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Car Forum / Driving, Maintenance, Tuning / Driving / June 2006Worldwide Campaign to Take the Lane
Yes, why not. If we are some more than a nuisance to drivers, then we too belong in the lane, the middle of the lane that is, since we can't be happy with the scraps of riding in the gutter, and then be terrorized there too, like it happened to me the other day when a black SUV blasted the horn in an act of intimidation. The Big Fish eats the Little Fish, but the sardines had it. Well, the Jungle may never be same... Here's an identifying T-shirt... http://www.cafepress.com/burncalories "When overtaking a bicyclist, motorists are worried about how close vehicles in the adjacent or oncoming lanes are rather than how close they are coming to the bicyclist - and they are certainly in too much of a hurry to stop and wait for a gap in traffic before pulling out and safely passing a rider." http://www.bicyclinginfo.org/ee/enforce_motorist.htm WELCOME TO THE JUNGLE http://webspawner.com/users/donquijote > "When overtaking a bicyclist, motorists are worried about how close > vehicles in the adjacent or oncoming lanes are rather than how close [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > > http://www.bicyclinginfo.org/ee/enforce_motorist.htm What a bunch of sensationist crap that is! Had they said "When overtaking a bicyclist, a very small percentage of motorists are worried about how close...." they would have a little more credibility. Wayne >> "When overtaking a bicyclist, motorists are worried about how close >> vehicles in the adjacent or oncoming lanes are rather than how close [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] >> >> http://www.bicyclinginfo.org/ee/enforce_motorist.htm > What a bunch of sensationist crap that is! Had they said "When > overtaking a bicyclist, a very small percentage of motorists are worried > about how close...." they would have a little more credibility. Don is just a troll. To be accurate, most motorists excerise enough care to leave sufficent distance. When they fear another motorist, most will put the insufficent space towards the bicyclist. Some motorists of course simply show no care what-so-ever and will even purposely brush pass a bicyclist on an otherwise empty four lane road. With regards to those who fear their fellow motorists more than the bicyclist, the bicyclist needs to do take things into his own hands. Experience allows one to develop knowledge of when these situations occur before they occur. Taking the lane for just a couple of seconds at the correct moment can prevent it. The vast majority of motorists who would have come to close grasp the concept and understand it once the bicyclist falls back and allows the pass a couple seconds later. If done correctly, the worst the passing motorist suffers is a momentary small reduction in speed. However, a very small percentage become hostile. Nothing can be done about them, as they are also the type to brush pass a lone bicyclist on an empty four lane road. >>> "When overtaking a bicyclist, motorists are worried about how close >>> vehicles in the adjacent or oncoming lanes are rather than how close [quoted text clipped - 27 lines] > done about them, as they are also the type to brush pass a lone bicyclist > on an empty four lane road. I am passed too closely on a regular basis. By "too closely" I mean the overtaking driver doesn't even cross the center line. I wrote a letter to my local newspaper about this, and the followups that were posted were along the lines of "you should be in the bike lane". >>>> "When overtaking a bicyclist, motorists are worried about how close >>>> vehicles in the adjacent or oncoming lanes are rather than how close [quoted text clipped - 30 lines] > local newspaper about this, and the followups that were posted were along > the lines of "you should be in the bike lane". The LAST time I got all self righteous about taking the lane was in 2001 and I wound up in a road rage type fist fight with a drunk 30 years younger than me. He was so pissed that he went around me then slammed on the brakes and got out swinging. I fended him off for about 3 minutes and then every cop in town arrived. All the neighbors that had called 911 wanted me to press charges and my only thought was that I was glad I didn't lose my cool and put him in ICU. Silly, but I was worried about seriously hurting him and ME going to jail for over defending myself. I did a flat palm punch to his forehead which should have rattled his brain enough to stay down, but he bounced off a car across the street and somehow stayed on his feet. The next few minutes were spent leisurely ducking drunken swings. Maybe he was pissed he didn't hit me. And people wonder why I ride in the country. Now as long as I don't piss off any bears. Bill Baka > All the neighbors that had called > 911 wanted me to press charges and my only thought was that I was glad > I didn't lose my cool and put him in ICU. I've kept my cool and pressed charges once. > And people wonder why I ride in the country. I refuse to allow people to force me off the road. I use my bicycles for recreation and transportation. Just like my cars. My rule is that if someone gives me problems I ride more. There is also something about being alone on such roads that has inspired crap such as drivers crossing the center line to play pointless games of chicken. Heavy traffic where a driver is well aware that he can't get away from me is often the best at keeping idiotcy down. Except for that creature who gets pissed off because he can't kiss a car bumper directly in front of him. When drivers think they'll get away is when they behave the worst IME. > Now as long as I don't piss off any bears. > > I am passed too closely on a regular basis. By "too closely" I mean the > > overtaking driver doesn't even cross the center line. I wrote a letter to my [quoted text clipped - 16 lines] > Now as long as I don't piss off any bears. > Bill Baka Good thing it was only one drunken driver and not a gang of fit guys. Yesterday, I was riding (not yet taking the lane, just the gutter) and some SUV opened the window and told me to be out of the road. There was some tempting sidewalk nearby but I didn't budge. I made a small mistake though: I GAVE THEM FINGER, and they either didn't see it or didn't care. I'll try to keep my cool next time and just wear my banana shirt with the slogan: YOU CAN EAT MY BANANA! > >>> "When overtaking a bicyclist, motorists are worried about how close > >>> vehicles in the adjacent or oncoming lanes are rather than how close [quoted text clipped - 30 lines] > I am passed too closely on a regular basis. By "too closely" I mean the > overtaking driver doesn't even cross the center line. I would guess this is because you're riding too close to the right-hand edge of the roadway. By riding too far to the right, you encourage cars to pass without treating you like a "slow moving vehicle" in the lane. I normally ride with a Take-a-Look mirror which helps greatly in controlling overtaking vehicle's behavior. My typical rides are on semi-rural roads with 45 mph speed limits, and no shoulders. When I observe a vehicle approaching from behind, and the vehicle is not setting up for a proper pass by moving towards or over the center line, I'll drift the bike to the left a foot or two while the vehicle is still well back. This, in turn, almost always encourages the overtaking driver to also shift left. As he gets close, I then drift back towards the right, allowing for optimimum separation between us. With the mirror, I can easily monitor the whole sequence of events without having to turn around. If an overtaking driver seems to not be getting the message as they approach, I'll intentionally "bobble" the bike a bit. Even with jerks who want to give me a close shave, this normally results in them moving left (the jerks just want to mess with you, not kill you). This technique is even more important when there's a line of overtaking cars...in that case, it's not the first car you need to worry about (it's the teenage girl in the 3rd vehicle who's talking to her friend on her cell phone while she tries to change the CD player that you should be most worried about!). By forcing the first car to respond by moving well left, the following cars will see that there's something ahead that they need to avoid. Also, if I notice a car approaching from my front at the same time a car is approaching from the rear, I'll often move to the center of the lane and indicate with a backward facing left palm that it's not safe for the overtaking car to pass. When the oncoming lane is clear, I move right and wave the overtaking car around. Using these assertive techniques, I find I hardly ever experience a "close shave", and most folks where I ride treat me with respect.  