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Car Forum / Driving, Maintenance, Tuning / Driving / March 2008Dallas: longer yellows, no RLC profit.
Dallas increased yellow light timing and now it's cameras are being pulled for lack of profit. The article is full of pro-RLC spin and saying yellows are for 'motorists to beat a red', but the message is clear... longer yellow = much less red light running = no camera profit. http://www.dallasnews.com/sharedcontent/dws/news/localnews/stories/DN-redlights_ 15met.ART.North.Edition1.468120d.html Dallas City Hall has idled more than one-fourth of the 62 cameras that monitor busy intersections because many of them are failing to generate enough red-light-running fines to justify their operational costs, according to city documents. <...> Dallas has lengthened yellow-light intervals on 12 of its 62 monitored traffic signals <...> -------------- The yellow lights were increased in time after dallas got caught profiting from short yellow signals: http://www.thenewspaper.com/news/20/2068.asp Note, the speed limit of 30mph, same as Chicago, and Chicago's yellows are even shorter than those in Dallas before they were made longer. > Dallas increased yellow light timing and now it's cameras are being > pulled for lack of profit. The article is full of pro-RLC spin and [quoted text clipped - 24 lines] > Note, the speed limit of 30mph, same as Chicago, and Chicago's yellows > are even shorter than those in Dallas before they were made longer. What's even more pathetic is the number of people in the Fark thread that still support these things. nate  Signaturereplace "roosters" with "cox" to reply. http://members.cox.net/njnagel > > Dallas increased yellow light timing and now it's cameras are being > > pulled for lack of profit. The article is full of pro-RLC spin and [quoted text clipped - 30 lines] > > nate spanked in fark, lick wounds in chi.general. return penis to stockroom please. SignatureThis signature can be appended to your outgoing mesages. Many people include in their signatures contact information, and perhaps a joke or quotation. >>>Dallas increased yellow light timing and now it's cameras are being >>>pulled for lack of profit. The article is full of pro-RLC spin and [quoted text clipped - 33 lines] > spanked in fark, lick wounds in chi.general. return penis to stockroom > please. WTF? Signaturereplace "roosters" with "cox" to reply. http://members.cox.net/njnagel > >>>Dallas increased yellow light timing and now it's cameras are being > >>>pulled for lack of profit. The article is full of pro-RLC spin and [quoted text clipped - 36 lines] > > WTF? nate, I really really enjoy alliteration in a person's name. what words and phrases were used as taunts and teases when you grew up? > Dallas increased yellow light timing and now it's cameras are being > pulled for lack of profit. The article is full of pro-RLC spin and [quoted text clipped - 25 lines] > Note, the speed limit of 30mph, same as Chicago, and Chicago's yellows > are even shorter than those in Dallas before they were made longer. certitude == danger: <http://freakonomics.blogs.nytimes.com/2008/03/14/taiwans-solution-to-tra ffic-jams/> they should be randomly short. besides, dallas is full of texicans. reminds me of a time i was at ohara airport, out a terminal one. Announcement comes on "Flight XYZ from DFW unloading at gate 12 with 650 passangers." That's an awful lot of passangers, so i went over to gate 12 to take a look. And out came all these little three foot tall people with giant cowboy hats. So i asked the gate attendant what was up and she 'splained that they were texicans with the sh.t squeezed out. takes less space. .max SignatureThis signature can be appended to your outgoing mesages. Many people include in their signatures contact information, and perhaps a joke or quotation. > Dallas increased yellow light timing and now it's cameras are being > pulled for lack of profit. The article is full of pro-RLC spin and [quoted text clipped - 26 lines] > Note, the speed limit of 30mph, same as Chicago, and Chicago's yellows > are even shorter than those in Dallas before they were made longer. I don't care if it is done for profit. Red light runners are criminals and i like to see them pay. Stop being a coddler. >>Dallas increased yellow light timing and now it's cameras are being >>pulled for lack of profit. The article is full of pro-RLC spin and [quoted text clipped - 29 lines] > I don't care if it is done for profit. Red light runners are criminals > and i like to see them pay. Stop being a coddler. Nobody's being a coddler, we just want the gov't to obey the laws. However, you're still a douche. nate Signaturereplace "roosters" with "cox" to reply. http://members.cox.net/njnagel > I don't care if it is done for profit. Red light runners