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Car Forum / Driving, Maintenance, Tuning / Maintenance and Repair / July 20071989 Mazda 626, unable to remove rear drums
(This is a continuation of an earlier post. The repair manual (Haynes) and on-line at Autozone says "On 323, 626 and MX-6, remove the backing plate plug to increase the shoe clearance. If this does not make it easy to remove the drum, loosen the parking brake lever adjustment nut or the operating stop lever at the backing plate." I sure can't find any backing plate plug...) Took the rear wheels off and spent two hours looking for the release to get the drums off. No Go. I don't know if someone replaced the original backing plates, but there is no hole. The parking brake release is on the outside on this model, and I actuated the release AND loosened the parking brake with the adjuster at the handle... STILL can't get the damn drums off!!! Any more suggestions? On Jul 9, 11:31 am, Hachiroku <Tru...@AE86.gts> wrote: > (This is a continuation of an earlier post. The repair manual (Haynes) and > on-line at Autozone says "On 323, 626 and MX-6, remove the backing plate [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] > > STILL can't get the damn drums off!!! Any more suggestions? You may have implicitly stated whether they are frozen to the hubs or the shoes are holding them on, but I didn't catch it. If the drums are frozen to the hubs, there may be two 8mm X 1.25 threaded holes in the drum designed for inserting common metric screws and slowly tightening them. I can visualize your super skinny Mazda drum but it has been too long to remember if they come with jack screw holes. If so, start by spraying down the hubs with penetrant, then insert screws and slowly tighten them alternately, following each pair of "tightens" with a mild hammer blow straight into the face of the drum to shock the rust bond. As long as the drums can spin, the shoes arent holding them up. If the shoes are the problem, then it sounds like you are doing everything you can. All you can do short of break the holddowns and springs is to back off the shoes in any manner possible. Toyota MDT in MO > On Jul 9, 11:31 am, Hachiroku <Tru...@AE86.gts> wrote: >> (This is a continuation of an earlier post. The repair manual (Haynes) [quoted text clipped - 32 lines] > > Toyota MDT in MO Hey, Comboverfish! I---I've tried everything...:( The only adjustment I can get to is the E-Brake, either through the console or at the linkage on the drum. There is a 'stop' that can be released, and then the connector for the E-Brake can be pushed in closer to the drum, supposedly to free up the brake a little. There is no adjusment I can see, and the spring holders, etc do not poke through the plates like on a Toyota. I can freely spin the drum, no problem, and 6 clicks on the E-Brake locks 'em. And jack holes were the second thing I looked for! They do not seem to be binding on the shoes. Perhaps it is just that they *are* stuck to the hub. I've been afraid to "Armstrong" them because I have this particularly nsaty habit of breaking something irreplaceable (or, replaceable at much more than what it would have cost to just have Meineke do the job! ;) Like the time I saved $250 doing the brakes on my '85 Celica, and then wound up needing an $800 knee operation! On Jul 9, 2:45 pm, Hachiroku <Tru...@AE86.gts> wrote: > > On Jul 9, 11:31 am, Hachiroku <Tru...@AE86.gts> wrote: > >> (This is a continuation of an earlier post. The repair manual (Haynes) [quoted text clipped - 32 lines] > > > Toyota MDT in MO > I---I've tried everything...:( The only adjustment I can get to is the > E-Brake, either through the console or at the linkage on the drum. There > is a 'stop' that can be released, and then the connector for the E-Brake > can be pushed in closer to the drum, supposedly to free up the brake a > little. I wouldn't worry about the shoe adjustment just yet. > There is no adjusment I can see, and the spring holders, etc do not poke > through the plates like on a Toyota. You are probably right on the money about no "reasonable" or "easy" adjustment being available. > I can freely spin the drum, no problem, and 6 clicks on the E-Brake locks > 'em. Sounds like you are in luck, then. > And jack holes were the second thing I looked for! > [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > (or, replaceable at much more than what it would have cost to just have > Meineke do the job! ;) I'm getting to the good part. I think I led you astray on the last post. Someone recently posted an Alldata blowup illustration. I checked it against our Alldata and my Mitchell. Both show a semi-mysterious "locknut" that holds the drum to the spindle. I could have sworn that these are knockoff drums, but according to these illustrations, the drum and hub are an assembly. All of the pics I've searched show a drum without studs, so I don't know what to think now. The real point here is -- see if there is a dust cap or whatever covering up a spindle nut. Directions show to unstake and remove the spindle nut. I can't tell if there is a sealed bearing (Toyota style) or a set of tapered bearings (older domestic style) in the drum, but it shouldn't matter for the sake of removing it. Just take the nut off and slide the drum/hub assembly off and Bob's your uncle. Let me know if this helps, Toyota MDT in MO BTW, noone, and I mean NOONE, replaces backing plates. Not for any good reason, anyway... P.P.S. sorry again about the wild goose chase. My memory sucks down to a virtually perfect vacuum. > Just take the nut off and > slide the drum/hub assembly off and Bob's your uncle. Ralph, Richard, George and Ray are my uncles. Bob couldn't make it... http://www.autozone.com/az/cds/en_us/0900823d/80/17/e3/75/0900823d8017e375/repai rInfoPages.htm http://www.autozone.com/az/cds/en_us/0900823d/80/17/e3/75/0900823d8017e375/repai rInfoPages.htm On Jul 9, 7:31 pm, Hachiroku <Tru...@AE86.gts> wrote: > > Just take the nut off and > > slide the drum/hub assembly off and Bob's your uncle. [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > > http://www.autozone.com/az/cds/en_us/0900823d/80/17/e3/75/0900823d801... OK, I'll bite on your cryptic reply one more time... I guess this means that you know about the nut, though I didn't see you mention it anywhere. Here's a straight out question: Have you removed the spindle nut yet? If so, I guess that the outer bearing's inner race is frozen to the spindle. Soooo, there exists a slide hammer attachment for removing drums. If the studs are captured in the drum/hub assembly you can use the simple hub type puller attachment. Place it over the studs and attach it with two lug nuts. Thread in the slide hammer and hammer away. I have even seen large jaw type pullers for this purpose that grab around the entire drum, but have never used one. Autozone should have a slide hammer and hub adapter kit as part of their loan-a-tool program. Toyota MDT in MO > On Jul 9, 7:31 pm, Hachiroku <Tru...@AE86.gts> wrote: >> > Just take the nut off and [quoted text clipped - 13 lines] > mention it anywhere. Here's a straight out question: Have you removed > the spindle nut yet? Sorry, I mentioned this in the original post in the Mazda group a couple weeks ago... > If so, I guess that the outer bearing's inner race is frozen to the > spindle. Soooo, there exists a slide hammer attachment for removing [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > > Toyota MDT in MO Since you left the Toy group, a few things have happened...I lost my cushy job and am delivering newspapers until the next cushy job comes along. Three hours in a car is a LOT of time to think, and this is exactly what I thought of in the wee hours of this morning while trying to go from 0-60-0 in the alloted 1/8 mile between stops... ;) Yeah, the studs and the drum form the hub, so this was my next idea. I'm just afraid to do this, since this is my 'work' car and I don't want to phu@|< anything up! I have a 'winter' car (Subaru AWD Coupe...stand by for questions on THAT!!!) but it needs work before getting registered. I used my Scion a couple times, but there are some hairy dirt roads, and my Supra sure isn't going out there!!! So this has to be something I can do with a limited budget, one day and git 'er done!!! BTW, Comboverfish, I really appreciate the 'inspiration' given by you and Tegger and all others that have answered! Very much appreciated. You know, two heads are better than mine!!! ;) Now, off to AutoZone to see if they have a loaner... On Jul 10, 12:45 pm, Hachiroku <Tru...@AE86.gts> wrote: > Yeah, the studs and the drum form the hub, so this was my next idea. I'm > just afraid to do this, since this is my 'work' car and I don't want to > phu@|< anything up! I wouldn't be too worried about the ensueing damage that might happen. If the drum *has* to come off eventually, tghen go for it. You aren't going to break anything unless the bearing race is near- welded to the spindle. Maybe the spindle is already worn from a dry spun race. Who knows? Worst scenario -- I'm sure you could find a cheap spindle at a boneyard and use the drum that came with it, or even get a new drum, bearings, and grease seal for dirt cheap. Now multiply that by two if both sides are stuck and $$$ can start adding up. If you end up buying new drums, all of the pics I've seen show them without studs, so be prepared to transfer them over. Toyota MDT in MO > On Jul 10, 12:45 pm, Hachiroku <Tru...@AE86.gts> wrote: > [quoted text clipped - 13 lines] > > Toyota MDT in MO Whaaaaa! The bearings are MINT. No grinding or binding at all! But I really need to replace the shoes!!! I'll have to wait till Saturday since I can't afford to have the car down for more than one afternoon. On Jul 10, 4:03 pm, Hachiroku <Tru...@AE86.gts> wrote: > > On Jul 10, 12:45 pm, Hachiroku <Tru...@AE86.gts> wrote: > [quoted text clipped - 21 lines] > > - Show quoted text - Thank God I found this discussion thread. I'm am dealing with the exact same issue. I think I figured out what Haynes was referring to by the plug in the back plate ( a screw?). But I'm pretty green at this, and didn't realize I have to remove the hub to get the drum off. So my question is: what is meant by unstaking the nut on the hub? And are hub nut wrenchs available at standard auto parts stores? Thanks. On Fri, 13 Jul 2007 12:50:09 -0700, dkennicutt wrote: > On Jul 10, 4:03 pm, Hachiroku <Tru...