 15 minutes, as penance; this would be enforced by a notification broadcast from central dispatch. Three violations in an hour or a 50% overspeed (e.g., 45 mph in a 30 mph zone) would constitute grounds for engine cutoff; the linkage, transmission, or ignition system would be disabled in a repairable (but not bypassable, at least by the casual user) and safe fashion (e.g., a foam plug of some sort in the fuel line that can be removed later) but the car would be disabled, coasting to a stop, ideally in a safe stretch of freeway. A patrol escort can also be notified to assist the driver -- or arrest him, as necessary.
Weather monitors could be built into the units as well, adjusting the speed limit for night driving, or rainy, foggy, snowy, or dusty weather, or any combination thereof.
Erratic driving would be slightly harder to enforce but there is the possibility that onboard GPS units can monitor the vehicle and check for "out-of-true" conditions that would suggest the driver is weaving, unsafely changing lanes, or passing on the wrong side -- or even *driving* on the wrong side.
Cars could also be equipped with units that allow printout of their route. This could be done wirelessly using Bluetooth or perhaps with an RJ45 jack compatible with networking equipment such as one might find on modern desktop computers. (This is primarily for use by the defense in a court case and for worried parents of teenagers; the prosecution would have the route as plotted out by cell monitors in the roadway.) Cars would not be required to have onboard maps, although such might be a nice addition for higher-priced automobiles. The route would be a 4- or 5-dimensional plot of points (1 coordinate is for speed); additional software could translate that into a scrawl that shows exactly where the car was when. Additional coordinates, such as car orientation, engine performance indications, and braking signals, are also possible. Such would turn the car into more of an airplane -- a consideration when one realizes that a 15 gallon fuel tank (weighing about 92 pounds) contains 1.815 gigaJoules, or just under half a ton of TNT equivalent. [*]
Can't be too careful with all those bombs driving around, now, can we? :-)
And of course cars might also know who's driving them, to some extent (or, more precisely, who will be held responsible if the law is violated). This might be doable by means of an authorization system that requires the license to be inserted in a slot, then a fingerprint unit would scan the driver's thumb and match it to the card.
Much of this machinery is already in place in US cities -- and is even advertised. "OnStar" for instance is a cellular communications system and GPS locator unit on General Motors vehicles here in the US. "LoJack" is occasionally sold on vehicles, and can remotely disable them using a special authorization signal when the vehicle is reported stolen. (It may also have GPS. I'd have to look.) Throttle control has been contemplated in Great Britain although I don't know if it's been implemented there yet; one can use cells or satellites, depending on expense and capabilities needed (rural roads are problematic). Cell phones, of course, are everywhere, and studies have been suggested to monitor cell signals to indicate traffic blockages -- but they could also be monitored for other purposes. (Note that cell signals are always "on", in some sense, if only as a beacon, so that the cell can find the phone in the event a call needs to reach it.)
How much of this is Constitutional in the US? Good question. I wish I knew the answer.
[*] The good news: it doesn't all get released at once! It's meted out by the throttle linkage, fuel injectors, etc. It's also surprisingly difficult to get a pool gasoline to catch fire, let alone explode, using merely a cigarette.
http://www.intuitor.com/moviephysics/ http://www.intuitor.com/moviephysics/mpmain.html#cigarettes
 Signature #191, ewill3@earthlink.net It's still legal to go .sigless.
necromancer - 31 May 2006 19:06 GMT > Ronnie Dobbs said in rec.autos.driving: > In the late 70s and 80s, most (all?) cars had speedometers that would only > go up to 85. Were they mandated by the government? What year did they come > out? Why 85? At the time the maximum speed limit was 55. Dunno if they were mandated (hanging head in shame at being a GA resident when this happened), but from my car ownership experiences reveal the following:
'76 model year: 120 MPH speedo, no 55 highlight
'83, '87 and '88 model years: 85MPH speedo with 55 highlight
'96 and '00 models: 110MPH and 120MPH respectively, no 55 highlight. Don't know the why of the 110 and 120 mph speedos, really. The fastest I've ever got one of them to is 90MPH sustained and 100MPH in a passing burst.
Brent P - 31 May 2006 19:33 GMT >> Ronnie Dobbs said in rec.autos.driving: >> In the late 70s and 80s, most (all?) cars had speedometers that would only >> go up to 85. Were they mandated by the government? What year did they come >> out? Why 85? At the time the maximum speed limit was 55.
> Dunno if they were mandated (hanging head in shame at being a GA > resident when this happened), but from my car ownership experiences > reveal the following: > > '76 model year: 120 MPH speedo, no 55 highlight > '83, '87 and '88 model years: 85MPH speedo with 55 highlight I think the actual law covered from 1977 to about 1985 model years. The problem is that once a speedo was designed, it continued for model years there after. '77 mavericks have the 85mph speedo, I know the '86 mazda had a normal speedo.
argatlam_roads@yahoo.com.mx - 31 May 2006 20:36 GMT ['Brent P':]
> I think the actual law covered from 1977 to about 1985 model years. > The problem is that once a speedo was designed, it continued for model > years there after. '77 mavericks have the 85mph speedo, I know the '86 > mazda had a normal speedo. Do you have a cite to the actual law? I.S.T.M. that the O.P. was looking for chapter and verse. B.T.W., my 1978 Impala had an 85 M.P.H. speedometer (can't remember whether 55 received special emphasis), but my 1986 Maxima goes up to 110 or 115.
