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Car Forum / Driving, Maintenance, Tuning / Maintenance and Repair / October 2007

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Replaced radiator, now it wont start :(

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afx - 28 Aug 2007 04:24 GMT
Im reposting this here in case someone else might know what the
problem is.

So the radiator got replaced, started up the car and it was running
fine, I went to check for tube leaks and found one with the trans.
fluid slowly dripping out, I fixed it and when I went to restart the
car it wont, just a single click. I checked the oil, its okay but it
still wont start, I'm currently taking the battery out to let the car
discharge for a bit before I start again..

any suggestions?

THINGS IVE CHECKED:

Battery Terminal

Charged Battery

Checked Battery Cables

Unplugged tube I fixed to make sure it wasn't interfering with
anything

Cried a few times....well...ok I didn't...
Rodan - 28 Aug 2007 06:42 GMT
   The radiator was replaced and the car ran fine.
I found and fixed a trans fluid tube leak, afterward
the car would not start.  Just a single click.
    The oil level is okay.   Battery terminals and cables
are okay.    I am taking the battery out to let the
car discharge for a bit before I start again.
    I'm reposting this.    Any suggestions?
___________________________________________

   Repost again - Disclose what vehicle is involved,
where in the vehicle the click comes from, and what
the car is discharging while the battery is out.

Good luck.

Rodan.
AFX - 28 Aug 2007 16:21 GMT
>     The radiator was replaced and the car ran fine.
> I found and fixed a trans fluid tube leak, afterward
[quoted text clipped - 12 lines]
>
> Rodan.

Sorry, I forgot this wasnt in a specific car forum :)

Its a 1998 3.2l V6 Chrysler Concorde and nothing really discharged
with the battery out.
Steve - 28 Aug 2007 18:17 GMT
>>    The radiator was replaced and the car ran fine.
>>I found and fixed a trans fluid tube leak, afterward
[quoted text clipped - 17 lines]
> Its a 1998 3.2l V6 Chrysler Concorde and nothing really discharged
> with the battery out.

I'm not sure where the neutral interlock on that car is, but if its near
the transmission shift lever input shaft (as they often are) I'd look
really close to see if the wires got knocked loose.
John S. - 28 Aug 2007 18:18 GMT
> Im reposting this here in case someone else might know what the
> problem is.
[quoted text clipped - 20 lines]
>
> Cried a few times....well...ok I didn't...

Do other high-draw electrical components like the blower and
headlights work properly?

If so I suspect that the failure to start is coincidental to the
radiator replacement.  Start with the starter solenoid.
clifto - 28 Aug 2007 21:55 GMT
>> Im reposting this here in case someone else might know what the
>> problem is.
[quoted text clipped - 26 lines]
> If so I suspect that the failure to start is coincidental to the
> radiator replacement.  Start with the starter solenoid.

I was thinking along the same lines as you. I bet if he turns on his
headlights and then tries to start the car, the headlights won't be on
while the key is in the 'start' position.

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AFX - 29 Aug 2007 04:51 GMT
> >> Im reposting this here in case someone else might know what the
> >> problem is.
[quoted text clipped - 36 lines]
>
> - Show quoted text -

Actually headlights and blower motor work just fine with the car in
the on position.
clifto - 29 Aug 2007 06:14 GMT
>> >> Im reposting this here in case someone else might know what the
>> >> problem is.
[quoted text clipped - 39 lines]
> Actually headlights and blower motor work just fine with the car in
> the on position.

I would have guessed that. How do the headlights work with the car in
the 'start' position?

In 'on' position they should work just like they do in 'off' position.
Assuming the battery cables are making any contact at all, this should
mean they work in both positions. 'start' is very different.

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AFX - 30 Aug 2007 04:45 GMT
> >> >> Im reposting this here in case someone else might know what the
> >> >> problem is.
[quoted text clipped - 52 lines]
>
> - Show quoted text -

They work well in all positions, I bought a new battery and cables and
its still a no go.
Rodan - 30 Aug 2007 06:40 GMT
It's hard to get a handle on the problem because the
OP feeds out information little bits at a time.    He/She
never did answer the critical question:  "Where in the
car does the click come from??"

It would also help if the OP would describe exactly
what he does when trying to start the car, and what
he sees/hears/smells/feels when he does it.

Rodan.
_______________________________________________

On Aug 29, 12:14 am, clifto <cli...@gmail.com> wrote:
> AFX wrote:
> > On Aug 28, 3:55 pm, clifto <cli...@gmail.com> wrote:
[quoted text clipped - 56 lines]
>
> - Show quoted text -

They work well in all positions, I bought a new battery and cables and
its still a no go.
AFX - 30 Aug 2007 20:20 GMT
Sorry I haven't posted as much as I can, here is all I know.

