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Car Forum / Driving, Maintenance, Tuning / Maintenance and Repair / February 2008Dodge caravan Metric Tools?
Just purchased a 2006 Dodge Caravan, anyone know who makes the 3.3L engine? Also the tools required to work on the vehicle, are they Metric or the standard N.American tools? Thank you in advance Denny B > Just purchased a 2006 Dodge Caravan, anyone know who > makes the 3.3L engine? Chrysler > Also the tools required to work on > the vehicle, are they Metric or the standard N.American tools? Everything is metric >> Just purchased a 2006 Dodge Caravan, anyone know who >> makes the 3.3L engine? > > Chrysler The OP might want to take a look at the following link for a little history on the 3.3 L. It is apparently not a bad engine. http://www.allpar.com/mopar/33.html > Just purchased a 2006 Dodge Caravan, anyone know who > makes the 3.3L engine? Also the tools required to work on > the vehicle, are they Metric or the standard N.American tools? > > Thank you in advance > Denny B All vehicles, even those made in the US of A, have been metric for the past 25 years. >> Just purchased a 2006 Dodge Caravan, anyone know who >> makes the 3.3L engine? Also the tools required to work on [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > All vehicles, even those made in the US of A, have been metric for the > past 25 years. You don't work on Chevy trucks much, eh? Back in the 1960s or 1970s, either fed govt or somebody else was wanting/trying to get everything in America on metric.I am used to good old standard American measurements, I don't want to go metric. cuhulin cuhu...@webtv.net wrote: > Back in the 1960s or 1970s, either fed govt or somebody else was > wanting/trying to get everything in America on metric.I am used to good > old standard American measurements, I don't want to go metric. > cuhulin Does that mean you don't use sparkplugs? :) > All vehicles, even those made in the US of A, have been metric for the past > 25 years. There's a big difference between a vehicle being metric and a vehicle having some metric parts.  SignatureB. Hussein Obama won't wear an American flag on his lapel, or put his hand over his heart during the national anthem, but prominently displayed in his Houston campaign office is a Cuban flag with a picture of Che Guevara superimposed on it. >> All vehicles, even those made in the US of A, have been metric for >> the past 25 years. > > There's a big difference between a vehicle being metric and a vehicle > having some metric parts. Vehicles designed in North America have been created entirely in Metric for at least the last 20 years. In the CAD/CAM files, cars are subdivided into one-decimeter (10cm, about 4") cubes. With a few exceptions, fasteners have been Metric for at least that long, I'm sure. SignatureTegger >>> All vehicles, even those made in the US of A, have been metric for >>> the past 25 years. [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] >With a few exceptions, fasteners have been Metric for at least that long, >I'm sure. Not exactly. I've got a Merc Sable that has both Metric and English fasteners and bolts. So I bought one of those combination socket sets to cover all the bases. Nick >>clifto <clifto@gmail.com> wrote: >>>> All vehicles, even those made in the US of A, have been metric for [quoted text clipped - 15 lines] > fasteners and bolts. So I bought one of those combination socket sets > to cover all the bases. My 1989 and 1991 Grand Marquises have more English than metric parts. My 1994 Acclaim has a good number of English parts, and they're always the ones I approach with a metric socket. All were made in the last 20 years. SignatureB. Hussein Obama won't wear an American flag on his lapel, or put his hand over his heart during the national anthem, but prominently displayed in his Houston campaign office are TWO Cuban flags, each with a picture of Che Guevara superimposed on it. >>>clifto <clifto@gmail.com> wrote: >>>>> All vehicles, even those made in the US of A, have been metric for [quoted text clipped - 20 lines] >the ones I approach with a metric socket. All were made in the last 20 >years. Yep. It is a small PITA figuring out which a bolt head needs, but I'm used to it by now. In some cases you can get away with either. For example lug nuts: 3/4 inch vs 19mm. But on other stuff, smaller bolts that can't afford that *tolerance,* you have to get the best fit you can so as not to strip the bolt heads. Especially ones on the brake system that can require high torque (caliper bracket bolts). He went to Islamic Madrassas when he was a kid, so what do you expect? He was Islamic. Don't know if he still is. But I won't hold that against him. As long as he doesn't make me bow down to Mecca 4 times a day and eat camel for supper. Nick > >B. Hussein Obama won't wear an American flag on his lapel, or put his hand over > >his heart during the national anthem, but prominently displayed in his Houston > >campaign office are TWO Cuban flags, each with a picture of Che Guevara > >superimposed on it. > > He went to Islamic Madrassas when he was a kid, so what do you expect? But he didn't. It was a school where the boys and girls sat in the same classrooms, something