Signature~_-* ...G/ \G http://www.CycliStats.com CycliStats - Software for Cyclists > I wrote a letter to my > local newspaper about this, and the followups that were posted were along > the lines of "you should be in the bike lane". > If an overtaking driver seems to not be getting the message as they > approach, I'll intentionally "bobble" the bike a bit. Yes, that is something I do as well. a couple inches of what appears to the driver as random lateral movement will generally result in that driver being better behaved. >> >>> "When overtaking a bicyclist, motorists are worried about how close >> >>> vehicles in the adjacent or oncoming lanes are rather than how close [quoted text clipped - 81 lines] > Using these assertive techniques, I find I hardly ever experience a "close > shave", and most folks where I ride treat me with respect. No. I take 18 inches of the lane. I just happen to live in an area with a lot of a.shole drivers. I am about as vehicular a cyclist as possible. > >> >>> "When overtaking a bicyclist, motorists are worried about how close > >> >>> vehicles in the adjacent or oncoming lanes are rather than how close [quoted text clipped - 84 lines] > No. I take 18 inches of the lane. I just happen to live in an area with a > lot of a.shole drivers. I am about as vehicular a cyclist as possible. Where do you live? There's plenty of rednecks and kids where I live, but the vast majority seem to have no trouble getting around me without incident. However, like most cyclists, these encounters cannot always be avoided...there's one old jerk that has buzzed me on occasion, who I've nearly had blows with while standing in the middle of the road hurling invectives at one another (just one reason I carry pepper spray). BTW - if you haven't tried a good mirror, you may be surprised at how much additional "situational awareness" it imparts. GG > "> > Where do you live? There's plenty of rednecks and kids where I live, but [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > > GG I live in Citrus County, Florida, which has the unique mixture of retired Yankees and rednecks, both of which like to pass too closely. I use a helmet mounted mirror, but seeing them coming still doesn't change the fact that they do it. I have, er, "informed" people of their poor passing technique when I caught them at stoplights. The usual response? "Get off the road!". Makes one want to smash a window with my ASP baton, but I usually just repeat my mantra and count to ten. :-) > > BTW - if you haven't tried a good mirror, you may be surprised at how much > > additional "situational awareness" it imparts. [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > Makes one want to smash a window with my ASP baton, but I usually just > repeat my mantra and count to ten. :-) Count to ten and then smash their window. :) Kidding. They got the lion's share of the road and still want more. Typical of the lion. That's why the monkey gave him the finger, I mean the banana... (Based on the slogan: MAKE LOVE, NOT WAR? "Make love, not war," was not just a protest against the indifference and lack of humaneness in Vietnam; it was also a positive statement that love between parent and child, teacher and pupil, fiance and fiancee, and husband and wife is an activity we should try to pursue in the house when work is not necessary. It is the one real source of truth, beauty, and salvation in a community where deceit, corruption, and impersonality seem to be rampant. -Jerome Kagan) The smart monkey shows his cleverness... And what better way to make love than to give the banana to the roaring lion? The monkey knows that the lion is more powerful than him, and knows he better use his own weapons, so he decides to be funny, that being his natural gift. The story goes like this: The lion roars: "Monkey, I'm made to eat meat, so you better come down right now." And the monkey replies very cool: "Mighty King, that's doubtful as the Bible says you were vegetarian, so you can eat my banana..." (T-shirts with the slogan "You Can Eat My Banana" available now!) > I have, er, "informed" people of their poor passing technique > when I caught them at stoplights. The usual response? "Get off the road!". > Makes one want to smash a window with my ASP baton, but I usually just > repeat my mantra and count to ten. :-) Yesterday I was riding about 25mph on a 30mph SL residential 2 lane road. A driver guns it up to 45-50mph to pass me rather close to a stop sign. I was close enough that I had taken the lane because I was going straight and most people turn right. He crosses the double yellow cuts back right and jams on the brakes. Thankfully there was just enough room where it simply looked bad instead of actually forcing me to take evasive action. So I pull up next to his left a half a second later (he's turning right, I'm going straight across the major arterial) and just say, 'what was that, about a half a second?' He gets all pissed off... I found that drivers don't the idiotcy and pointlessness of what they've done pointed out. > "Brent P" <tetraethylleadREMOVETHIS@yahoo.com> wrote in message >> To be accurate, most motorists excerise enough care to leave sufficent >> distance. When they fear another motorist, most will put the insufficent [quoted text clipped - 13 lines] >> done about them, as they are also the type to brush pass a lone bicyclist >> on an empty four lane road. > I am passed too closely on a regular basis. By "too closely" I mean the > overtaking driver doesn't even cross the center line. I ride a few inches further left when that occurs and it usually cures the problem of close passing by drivers affraid to cross a painted line. > I wrote a letter to my > local newspaper about this, and the followups that were posted were along > the lines of "you should be in the bike lane". The problem with bike lanes is that drivers then believe bicyclists are only allowed to use roads with them, must remain in the bike lane, and that the painted stripe offers the bicyclist magical protection. That is, the bicyclist is magically safe when they pass withing 6 inches because each is on opposite sides of a painted line and there is car door opening to the bicyclist's right taking up 90+% of the bike lane. > > "Brent P" <tetraethylleadREMOVETHIS@yahoo.com> wrote in message > [quoted text clipped - 32 lines] > each is on opposite sides of a painted line and there is car door opening > to the bicyclist's right taking up 90+% of the bike lane. That's a very valid point. I saw a study once (in Florida, I think) that showed that after a bike lane was added to a roadway, the average distance between car and cyclist actually *decreased* when compared to a roadway with no designated bike lane. That might not be the case with really wide (6'+) bike lanes, but the right side of those tend to become unusable anyway due to the accumulated glass, stones, etc. In Europe, they're actually experimenting with removing "traffic control devices" (e.g., bike lanes, designations between roadway and sidewalk, traffic signals, etc.) because it helps enforce good behavior by removing the "I'm in my space and you're in your space" attitudes. ~_-* ...G/ \G http://www.CycliStats.com CycliStats - Software for Cyclists > > With regards to those who fear their fellow motorists more than the > > bicyclist, the bicyclist needs to do take things into his own hands. [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] > local newspaper about this, and the followups that were posted were along > the lines of "you should be in the bike lane". And since THERE'S NO BIKE LANE, that amounts to YOU SHOULD BE RIDING A STATIONARY BIKE AT HOME, and stop whining. ;) > > What a bunch of sensationist crap that is! Had they said "When > > overtaking a bicyclist, a very small percentage of motorists are worried > > about how close...." they would have a little more credibility. > > Don is just a troll. I thought I had earned the tittle of "activist" by now. Was Cervantes a troll too, and how about Bush? > To be accurate, most motorists excerise enough care to leave sufficent > distance. When they fear another motorist, most will put the insufficent [quoted text clipped - 13 lines] > done about them, as they are also the type to brush pass a lone bicyclist > on an empty four lane road. Yep, and it only takes one bad one to end your life (miseries). The best solution would be to take the lane or...set aside a lane for cyclists. > > "When overtaking a bicyclist, motorists are worried about how close > > vehicles in the adjacent or oncoming lanes are rather than how close [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > overtaking a bicyclist, a very small percentage of motorists are worried > about how close...." they would have a little more credibility. Well, I just quoted them. But, since I'm riding on the gutter, few have to bother to really avoid since there's some room left for me, the scraps so to speak. However, it only takes one reckless driver in 1000 to make a small mistake and... The result is that monkey lives in a permanent state of stress, in which being eating would be the actual end of his miseries. I hope they don't live him paralized though. :( +-------------------+ .:\:\:/:/:. | PLEASE DO NOT | :.:\:\:/:/:.: | FEED THE TROLLS | :=.' - - '.