are criminals > and i like to see them pay. Increased yellow timing makes LESS RED LIGHT RUNNERS. What part of that don't you understand? You, and everyone else, should be all for that. > > I don't care if it is done for profit. Red light runners are criminals > > and i like to see them pay. > > Increased yellow timing makes LESS RED LIGHT RUNNERS. What part of > that don't you understand? You, and everyone else, should be all for > that. nope - other way around > > > I don't care if it is done for profit. Red light runners are criminals > > > and i like to see them pay. [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > > nope - other way around Other way around of what? You're NOT for less red light runners? >Increased yellow timing makes LESS RED LIGHT RUNNERS. (Note: not advocating red light cameras.) However, while longer yellows can significantly reduce red light running and associated crashes, it is not cost-free, in that an earlier (longer) yellow will stop traffic sooner (at least for "conservative" drivers who will stop for a yellow if it is safe to stop, as opposed to drivers who will race the yellow), reducing green light time. This could lead to greater traffic congestion. Example: A Street and 1st Avenue cross. With "standard" yellow lights: 26 seconds: A Street green, 1st Avenue red 4 seconds: A Street yellow, 1st Avenue red 26 seconds: 1st Avenue green, A Street red 4 seconds: 1st Avenue yellow, A Street red repeat With longer yellow lights: 25 seconds: A Street green, 1st Avenue red 5 seconds: A Street yellow, 1st Avenue red 25 seconds: 1st Avenue green, A Street red 5 seconds: 1st Avenue yellow, A Street red repeat With the longer yellow lights, total green light time each minute is reduced from 52 seconds to 50 seconds, or 4%. Signature------------------------------------------------------------------------ Timothy J. Lee Unsolicited bulk or commercial email is not welcome. No warranty of any kind is provided with this message. >>Increased yellow timing makes LESS RED LIGHT RUNNERS. > [quoted text clipped - 25 lines] >With the longer yellow lights, total green light time each minute is >reduced from 52 seconds to 50 seconds, or 4%. It takes a lot longer working to pay an RLC ticket or deal with a collision. There is also no rule that the green signal need be reduced in time for a longer yellow. The entire cycle time red-green-yellow can be increased instead. On Mar 17, 6:59 pm, tetraethylleadREMOVET...@yahoo.com (Brent P) wrote: > In article <47df045c$0$36367$742ec...@news.sonic.net>, Timothy J. Lee wrote: > >In article <3fb9b84f-f8da-469b-bd0c-8dac844aa...@x41g2000hsb.googlegroups.com>, [quoted text clipped - 36 lines] > > - Show quoted text - A lot of the pro-RLC wizards would probably come back with something like "just be glad you have a yellow light...we can remove it altogether." > On Mar 17, 6:59 pm, tetraethylleadREMOVET...@yahoo.com (Brent P) > wrote: [quoted text clipped - 48 lines] > like "just be glad you have a yellow light...we can remove it > altogether." well,we can 'remove' the RLCs,too. B-) Got a scoped rifle? SignatureJim Yanik jyanik at kua.net >>Increased yellow timing makes LESS RED LIGHT RUNNERS. > [quoted text clipped - 25 lines] > With the longer yellow lights, total green light time each minute is > reduced from 52 seconds to 50 seconds, or 4%. But if the 4 second yellow causes a "dilemma zone" the increase in safety is well worth the slight decrease in throughput. I don't think anyone is arguing for unreasonably long yellow intervals, simply reasonable and consistent ones. nate Signaturereplace "roosters" with "cox" to reply. http://members.cox.net/njnagel >But if the 4 second yellow causes a "dilemma zone" the increase in >safety is well worth the slight decrease in throughput. Certainly. However, it should be remembered that longer yellows are not cost-free, as seems to be commonly assumed. And, at the very limit of traffic capacity, the extra few percent may be significant. (Note: not advocating red light cameras.) Also, the "dilemma zone" may or may not exist for a fixed length yellow, depending on the approaching driver and vehicle. A driver with slow reaction time driving a vehicle with long braking distances may have a "dilemma zone" that does not exist for other drivers. Unfortunately, this seems to be another way inattentive drivers (who have a slow reaction time) indirectly create additional traffic congestion, by requiring traffic engineers to set longer yellow lights for intersection safety. Signature------------------------------------------------------------------------ Timothy J. Lee Unsolicited bulk or commercial email is not welcome. No warranty of any kind is provided with this message. >>But if the 4 second yellow causes a "dilemma zone" the increase in >>safety is well worth the slight