@AE86.gts> wrote: >> > On Jul 10, 12:45 pm, Hachiroku <Tru...@AE86.gts> wrote: [quoted text clipped - 32 lines] > > Thanks. If you look at the nut securing the hub/drum to the spindle, you'll see a 'collar' on the top of the nut. There is a notch in the spindle, and a small section of this 'collar' is supposed to be hammered into this notch with a chisel or drift punch type tool. You need to pry the part of the nut pounded into the notch out of the notch before you can remove the nut. I'll have to look...it's either 32 or 34mm, and one axle I bought for the front can with a smaller nut than was on the old on, so I needed ANOTHER axle socket! Luckily, I had a 1 1/8" socket that was spot-on. AutoZone charges about $11 for these, and if you plan on doing a lot of work, buy one. If not, they offer it as a loaner (you pay for the tool, and then return it unbroken and get your money back) Also, get the BIGGEST 'breaker bar' you can afford, if you don't have one! I had an 18" bar, wouldn't budge. So, I promptly BROKE a 24" bar, went and got another, and used the bar with an 24" jack handle I slid over the bar (for a total of 36") before the nut would budge. That was AFTER heating it with a propane torch!!!! The other one only needed an impact wrench at 85 PSI... Hachiroku wrote: > I'll have to look...it's either 32 or 34mm, and one axle I bought for the > front can with a smaller nut than was on the old on, so I needed ANOTHER [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > work, buy one. If not, they offer it as a loaner (you pay for the tool, > and then return it unbroken and get your money back) Around here, Sears is often the cheapest source for big sockets like that, sometimes equalling Harbor Freight. > Also, get the BIGGEST 'breaker bar' you can afford, if you don't have one! > I had an 18" bar, wouldn't budge. So, I promptly BROKE a 24" bar, went and > got another, and used the bar with an 24" jack handle I slid over the bar > (for a total of 36") before the nut would budge. That was AFTER heating it > with a propane torch!!!! When things get that tough, I slip a 7-8' piece of pipe over the handle of a ratchet, place a jack under it, and go inside and watch TV. The nut usually loosens in 30 minutes, and I've broken only one ratchet doing this, Dad's Montgomery Ward, which Ward replaced with a Sears Craftsman because they no longer carried 1/2" ratchets. >> Also, get the BIGGEST 'breaker bar' you can afford, if you don't have >> one! I had an 18" bar, wouldn't budge. So, I promptly BROKE a 24" bar, [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > a ratchet, place a jack under it, and go inside and watch TV. The nut > usually loosens in 30 minutes Now why the "helk" didn't *I* think of that?! I could've watched the Indy car race! (Actually, I did it earlier, and since it was off a couple weeks ago, a few seconds @ 90 PSI did it...) On Fri, 13 Jul 2007 12:50:09 -0700, dkennicutt wrote: > On Jul 10, 4:03 pm, Hachiroku <Tru...@AE86.gts> wrote: >> > On Jul 10, 12:45 pm, Hachiroku <Tru...@AE86.gts> wrote: [quoted text clipped - 32 lines] > > Thanks. Go to alt.binaries.images.fun, and look for 9 posts, Mazda Brake Drum Removal, # There are 9 posts; the only one I skipped (pictures were an afterthought...) was prying off the dust cap. Remove the wheel and tire and take a paint scraper/putty knife and a hammer, hammer the putty knife into the groove between the hub and the dust boot, turn the hub 45 degrees, and repeat until you get enough room to get a screwdriver in there, and pry the dust cap off. > On Jul 10, 12:45 pm, Hachiroku <Tru...@AE86.gts> wrote: > [quoted text clipped - 13 lines] > > Toyota MDT in MO alt.binaries.images.fun, look for 9 pics headered Mazda Brake Drum Removal, # number is 1 through 9. THere is a 'bonus' pic, # 5 or 6 I think... > If so, I guess that the outer bearing's inner race is frozen to the > spindle. Soooo, there exists a slide hammer attachment for removing > drums. Yup! Thanks! Borrowed one from AutoZone, and, as Tegger says, "Bob's Your Uncle"! A lot of times manuals put that bit in there about the hole in the backing plate and there never was a hole there -- in that model... There probably is some kind of adjuster that sticks thru the plate that you need to turn to release the shoes from the drum. Maybe a square peg around the wheel cyl location?? The shoes need to be backed off sufficiently so that they will clear the ridge on the edge of the drum.  SignatureCraigFL http://www.automotiveforums.com > A lot of times manuals put that bit in there about the hole in the backing > plate and there never was a hole there -- in that model... [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > around the wheel cyl location?? The shoes need to be backed off > sufficiently so that they will clear the ridge on the edge of the drum. See my answer to MDT Tech. The shoes aren't binding at all, and if they are inside a 'ridge', I can't even budge the drums enough to verify that. |
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