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Car Forum / Driving, Maintenance, Tuning / Maintenance and Repair / October 2007Blown head gasket, cracked head, or both?
I have a '92 Honda Accord Wagon with 228,000 miles in immaculate condition, and recently passed smog with all readings well below average. Recently it overheated due to radiator leak. I pulled over as soon as I noticed steam, let it cool, and filled up the radiator, drove home. I replaced the radiator, and everything seemed fine for a few days. One morning I noticed white smoke coming out of the exhaust, with the tell-tell sickly-sweet coolant smell. The engine still idled perfectly, and a couple minutes later the steam disappeared. I checked for water on the oil dipstick and oil cap; there was none. Also, no sign of oil in the radiator. I drove it 50 miles on the highway, and checked the water level when I returned - it was approx. 1 pint low. It drove OK for the next couple days - white smoke disappearing after warm-up. Today I started it and the engine ran very rough for the first 15 seconds, then the idle smoothed out. Now the steam was coming out continuously, although the idle was still smooth. Researching online, it seems that Honda engines are notorious for leaking/blown head gaskets after overheating. What I'm wondering is: In your experiences, what are the chances that it's just the gasket and not a cracked head or block, or a warped head? I really like this car a lot, and want to do the job myself (2.2L engine with A/C). I guess I'll find out soon enough, and I'm keeping my fingers crossed. Any ideas/suggestions are very much appreciated. Wish me luck! Pigeon "Pigeon Hohl" <pigeon@dontfeed.org> wrote in message news:pigeon- > Any ideas/suggestions are very much appreciated. > > Wish me luck! > > Pigeon Most likely a head gasket, but some of the earlier Honda engines were bad about warping the heads too. You will have to pull it down to find out which is your problem, in any case. A machine shop can check for cracks and true the head if it needs it. If it is cracked, you can get a reconditioned head for it. Check for cracks in the block, but that is not really so likely. Put it back together right, and you should still have a lot of life in the car. >Researching online, it seems that Honda engines are notorious for >leaking/blown head gaskets after overheating. What I'm wondering is: >In your experiences, what are the chances that it's just the gasket and >not a cracked head or block, or a warped head? I really like this car a >lot, and want to do the job myself (2.2L engine with A/C). I guess I'll >find out soon enough, and I'm keeping my fingers crossed. Honda engines don't have any more trouble with warping the heads than other manufacturers do. Any new engine is going to have trouble with overheating... The good ol' iron head engines that could survive an overheat are long gone for current production stuff. Your head probably isn't cracked but there is a good chance it is warped. Take the head to a machine shop and have it decked for your best shot at success. They can check it for cracks as well. It might be cheaper / easier to find a new head for it. You'll have to be careful with this one as the "might as wells" will get you. Try to keep from replacing toooo much stuff until you have a good end result. Also keep in mind that you could have bottom end damage from the overheat as well and sometimes when u put a fresh head on a worn bottom end you suddenly gain oil burning issues that you didn't have before. Steve B. > You'll have to be careful with this one as the "might as wells" will > get you. Try to keep from replacing toooo much stuff until you have > a good end result. Also keep in mind that you could have bottom end > damage from the overheat as well and sometimes when u put a fresh head > on a worn bottom end you suddenly gain oil burning issues that you > didn't have before. Thanks for the responses. My idea was to try to do this with minimal expense. I asked a local mechanic friend about possibly doing the job for me, as my experience is limited to stuff like timing belt replacement, valve adjustment, ect. He said if he did the job, he would insist on having the machine-shop grind the valve seats (in addition to checking/milling the head). Also, he said you might as well replace the piston rings and the lower bearings as long as the head is off. This seems a bit much, especially considering what you say about "might as wells". At this point I think I'll just remove the head and have a shop look at it, and take it from there. After all, 227.000 on a Honda is basically just broken-in, no? ;-) Pigeon >Thanks for the responses. My idea was to try to do this with minimal >expense. I asked a local mechanic friend about possibly doing the job [quoted text clipped - 11 lines] > >Pigeon Well... At 227k miles most any automobile engine is much closer to worn out than it is to just broken in. Your mechanic friend is right about the "proper" way a shop would do it. If you can do the labor though I would do it just the way you plan to do. Shops have to be careful because customers come in today wanting it fixed as cheap as possible then when something else goes in a month that same customer is pissed off because that part wasn't replaced while the mechanic was in there. If you can do a timing belt and a valve adjustment you can do this. It's one of those projects that sounds harder than it really is. Steve B. > >Thanks for the responses. My idea was to try to do this with minimal > >expense. == If you like the car and plan on keeping it, once the head is off, why not go ahead with ring and bearing replacement along with grinding the valve seats? For slightly more in parts, and little extra labor, you'll then have an improvement in reliability and performance instead of barely patching it back together. That being said, I've got a '77 Toyota pickup truck where I found a remanufactured head for $125 and a reground cam for $40 many years ago. That's all I changed (plus gaskets) after overheating on the highway, and it still runs just fine today. >> >Thanks for the responses. My idea was to try to do this with minimal >> >expense. > == > If you like the car and plan on keeping it, once the head is off, why > not go ahead with ring and bearing replacement along with grinding the > valve seats? People used to do this. BUT, one of the Houston engine rebuilders cautioned me not to do so.. Putting in rings without conditioning the cylinder walls is perhaps not an improvement. And just putting bearings on an old crank may not help as much as you would hope. If the valves are burned or are not seating, I agree that this is a good time to do that work. Some say that you will cause problems by improving the seal with a valve job without redoing the rings....and, I think that sometimes this may be the case...but not always. You can patch an engine and run for a good while. To do it right costs money. The owner can choose the level of expense he is capable of affording, but dont expect a new engine with a partial or half hearted repair job. |
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