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Car Forum / Driving, Maintenance, Tuning / Maintenance and Repair / March 2007Independence from foreign oil
On CSPAN the other day, in a senate hearing, one of the senators made the point that IF Americans drove cars that averaged fuel mileage comparable with the European cars (average~ 44 miles per gallon), that we would not have to import a drop of foreign oil. If true, that would be a real salute to countries like Iran, Syria, Iraq, and others. <HLS@nospam.nix> wrote in news:l1jOh.3413$u03.2709 @newssvr21.news.prodigy.net: > On CSPAN the other day, in a senate hearing, one of the senators made the > point that IF Americans [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > If true, that would be a real salute to countries like Iran, Syria, Iraq, > and others. Except that it has been copiously and abundantly documented that increased fuel efficiency results in more miles driven, effectively cancelling out any reductions in fuel usage due to increased vehicle gas mileage. Remember: senators are stupid. That's why they're senators, and not actual productive members of society.  SignatureTegger > <HLS@nospam.nix> wrote in news:l1jOh.3413$u03.2709 > @newssvr21.news.prodigy.net: [quoted text clipped - 14 lines] > Remember: senators are stupid. That's why they're senators, and not actual > productive members of society. Worse than stupid...self serving, dishonest, unconscionable. Gore suggested a one dollar tax per gallon of gasoline (not Imperial gallon). He suspects that this would help control the consumption, allow enough taxes to avoid payroll deductions, and go a ways toward national health care. The only problem is that if the Democrats (or Republicans) get this tax through, they will just piss it away on "entitlements" or something else, and still raise taxes. Hang the bastards > Gore suggested a one dollar tax per gallon of gasoline (not Imperial > gallon). He suspects that this > would help control the consumption, allow enough taxes to avoid payroll > deductions, and go a ways > toward national health care. Except that any tax collected on GASOLINE should NOT be going to healthcare, etc. It should go to road maintenance and cleaning up the environment. If you want better health care, push up INCOME tax. Better schools? Push up PROPERTY tax. If people know how much they were paying for the services they're getting, there would be a LOT less folks whining about their taxes. > If you want better health care, push up INCOME tax. Better schools? Push up > PROPERTY tax. More money paid != better > If people know how much they were paying for the services they're getting, > there would be a LOT less folks whining about their taxes. Actually there would be a lot MORE whining about the taxes if they knew how much was being pissed away. >> Gore suggested a one dollar tax per gallon of gasoline (not Imperial >> gallon). He suspects that this [quoted text clipped - 11 lines] > If people know how much they were paying for the services they're > getting, there would be a LOT less folks whining about their taxes. All tax dollars go into a general pool. Is is erroneous to think of taxes as actually being earmarked and used for specific things. Politicians and bureaucrats perpetuate the myth because it's useful for making tax hikes palatable to the public. SignatureTegger > All tax dollars go into a general pool. Is is erroneous to think of taxes > as actually being earmarked and used for specific things. > > Politicians and bureaucrats perpetuate the myth because it's useful for > making tax hikes palatable to the public. Myths like the social security 'trust' fund... More euphemistic wording to cloak the fact that there never has been a trust fund. That money goes into the general budget and is pissed away (or maybe "porked" away is a better description) Politicians are well known for porking the electorate. I'd like to see the documentation. > <HLS@nospam.nix> wrote in news:l1jOh.3413$u03.2709 > @newssvr21.news.prodigy.net: [quoted text clipped - 17 lines] > -- > Tegger > I'd like to see the documentation. He was a senator...They shy from documentation;>) > Except that it has been copiously and abundantly documented that increased > fuel efficiency results in more miles driven, effectively cancelling out > any reductions in fuel usage due to increased vehicle gas mileage. > > -- > Tegger That surprises me. I had heard that gasoline demand was basically inflexible and that price didn't matter. If price doesn't matter, then why would folks drive more miles with a more effficient car. Can you reference some of those studies that showed demand WAS flexible/ > > Except that it has been copiously and abundantly documented that increased > > fuel efficiency results in more miles driven, effectively cancelling out [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > why would folks drive more miles with a more effficient car. Can you > reference some of those studies that showed demand WAS flexible/ I am not sure what the studies show. As I lived in Northern Europe of a long long time, I can tell you that I was careful with gasoline use, but went where I had to go. We had a good public transportation system of trains and buses, and they were cheaper than using a car for many things. AND, if you were going out partying, you darn sure didnt want to be responsible for a car with the intolerance of drinking and driving. We paid about $8 per US gallon. > That surprises me. I had heard that gasoline demand was basically > inflexible and that price didn't matter. I'm thoroughly convinced that the minimum usage is inflexible, but I'd have to see convincing arguments before I believed maximum usage was inflexible. SignaturePork: It's the other white flag! -- James Lileks > On CSPAN the other day, in a senate hearing, one of the senators made the > point that IF Americans drove cars that averaged fuel mileage comparable > with the European cars (average~ 44 miles per gallon), that we would not > have to import a drop of foreign oil. Are they insane? I *NEED* a double-cab, extended box, camperized, 454cu/in, duallie-wheeled 4x4 to drive the 2 blocks to the grocery store to get some milk!!!!! > Are they insane? I *NEED* a double-cab, extended box, camperized, 454cu/in, > duallie-wheeled 4x4 to drive the 2 blocks to the grocery store to get some milk!!!!! Insane? Arguably...But probably harmless, as they can't agree on anything and nothing will happen anyway > > On CSPAN the other day, in a senate hearing, one of the senators made the > > point that IF Americans drove cars that averaged fuel mileage comparable [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > Are they insane? I *NEED* a double-cab, extended box, camperized, 454cu/in, > duallie-wheeled 4x4 to drive the 2 blocks to the grocery store to get some milk!!!!! Indeed I do. Since I need such a vehicle for other purposes, getting a second high mileage but otherwise nearly useless vehicle for those 6 mile round trip grocery runs makes no sense whatsoever. It would save on the order of 1/4 gal of gas per trip, perhaps 15 gal per year at an increased vehicle cost (vehicle+tax+insurance+maintenance) of thousands of dollars per year. Pete C.
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