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Car Forum / Driving, Maintenance, Tuning / Maintenance and Repair / December 2005Diag Trouble Codes - Changing Thresholds
I recently purchased Digimoto OBDII Vehicle Diagnostic Software. I have a 1999 Toyot 4-Runner. The Check Engine light has been on for a few weeks. Using Digimoto, I was able to find the cause (Catalytic Converter Flow Threshold Exceeded) and clear the DTC. I am certain that the Check Engine light will come back on in a few days as I have not resolved the problem. My question is this. Is there any way (I assume I'll need additional software) to change the thresholds on the DTC's? Obviously, in most cases, I'd want to fix the problem, but in this case the vehicle isnt suffering performance and isnt really worth investing in a new converter. Were I able to increase the threshold slightly, I could operate the vehicle for several more months/years without having to worry about missing a "legitimate" error code due to something more critical failing. Thanks, Exactly what codes p0420-430? If in fact the cat was no longer efficient it will not affect performance but would fail an emissions test. These codes may not necessarily indicate the cat itself is bad. >I recently purchased Digimoto OBDII Vehicle Diagnostic Software. I have > a 1999 Toyot 4-Runner. The Check Engine light has been on for a few [quoted text clipped - 11 lines] > > Thanks, That is not correct, it would still pass emissions testing. OBDII vehicles are passed based on an OBDII scan, they do not stick the device in their exhaust anymore. If the computer isn't seeing a problem, the OBDII emissions testing software will not see a problem either. I know this because I had my OBDII software edited for my Turbo Blazer Xtreme and I got it to pass smog legally every time with the edited computer. All it scans for is DTCs..... http://www.carforums.net/ Auto Forums Emissions is not a problem here. Rural South Central Tennessee doesnt have emissions checks. Any specific software suggestions I could look at? In article <1133830438.637657.206650@g49g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>, > That is not correct, There wasn't a single incorrect statement in Shep's post. > it would still pass emissions testing. With cat efficiency codes set and incomplete monitors, I think not. > OBDII > vehicles are passed based on an OBDII scan, they do not stick the > device in their exhaust anymore. Who said they did? > If the computer isn't seeing a > problem, the OBDII emissions testing software will not see a problem > either. Which part of "The Check Engine light has been on for a few weeks. Using Digimoto, I was able to find the cause (Catalytic Converter Flow Threshold Exceeded) and clear the DTC." DO YOU NOT UNDERSTAND? > I know this because I had my OBDII software edited for my Turbo > Blazer Xtreme and I got it to pass smog legally every time with the > edited computer. You may have gotten it to pass, but it certainly wasn't legally. Futzing with the cat monitor thresholds is no different than plugging in a MIL eliminator. > All it scans for is DTCs..... Wrong again. VIN Monitor status Pending codes and other stuff that you obviously wouldn't comprehend. Listen LOSER.... STOP FOLLOWING ME AROUND TRYING TO DISCREDIT ME! I know exactly what I speak of, I had an OBDII vehicle with many computer modifications pass emissions in a state that uses California testing, so don't speak unless you know what you're talking about. THE ONLY tests they do are OBDII DTC error scans and VIN checks, pending codes would not exist if he increases the threshold, and they do not stick any device in the tail pipe on OBDII vehicles. It is all computer scanned, so get off your high horse and go research before you spout out incorrect info. ANd if you continue to follow me around trying to discredit me I'm goign to report you for abuse. http://www.carforums.net/ Auto Forums In article <1133844333.077815.9440@g47g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>, > Listen LOSER.... Why should anyone listen to you? > STOP FOLLOWING ME AROUND TRYING TO DISCREDIT ME! "Following you around?" Look little boy, I've been posting to these automotive newsgroups for over 10 years. > I know exactly what I speak of, Doesn't sound like it so far. > I had an OBDII vehicle with many > computer modifications pass emissions in a state that uses California > testing, California testing is hardly proof of anything. Cheating the test by hacking the software is not a pass, it's a tamper that has yet to be caught. > so don't speak unless you know what you're talking about. Well, ya see, that's the thing. I DO know what I'm talking about. > THE ONLY tests they do are OBDII DTC error scans and VIN checks, So why is there set criteria for how many un-run monitors will be allowed, and how do you know the OP is in the state of California? > pending codes would not exist if he increases the threshold, Do you honestly believe that pending codes only apply to cat efficiency codes? > and they > do not stick any device in the tail pipe on OBDII vehicles. And so far, the only person who's brought that up is YOU. Watta moron! Of course, if enough of you jack a.ses continue to foul the air, they WILL begin tailpipe testing on OBD2 vehicles. naturally, you self centered little twits never consider that possibility. > It is all > computer scanned, so get off your high horse and go research before you > spout out incorrect info. Resetting thresholds is tampering, tampering is illegal. The threshold is 1.5 times the allowable federal standard. If you -have- to reset the threshold *above* that, guess what's happening numbskull? > ANd if you continue to follow me around > trying to discredit me I'm goign to report you for abuse. Go for it! What are you talking about if the cat code is present you fail, here in NYS, if you clear the codes and the monitors are not reset again you fail!! I do this every day as a NYS safety and emissions inspector. > That is not correct, it would still pass emissions testing. OBDII > vehicles are passed based on an OBDII scan, they do not stick the [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > http://www.carforums.net/ > Auto Forums > What are you talking about if the cat code is present you fail, here in NYS, > if you clear the codes and the monitors are not reset again you fail!! I do > this every day as a NYS safety and emissions inspector. Obviously, this bozo thinks his belly button is the center of the universe. 