=: | | '=(\ 9 9 /)=' | Thank you, | ( (_) ) | Management | /`-vvv-'\ +-------------------+ / \ | | @@@ / /|,,,,,|\ \ | | @@@ /_// /^\ \\_\ @x@@x@ | | |/ WW( ( ) )WW \||||/ | | \| __\,,\ /,,/__ \||/ | | | jgs (______Y______) /\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\//\/\\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\ ============================== > +-------------------+ .:\:\:/:/:. > | PLEASE DO NOT | :.:\:\:/:/:.: [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > /\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\//\/\\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\ > ============================== Your ascii troll appears to have gone through a paper shredder ;) > > +-------------------+ .:\:\:/:/:. > > | PLEASE DO NOT | :.:\:\:/:/:.: [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] > > Your ascii troll appears to have gone through a paper shredder ;) Is that a monkey? Cute... By the way, I got a similar recommendation, but says, DO NOT FEED THE LION! > Yes, why not. If we are some more than a nuisance to drivers, then we > too belong in the lane, the middle of the lane that is, since we can't [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > Little Fish, but the sardines had it. Well, the Jungle may never be > same... You really have to be crazy to ride a bicycle on our roads. The car drivers will terrorize you every time, knowing that even if they kill you all they have to do is call it an accident and nothing will be done to them. > > Yes, why not. If we are some more than a nuisance to drivers, then we > > too belong in the lane, the middle of the lane that is, since we can't [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > you all they have to do is call it an accident and nothing will be done > to them. I agree. And then you'll be on the evening news and the rest of the cyclists would be further scared into riding sidewalks --or not riding at all. And the police will even be sympathetic to them... 'EVERY police patrol officer should watch for these violations while on routine patrol and take enforcement action when they observe them. Problems with enforcement against the driver: Unfortunatley, the law enforcement officer is most likely having to make up for the failure of traffic engineers to properly accommodate bicyclists in roadway design, or for our failure to train motorists to deal safely with bicyclists, or for a lack of bicyclist education. If a bicyclist is "holding up" a motorist by riding in the middle of the travel lane, the chances are the bicyclist would be more than happy to be riding in a designated bike lane or on a paved shoulder, but none exists. Many motorists are uncomfortable passing a cyclist because they were never really taught how to deal with that situation when learning to drive. Bicyclists are often held in quite low esteem by other road users - the image of the errant cyclist running stop signs and red lights pops easily into almost everyone's head. Thus, stopping a motorist to cite them for a traffic violation involving a cyclist is, on the face of it, going to win the officer very few new friends. Indeed, many motorists will be completely unaware of what they have done wrong even after being pulled over. The first task for the officer, therefore, is to make sure the motorist does understand and appreciate the impact of behavior that causes danger to a bicyclist. If the driver seems to get the message, a warning may be all that is necessary. Some drivers, however, won't get it. They will steadfastly refuse to accept that a cyclist - any cyclist - should be on the road, particularly that road, in front of them. They may even claim to be acting in the cyclists' best interest in telling them to "get off the road" for their own safety. Even if the officer wouldn't ride on that road themselves, they should help the driver understand that the cyclist has a legitimate right to be on the road and that riding in the gutter or on the sidewalk (assuming one exists) is likely much less safe. If the driver still fails to see the light, a ticket may be the only option. Officers should beware the defense that "the cyclist was all over the road". Certainly some cyclists do weave around and are unpredictable. More often than not, the cyclist is simply trying to avoid a pothole, dodge a rock or broken glass, or stay away from a crack in the road between the gutter and the asphalt. Cyclists are not required or expected to ride in the gutter, and are not required to get out of the way of motorists. Equally, a cyclist should not deliberately hold up a motorist when there is space for safe passing.' (same original link) > Here's an identifying T-shirt... > http://www.cafepress.com/burncalories Does that T-Shirt really say "We will take the lane until we get bike lanes" ? Are you suggesting that cyclists should ride around in a shirt that implies to drivers that bikes shouldn't be on the road if there's a cycle farcility like these ? http://www.warringtoncyclecampaign.co.uk/facility-of-the-month What I propose is very similar to Critical Mass, perhaps only that we are facing the jungle out there, and the issue wouldn't be only cycling which interests a few, but all the issues across the board*. Well, and our message is very funny which makes our fliers a hot commodity among the little people. So, yes, we are more than Critical Mass in that the sardiness see the need to stick together and face the predators... *'Coming Out of the Jungle' at http://webspawner.com/users/donquijote1 6. Learn the traffic laws. If your ride draws any appreciable number of riders, you can expect attention from the police. Riders may or may not choose to follow the law, but you still need to know what the law is so you know whether or not you're breaking it. Get a copy of your local traffic laws from your state and city websites. Most states requires cyclists to obey all the same rules as cars (e.g., Stop signs & red lights). You'll probably also be required to have a headlight after dark, and there may be limits to how many bikes abreast (side by side) you can ride. Some riders ignore laws that have no safety consequences (e.g., riding 3-abreast instead of 2-abreast). 