Its a 1998 Chrysler Concorde 3.2l V6 with 155,000 miles on it.

The radiator went out last week, it had a big hole in the plastic side
part.

I bought a new radiator and put it in last weekend. The car started
fine.

There was a small leak in the hose so I took it off, fixed the leak
and put it back on.

Now the car wont start.

It gives me a single click then I try and turn it on. The click seems
to originate from the right (driver) side of the engine (facing the
car) and sounds to me like the same sound you get when a battery
terminal is lose. I replaced the battery and terminals and it still
doesn't work. I have tried turning the crankshaft manually but that
didn't work, I turned it a full 360 degrees. I changed the oil and
made sure the transmission oil was full and clean, I have checked most
electrical wires for anything that might hinder its performance, I got
a multimeter but don't know how or where to use it.

The electrical inside the car seems to work fine, the lights come on
and don't dim when I try to start the car. I put a new battery in so
it shouldn't.

I'm getting ready to tow this POS to Austin to roll down a hill if I
don't get this thing running soon!
inafogg - 30 Aug 2007 21:00 GMT
can u jump stater solonoid. try tapping on starter maybe bushes are'nt
making contact.it sounds like maybe starter problems

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Rodan - 30 Aug 2007 23:45 GMT
"AFX" wrote:         (1998 Chrysler Concorde 3.2l V6   155 k)

Here is all I know.     I put in a new radiator and car started fine.
Now it won't start.   It gives me a single click then I try and turn
it on. The click seems to come from the right (driver) side of the
engine and sounds like the sound you get when a battery terminal
is loose.  The electrical inside the car seems to work fine, the lights
come on and don't dim when I try to start the car.

None of the following things have helped:
Replaced the battery and terminals.
Turned the crankshaft 360 degrees manually.
Changed the oil and checked thetransmission fluid.
Checked most electrical wires.
Got a multimeter but don't know how or where to use it.

I'm getting ready to tow this POS to Austin to roll down a hill if I
don't get this thing running soon!
________________________________________________________

Don't throw it away yet.     There is some great information here.

If you have the headlights and all the other lights on and you turn
the key to the start position, the heavy starter current SHOULD dim
the lights, even with a fully charged battery.

Your lights do not dim, so the starter is not getting any current.
To find why, follow these checks:

Ignition key switch:    The battery cable goes to a solenoid switch
which clicks when you turn the ignition key to the start position.
The ignition key switch is okay because it makes the solenoid click.

Solenoid switch.   There is a heavy cable from the solenoid to the
starter.  The solenoid switch must connect the battery cable to the
starter cable.    Set the multimeter on a 12-VDC (minimum) scale,
place its neg probe on a grounded spot and its pos probe on the
solenoid battery terminal.    If it reads 12 volts, the battery is
connected.    Move the pos probe to the solenoid starter terminal.
It should read zero because the solenoid is not energized.   Have
someone turn the ignition key to the start position (keeping your
arms away from anything that might move).   The voltage reading
should jump up to about 12 volts to energize the starter.  If the
voltage stays at zero, the solenoid is bad and must be replaced.

Starter.   If the battery, the cables, the ignition switch, and the
solenoid have been eliminated, the only thing left is the starter.
If you don't find a loose cable at the starter, remove the starter
and take it to a parts store for testing and replacement if needed.

Good luck.

Rodan.
clifto - 31 Aug 2007 03:13 GMT
> If you have the headlights and all the other lights on and you turn
> the key to the start position, the heavy starter current SHOULD dim
> the lights, even with a fully charged battery.

Expanding that for completeness: they should dim a little to somewhat;
they should not be unaffected and they should not go off or really dim.

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Scott Dorsey - 31 Aug 2007 15:01 GMT
>It gives me a single click then I try and turn it on. The click seems
>to originate from the right (driver) side of the engine (facing the
[quoted text clipped - 9 lines]
>and don't dim when I try to start the car. I put a new battery in so
>it shouldn't.

Okay, so the starter solenoid is closing when you turn the switch,
so you know the ignition switch is good.  And you know the battery is
good.

So either the starter isn't turning because the starter is bad, or
because the cable from the battery to the starter is bad, or because
the engine is totally siezed up.

>I'm getting ready to tow this POS to Austin to roll down a hill if I
>don't get this thing running soon!

