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Car Forum / Driving, Maintenance, Tuning / Driving / April 2008

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Traffic Control for Political Reasons

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Scott in SoCal - 28 Mar 2008 16:07 GMT
Here we have an example of a traffic control device being considered
not because an engineering study warranted such a device, but because
a student was hit by a car nearby and the emotional knee-jerk reaction
among the parents was to push for a traffic light.

Something very similar happened at my high school: a student was
killed while crossing the busy street in front of the high school.
This student was NOT in a crosswalk - he crossed illegally in the
middle of the block. The knee-jerk reaction was to lower the speed
limit in front of the school from 30 MPH to 15 MPH. That speed zone
still exists, even though it's been over 20 years since the boy died.

You can bet your britches that this block-long stretch of underposted
speed limit is heavily patrolled by the local police department.

http://www.azstarnet.com/metro/231346

Traffic control device reconsidered
> Student's injury near marana high prompts study of intersection <
By Brian J. Pedersen

Marana officials are reconsidering installing a stoplight at an
intersection next to Marana High School where an 18-year-old student
was critically injured March 15.

A traffic engineering study conducted by the town in November
determined the intersection of West Emigh and North Sandario roads did
not warrant any sort of traffic-control devices, Marana traffic
engineering division manager Fernando Prol said.

Marana senior Cecelia Van Dyke remained in critical condition earlier
this week at University Medical Center, where she's been since being
flown there after her vehicle collided with a garbage truck after she
turned north onto Sandario shortly after school let out.

As a result of the crash, Prol said, the town is taking another look
at what can be done at the intersection, which lies about a
quarter-mile east of the high school, 12000 W. Emigh Road.
Signature

"Dave's not here, man!"
 - Tommy Chong

Speeders & Drunk Drivers are MURDERERS - 28 Mar 2008 17:44 GMT
> Here we have an example of a traffic control device being considered
> not because an engineering study warranted such a device, but because
[quoted text clipped - 7 lines]
> limit in front of the school from 30 MPH to 15 MPH. That speed zone
> still exists, even though it's been over 20 years since the boy died.

15 mph in a school zone should be the law. Only you kid-killing speed-
loons say otherwise.
necromancer - 29 Mar 2008 00:08 GMT
SFB left this steamer in rec.autos.driving:

>15 mph in a school zone should be the law. Only you kid-killing speed-
>loons say otherwise.

Sounds good to me. Next time you are busted, will it be for 41 in a 15
instead of 41 in a 25. That's 26 over the limit. I demand your
immediate execution.

--

Speeders & Drunk Drivers Are MURDERERS (a.k.a. SFB) admits to being
a deadly speeder, psychopath and criminal coddler:

">  Have you ever driven a car faster than the legal speed limit?

Yes, but never deliberately.  In fact i got a speeding ticket about 5
years ago for doing 41 in a 25.  I just about kicked the cops teeth in
cause i was sure he was lying.  No way the SL on this wide open
stretch could be 25, i thought."

Pride of America (c.k.a. Laura Bush murdered her boyfriend/
laura bush - VEHICULAR HOMICIDE/Speeders And Drunk Drivers
Are Murderers (SADDAM)), 10/3/2002
Message-ID: <3c1753f7.0210030916.7b6f5dff@posting.google.com>
http://tinyurl.com/5u4wg

Proof that POA is LBMHB/lbVH/SADDAM:
See the following: http://tinyurl.com/ahphj
gpsman - 28 Mar 2008 19:15 GMT
> Here we have an example of a traffic control device being considered
> not because an engineering study warranted such a device, but because
> a student was hit by a car nearby and the emotional knee-jerk reaction
> among the parents was to push for a traffic light.

Heh, read much?  There's no mention of consideration of a "traffic
light".

> Something very similar happened at my high school: a student was
> killed while crossing the busy street in front of the high school.
> This student was NOT in a crosswalk - he crossed illegally in the
> middle of the block. The knee-jerk reaction was to lower the speed
> limit in front of the school from 30 MPH to 15 MPH. That speed zone
> still exists, even though it's been over 20 years since the boy died.

You seem to imply there have been no subsequent pedestrian/vehicle
incidents, but lowering the SL in front of the school was both
unreasonable and ineffective.

> You can bet your britches that this block-long stretch of underposted
> speed limit is heavily patrolled by the local police department.

O M G!  A whole f.cking block?!

The nerve of those sons of bitches to add 11 seconds to a trip in an
effort to lessen the chances that dumbasses like yourself will kill a
kid if they hit one.