7. Will you block traffic? The most controversial aspect of CM is the extent to which it blocks traffic. CM'ers are fond of saying "We're not blocking traffic, we ARE traffic!" While that's a cute phrase, it's obviously pretty silly. It's like a murderer saying, "I didn't kill that human, I *am* a human!" Just because bikes are legitimate road users doesn't mean they don't slow down other road users -- especially when they go out of their way to do so by taking up multiple lanes. Remember that CM is supposed to be a celebration of cycling, not your opportunity to see how much inconvenience you can cause to others. It's about asserting our right to the road, not denying others their right to the road. Leave at least one lane open for cars. (So if you're on a 4-lane road, take no more than 3 lanes. Except if you're on a one-lane road, obviously you will take the whole lane.) Taking all the lanes, all the time, might be fun for you, but it certainly brings the police down on you quicker. Motorists will ring 911 off the wall with their cell phones if you block them 100%. It also doesn't win you any friends. Are you doing CM to show motorists how much fun biking can be, or are you just trying to piss them off because it makes you feel good? Only CM riders can answer these questions for themselves. Also remember that your local laws may have a say about that (though some riders choose to ignore them). Even if you decide that you don't want to go overboard with taking lanes, understand that you can't control the riders -- some riders may want to take all the lanes all the time. If this is not the flavor you want for your ride, then make that clear in the fliers you make for the ride, and get other cyclists to apply gentle peer pressure when a few cyclists stray. Unfortunately if two people out of 200 decide to be jerks then your CM's reputation will come from them rather than from the other 198. But since CM has no leaders, you can't order anyone to ride the way you want, you can only try to encourage them. 8. Confrontation with motorists. Harassing motorists doesn't help anyone. You can assert your right to the road without being a dick about it. Many CM'ers make it a point to be friendly to motorists, such as smiling and waving -- even smiling and waving back when motorists are honking and cursing at them. Some go even farther, handing out flowers, holding signs saying "Sorry for the delay", or passing out fliers apologizing for the minimal once-a-month delay, and explaining why we ride. If you want to avoid confrontation with motorists, put something to that effect in the fliers you use to promote the rides. http://critical-mass.info/howto/ > What I propose is very similar to Critical Mass, Your plan, then, is to win them over by being obnoxious. > > What I propose is very similar to Critical Mass, > > Your plan, then, is to win them over by being obnoxious. Nope. It's not what it says above... "Remember that CM is supposed to be a celebration of cycling, not your opportunity to see how much inconvenience you can cause to others. It's about asserting our right to the road, not denying others their right to the road. Leave at least one lane open for cars." > > > What I propose is very similar to Critical Mass, > > [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > > Leave at least one lane open for cars." From every news report I've seen, they don't act that responsibly. > From every news report I've seen, they don't act that responsibly. Only bad stuff makes the news. Where's the story in "Critical Mass Ride Passes Without Incident; Bikes, Cars Share Road Peacefully?" Signaturefneep >> From every news report I've seen, they don't act that responsibly. > > Only bad stuff makes the news. Where's the story in "Critical Mass Ride > Passes Without Incident; Bikes, Cars Share Road Peacefully?" Critical mass by definition is about causing a critical mass of badly riding bicycle riders slow traffic. In chicago they will take over intersections so 'the mass' can stick together. That means they ignore the red cycles. If a motorist dares to assert himself on a green signal for his direction, he is attacked. If it wasn't for the police round ups of anyone on a bicycle I might be tempted to go down there and ride perpendicular to the mass and ride through on my green while they were running the red. Maybe that way they would get the point. Or maybe run a red while they are going through on green... of course like most self important people they probably won't understand the lesson. > > Leave at least one lane open for cars." > > From every news report I've seen, they don't act that responsibly. OK, although I've made contacts for colaboration with them, I promise always to leave a free lane for cars. It's in our philosophy that both the lion and us accept COMPETITION so that one day may share the road in peace. Actually that's the way it happens in a tiny itchy piece of America: Key West. There you see high respect for riders. No wonder so many tourists feel so free down there. This is the lion we mean to tame... THE LAW OF THE JUNGLE Once upon a time, in the deep jungle, lived a Lion and a Monkey... One day the Monkey, tired of the Lion always taking the LION'S SHARE, and seeing that such injustice represented a danger to all, demanded JUSTICE... The Lion, yawning and stretching, said, "You would have to have paws and sharp teeth..." Then the Monkey, who was very clever, devised a plan: He would go to the costume store, and look like a lion... When the HUNGRY LION saw him, noticing that the new lion wasn't a match for him, and fearing COMPETITION, killed him on the spot --before the indifferent look of the little animals of the jungle... And that's how the Law of the Jungle was re-established one more time... I dont mind shareing the road with bicycles but lots of riders need to show a little more respect for cars too. Every spring in the shanondoah vally, bicyclist gather in large groups and take over the roads. Now its my understanding that bicycles have to obay the same laws as cars do. I was sitting at a red light (first in line) in the left turn lane waiting for the green arrow. Well all these bicycles pulled up all around my car. And I mean all the way up past the front tires of my car. I just let them go but I was very tempted to pull my 44 automatic pistol from under the seat and ask them nicely to get back behind the car where they belong. Also they seem to like riding when every body is leaving and going to work during the week. And they don't even consider pulling off the road at a good spot to let cars around them. Why cant they stay on the Blue Ridge Parkway and ride during the hours when people have to be at certain places at certain times. I dont think they realize they are playing with peoples paychecks when they back up traffic. I get fustrated from Farm Tractors too. But I have more respect for them because they are going to or leaving the feilds. I know they are not out their backing up traffic for fun and sport, and most pull off the road at the first chance they get to let cars go by. I guess I could have just said cars and bikes both need to show each other more respect. > I was sitting at a red light (first in line) in the left turn lane waiting > for the green arrow. Well all these bicycles pulled up all around my car. They're supposed to wait in queue. AFAIK, only California allows lane splitting. > Also they seem to like riding when every body is leaving and going to work > during the week. And they don't even consider pulling off the road at a good > spot to let cars around them. Learn how to pass. When I pass a cyclist on a two-lane undivided road, I go completely into the opposite lane, pass, and return to the right side of the road. It's no different when passing a slow moving motor vehicle except for the fact that it's much easier to see a passing opportunity ahead of the cyclist ahead of time. >> I was sitting at a red light (first in line) in the left turn lane >> waiting for the green arrow. Well all these bicycles pulled up all around [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] > except for the fact that it's much easier to see a passing opportunity > ahead of the cyclist ahead of time. I do when the opportunity presents itself but I live out in the sticks and the roads are mostly curves and hills. Not very many safe places to pass. But when I find a good spot I do. >>Learn how to pass. When I pass a cyclist on a two-lane undivided road, I >>go completely into the opposite lane, pass, and return to the right side >>of the road. It's no different when passing a slow moving motor vehicle >>except for the fact that it's much easier to see a passing opportunity >>ahead of the cyclist ahead of time. > I do when the opportunity presents itself but I live out in the sticks and > the roads are mostly curves and hills. I know what you mean (I live in WV). > Not very many safe places to pass. But when I find a good spot I do. It's not too difficult. Compared to a motor vehicle, it takes much less time to pass a cyclist due to the larger speed differential at a lower speed. Therefore, there will be more opportunities to pass. >>>Learn how to pass. When I pass a cyclist on a two-lane undivided road, I >>>go completely into the opposite lane, pass, and return to the right side [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] > time to pass a cyclist due to the larger speed differential at a lower > speed. Therefore, there will be more opportunities to pass. I agree when its only a few but most of the time their in pacts of 15 or more. But I do find them them riding alone also > It's not too difficult. Compared to a motor vehicle, it takes much less > time to pass a cyclist due to the larger speed