If it has a manual transmission, just push start it and take it to a
tech.  If it won't push start, then you know the problem is the engine.
If it push starts, either it's the starter or the high current cable to
the starter, or the fusible link in that cable.  Measure the voltage at
the starter on the big cable to the battery... if there is voltage there,
the cable and the fusible link are good.
--scott
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Dll - 31 Aug 2007 18:41 GMT
"Scott Dorsey"

> AFX

>>The electrical inside the car seems to work fine, the lights come on
>>and don't dim when I try to start the car. I put a new battery in so
>>it shouldn't.

Yes it should.  The starter motor is either toast or not getting power from
the solinoid.

> Okay, so the starter solenoid is closing when you turn the switch,
> so you know the ignition switch is good.

No, little can be said about the solenoid.  The poster is clearly too
incompetent to test it, so little will likely ever be said.

> So either the starter isn't turning because the starter is bad, or
> because the cable from the battery to the starter is bad, or because
> the engine is totally siezed up.

No.  None of these statements are are valid or remotely probable.

Since poster is too incompetent to test starter/solenoid, it follows he
should remove it from the car and bring it to a parts store to get tested,
usually for free.  If it is bad, and the solenoid probably is, then buy a
new one.

- N
AFX - 01 Sep 2007 05:38 GMT
Im just replying to thank you guys for the input! I havent read the
posts yet im out on business the next few days but ill get back to
this thing soon enough!!

Thanks again.

-Kirk-
AFX - 10 Sep 2007 00:45 GMT
> Im just replying to thank you guys for the input! I havent read the
> posts yet im out on business the next few days but ill get back to
[quoted text clipped - 3 lines]
>
> -Kirk-

Alright I got under the car and put a multimeter to the starter. I
turned the car and it went from 15 to 17.0 and kind of stayed for a
bit.

What does this mean?
Rodan - 10 Sep 2007 01:13 GMT
I got under the car and put a multimeter to the starter.
I turned the car and it went from 15 to 17.0 and kind of
stayed for a bit.       What does this mean?
____________________________________________

Put the multimeter to what on the starter?
What scale was the multimeter set on?
What was turned in the car?
What went from 15 to 17.0?
What kind of stayed?
What is a bit?

If you will better describe what is happening,
someone can help.

Good luck.

Rodan.
AFX - 10 Sep 2007 03:57 GMT
> I got under the car and put a multimeter to the starter.
> I turned the car and it went from 15 to 17.0 and kind of
[quoted text clipped - 14 lines]
>
> Rodan.

Sorry I had so much grease on my hands I didn't want to type much,

I put it on the little bolt that connects the starter solenoid to the
starter (It had a little rubber cover on it)

When my buddy first turned it, it went to 17, as he held it went to 15
then stayed for about 3 seconds before he turned it off, it seemed to
fluctuate between 11, 15 and 17 but that could have been the awkward
position I was holding the negative with.
Steve - 10 Sep 2007 16:29 GMT
>>I got under the car and put a multimeter to the starter.
>>I turned the car and it went from 15 to 17.0 and kind of
[quoted text clipped - 24 lines]
> fluctuate between 11, 15 and 17 but that could have been the awkward
> position I was holding the negative with.

OK, so you're getting power to the solenoid. Now the much more important
question- since you were RIGHT THERE, did you hear and feel the solenoid
"bang" into position when your friend turned the key?

If so, pull the starter and have it repaired.
AFX - 12 Sep 2007 05:16 GMT
> >>I got under the car and put a multimeter to the starter.
> >>I turned the car and it went from 15 to 17.0 and kind of
[quoted text clipped - 32 lines]
>
> - Show quoted text -

Oh yeah, I put my hand on it and you could feel it hammer something
and make a pretty audible "CLICK"
clifto - 12 Sep 2007 07:03 GMT
>> >>I got under the car and put a multimeter to the starter.
>> >>I turned the car and it went from 15 to 17.0 and kind of
[quoted text clipped - 35 lines]
> Oh yeah, I put my hand on it and you could feel it hammer something
> and make a pretty audible "CLICK"

It wouldn't be a bad bet to remove the starter and take it to one of the
auto parts places that will test it for you.

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Steve - 12 Sep 2007 16:17 GMT
>>OK, so you're getting power to the solenoid. Now the much more important
>>question- since you were RIGHT THERE, did you hear and feel the solenoid
[quoted text clipped - 6 lines]
> Oh yeah, I put my hand on it and you could feel it hammer something
> and make a pretty audible "CLICK"

Then the diagnosis is 99-44/100% POSITIVE that its the damn solenoid
contacts, or (less likely but possible) a dead starter motor. EITHER
WAY, the solution is to pull the starter and have it repaired.
AFX - 20 Oct 2007 21:00 GMT
> >>OK, so you're getting power to the solenoid. Now the much more important
> >>question- since you were RIGHT THERE, did you hear and feel the solenoid
[quoted text clipped - 10 lines]
> contacts, or (less likely but possible) a dead starter motor. EITHER
> WAY, the solution is to pull the starter and have it repaired.

