Car Forum / Driving, Maintenance, Tuning / Driving / January 2007
Traffic pinball in Portland, Oregon
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MLOM - 17 Jan 2007 18:33 GMT Another fine day on the ice with FUBAR vehicle operators.
http://video.msn.com/v/us/msnbc.htm?g=C25F5D6E-1900-4EB3-8CE2-A25E2C142C90&f=00& fg=copy
bob zee - 17 Jan 2007 19:36 GMT > Another fine day on the ice with FUBAR vehicle operators. > > http://video.msn.com/v/us/msnbc.htm?g=C25F5D6E-1900-4EB3-8CE2-A25E2C142C90&f=00& fg=copy I am sure it is a good video. I would like to see it. Too many hoops to jump through though:
Step 1: Download Microsoft? Internet Explorer 6 Microsoft Internet Explorer 6 is free to download Step 2: Download Microsoft Windows Media? Player Windows Media Player 10 is free to download Step 3: Download Macromedia Flash Player Macromedia Flash player is free to download
oh well
:~( bob z.
necromancer - 17 Jan 2007 20:47 GMT Ladies and Gentlemen (and I use those words loosely), bob zee said in rec.autos.driving:
> > Another fine day on the ice with FUBAR vehicle operators. > > [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > Step 1: Download Microsoft© Internet Explorer 6 > Microsoft Internet Explorer 6 is free to download Funny, I was able to watch it with Firefox with no problem....
 Signature Sincerely,
The New World Order.
Ad absurdum per aspera - 17 Jan 2007 21:23 GMT >>>http://video.msn.com/v/us/msnbc.htm?g=C25F5D6E-1900-4EB3-8CE2-A25E2C142C90&f=00& fg=copy That first one made the national news this morning. It's hard to tell because of the lens and camera angle, but I'd bet that the long tailslide into a group of cars in an intersection is downhill, Portland being well provided with hills.
I think most or all of the perpetrators were also getting a hard first lesson in what an SUV does and doesn't buy you.
Something else one notices: some of these were subsequent accidents -- people piling into the scene of an earlier stall or accident -- and a number of those sent pedestrians scattering. The end of the first sequence, in particular, seemed to catch a number of people by surprise who'd been crossing the street or standing around in the middle of the street eyeballing the aftermath of the earlier accident.
Fortunately I saw this from a city just south of the freeze line in the storn du jour. A few people went out and found the patches of black ice, but most folks seemed to exercise common sense and made it through the morning commute undamaged... or just had a second cup of coffee in their own kitchens until things got better. (Sometimes the most valuable thing thing the old-timers know about the bad driving conditions peculiar to their area is when to stay home!)
>> I would like to see it. Too many hoops to jump through though: None of the browsers are perfect, but Firefox for the Mac (http://www.getfirefox.com) and whatever free plug-ins I've plugged into it over time served me well.
--Joe
Scott en Aztlán - 18 Jan 2007 07:01 GMT "Ad absurdum per aspera" <jtchew@california.com> said in rec.autos.driving:
>>>>http://video.msn.com/v/us/msnbc.htm?g=C25F5D6E-1900-4EB3-8CE2-A25E2C142C90&f=00& fg=copy > >That first one made the national news this morning. It's hard to >tell because of the lens and camera angle, but I'd bet that the long >tailslide into a group of cars in an intersection is downhill, Portland >being well provided with hills. Maybe, but that doesn't explain the first vehicle, which slides down one hill, makes a 90 degree turn, and then slides backwards down a second hill. I strongly suspect that gravity had some solid assistance from the driver's right foot causing the drive wheels to alternately spin and lock up.
 Signature I'm a wreckless driver and damn proud of it!
Eeyore - 18 Jan 2007 07:08 GMT > "Ad absurdum per aspera" <jtchew@california.com> said > [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > from the driver's right foot causing the drive wheels to alternately > spin and lock up. I'm sure I heard the driver 'gun' the engine at least once. How crazy is that ?
Graham
Scott en Aztlán - 18 Jan 2007 15:43 GMT Eeyore <rabbitsfriendsandrelations@hotmail.com> said in rec.autos.driving:
>> Maybe, but that doesn't explain the first vehicle, which slides down >> one hill, makes a 90 degree turn, and then slides backwards down a [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > >I'm sure I heard the driver 'gun' the engine at least once. How crazy is that ? Ever see someone stuck in the snow? They will sit there and floor the pedal, even though the wheel is just spinning and burning off all their rubber. People are STUPID!!!