differential at a lower > speed. Therefore, there will be more opportunities to pass. The bicyclist is also a fraction of the length and width of an automobile. So even when the bicyclist is doing 28 in a 30 the pass takes far less time. (although most drivers wouldn't even consider passing another driver in that situation, but it's common for drivers to pass me when I am doing the speed limit or greater on a bicycle when they wouldn't dare if I had been driving the same speed) Width wise, should there be a problem, getting closer to a bicyclist is possible where it would be certain collision with a motor vehicle. >>It's not too difficult. Compared to a motor vehicle, it takes much less >>time to pass a cyclist due to the larger speed differential at a lower >>speed. Therefore, there will be more opportunities to pass. > The bicyclist is also a fraction of the length and width of an automobile. > So even when the bicyclist is doing 28 in a 30 the pass takes > far less time. (although most drivers wouldn't even consider passing > another driver in that situation, but it's common for drivers to pass me > when I am doing the speed limit or greater on a bicycle when they > wouldn't dare if I had been driving the same speed) At those speeds, I ride in the middle of the lane. I got a speedometer for my bike, but I cannot maintain more than 16 to 18 mph (my tandem pedaling rpm in top gear) on flat ground without tiring myself out. Slight uphill grades take me down to 12 to 14 mph. I am able to maintain 22 to 25 mph if I'm going down those slight grades though. > Width wise, should there > be a problem, getting closer to a bicyclist is possible where it would > be certain collision with a motor vehicle. I wouldn't try passing if that were a problem (no point in risking a collision with another motor vehicle or cyclist). There will always be another passing opportunity. >>>It's not too difficult. Compared to a motor vehicle, it takes much less >>>time to pass a cyclist due to the larger speed differential at a lower [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] > Slight uphill grades take me down to 12 to 14 mph. I am able to > maintain 22 to 25 mph if I'm going down those slight grades though. I have speedo on my cannondale and often take the lane when I reach the posted speed limit. However that won't stop a great number of drivers, like the one I mentioned in earlier post. They will actually speed up to absurd speeds for the conditions to pass. I've had people go over 40mph on residential 20/25mph roads because even though I was at or slightly above the speed limit, they base their speed on what's around them. Since I am using a bicycle, I must be slow so.... >> Width wise, should there >> be a problem, getting closer to a bicyclist is possible where it would >> be certain collision with a motor vehicle. > I wouldn't try passing if that were a problem (no point in risking a > collision with another motor vehicle or cyclist). There will always be > another passing opportunity. I was refering to something unforseen by a normal person... say an animal or child or an illegally operating bicyclist or someone pulling out of a driveway without looking and yielding... that sort of thing. But some drivers are extremely timid and need to be encouraged, because the drivers behind them take their rage out on the bicyclist. >I have speedo on my cannondale and often take the lane when I reach the >posted speed limit. However that won't stop a great number of drivers, [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] >above the speed limit, they base their speed on what's around them. Since >I am using a bicycle, I must be slow so.... The idea is to get the pass done as quickly as possible. I'll do the same to a car. Posted speed limit? That's a concern for the tax collectors. SignatureThere's no such thing as a free lunch, but certain accounting practices can result in a fully-depreciated one. >>I have speedo on my cannondale and often take the lane when I reach the >>posted speed limit. However that won't stop a great number of drivers, [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > The idea is to get the pass done as quickly as possible. I'll do the > same to a car. I drive on these roads at 25mph too. Nobody passes me. Why must I be passed when bicycling at 25mph but not when driving at 25mph? > Posted speed limit? That's a concern for the tax collectors. 25mph is proper for residential roads. It's about the only widely used speed limit that makes sense and isn't a taxation guide. There are numerous useful arterials to drive 40+mph on where the speed limit is a taxation guide line. > I guess I could have just said cars and bikes both need to show each other > more respect. Fair enough. Just that monkeys in packs tend to misbehave. A lot of education is in order for both cyclists and drivers. Today by the way I rode in the jungle, and I mean, THE jungle, but no incidents. I too rode respecting almost all laws. I guess riders could eventually be ticketed if we want full recognition. > > I guess I could have just said cars and bikes both need to show each other > > more respect. > > Fair enough. Just that monkeys in packs tend to misbehave. That's called Critical Mass. > > > I guess I could have just said cars and bikes both need to show each other > > > more respect. > > > > Fair enough. Just that monkeys in packs tend to misbehave. > > That's called Critical Mass. It's also packs of bicycles in Key Biscayne, where they do got bike lanes but ride the roads in packs in order to train, socialize, etc. And I hear one got killed recently. Here is the result of the search... "What we need is unity"... This says it all. Hundreds ride to pay tribute to fallen cyclists Close to 300 cyclists took part in the Ride of Silence on Key Biscayne on Wednesday to honor those have been injured or killed in bike accidents and to raise awareness. BY MICHELLE HAMMONTREE-GARCIA mhammontree@MiamiHerald.com Jo Kling lost her brother in a Bangkok bicycle accident seven years ago. Maria Luisa De Jesus was bedridden for a week after being sideswiped by a car on the Rickenbacker Causeway. And John Rothchild was hit on Miami Beach while riding parallel to traffic. All were in a group of 325 cyclists who took part in a 12-mile Ride of Silence on Key Biscayne on Wednesday to raise awareness and honor biking enthusiasts who have been killed or injured on public roads. They rode slowly and silently, and wore black armbands in solidarity -- or red arm bands if they had been injured, or a family member had been injured or killed. ''The ride was like a funeral march, or a procession,'' said organizer John Voss. It was emotional for some, like De Jesus, who was hit May 8 as she came off the William Powell Bridge heading toward the Key Biscayne toll plaza. ''I started crying as I was riding out of the parking lot onto the road,'' De Jesus said. ``I got off easy. In the last few months, accidents are happening too often and too fast.'' Earlier this year, cyclist Omar Otaola was killed after he was struck by a car just past the Bear Cut Bridge, where the bicycle lane comes to an end, forcing cyclists to turn into the parking lot or merge with motorists. Otaola, 33, left behind a wife and two daughters. Held during National Bike Month, the Ride of Silence is a global event. This year cyclists in 273 U.S. cities and in six countries -- including Australia, Canada and China -- participated in similar rides Wednesday. The organization's website, www.rideofsilence.org, tells the story of how Chris Phelan created the ride in 2003 in Dallas after a fellow cyclist was hit and killed by a bus. Voss, an avid cyclist, organized the event in Miami after coming across the website. ''I was surprised that Miami hadn't participated in the event yet. It was the appropriate reaction because of the amount of people that ride in Miami and the recent deaths,'' said Voss, 39, the chief operating officer for Hispanic Market Weekly magazine. Kling, 61, joined the ride in honor of her brother, who was the victim of a hit-and-run. ''People are taking action and that is a good thing. Motorists need to be aware that there are cyclists on the road with them and that we have the right to be there,'' Kling, who lives near the Design District, said before the ride. ``One thing I notice more and more is that people are distracted on their cellphones while driving.'' Rothchild, 61, was hit by a motorist while testing out his new bike in Miami Beach. He was riding parallel to traffic when he heard screeching brakes. The next thing he knew he was airborne, landing on his hip with his bike on top of him. 