'Woo-hoo, lookit me, I taped over the MIL' Yep, and technically any exhaust systems that generate noise levels higher than the factory system for the vehicle are illegal as well. Had an '02 Chevy in the other day that failed big time. No cat and no mufflers. So is altering the vehicle software to pass. That is a federal offence.  SignatureSteve Williams > What are you talking about if the cat code is present you fail, here in NYS, > if you clear the codes and the monitors are not reset again you fail!! I do [quoted text clipped - 13 lines] > http://www.newsfeeds.com The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! 120,000+ Newsgroups > ----= East and West-Coast Server Farms - Total Privacy via Encryption =---- I don't remember him asking if it was illegal or not, all I saw him ask was can it be done. I answered his question, and correctly. End of story, move on with your life. And actually, my turbo charged vehicle ran cleaner turbo charged than it did stock, especially at idle and cruising speeds. Of course in boost no vehicle is cleaner, but that's the nature of the beast. The only error codes I had to reset to get mine to run correctly weren't even for smog checks really, they were more because the SES light would drive me nuts. I had to change my coolant temperature setting since I changed the thermostat and anything under 170 degree average would set a MIL, and the other thing I needed to change was air flow into the motor through the MAF sensor. Neither of this was tampered with so that it would pass smog at a low RPM, legally they can't put the vehicle into an RMP high enough to produce boost when they put it on the smog machine anyway, even on the roller dyno. And good luck catching someone who has increased a threshold with software the edits the stock computer system, most vehicle computers have no way to alert others they have been tampered with. Alright I'm done now, don't feel like arguing anymore. In article <1133896446.843846.39100@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com>, > I don't remember him asking if it was illegal or not, all I saw him ask > was can it be done. I answered his question, and correctly. No, you didn't answer his question. All you did was blather about your Blazer and the illegal modifications that you did to it. As for "correctly," you haven't been correct about anything in this thread so far. > End of > story, move on with your life. What next bozo, you going to tell people how to roll back their odometer? > And actually, my turbo charged vehicle ran cleaner turbo charged than > it did stock, especially at idle and cruising speeds. I'm sure that you actually believe that. Thing is, I seriously doubt that you subjected that Blazer to the full 7 day federal test protocol necessary to verify such claims. IOWs, you're an assclown who knows enough to be dangerous. > Of course in > boost no vehicle is cleaner, but that's the nature of the beast. There are a million rationalizations in the naked city. > The > only error codes I had to reset to get mine to run correctly weren't [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > into an RMP high enough to produce boost when they put it on the smog > machine anyway, even on the roller dyno. My, what a limited understanding you have. > And good luck catching someone > who has increased a threshold with software the edits the stock > computer system, most vehicle computers have no way to alert others > they have been tampered with. You've been caught. What's so hard about that? > Alright I'm done now, don't feel like arguing anymore. Junior, you don't -have- an argument. I don't remember him asking if it was illegal or not, all I saw him ask was can it be done. I answered his question, and correctly. End of story, move on with your life. And actually, my turbo charged vehicle ran cleaner turbo charged than it did stock, especially at idle and cruising speeds. Of course in boost no vehicle is cleaner, but that's the nature of the beast. The only error codes I had to reset to get mine to run correctly weren't even for smog checks really, they were more because the SES light would drive me nuts. I had to change my coolant temperature setting since I changed the thermostat and anything under 170 degree average would set a MIL, and the other thing I needed to change was air flow into the motor through the MAF sensor. Neither of this was tampered with so that it would pass smog at a low RPM, legally they can't put the vehicle into an RMP high enough to produce boost when they put it on the smog machine anyway, even on the roller dyno. And good luck catching someone who has increased a threshold with software the edits the stock computer system, most vehicle computers have no way to alert others they have been tampered with. Alright I'm done now, don't feel like arguing anymore. http://www.carforums.net/ Auto Forums > I don't remember