decrease in throughput. [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] >limit of traffic capacity, the extra few percent may be significant. >(Note: not advocating red light cameras.) Trivial compared to what is lost to slotherators and then it's only if the green is shortened. It does not have to be. >Also, the "dilemma zone" may or may not exist for a fixed length >yellow, depending on the approaching driver and vehicle. A driver [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] >congestion, by requiring traffic engineers to set longer yellow >lights for intersection safety. With good brakes and reactions the dilemma zone doesn't really change because of the driver behind you. Even though I've modified the brakes on my car for better performance, the SUV driver behind me hasn't. >Trivial compared to what is lost to slotherators and then it's only if >the green is shortened. It does not have to be. If the green light is not shortened, the entire cycle (including the red light, since a lengthened green means lengthened red for the conflicting directions) must be lengthened. However, longer red lights are likely to be more annoying to drivers who get caught by them, which may increase the incentive to race the yellow. Signature------------------------------------------------------------------------ Timothy J. Lee Unsolicited bulk or commercial email is not welcome. No warranty of any kind is provided with this message. >>Trivial compared to what is lost to slotherators and then it's only if >>the green is shortened. It does not have to be. [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] >are likely to be more annoying to drivers who get caught by them, which >may increase the incentive to race the yellow. since all instances of longer yellows I see have never mentioned a reduction in green I would wager your speculation is already disproven. >With good brakes and reactions the dilemma zone doesn't really change >because of the driver behind you. Even though I've modified the brakes >on my car for better performance, the SUV driver behind me hasn't. That actually is a case where the mere presence of inattentive drivers in poor braking vehicles means that a yellow light has to be lengthened for safety (causing added traffic congestion), even though you may be an alert driver in a good braking vehicle. Signature------------------------------------------------------------------------ Timothy J. Lee Unsolicited bulk or commercial email is not welcome. No warranty of any kind is provided with this message. >>With good brakes and reactions the dilemma zone doesn't really change >>because of the driver behind you. Even though I've modified the brakes [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] >for safety (causing added traffic congestion), even though you may be >an alert driver in a good braking vehicle. The yellow should not be so short that I, in a good braking vehicle, need do a full decel stop. >> In article >> <3fb9b84f-f8da-469b-bd0c-8dac844aa3bc@x41g2000hsb.googlegroups.com>, [quoted text clipped - 36 lines] > > nate the 3 sec and 2 sec yellows are the ones that worry me,especially when there's a RLC installed nearby. Orlando is going ahead with their RLC program,but only issuing "code violation" tickets,not a real traffic ticket,just a $62 fine. I expect to see lights with shortened yellow times where the RLCs are. SignatureJim Yanik jyanik at kua.net SFB spewed: >I don't care if it is done for profit. Red light runners are criminals >and i like to see them pay. Stop being a coddler. Read the article, you moron. Setting the yellow lights properly eliminated red light running, you stupid f.cking moron. That's why the cameras were losing money. For someone who is so, "safety conscious," you seem to really want to see people get killed. Why don't you do the world a favor and drive your beater straight into the sun, you degenerate piece of sh.t. "My tars have been bald for two years. Every month i glue some sandpaper to them and everythings cool." --Laura Buch murdered her boyfriend / laura bush - VEHICULAR HOMICIDE / Speeders & Drunk Drivers Are MURDERERS 10/25/05 Message ID: s2ttl1tgnpq5pr6p48lr111p3lnvr4blch@4ax.com http://tinyurl.com/7p7xq > SFB spewed: > [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > eliminated red light running, you stupid f.cking moron. That's why the > cameras were losing money. and having the proper light timing doesn't cost the city anything. SignatureJim Yanik jyanik at kua.net >Note, the speed limit of 30mph, same as Chicago, and Chicago's yellows >are even shorter than those in Dallas before they were made longer. LOL!! Rappe should be chiming into the discussion any minute now... :) Signature"Dave's not here, man!" - Tommy Chong |
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