 Signature I'm a wreckless driver and damn proud of it!
Brent P - 18 Jan 2007 18:53 GMT > Ever see someone stuck in the snow? They will sit there and floor the > pedal, even though the wheel is just spinning and burning off all > their rubber. People are STUPID!!! You need traction to burn rubber. The surface is lubricated with snow...
Scott en Aztlán - 19 Jan 2007 02:54 GMT tetraethylleadREMOVETHIS@yahoo.com (Brent P) said in rec.autos.driving:
>> Ever see someone stuck in the snow? They will sit there and floor the >> pedal, even though the wheel is just spinning and burning off all >> their rubber. People are STUPID!!! > >You need traction to burn rubber. The surface is lubricated with snow... You live in Chicago, and yet claim you've never seen what I described?
OK, now I *know* you just like to argue for argument's sake.
 Signature I'm a wreckless driver and damn proud of it!
MLOM - 19 Jan 2007 03:34 GMT > tetraethylleadREMOVETHIS@yahoo.com (Brent P) said in > rec.autos.driving: [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > -- > I'm a wreckless driver and damn proud of it! Likely it's not so much actual loss of rubber from the tires )unless there is actual contact with the pavement), but the smooth surface on the tires from the treads filling with ice. Pretty much like Aunt Judy's "tars" sans sandpaper.
Scott en Aztlán - 19 Jan 2007 15:55 GMT "MLOM" <grvan@netzero.net> said in rec.autos.driving:
>> >> Ever see someone stuck in the snow? They will sit there and floor the >> >> pedal, even though the wheel is just spinning and burning off all [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] >the tires from the treads filling with ice. Pretty much like Aunt >Judy's "tars" sans sandpaper. Ever see a smoky burnout on dry pavement? The driver holds the front wheels still using the brakes; the car doesn't move, but the rear wheels overcome the friction of the brakes and the pavement and spin.
The same thing can happen on ice - all it takes is for the front wheels to be wedged into the snow enough to overcome the available traction on the rear wheel(s). The wheel spins, the rubber heats up from the friction (although there isn't much, mu is still > 0), and the rubber burns. Counterintuitive to anyone who has never lived in the snow belt, but absolutely true.
 Signature I'm a wreckless driver and damn proud of it!
necromancer - 20 Jan 2007 04:46 GMT Ladies and Gentlemen (and I use those words loosely), Scott en Aztlán said in rec.autos.driving:
> The wheel spins, the rubber heats up > from the friction (although there isn't much, mu is still > 0), and > the rubber burns. Counterintuitive to anyone who has never lived in > the snow belt, but absolutely true. Better be careful, Scott; using such complicated words in the presence of the likes of CT, Aunt Judy and other schiesskopfs can be have disasterous results. ;)
Brent P - 19 Jan 2007 06:07 GMT > tetraethylleadREMOVETHIS@yahoo.com (Brent P) said in > rec.autos.driving: [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > > You live in Chicago, and yet claim you've never seen what I described?
> OK, now I *know* you just like to argue for argument's sake. I am not arguing. I am saying rubber doesn't burn. I've spun the tires pretty good and never took any tread off of them in the snow.
Scott en Aztlán - 19 Jan 2007 15:56 GMT tetraethylleadREMOVETHIS@yahoo.com (Brent P) said in rec.autos.driving:
>> tetraethylleadREMOVETHIS@yahoo.com (Brent P) said in >> rec.autos.driving: [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > >I am not arguing. I am saying rubber doesn't burn. You're wrong.
 Signature I'm a wreckless driver and damn proud of it!
Brent P - 19 Jan 2007 17:17 GMT > tetraethylleadREMOVETHIS@yahoo.com (Brent P) said in > rec.autos.driving: [quoted text clipped - 15 lines] > > You're wrong. Then it's done with cars with more power than mine or by some really stupid people. I've spun my tires pretty damn good in snow and haven't burned any tread off.
And no, I haven't seen any smoking tires spinning in snow.
Scott en Aztlán - 20 Jan 2007 03:33 GMT tetraethylleadREMOVETHIS@yahoo.com (Brent P) said in rec.autos.driving:
>Then it's done with cars with more power than mine or by some really >stupid people. I've spun my tires pretty damn good in snow and haven't >burned any tread off. > >And no, I haven't seen any smoking tires spinning in snow. I did it with my 1973 Vega back in the early 80s when I was young, dumb, and inexperienced at driving. That's how I know so much about it. :)
 Signature I'm a wreckless driver and damn proud of it!