that never happens in a Madrassa. > He was Islamic. His name and father are. > Don't know if he still is. He never was. He's Methodist, just like Bush. > But I won't hold that against him. You already did, in a cowardly, underhanded way, not the way a real man would. But I won't hold that against you. > As long as he doesn't make me bow down to Mecca 4 times > a day and eat camel for supper. The Bush family has been trying to do that to us for years and has long been good buddies with the bin Ladens and the chief sponsor of Islamic terrorism, the Saud family. >> But I won't hold that against him. > >You already did, in a cowardly, underhanded way, not the way a real >man would. But I won't hold that against you. Enlighten me. Tell me what a Real Man is. After all these years, I'm having a problem considering your proposal that I don't measure up. Nick >>>clifto <clifto@gmail.com> wrote: >>>>> All vehicles, even those made in the US of A, have been metric for [quoted text clipped - 20 lines] > the ones I approach with a metric socket. All were made in the last 20 > years. You can tell I don't have much experience with domestic cars... SignatureTegger I once read somewhere years and years ago that Asian metrics are different than European metrics. cuhulin cuhulin@webtv.net wrote in news:17314-47B6019E-392@storefull- 3256.bay.webtv.net: > I once read somewhere years and years ago that Asian metrics are > different than European metrics. > cuhulin That sounds just nutty enough to be possibly true... And hey, I discovered a couple of years ago that my Japanese car has a 15/16" bore master cylinder. It's even cast into the side of the barrel. SignatureTegger > cuhulin@webtv.net wrote in news:17314-47B6019E-392@storefull- > 3256.bay.webtv.net: [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > And hey, I discovered a couple of years ago that my Japanese car has a > 15/16" bore master cylinder. It's even cast into the side of the barrel. There are a few different "Metric Standards". You have the European Industrial Standard and the Japanese Industrial Standard those are the common automotive ones. Then if you go into aircraft you get into the International Standard for Aircraft. Plus there are also quite a few "proprietary" sizes and threads as well. Then there are the real off beat ones where you get a metric threaded stud/bolt that uses a common inch size for the head. SignatureSteve W. Near Cooperstown, New York Life is not like a box of chocolates it's more like a jar of jalapenos- what you do today could burn your a.s tomorrow! >> cuhulin@webtv.net wrote in news:17314-47B6019E-392@storefull- >> 3256.bay.webtv.net: [quoted text clipped - 11 lines] > Industrial Standard and the Japanese Industrial Standard those are the > common automotive ones. What are the practical differences between those two (such that I'd notice in everyday use)? I Googled, but didn't come up with anything useful. SignatureTegger >>> cuhulin@webtv.net wrote in news:17314-47B6019E-392@storefull- >>> 3256.bay.webtv.net: [quoted text clipped - 16 lines] > > I Googled, but didn't come up with anything useful. The DIN (Deutsches Institut für Normung) EIS standards and the JIS share a lot BUT there are more than a few gotchas in the mix. Depending on the thread pitch itself the root diameters and thread wall angles may be different. In practical use it means that you may have a M-8 bolt in JIS and an M-8 hole in DIN and they will not go together. Things like head bolts on German autos and bottom end parts are a couple of the OOPs areas I have run into. SignatureSteve W. >>> There are a few different "Metric Standards". You have the European >>> Industrial Standard and the Japanese Industrial Standard those are [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] > together. Things like head bolts on German autos and bottom end parts > are a couple of the OOPs areas I have run into. I had NO idea, so thanks. We have two Japanese cars, and Japanese is all I've ever owned (with the exception of one Dodge Coronet). Any Metric fasteners I've ever bought have come from all sorts of places, from the auto dealer to auto parts jobbers to the corner hardware store. I've never encountered any sort of problems with the fit of any bolt in any hole. Nor have I ever been asked which standard of Metric fastener I require. I have a Metric tap and die set. The labeling does not specify the standard to which the tools conform. I'm thinking either most fasteners must be made to a single standard (DIN?), or the standards are so similar you'd need to find yourself in unusual situations to see any difference. SignatureTegger >> The DIN (Deutsches Institut für Normung) EIS standards and the JIS >> share a lot BUT there are more than a few gotchas in the mix. [quoted text clipped - 14 lines] >hole. Nor have I ever been asked which standard of Metric fastener I >require. Some of the thread profiles are the same, and the ones that aren't are mostly close enough. For most things, there's not a big deal, but if you have bolts that need to be torqued precisely, it's a huge deal. This makes it a big deal for the aircraft industry. It's also a big deal on very small parts where the torque to seat them and the torque