John F. Carr - 01 Jun 2006 00:05 GMT >I think the actual law covered from 1977 to about 1985 model years. >The problem is that once a speedo was designed, it continued for model >years there after. '77 mavericks have the 85mph speedo, I know the '86 >mazda had a normal speedo. The law was Federal Motor Vehicle Safety Standard 127, a NHTSA regulation. The repeal process started shortly after Reagan took office. The Federal Register notice stated:
In February and March of [1981], NHTSA undertook a comprehensive review of its existing and pending vehicle safety standards. The purpose of the review was to determine what modifications could be made to the standards to reduce the regulatory burden on the automobile industry without sacrificing safety. Among the factors considered in evaluating each standard was the magnitude of the standard's contribution to safety, the likelihood that manufacturers might continue to comply with the standard after its modification or rescission, and the costs of the standard. ...
Among the standards considered was Safety Standard No. 127, Speedometers and Odometers (49 CFR 571.127). ... The speedometer requirements became effective on September 1, 1979.
The rule was officially revoked effective March 25, 1982.
The electronic Federal Register archives do not go back to the original rulemaking process under Carter.
The process shows how the predient affects the attitude of the government towards regulation. Carter's NHTSA had claimed that tamper-evident odometers were essential for safety. Under Reagan, they weren't a safety problem any more.
 Signature John Carr (jfc@mit.edu)
John F. Carr - 01 Jun 2006 00:19 GMT >The electronic Federal Register archives do not go back to >the original rulemaking process under Carter. On closer examination, the speedometer rule may be partially President Ford's doing. The notice of revocation of the regulation stated:
The agency's 1976 regulatory evaluation on Standard No. 127 projected that the requirement that the limitation on the maximum speed shown on the speedometer scale would be five percent effective in reducing accidents involving young drivers. The projected effectiveness was based on the assumption that the 85 mph maximum speed indication would be a psychological deterrent to high speed driving. However, the agency has no data indicating that the speedometer scale limitation is effective to any extent in reducing the tendency to drive too fast and in reducing the resultant accidents and injuries. Also, the commenters provided no data indicating that the limitation had any actual effect.
If NHTSA was thinking about 85 mile per hour speedometers in 1976, Carter was not President yet. He may have signed off on the final rule.
 Signature John Carr (jfc@mit.edu)
Allen Seth Dunn - 01 Jun 2006 01:51 GMT >> Ronnie Dobbs said in rec.autos.driving: >> In the late 70s and 80s, most (all?) cars had speedometers that would [quoted text clipped - 15 lines] > I've ever got one of them to is 90MPH sustained and 100MPH in a passing > burst. For what it's worth, my 94 Ford Ranger has this too.
Otto Yamamoto - 01 Jun 2006 03:48 GMT > Dunno if they were mandated (hanging head in shame at being a GA > resident when this happened), but from my car ownership experiences > reveal the following: God. Grow a brain. 55 is the Richard Nixon Memorial Speed Limit; Ray-gun promised a repeal, but vetoed the highway bill that put the rural Interstate limit to 65 MPH in 1987. Even with that, most of the easten states remained at 55 until the NMSL died under the(wait for it.........) CLINTON(booga! booga!) administration. Betcha pissed yr pants when I said CLINTON. Now I'll say CARTER! Bwhahahahaha. You know, "liberals" work overtime to suck, but they don't hold a candle to "conservatives", who not only suck harder, but are proud of it!
 Signature Otto Yamamoto http://mryamamoto.50megs.com
necromancer - 01 Jun 2006 05:22 GMT > Otto Yamamoto said in rec.autos.driving: > [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > overtime to suck, but they don't hold a candle to "conservatives", who not > only suck harder, but are proud of it! And your liberal educated reading comprehension skill are showing. Go back and re-read the posts where people were talking about speedometers reading up to 85MPH and HAD 55MPH HIGHLIGHTED ON THEM, YOU IDIOT!!!
Pooh Bear - 01 Jun 2006 05:58 GMT > > Ronnie Dobbs said in rec.autos.driving: > > In the late 70s and 80s, most (all?) cars had speedometers that would only [quoted text clipped - 13 lines] > I've ever got one of them to is 90MPH sustained and 100MPH in a passing > burst. My last 3 cars have had 140 mph speedos. Probably the previous 2 as well but not sure.
Graham
dougwill2001@yahoo.com - 31 May 2006 21:59 GMT > In the late 70s and 80s, most (all?) cars had speedometers that would only > go up to 85. Were they mandated by the government? What year did they come > out? Why 85? At the time the maximum speed limit was 55. IIRC, the 100 mph max. speedometer reading regulation was a child of Senator Danforth.
I do not recall if Danforth was behind the 85 mph max. regulation.
Douglas A. Willinger Takoma Park Highway Design Studio http://www.HighwaysAndCommunities.com http://www.HighwaysAndCommunities.com/southcapitolstreet http://wwwsouthcapitolstreet.blogspot.com/
|
|
|