MLOM - 20 Jan 2007 03:39 GMT Scott en Aztl?n wrote:
> tetraethylleadREMOVETHIS@yahoo.com (Brent P) said in > rec.autos.driving: [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > dumb, and inexperienced at driving. That's how I know so much about > it. :) Beginner's luck?
Scott en Aztlán - 20 Jan 2007 04:22 GMT "MLOM" <grvan@netzero.net> said in rec.autos.driving:
>> >Then it's done with cars with more power than mine or by some really >> >stupid people. I've spun my tires pretty damn good in snow and haven't [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > >Beginner's luck? That and the time I floored it on a patch of road sand were the only times that POS Vega ever burned any rubber. It burned oil just fine, but rubber took some real doing. :)
 Signature I'm a wreckless driver and damn proud of it!
Brent P - 20 Jan 2007 05:32 GMT > tetraethylleadREMOVETHIS@yahoo.com (Brent P) said in > rec.autos.driving: [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > dumb, and inexperienced at driving. That's how I know so much about > it. :) You had a vega that lived that long? My parent's had a '74, by '82 it was shot and it was a ancient as vegas go. Sold it to guy who patched up all the rust and then sold it for profit.
Scott en Aztlán - 20 Jan 2007 16:41 GMT tetraethylleadREMOVETHIS@yahoo.com (Brent P) said in rec.autos.driving:
>>>And no, I haven't seen any smoking tires spinning in snow. >> [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > >You had a vega that lived that long? It was on its last legs at 77,000 miles. Several body panels were completely rusted through; the engine burned a quart of oil per tank of gas, and backfired loudly whenever I floored the accelerator pedal. But I'm proud to say I bought and paid for it myself. :) I drove it for a year, then sold it for the same $400 I had originally paid to buy it.
 Signature I'm a wreckless driver and damn proud of it!
Ed Pirrero - 19 Jan 2007 18:16 GMT > tetraethylleadREMOVETHIS@yahoo.com (Brent P) said in > rec.autos.driving: [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > > OK, now I *know* you just like to argue for argument's sake. What took you so long to figure it out?
Sheesh. You Californians are SLOW.
E.P. ;)
Arif Khokar - 18 Jan 2007 02:26 GMT > Ladies and Gentlemen (and I use those words loosely), bob zee said in > rec.autos.driving:
>> Step 1: Download Microsoft© Internet Explorer 6 >> Microsoft Internet Explorer 6 is free to download
> Funny, I was able to watch it with Firefox with no problem.... Yeah, supposedly I need Firefox 1.5 despite the fact that Seamonkey 1.1b runs off of a later version of the Mozilla source.
Scott en Aztlán - 18 Jan 2007 07:35 GMT Arif Khokar <akhokar1234@wvu.edu> said in rec.autos.driving:
>> Ladies and Gentlemen (and I use those words loosely), bob zee said in >> rec.autos.driving: [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] >Yeah, supposedly I need Firefox 1.5 despite the fact that Seamonkey 1.1b >runs off of a later version of the Mozilla source. So WTF are you waiting for? It's a free download, fer chrissakes!
P.S. Firefox 2.0 is out now. :)
 Signature I'm a wreckless driver and damn proud of it!
Arif Khokar - 18 Jan 2007 17:14 GMT > P.S. Firefox 2.0 is out now. :) I know, but it doesn't have a newsreader, unlike Seamonkey ;)
Scott en Aztlán - 18 Jan 2007 06:58 GMT necromancer <55_sux@worldofnecromancer_nospam_noway.org> said in rec.autos.driving:
>Ladies and Gentlemen (and I use those words loosely), bob zee said in >rec.autos.driving: [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > >Funny, I was able to watch it with Firefox with no problem.... Same here.
 Signature I'm a wreckless driver and damn proud of it!
Eeyore - 18 Jan 2007 07:09 GMT > necromancer <55_sux@worldofnecromancer_nospam_noway.org> said > >Ladies and Gentlemen (and I use those words loosely), bob zee said [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > > Same here. Opera wouldn't comply for me - I had to revert to IE for it.
Graham
Eeyore - 17 Jan 2007 20:54 GMT > > Another fine day on the ice with FUBAR vehicle operators. > > [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] > oh well > :~( Typical Microsoft.
Graham
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