There's just *never* a good reason to lift off the throttle, is there?
-----

- gpsman
spamTHISbrp@yahoo.com - 28 Mar 2008 19:24 GMT
> Here we have an example of a traffic control device being considered
> not because an engineering study warranted such a device, but because
[quoted text clipped - 37 lines]
> "Dave's not here, man!"
>   - Tommy Chong

Maybe it is indeed a bad spot that needs a light, and they just got it
wrong the 1st time, or didn't examine the conditions during a busy
period?

Dave
Scott in SoCal - 28 Mar 2008 22:29 GMT
>> A traffic engineering study conducted by the town in November
>> determined the intersection of West Emigh and North Sandario roads did
[quoted text clipped - 4 lines]
>wrong the 1st time, or didn't examine the conditions during a busy
>period?

Aren't all of those things supposed to be covered by a proper
engineering study?
Signature

"Dave's not here, man!"
 - Tommy Chong

gpsman - 28 Mar 2008 23:07 GMT
> >> A traffic engineering study conducted by the town in November
> >> determined the intersection of West Emigh and North Sandario roads did
[quoted text clipped - 7 lines]
> Aren't all of those things supposed to be covered by a proper
> engineering study?

I don't think the study could have factored that it was itself in
error.

It seems funny to me how all the supposed "engineers" here never
consider that an engineer might make a mistake, and that they
themselves never do, even though it's obvious they can't read real
good.
-----

- gpsman
Paul Hovnanian P.E. - 31 Mar 2008 04:29 GMT
> Here we have an example of a traffic control device being considered
> not because an engineering study warranted such a device, but because
[quoted text clipped - 7 lines]
> limit in front of the school from 30 MPH to 15 MPH. That speed zone
> still exists, even though it's been over 20 years since the boy died.

Where I live, a 20 MPH limit in a school zone is par for the course. If
an intersection crosswalk isn't convenient, the traffic engineers will
often put in middle of the block crosswalks. If pedestrian right of way
isn't respected, they'll put in a light as well.

Face it, kids just don't have very good judgment, either driving or
walking. By the time they're in high school, one would hope it would be
better, but that's not the case.

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Paul Hovnanian     mailto:Paul@Hovnanian.com
------------------------------------------------------------------
Q:  Why do mountain climbers rope themselves together?
A:  To prevent the sensible ones from going home.

Matthew T. Russotto - 02 Apr 2008 02:30 GMT
>Where I live, a 20 MPH limit in a school zone is par for the course. If
>an intersection crosswalk isn't convenient, the traffic engineers will
[quoted text clipped - 4 lines]
>walking. By the time they're in high school, one would hope it would be
>better, but that's not the case.

Then perhaps by then it is time to stop (with apologies to
Aunty Diarrhea) coddling them.
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 There's no such thing as a free lunch, but certain accounting practices can
 result in a fully-depreciated one.

Scott in SoCal - 02 Apr 2008 03:17 GMT
>>Where I live, a 20 MPH limit in a school zone is par for the course. If
>>an intersection crosswalk isn't convenient, the traffic engineers will
[quoted text clipped - 7 lines]
>Then perhaps by then it is time to stop (with apologies to
>Aunty Diarrhea) coddling them.

I agree - the sooner we weed them out of the gene pool, the better.
Signature

"Dave's not here, man!"
 - Tommy Chong

Paul Hovnanian P.E. - 03 Apr 2008 03:06 GMT
Now, if you want to see some traffic/crosswalk signals that are really
buggered up, come to Redmond, Washington.

The intersections along 156th Ave through the Microsoft campus area are
completely ot of sync. And it appears that they are so intentionally, as
a kind of traffic calming. The east-west signals come on regardless of
the presence of pedestrians or cross traffic (despite fancy sensor
systems). They come on too frequently, but for short durations.

This makes for a rather amusing (if you have a morbid sense of humor)
scene. Picture employees who have spent their lives in front of computer
screens, living off of cold pizza and Jolt cola, trying to waddle across
the street before the cross traffic gets the green light.

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Paul Hovnanian     mailto:Paul@Hovnanian.com
------------------------------------------------------------------
Due to recent budget cuts, the light at the end of the tunnel has
temporarily been turned off.

Scott in SoCal - 03 Apr 2008 13:25 GMT
>Now, if you want to see some traffic/crosswalk signals that are really
>buggered up, come to Redmond, Washington.
[quoted text clipped - 9 lines]
>screens, living off of cold pizza and Jolt cola, trying to waddle across
>the street before the cross traffic gets the green light.

I can easily picture Bill Gates trying to calculate the optimal speed
at which to drive in order to make it all the way through the gauntlet
without stopping. :)
Signature

"Dave's not here, man!"
 - Tommy Chong

 
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