'It is not all the motorists' fault. Things like construction make traversing some roads difficult for both bikers and drivers. We both suffer. What we need is unity,'' Rothchild said. ``Some things that can help are better signage, doubling speeding fines if there are bikers on the road and cleaning up some roads.'' http://www.miami.com/mld/miamiherald/news/local/states/florida/counties/miami-da de/cities_neighborhoods/coral_gables/14625355.htm >> I guess I could have just said cars and bikes both need to show each >> other [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > I too rode respecting almost all laws. I guess riders could eventually > be ticketed if we want full recognition. I think its too much fund raising evolved with bicyclist for the law to crack down. Now if its just a pack of kids with no protection then I say yes. I very rarely see kids on the road. Just last month I did see two kids on skateboards in the middle of a major road on a bridge. I thought that was very dangerous. Most of the bike problems I run into is the groups with the black spandex pants and all the riding gear. But I will admit their was a few I did not mind following watching them bent over the handle bars :) >I dont mind shareing the road with bicycles but lots of riders need to show >a little more respect for cars too. Every spring in the shanondoah vally, [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > go but I was very tempted to pull my 44 automatic pistol from under the > seat and ask them nicely to get back behind the car where they belong. So, you carry a Desert Eagle under your seat? Or is it an Automag? If you're going to lie about having a gun under your seat, at least know what you're talking about. >>I dont mind shareing the road with bicycles but lots of riders need to >>show a little more respect for cars too. Every spring in the shanondoah [quoted text clipped - 11 lines] > you're going to lie about having a gun under your seat, at least know what > you're talking about. Its a Desert Eagle old type frame. holds 8 in the clip and 1 in the barrel. 44 mag. It will hit a milk jug at 200 feet every time. So what makes you think im lying? Also have a raging bull 454 but its too big of a gun for self defense >>>I dont mind shareing the road with bicycles but lots of riders need to >>>show a little more respect for cars too. Every spring in the shanondoah [quoted text clipped - 15 lines] > makes you think im lying? Also have a raging bull 454 but its too big of a > gun for self defense Because nobody with any sense: A) Would keep an expensive firearm like a Desert Eagle under the seat of a vehicle B) Would use something as jury UNFRIENDLY as a Desert Eagle in a defense situation C) Would use something as unwieldy and overpenetrative as a .44 magnum anywhere stray rounds could injure other people. So, either you're lying, or you're a stupid, reckless a.shole. Which is it? >>>>I dont mind shareing the road with bicycles but lots of riders need to >>>>show a little more respect for cars too. Every spring in the shanondoah [quoted text clipped - 27 lines] > So, either you're lying, or you're a stupid, reckless a.shole. Which is > it? I will settle for reckless a.shole. But if people don't try to start crap with me when I am not doing anything to them. Then they will have nothing to worry about. If people cant respect each other because its the right thing to do. Then maybe they will respect others because what can happen if they don't. That's why I think every person should carry. Theirs not many people that would rob a 7-11 if every body in the store was carrying a firearm. Yes that idea has a few problems too. But those problems would be more isolated then the wide spread problems we have now. > I will settle for reckless a.shole. But if people don't try to start crap > with me when I am not doing anything to them. Then they will have nothing to > worry about. If people cant respect each other because its the right thing > to do. Then maybe they will respect others because what can happen if they > don't. That's why I think every person should carry. Theirs not many people > that would rob a 7-11 if every body in the store was carrying a firearm. There are not many who would rob a store if nobody had a weapon plus the chances of anybody being injured are less. That would seem to be a better outcome. Maybe we just see things differently in Australia. YMMV, Darryl > > I will settle for reckless a.shole. But if people don't try to start crap > > with me when I am not doing anything to them. Then they will have nothing to [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > YMMV, > Darryl Yep. In Australia you are upside-down. Or maybe it is us, since the rest of the world is at odds with us. :( Comprehensive programs to reclaim the jungle --I mean the roads-- from the Big Predators --I mean the SUVs-- and give it back to the little furry animals --I mean the cyclists. Of course, even if we are right we will find the opposition of the vultures --I mean those who profit from the jungle-- so there's only one choice left: ORGANIZE. Don't say Aesop didn't tell you about it... The Lion and the Three Bulls THREE BULLS for a long time pastured together. A Lion lay in ambush in the hope of making them his prey, but was afraid to attack them while they kept together. Having at last by guileful speeches succeeded in separating them, he attacked them without fear as they fed alone, and feasted on them one by one at his own leisure. Moral: Union is strength. OK, here's what we got to do in order to bring cyclists out overcoming fear and intimidation... (I'd provoke though a quick resolution to the issue: TAKE THE LANE) Stone One: the secret of the average (17-24 year olds are not significantly more at risk cycling than driving, but when cycling they are drastically less danger to others. Getting this group out of cars and onto bikes would be an entirely risk-free measure that would also cut road danger as effectively as campaigns against drinking and driving. That is our first stepping stone. Getting more young adults to cycle really will mean less danger.) Stone Two: cyclists don't kill (Those who focus only on cyclist versus driver risks are apt to miss that cycling is a benign mode of transport. There were 172 cyclists killed in 1999, but only 6 other road users were killed in crashes involving a bicycle. By comparison, there were 1,100 drivers killed, but 1,600 other road users were killed in crashes involving cars. The reason is obvious enough: car crashes are far more violent than bicycle crashes.) Stone Three: the Growth Rule (Consider these two facts: 0.8% of road travel is by bicycle; 5% of road deaths are cyclists. It is silly to conclude that if 16% of road travel were by bike, 100% of road deaths would be cyclists. But that is exactly what the DTLR does assume when it is estimating the effects of increased cycling. It is clear enough that the main reason the risks of cycling are higher here in Britain than elsewhere is simply that there are not enough cyclists on the roads. If there were more cyclists, cycling would get safer - and that's a mathematical certainty, as we saw above.) Better marketing = safer cycling If there is going to be a cycling revival, we have to destroy the old myths and create a new brand image for cycling - based on the facts. Destroy the myth that cycling is dangerous and you destroy the other myth that pro-bike equals anti-car. The bike will sell on its strongest points: - Safe - Healthy - Quick No lie in any of that, especially pushing it at the 17-24 age group. Put the facts in a positive instead of negative light. The logic path is clear enough. To make cycling safer, we must make it more popular; to make it more popular, we have to rebuild its image as something attractive that people will be drawn to getting into. Brand image is a self-fulfilling prophecy. Changing the software of minds If I were putting together an action plan for a cycling revival, these would be my main points: 1. Educate local government, the medical establishment and the road safety establishment about the three stepping stones: - encourage 17-24 age group to cycle rather than drive; - cyclists don't kill, so most other age groups are a safe bet too; - the safety benefits of much more cycling as given by the Growth Rule. 1. Also gather more backing from enlightened public health professionals; 