Hello all,
I have a 1968 mustang with a 302. Most of the time, especially when
the engine is cold, it starts just fine. Sometimes, more often when
the engine is hot than cold, I have to crank the engine for nearly ten
or fifteen seconds before it starts, and then it catches, runs a
little rough for a bit, then funs fine. Once or twice, it has not
started at all after fifteen seconds of cranking. I really hesitate to
even crank it for more than ten seconds, because I don't want to
overheat the starter. The gas cap does not have a seal on it, which is
why I doubt that it is vapor-lock related. The fuel line leading to
the carb has a clear fuel filter, and it is always full or nearly
full. The carb has float bowl gas windows, and they never drain. I was
at one point having trouble with the accelerator jets draining into
the manifold, but i corrected this problem by adjusting the
accelerator arm. For reference, The carb is a Demon 625 cfm road demon
jr. I have an electronic ignition module in the distributor made by
crane cams called the XR-I. My normal starting procedure consists of
pumping the throttle twice and turning the key- that usually works
fine, except for the incidents described above.
Thanks for the help and input!
PS- anyone know any tips for finding vacuum leaks- I'm a bit scared to
use the propane method. Maybe I'm a wuss :-D
Don Stauffer in Minnesota - 25 Mar 2007 16:28 GMT
> Hello all,
>
[quoted text clipped - 21 lines]
> PS- anyone know any tips for finding vacuum leaks- I'm a bit scared to
> use the propane method. Maybe I'm a wuss :-D
If the filter shows gas, then I agree that vapor lock is unlikely to
be the problem. BTW, whether tank is vented or not is not an issue
with vapor lock with mechanical fuel pump. It is just that a fuel
pump cannot pump vapor, only liquid.
Now, what may well be the problem is something else that is richening
the mixture. I don't know for sure what kind of a float that Mustang
carb has, but a leaky or fuel soaked float can cause rich mixture and
starting problems. Leaky needle valve in float chamber can also do
this. I'd get carb rebuilt.
BTW, there are other ways to find vacuum leak. Ear, water, oil, etc.
Don Stauffer in Minnesota - 25 Mar 2007 16:28 GMT
> Hello all,
>
[quoted text clipped - 21 lines]
> PS- anyone know any tips for finding vacuum leaks- I'm a bit scared to
> use the propane method. Maybe I'm a wuss :-D
Kevin Bottorff - 25 Mar 2007 23:57 GMT
> Hello all,
>
[quoted text clipped - 21 lines]
> PS- anyone know any tips for finding vacuum leaks- I'm a bit scared to
> use the propane method. Maybe I'm a wuss :-D
sounds to me like your describing a flooded condition, now you just have
to narrow down why. KB If the car is warm the 2 pumps will deff.
flood it.

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lugnut - 26 Mar 2007 13:15 GMT
>Hello all,
>
[quoted text clipped - 21 lines]
>PS- anyone know any tips for finding vacuum leaks- I'm a bit scared to
>use the propane method. Maybe I'm a wuss :-D
One thing I notice is that the glass fuel levels are always
full. IIRC, the Demon is basically a Holley. If this is
true, the correct fuel level is at the bottom of the hole in
which case you should not see fuel. If you see the fuel,
the float is probably too high causing flooding and you need
that 15 second crank to clear a flooded condition. IIWY, I
would try lowering the float level. Make sure the fuel
pressure is correct. It is possible that the float needle
is leaking a bit allowing the fuel level to rise after
shutdown. You need to make sure the fuel level is correct
both running and stopped. If the fuel level rises after
shutdown and/or the fuel pressure drops, your float valve
and/or pump check valve is leaking resulting in a high fuel
level/flooded condition. If you do not already have the
Holley tuning and service manual, it is well worth the cost.
Lugnut
Steve - 27 Mar 2007 16:38 GMT
My normal starting procedure consists of
> pumping the throttle twice and turning the key- that usually works
> fine, except for the incidents described above.
Do you do that when its hot? If so, DON'T. Try cranking it without
pumping the throttle, or by holding the throttle 1/2 open while cranking
until the engine catches.
Modern fuels, especially "winter blend" fuels, have a very high vapor
pressure and are more prone to a) vapor locking and b) "boiling" out of
the carb when the engine is shut down hot, and then pooling in the
intake as it cools. I suspect that the problem is the latter in this
case, and that by pumping the pedal twice with the engine hot you're
adding more raw fuel to that already pooled in the intake and creating a
flooded condition.
But also be aware that a weak ignition component will also show up under
heat-soak conditions, so it may be that you're getting a weak spark or
NO spark when trying to start the hot engine.
bobar3425 - 28 Mar 2007 04:54 GMT
Hey thanks for the responses everyone!
I will adjust the float levels and check the ignition system!
Thanks again!