Not exactly sure of the answer that you want, but I think the day is
coming (if we like it or not) where the percentage of corn and soybean
products being added to our fuel is increasing. About 25 miles to the
north of me the largest biodiesel plant in the U.S. is under
construction and is due for completion in '07 or '08. So I guess after
that, the area will have a larger percentage of biodiesel fuel use.
As for if you are trying to start a pro or con argument on ethanol or
biodiesel use, sorry, I'm not going to bite.

I don't know if you travel, bur if you go to Brasil, ethanol is for
sale at every gas station (as "Alcool"). About a quarter of cars I
would say run on the stuff. They make it from sugar cane
The engine is specially modified. No-one likes it but it's sold at a
lower price than petrol (gas). You have to decoke the engine quite
regularly and there's much less power.  I think the compression ratio
has to be considerably reduced.
In Bolivia now, they sell compressed methane (at about 10 bars) at some
gas stations in the cities.  Now that sounds a dangerous business!
Here in the UK you can buy "Autogas" at some gas stations  (liquified
petroleum gas/propane). Engines run very sweet on this and easier
starting. The engine has to be modified but there's no power loss
USA lags  behind the rest of the world  again.

        Perhaps none use only ethanol at this time. but they
may use the stalks, shucks, or other by products to supply
heat to the stills.

        But there is a better way, any waste heat at about 100C
can be used for the heat for the still, and many Trillions of
BTU of waste heat has just been wasted when it could have
been use to run a still, or to distill bad water or salt water
for drinking water, see the date on;

http://stinet.dtic.mil/oai/oai?&verb=getRecord&metadataPrefix=html&identifier=AD
0406634

        I have proposed that power plant waste heat be used,
but hopefully has already considered it and is using it.

Joe Fischer

Mad Scientist Jr <usenet_daughter@yahoo.com> wrote in article
<1157733848.658173.103060@m79g2000cwm.googlegroups.com>...

I think the question should be about ethanol producers who use *ETHICS* to
*market* their product......

.....discussing the *real* costs of ethanol production, and including them
in the cost of ethanol......

.....discussing the Federal subsidies, and including them in the
expenditures to produce ethanol.......

etc.

None of them.  Its inefficient.
They don't use gasline either.
They use diesel and biodiesel.
Slow turning engines with a lot of torque.
More btu/lb in diesel.

If you took the time to have a nice caipirinha out on Copacabana beach,
and to enjoy the tanginhas, you would wonder why anyone would want to
use alcohol for fuel, and why they would worry so much about what they
were going to 'drive'.

You would understand why God did not put brains in the little head.

I cant imagine that any ethanol producer doesnt use exclusivly ethanol
in any and all trucks etc. they own. The choice would be convert the
engine or pay for diesel at retail so that you sell the ethanol at
wholesale. That might not apply to semi-trucks etc given the cost of
converting a engine that size, I dont know.

The problem is that the industry is not intergrated at all and so the
producer buys grain without any relationship to the farmer etc. It
might be interesting to arrange a barter of X gallons of ethanol in
exchange for X bushel of corn rather than have 6 people take a cut
prior to the ethanol plant.

Actually what got me started in chemistry and ethanol was a local farm
in my home town that built a distillery just large enough to supply his
tractors and trucks.  I was close friends with his nephew and so did a
interview with him about the process when I was in high school.

The problem was that it was a family farm owned by his father (the
nephew's grandfather) and when a offer of $100K (this was the 80's)
came in for the farm, the grandfather sold it out from under his son.
The system was dismantled soon after that point.

Ghostwriter