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Car Forum / Driving, Maintenance, Tuning / Driving / November 2007

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New RLC timing scam... 3 second GREEN signals.

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Brent P - 15 Nov 2007 14:59 GMT
http://www.thenewspaper.com/news/20/2071.asp

<...>

"I can guarantee you it does not stay on green when you cross over
Timberland it does not stay on green more than three seconds," Shaw said.
"More than five seconds at the most. Maybe three cars get through then
all of a sudden you have to stop."

Although Texas Department of Transportation standards suggest the signal
should stay green for a minimum of eight to ten seconds, KTRE timed the
light at between three and five seconds of green. Shaw and others find
this to be an inadequate time to clear the intersection, and each time
someone fails to slam on the brakes in time, Lufkin will pocket $22.50,
the state of Texas takes $22.50 and German red light camera vendor
Traffipax earns $30. Officials say the timing results from programming
designed to optimize traffic flow during peak traffic periods.

<...>

Although San Diego officials at the time insisted that "high accident"
intersections were the priority, not one of the top accident
intersections received a camera. Instead, the primary criteria actually
used were: short yellow times ("amber phase less than 4 seconds") and
"high traffic volume." San Diego rejected placement of red light cameras
in at least twelve intersections specifically because the "timing of
lights clears out traffic." This factor may describe a shortened green
scenario.

<...>
gpsman - 15 Nov 2007 16:01 GMT
On Nov 15, 9:59 am, tetraethylleadREMOVET...@yahoo.com (Brent P)
wrote:
> http://www.thenewspaper.com/news/20/2071.asp
>
[quoted text clipped - 4 lines]
> "More than five seconds at the most. Maybe three cars get through then
> all of a sudden you have to stop."

"We (KTRE-TV) staked out the intersection of Chestnut and Timberland
and it seemed <> like 3 to 5 seconds."

Apparently few in TX own an actual time measurement device, or else
are ill equipped to use one.

Why am I not surprised a contemporary "journalist" intending to time a
light might report what "seemed" to be facts?

Goes to show what you get when you require a clean suit and pay
minimum wage, I guess.
-----

- gpsman
Larry Bud - 15 Nov 2007 20:44 GMT
> On Nov 15, 9:59 am, tetraethylleadREMOVET...@yahoo.com (Brent P)
> wrote:
[quoted text clipped - 10 lines]
> "We (KTRE-TV) staked out the intersection of Chestnut and Timberland
> and it seemed <> like 3 to 5 seconds."

f.cking dishonest of you to change the text of the story.  What part
of

"KTRE timed the light at between three and five seconds of green."

Do you not understand?  Do you want a definition of "timed"??
N8N - 15 Nov 2007 21:09 GMT
> > On Nov 15, 9:59 am, tetraethylleadREMOVET...@yahoo.com (Brent P)
> > wrote:
[quoted text clipped - 17 lines]
>
> Do you not understand?  Do you want a definition of "timed"??

Welcome to gpsman's world.  He finds it inconceivable that any
governmental agency would ever do anything to entrap motorists, while
those of us who live in the real world find it difficult to believe
that there's anyone left who *doesn't* question the government's
motives on just about everything.

nate
Scott in SoCal - 15 Nov 2007 22:31 GMT
>> On Nov 15, 9:59 am, tetraethylleadREMOVET...@yahoo.com (Brent P)
>> wrote:
[quoted text clipped - 17 lines]
>
>Do you not understand?  Do you want a definition of "timed"??

Clearly the signal is sensor-controlled, and thus the green time is
variable length (with a ridiculously short maximum on-time of 5
seconds).
Brent P - 15 Nov 2007 23:25 GMT
>>> On Nov 15, 9:59 am, tetraethylleadREMOVET...@yahoo.com (Brent P)
>>> wrote:
[quoted text clipped - 21 lines]
> variable length (with a ridiculously short maximum on-time of 5
> seconds).

Who wants to bet gpstroll is one of those people who doesn't pull on to
the clearly visible sensor loop and forces everyone behind him to wait
until another vehicle comes along from the oncoming side to trigger the
light? Bonus: directionally programmed light so they don't get a green at
all.
Murderous Speeding Drunken Distracted Driver (Hector Goldstein) - 16 Nov 2007 00:30 GMT
>> On Nov 15, 9:59 am, tetraethylleadREMOVET...@yahoo.com (Brent P)
>> wrote:
[quoted text clipped - 17 lines]
>
>Do you not understand?  Do you want a definition of "timed"??

Won't matter; he's demonstrated before he doesn't understand the
concept.

--

Great minds discuss ideas, average minds discuss events, small minds discuss people.
- Admiral Hyman Rickover, U.S. Navy
Scott in SoCal - 16 Nov 2007 04:34 GMT
On Thu, 15 Nov 2007 19:30:17 -0500, "Murderous Speeding Drunken
Distracted Driver (Hector Goldstein)"
<drunk_and_distracted@the_wheel.com> wrote:

>>> On Nov 15, 9:59 am, tetraethylleadREMOVET...@yahoo.com (Brent P)
>>> wrote:
[quoted text clipped - 20 lines]
>Won't matter; he's demonstrated before he doesn't understand the
>concept.

That time/chance confusion rearing its ugly head again?
gpsman - 16 Nov 2007 03:31 GMT
> > On Nov 15, 9:59 am, tetraethylleadREMOVET...@yahoo.com (Brent P)
> > wrote:
[quoted text clipped - 15 lines]
>
> "KTRE timed the light at between three and five seconds of green."

Uh, *I* didn't change it, I quoted the *original source* (KTRE-TV) and
failed to note it, but I must say I do find your critique of the
reporting of thenewspaper.com refreshingly accurate.
http://www.ktre.com/Global/story.asp?S=7356188&nav=menu118_3

gpsman apologizes for any confusion his error might have caused.
-----

- gpsman
Murderous Speeding Drunken Distracted Driver (Hector Goldstein) - 16 Nov 2007 03:41 GMT
>gpsman apologizes for any confusion his error might have caused.

That's the most accurate statement you've made in any of your posts
that I've read.

--

Great minds discuss ideas, average minds discuss events, small minds discuss people.
- Admiral Hyman Rickover, U.S. Navy
MLOM - 16 Nov 2007 04:31 GMT
On Nov 15, 9:41 pm, "Murderous Speeding Drunken Distracted Driver
(Hector Goldstein)" <drunk_and_distracted@the_wheel.com> wrote:
> >gpsman apologizes for any confusion his error might have caused.
>
[quoted text clipped - 5 lines]
> Great minds discuss ideas, average minds discuss events, small minds discuss people.
> - Admiral Hyman Rickover, U.S. Navy

Except for the word "might." ;)
Daniel W. Rouse Jr. - 16 Nov 2007 06:29 GMT
> http://www.thenewspaper.com/news/20/2071.asp
>
[quoted text clipped - 26 lines]
>
> <...>

San Diego has also been caught on more than one occasion with shorter than 3
second yellow lights in relatively high traffic areas, and has also very
publicly made it known that they changed the red light grace period before
the camera takes photos or video to just 0.1 seconds.

(News article citations will be provided upon request.)

So at least in the case of San Diego, it is my own opinion that the red
light cameras are very much about revenue collection. The easy solution to
defeat this, though it may irritate those drivers who are in a hurry and
like to follow the vehicle in front of them as closely as possible, is to
always at least begin coasting when approaching a stale green light
intersection, to prepare for a relatively rapid stop if the light suddenly
turns yellow.
 
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