2. Encourage existing cyclists to support the new image - safe, healthy, quick; 3. Keep pushing the Growth Rule message to sustain momentum of revival. http://www.cyclenetwork.org.uk/papers/stepping.pdf > So, you carry a Desert Eagle under your seat? Or is it an Automag? If you're > going to lie about having a gun under your seat, at least know what you're > talking about. Just out of curiosity (and I know you weren't the person talking about having an automatic pistol under the seat of his car) but if one *were* to have an automatic in a car, and actually fire it, what the heck would happen to the spent casings? Woudn't they bounce all over the interior of the car at a fairly high velocity? Or do they have soem sort of 'brass catcher' bag attachment on them these days? >> So, you carry a Desert Eagle under your seat? Or is it an Automag? If >> you're going to lie about having a gun under your seat, at least know [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > Or do they have soem sort of 'brass catcher' bag attachment on them > these days? They likely would hit the headliner,and lose energy and drop onto the floor somewhere.Hard surfaces make them ricochet more. I'd be more worried about hot brass dropping down my neck or landing on my arm.Maybe thats another reason gangbangers wear flannel long-sleeve shirts,even in hot weather. ;-) SignatureJim Yanik jyanik at kua.net >> So, you carry a Desert Eagle under your seat? Or is it an Automag? If >> you're [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > Or do they have soem sort of 'brass catcher' bag attachment on them > these days? No the casings do not eject at such a high velocity to do any harm. If one would hit the dash or windshield it would most likely just bounce off and land in the floorboard. I am left handed and got hit by casing a few times. As Jim said. The hot brass would be more an issue if it went down your shirt. But no real harm, just be sore for a few hours. > I was sitting at a red light (first in line) in the left turn lane waiting > for the green arrow. Well all these bicycles pulled up all around my car. > And I mean all the way up past the front tires of my car. I just let them go > but I was very tempted to pull my 44 automatic pistol from under the seat > and ask them nicely to get back behind the car where they belong. Let me explain what some drivers do, from the perspective of a bicyclist who does wait in the queue. I pull up at the back of the queue. A driver pulls up behind me. That driver decides that since I am on a bicycle I don't get a turn and begins to use the size of his vehicle to take my place in queue. (even when I am in the middle of the lane) And so the argument begins as I attempt to hold my place. This gets worse in a multi-light-cycle stop-and-go. On a couple of occasions, because I was being harrassed by drivers for doing things the right way, I gutter passed to the front and took off first. This gave me a lead on the a.sholes and moved the confrontration to where they would have to slow down to harrass me. Most won't do that. > Also they seem to like riding when every body is leaving and going to work > during the week. Funny, when I bike commute many a driver thinks I am on pleasure ride.... > And they don't even consider pulling off the road at a good > spot to let cars around them. I've had drivers tell me what a 'good spot' was on occasion. Such 'good spots' generally had a significant chance of crashing, falling, and/or causing damaging to the bicycle or being more dangerous that continuing to ride normally. Not to mention the fact that if these drivers had the slightest bit of skill in operating their vehicle they had chances to pass me. >> I was sitting at a red light (first in line) in the left turn lane waiting >> for the green arrow. Well all these bicycles pulled up all around my car. [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] >don't get a turn and begins to use the size of his vehicle to take my >place in queue. So of course this justifies what those pedalcyclists did to the previous poster? SignatureWhat the heck, I'll play too. - Dave >>> I was sitting at a red light (first in line) in the left turn lane waiting >>> for the green arrow. Well all these bicycles pulled up all around my car. [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] >>don't get a turn and begins to use the size of his vehicle to take my >>place in queue. > So of course this justifies what those pedalcyclists did to the > previous poster? I am explaining what some drivers do, just as I stated. There is nothing to 'read' into it. You should know by now the only thing I may be justifying here (well in the portion you snipped) is the feeling of shooting the people who do this sort of thing regardless of their vehicle. >>>> I was sitting at a red light (first in line) in the left turn lane >>>> waiting [quoted text clipped - 20 lines] > shooting > the people who do this sort of thing regardless of their vehicle. I did not say I was going to shoot them. I just said I was going to ask them nicely first. Then the rest would depend on how big and bad they wanted to be. > Let me explain what some drivers do, from the perspective of a bicyclist > who does wait in the queue. I pull up at the back of the queue. A driver [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > argument begins as I attempt to hold my place. This gets worse in a > multi-light-cycle stop-and-go. Drivers are not that bad around here. On my commute, I have to take a left turn. There are two left turn lanes, and I queue up in the right-most left turn lanes (often I'm the first or second in queue). Despite the fact that the left most turn lane has one or two cars in it, people pull up behind me. After the first time one of those drivers nearly ran me off the road in the turn, I've resorted to keeping the lane until after I've completed the left turn. Now, I don't accelerate that fast (I usually can match, but I'm not able to exceed the average driver's rate of acceleration). I would assume that a driver would have the sense to take the left most turn lane and accelerate at his or her desired pace instead of tailgating and attempting to brush pass me in the turn. > Now, I don't accelerate that fast (I usually can match, but I'm not able > to exceed the average driver's rate of acceleration). I would assume > that a driver would have the sense to take the left most turn lane and > accelerate at his or her desired pace instead of tailgating and > attempting to brush pass me in the turn. Many don't have that kind of sense. I've had this occur a few times. Clear and open left lane, but they choose to use the right lane behind me. Then they are upset they are behind me and I'm not moving fast enough. One, it's the right lane. Two, the left lane is open. and sometimes 3, I'm going the speed limit anyway. Then again I've seen drivers do this sort of nonsense all on their own. 10 vehicles waiting in the left lane, one in the right. Both lanes going to the same place. >> I was sitting at a red light (first in line) in the left turn lane >> waiting [quoted text clipped - 32 lines] > slightest bit of skill in operating their vehicle they had chances to > pass me. Just like I said before. Cars need to show respect for the bikes and bikes need to show respect for the cars. Until that happens then their is always going to be conflicts. > > I've had drivers tell me what a 'good spot' was on occasion. Such 'good > > spots' generally had a significant chance of crashing, falling, and/or [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > need to show respect for the cars. Until that happens then their is always > going to be conflicts. The lion and the monkey should coexist. It won't happen though until the lion shows respect for the monkey. Or until the monkey makes him the lion banana. > The lion and the monkey should coexist. It won't happen though until > the lion shows respect for the monkey. Or until the monkey makes him > the lion banana. I apologize: I'm teaching the monkey how to write. It should say: "Or until the monkey makes the lion eat the banana." Check it out... http://clipart.com/en/close-up?o=2671139&memlevel=C&a=a&q=monkey%20with%20banana &k_mode=all&s=37&e=54&show=&c=&cid=&findincat=&g=&cc=&page=3&k_exc=&pubid= > Yes, why not. If we are some more than a nuisance to drivers, then we > too belong in the lane, the middle of the lane that is, since we can't [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > Little Fish, but