OK guys, I just put a brand new starter in and its doing the same
f.cking thing.

Is it time to burn this car yet?
Scott Dorsey - 22 Oct 2007 15:36 GMT
>> >>OK, so you're getting power to the solenoid. Now the much more important
>> >>question- since you were RIGHT THERE, did you hear and feel the solenoid
[quoted text clipped - 15 lines]
>
>Is it time to burn this car yet?

If you pull the starter out, will it turn when detached from the car?

Is the ground strap from the block to the battery good?

Is this a "brand new" starter from the dealer or from a chain store?
--scott
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Mike Romain - 23 Oct 2007 16:08 GMT
>>>> OK, so you're getting power to the solenoid. Now the much more important
>>>> question- since you were RIGHT THERE, did you hear and feel the solenoid
[quoted text clipped - 11 lines]
>
> Is it time to burn this car yet?

I would clean the battery terminals and put a multimeter on the battery
to see what voltage is in there first...

My bet is on dirty cables...

Mike
86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00
88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's - Gone to the rust pile...
clifto - 28 Oct 2007 21:38 GMT
>> >>OK, so you're getting power to the solenoid. Now the much more important
>> >>question- since you were RIGHT THERE, did you hear and feel the solenoid
[quoted text clipped - 13 lines]
> OK guys, I just put a brand new starter in and its doing the same
> f.cking thing.

Did replacing the starter also replace the solenoid (i.e. as an attached
unit)?

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aarcuda69062 - 11 Sep 2007 00:47 GMT
In article
<1189393056.904862.254480@r34g2000hsd.googlegroups.com>,

> > I got under the car and put a multimeter to the starter.
> > I turned the car and it went from 15 to 17.0 and kind of
[quoted text clipped - 16 lines]
>
> Sorry I had so much grease on my hands I didn't want to type much,

They make these things called rags...

> I put it on the little bolt that connects the starter solenoid to the
> starter (It had a little rubber cover on it)

The bolt that connects the starter solenoid to the starter or the
bolt that connects the battery cable to the solenoid?

> When my buddy first turned it, it went to 17, as he held it went to 15
> then stayed for about 3 seconds before he turned it off, it seemed to
> fluctuate between 11, 15 and 17 but that could have been the awkward
> position I was holding the negative with.

Do either one of you have the slightest clue as to what you need
to be testing?

Lemme ask you this; given that you had a gargantuan hole in the
radiator tank and, IIRC you drove the car some distance under
this condition, have you bothered to put a socket to the
crankshaft bolt to see if the engine is seized?
Comboverfish - 12 Sep 2007 03:52 GMT
> Lemme ask you this; given that you had a gargantuan hole in the
> radiator tank and, IIRC you drove the car some distance under
> this condition, have you bothered to put a socket to the
> crankshaft bolt to see if the engine is seized?

>From his post Aug 30th: "I have tried turning the crankshaft manually
but that
didn't work, I turned it a full 360 degrees."

I'm not exactly sure how turning the crank should "have worked" in the
OP's context, but it seems unlikely the engine is locked up.

So anyhoo, that's an ND starter, right?  150k miles?  I'm thinkin'
solenoid contacts.  Of course if it's anything but an original ND or
true ND reman, don't waste time overhauling contacts; get a whole
'nuther unit.

Toyota MDT in MO

P.S. I wish I had a nickel for every 11, 15, 17 volt variable output
battery that's flown me for a misdiagnosis.
P.P.S. 17!!
Steve - 12 Sep 2007 16:15 GMT
> So anyhoo, that's an ND starter, right?  150k miles?  I'm thinkin'
> solenoid contacts.

You and EVERYONE else.... :-p
AFX - 12 Sep 2007 05:16 GMT
> The bolt that connects the starter solenoid to the starter or the
> bolt that connects the battery cable to the solenoid?

Im pretty sure it was solonoid to starter as I said in my previous
post.

Do either one of you have the slightest clue as to what you need
to be testing?

Nope, just testing what you guys tell me to.

Lemme ask you this; given that you had a gargantuan hole in the
radiator tank and, IIRC you drove the car some distance under
this condition, have you bothered to put a socket to the
crankshaft bolt to see if the engine is seized?

I only drove it maybe a quarter mile and it never overheated. I turned
the car on after replacing the radiator and it worked just fine, then
I turned it off to fix a leak and no more than 15 seconds later. It
wont start.
 
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