to strip them are sometimes already very close. I encountered that issue with M1.5 screw on the Studer (German) tape machines. >I have a Metric tap and die set. The labeling does not specify the standard >to which the tools conform. > >I'm thinking either most fasteners must be made to a single standard >(DIN?), or the standards are so similar you'd need to find yourself in >unusual situations to see any difference. Yes, this is what makes it so insidious. Everything is mostly fine until you find yourself in an unusual situation. It't not QUITE as bad as Whitworth threads... a 1/4-20 Whitworth bolt will fit into a 1/4-20NC nut but the 1/4-20NC bolt won't fit into a 1/4-20 Whitworth nut. Or is it the other way around? Legions of folks ruined MG engine blocks this way. --scott Signature"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis." > It't not QUITE as bad as Whitworth threads... a 1/4-20 Whitworth bolt will > fit into a 1/4-20NC nut but the 1/4-20NC bolt won't fit into a 1/4-20 Whitworth > nut. Or is it the other way around? Legions of folks ruined MG engine blocks > this way. It would take so much less effort to simply let the MG blocks ruin themselves... Toyota MDT in MO >> It't not QUITE as bad as Whitworth threads... a 1/4-20 Whitworth bolt will= > [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] >It would take so much less effort to simply let the MG blocks ruin >themselves... Some folks claim they come already pre-ruined from the factory. But honestly, the oil loss is a feature. The oil leaking from every corner of the block soon coats the underside of the car and prevents rust. --scott Signature"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis." I was watching Junkyard Wars on tv yesterday.The two teams each cobbled up some vehicles for a paintball contest.One of the teams dug out an old Range Rover.The rear end of the frame on that Range Rover was so rotten, they could pick that rotten frame metal off with their fingernails. cuhulin > I was watching Junkyard Wars on tv yesterday.The two teams each cobbled > up some vehicles for a paintball contest.One of the teams dug out an old > Range Rover.The rear end of the frame on that Range Rover was so rotten, > they could pick that rotten frame metal off with their fingernails. > cuhulin sounds like my 86 Jimmy. When I parted it out, a guy wanted the doors for the power window motors. Had a hard time getting the pin out of the driver's door, so I just reefed it all the way open (like I said, he wanted the guts not the skins) and the hinges peeled off the body. I knew it was rusty, but I didn't realize I could pull the doors off... Ray Try owning a vintage Russian motorcycle (1952 M72). Even the local metric fastener place is scared when I walk in! Andy >I once read somewhere years and years ago that Asian metrics are > different than European metrics. > cuhulin Russian Motorcycle? You can buy a Chinese copy of a pre-war BMW R-71 Motorcycle (with a sidecar) www.chang-jiang.com if you want one. Heck, nowdays there are Chinese copies of everything. cuhulin > Russian Motorcycle? You can buy a Chinese copy of a pre-war BMW R-71 > Motorcycle (with a sidecar) www.chang-jiang.com if you want one. > > Heck, nowdays there are Chinese copies of everything. > cuhulin .....and cheap copies , too. Even wheel and engine bearings >Russian Motorcycle? You can buy a Chinese copy of a pre-war BMW R-71 >Motorcycle (with a sidecar) www.chang-jiang.com if you want one. You don't want one. That's actually a Chinese copy of the Russian Ural copy of the BMW R-71. The Ural is better made than the Chinese one by quite a bit... and it's not so well made although it IS a hell of a lot of fun. --scott Signature"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis." >Try owning a vintage Russian motorcycle (1952 M72). Even the local metric >fastener place is scared when I walk in! I have worked on some Russian gear that was metric but with a different thread profile than the standard M thread. Kind of like 1/4-20 Whitworth... --scott Signature"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis." > >>>>> All vehicles, even those made in the US of A, have been metric for > >>>>> the past 25 years. [quoted text clipped - 24 lines] > -- > Tegger A good rule of thumb on domestic vehicles with mixed fasteners: The bolts or studs that thread directly into the heads and block will be standard, while all others will be metric. They are slowly phasing in new designs/castings to take the place of certain 30+ year old engines, so just be patient ;-) Toyota MDT in MO I have a lot of taps and dies and threading thingys.I bought them at some pawn shops around here.Sometimes, there are some good tools for sale in those pawn shops, you never know what you will find in there. One of the pawn shops, about five miles me, you have to be carefull when you walk through the door, there are all kinds of tools and tool boxes on the floor, the shelves,everywhere.My favorite kind of pawn shop. cuhulin Comboverfish <comboverfish@yahoo.com> wrote in news:ba725630-67c3-4f05- 849c-2200325e3b10@n77g2000hse.googlegroups.com: > A good rule of thumb on domestic vehicles with mixed fasteners: > [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > They are slowly phasing in new designs/castings to take the place of > certain 30+ year old engines, so just be patient ;-) According to an article I have in a British magazine... In the 1950s, Ford of France sold the tooling for a particular vehicle (called the "Vedette") to Simca. Simca then produced the car as the Simca Vedette. The article says the car was identical in all ways to the Ford design...except that Simca converted every single fastener from Imperial to Metric. I wonder what that cost? SignatureTegger > According to an article I have in a British magazine... > > In the 1950s, Ford of France sold the tooling for a particular vehicle > (called the "Vedette") to Simca. Simca then produced the car as the Simca > Vedette. Does that rhyme with "bidet"? I sure hope so. > The article says the car was identical in all ways to the Ford > design...except that Simca converted every single fastener from Imperial to > Metric. I wonder what that cost? Please kill me if I ever have to work on a French built, Ford designed car. Toyota MDT in MO >> According to an article I have in a British magazine... >> [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > > Does that rhyme with "bidet"? I sure hope so. Sorry to burst your bubble, but it's pronounced vedd-ETT, like "Corvette". I think it means "diplomat". >> The article says the car was identical in all ways to the Ford >> design...except that Simca converted every single fastener from >> Imperial to Metric. I wonder what that cost? > > Please kill me if I ever have to work on a French built, Ford designed > car. Would you like to be beat to death with a Metric, SAE, AF or Whitworth wrench? SignatureTegger I used to work at a factory that manufactured auto and big heavy 18 wheeler and lawn mower batteries and every six months or so, we manufactured a few pallet loads of six volt old timey looking batteries for old MG cars. cuhulin cuhulin@webtv.net wrote in news:21472-47B7940F-729@storefull- 3252.bay.webtv.net: > I used to work at a factory that manufactured auto and big heavy 18 > wheeler and lawn mower batteries and every six months or so, we > manufactured a few pallet loads of six volt old timey looking batteries > for old MG cars. 6-volt tar-tops? SignatureTegger Yep, they were six volt batteries.One of the old cars I used to own in the 1970s was a 1950 Ford six cylinder car, flat head engine with manual shift transmission and overdrive.That was before I worked at the battery factory, that old factory first opened up back around 1960 or 1961, I think.The factory closed down about ten years ago, we were manufacturing up to 14,000 batteries daily on two shifts.The factory ran five and a half days each week, half a day on Saturdays.I went there and I bought an eight volt battery for my 1950 Ford car.I had to adjust the regulator with a pair of pliers so the eight volt battery could charge up properly.That eight volt battery made the engine start up faster and the head lights were brighter too. cuhulin > >>>> All vehicles, even those made in the US of A, have been metric for > >>>> the past 25 years. [quoted text clipped - 25 lines] > campaign office are TWO Cuban flags, each with a picture of Che Guevara > superimposed on it. You need to correct the factual errors in your postscript because I saw Barack Hussein Obama, Jr. with his hand over his heart when the national anthem played, and unlike when George Bush did it, he wasn't playing with his left nipple. >>> All vehicles, even those made in the US of A, have been metric for >>> the past 25 years. [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > With a few exceptions, fasteners have been Metric for at least that long, > I'm sure. Yeah, but not all parts on all vehicles in the last 20 years are designed in the last 20 years. I own a 90 Beretta (3.1), a 90 Chevy 1/2 Ton (350) and an 01 Trans Am. I've come across standard size bolts on both of the 90's. I'm trying to remember exactly what (it's late), but I think it was either engine related and/or rear axle related on the truck. Both engines on these two vehicles are old enough designs to predate metric. I do know that both shop manuals warn about the fact that they may use both measuring systems. There is a possibility that the parts on these vehicles that aren't metric were replaced - on the Beretta, replacement balljoints and tierods weren't metric. (That might also be brand specific too.. Moog is say standard and TRW would be metric.) I'm just a diy-er but generally buy tools in both SAE and metric. Even if you own a 1970 Buick that's all standard, you might meet a cutie with a 90 Beretta that's got a busted alternator... and eventually marry her. :) Ray I have a Craftsman adjustable wrench that is both Metric and SAE -- On one side it's clearly marked in inches and the other side is in Millimeters <g>. Sorry, I couldn't resist... Pete Craftsman adjustable wrench (I have heard some people before call them a Japanese socket set) that is both Metric and SAE.I have a big old pipe wrench that will most anything. A buddy of mine, one time he was making fun of his wife.He said she has to use a pipe wrench to unroll a roll of toilet paper. cuhulin |
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