the sardines had it. Well, the Jungle may never be > same... If you want whole lanes for bikes only, they you have to pay for it. Since bike riders are very small part of the traffic, it should not cost more than a few tens of thousands of dollars per year maybe up to a few million per year for each bike rider to build those lanes. If you want to ride with the cars at a much slower speed, the accident and death rate will go up exponentially. Then you are just asking for legal suicide, Those are the choices. Politically there is no way that either approach will be realistic. Building a network of bike only lanes for free is not realistic either in the US > If you want whole lanes for bikes only, they you have to pay for it. We already did. Thanks for mentioning it! SignatureWarm Regards, Claire Petersky http://www.bicyclemeditations.org/ See the books I've set free at: http://bookcrossing.com/referral/Cpetersky > > Yes, why not. If we are some more than a nuisance to drivers, then we > > too belong in the lane, the middle of the lane that is, since we can't [quoted text clipped - 16 lines] > will be realistic. Building a network of bike only lanes for free is not > realistic either in the US Well, it seems the lion will eat me either way... And surely one solution is...to ride a stationary bike while I watch the evening news and see how people die in the real world for nothing (a hit and run while biking) or over a stupid war over oil, and then feel comfort in the safety I enjoy... Or just take a stand and say, "I will go out there to the jungle and fight the predators and all the lie-ons*, and if anything I will die for a cause..." The cause of the sardines, that is, since it's only one worth fighting for and staying home is part of the indifference that causes the world to remain a jungle. This quote is perhaps the key: "What worries me is not the violence of a few, but the indifference of the many" -M.L. King Maybe we need a slogan: "Play Hard, Fight Smart"... (*Robert Redford was speaking recently about all those lies in the system. I'll try to get his actual words.) Well, this article by Redford is not exactly news (2002) but very timely nevertheless... (And, of course, the REAL PATRIOTS are not those fakes in SUVs with the "We Support Our Troops" made-in-China ribbon, but THOSE RIDING BICYCLES, who happen to be terrorized by the same distracted, phone-in-ear SUV drivers.) "Big challenges require bold action and leadership. To get the United States off fossil fuels in this uneasy national climate of terrorism and conflict in the Persian Gulf, we must treat the issue with the urgency and persistence it deserves. The measure of our success will be the condition in which we leave the world for the next generation." The Highest Patriotism Lies in Weaning U.S. From Fossil Fuels by Robert Redford The Bush White House talks tough on military matters in the Middle East while remaining virtually silent about the long-term problem posed by U.S. dependence on fossil fuels. Failing to rein in our dependence on imported oil gives leverage to undemocratic and unstable regimes. Wasteful consumption of fossil fuels creates political liabilities overseas, air pollution at home and global warming. The rate at which the United States burns fossil fuels has made our country a leading contributor to global warming. The Bush administration's energy policy to date -- a military garrison in the Middle East and drilling for more oil in the Arctic and other fragile habitats -- is costly, dangerous and self-defeating. Despite the absence of leadership on energy security in Washington, some local efforts are paying off. Last year, San Francisco voters overwhelmingly approved a $100-million bond initiative to pay for solar panels, wind power and energy efficiency for public buildings. The measure was supported not only by the environmental community but also by the Chamber of Commerce, labor unions and the American Lung Assn. San Francisco's first solar project, a $5.2-million energy- efficiency upgrade at the Moscone Convention Center, was dedicated last month. What's the straight economic benefit of this particular project? Plenty. The upgrades and the panels combined will cut energy consumption in the building by as much as 38%, and the project will pay for itself from energy savings. The net savings to taxpayers after debt service is subtracted are projected to be more than $200,000 a year. American rooftops can be the Persian Gulf of solar energy. After Australia, no developed nation on Earth gets more annual sunlight than the United States. In addition, wind is now the fastest-growing energy source worldwide and one of the cheapest. But wind and solar power generate less than 2% of U.S. power. We can do better. We can increase auto fuel economy standards to 40 miles per gallon. The technology to achieve that goal exists now. Phasing in that standard by 2012 would save 15 times more oil than Alaska's Arctic National Wildlife Refuge is likely to produce over 50 years. We could also give tax rebates for existing hybrid gas-electric vehicles that get as much as 60 mpg and invest in mass transit. These measures would keep energy dollars in the American economy, reduce air pollution and create jobs at home. The benefits of switching to a mostly pollution-free economy would be considerable, and the costs of failing to do so would be steep. Prolonging our dependence on fossil fuels would guarantee homeland insecurity. If you are worried about getting oil from an unstable Persian Gulf, consider the alternatives: Indonesia, Nigeria, Uzbekistan. If we want energy security, then we have to reduce our appetite for fossil fuels. There's no other way. Other issues may crowd the headlines, but this is our fundamental challenge. Big challenges require bold action and leadership. To get the United States off fossil fuels in this uneasy national climate of terrorism and conflict in the Persian Gulf, we must treat the issue with the urgency and persistence it deserves. The measure of our success will be the condition in which we leave the world for the next generation. Weaning our nation from fossil fuels should be understood as the most patriotic policy to which we can commit ourselves. http://www.commondreams.org/views02/1202-03.htm > Well, this article by Redford is not exactly news (2002) but very > timely nevertheless... [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] > The Highest Patriotism Lies in Weaning U.S. From Fossil Fuels > by Robert Redford I'd be willing to make a serious bet that Robert Redford consumes more fossil fuels than you and me combined. >> Well, this article by Redford is not exactly news (2002) but very >> timely nevertheless... [quoted text clipped - 16 lines] > I'd be willing to make a serious bet that Robert Redford consumes more > fossil fuels than you and me combined. He whispers to horses, however. (Of course, so did Homer Simpson in a memorable TV moment...) > I'd be willing to make a serious bet that Robert Redford consumes more > fossil fuels than you and me combined. Perhaps. But then there is this: SANTA MONICA, California (Reuters) -- In the Robert Redford Building, toilets flush themselves with rainwater -- except for the urinals, which use no water at all -- the floors are made of bamboo and the carpets from hemp. All of which help make it, the actor said during a dedication ceremony in the Los Angeles municipality of Santa Monica, one of the "greenest" buildings in America and a glimpse into the environmentally friendly future. http://www.cnn.com/2003/TECH/science/11/17/redford.building.reut/ Signaturefneep > > I'd be willing to make a serious bet that Robert Redford consumes more > > fossil fuels than you and me combined. [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > buildings in America and a glimpse into the environmentally friendly > future. How much jet fuel did he burn traveling to the dedication ceremony? Signature------------------------------------------------------------------------- Free software - Baxter Codeworks www.baxcode.com ------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > > I'd be willing to make a serious bet that Robert Redford consumes more > > > fossil fuels than you and me combined. [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] > > How much jet fuel did he burn traveling to the dedication ceremony? Gore planned his trips to be Carbon-Neutral. He either traveled commercial or got Carbon Offsets. |
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