him asking if it was illegal or not, all I saw him ask > was can it be done. I answered his question, and correctly. End of [quoted text clipped - 15 lines] > computer system, most vehicle computers have no way to alert others > they have been tampered with. Want to bet. Ever heard of a comparator. It pulls the vehicles code and compares it to the known factory info. If they match your OK if not your busted for tampering with federal emissions controls. > Alright I'm done now, don't feel like arguing anymore. > > http://www.carforums.net/ > Auto Forums I am not sure on a Toyota, but on my old ODBII vehicle (Chevy Blazer) I was able to edit the LS1 based computer with LS1 edit and increase many thresholds, as I had a turbo charger kit on it. I'm sure someone makes the software or has the ability to increase the threshold for you. Good luck http://www.carforums.net/ Auto Forums > I recently purchased Digimoto OBDII Vehicle Diagnostic Software. I have > a 1999 Toyot 4-Runner. The Check Engine light has been on for a few [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > to worry about missing a "legitimate" error code due to something more > critical failing. But soon the converter would get worse and you would have to raise the threshold again, the converter would get worse, you would raise it again, and so on and so on. Check your owners manual - you may find that your vehicle is still under warranty for emissions components (you didn't post your mileage) and you can dump the mess into the dealer's lap and let him worry about it. Ted I feel like I have just asked what time it is and been given a lecture on quantum physics. All I want to know is how to change thresholds and some software suggestions to do so. xblazinlv - Thanks for the input. Your post was at least on topic. Now I remember why I dont post many questions in news groups. You either get a couple of juveniles engaged in some sort of verbal goober pulling contest or a barrage of advice on why I really dont want to do what I think I want to do. Good greif. Ityis possible there is a software update from the mfg that will expand the cat threshold, I have run into this on several model Fords and Toyotas, found when checking tsbs related to this problem. >I feel like I have just asked what time it is and been given a lecture > on quantum physics. All I want to know is how to change thresholds and [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > > Good greif. In article <1133869169.617259.167450@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com>, > I feel like I have just asked what time it is and been given a lecture > on quantum physics. All I want to know is how to change thresholds and [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > > Good greif. Yeah, who the f.ck wants to breath clean air anyhow? You're an assclown. If anyone SANE shows up here with an answer to my question, please email me. My address is my username with all the caps took out. Thanks to all who gave reasonable responses and advice. Unfortunately, I am not going to spend $600 on a vehicle thats worth $1000. Especially since I dont live anywhere near a populated area with emissions controls and the vehicle will probably be used for nothing more that pulling the next big buck out of the holler. > If anyone SANE shows up here with an answer to my question, please > email me. My address is my username with all the caps took out. Thanks [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > controls and the vehicle will probably be used for nothing more that > pulling the next big buck out of the holler. I have to jump in here and ask: Why would you not simply sell this car and buy one old enough to not monitor the cat's efficiency? In article <1133907302.387144.309970@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com>, > If anyone SANE shows up here with an answer to my question, please > email me. My address is my username with all the caps took out. Thanks > to all who gave reasonable responses and advice. You're welcome. > Unfortunately, I am > not going to spend $600 on a vehicle thats worth $1000. Funny, my friend just sold a 99 4 Runner for over $8000.00 You must have really turned that thing into a piece of crap. > Especially > since I dont live anywhere near a populated area with emissions > controls and the vehicle will probably be used for nothing more that > pulling the next big buck out of the holler. You make no sense. Why bother with it at all if it's just a hunting vehicle? > If anyone SANE shows up here with an answer to my question, please > email me. My address is my username with all the caps took out. Thanks [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > controls and the vehicle will probably be used for nothing more that > pulling the next big buck out of the holler. As an answer to your initial question, NO, you can't change any setting in a '99 4Runner ECM. It is all hardware-programmed. Toyota didn't have reflashable ECMs as a general rule until 2001. In the case of the 4Runner, 2003 with the new bodystyle. I don't follow the performance area of the industry, so I don't even know if there are "performance" ECMs available from an aftermarket source. Your fix is a new cat, and a Toyota OE unit at that. The aftermarket hasn't caught up IRT making quality converters yet; they offer units that either aren't CARB approved or don't satisfy the manufacturers' OBDII cat efficiency monitors. Of all the parameters that OBDII ECMs monitor, I think that cat parameters have the least wiggle room for failure. Bad for you, but better for the environment. After all, you don't want that 10 point buck dying from CO poisoning before you put a slug in him, now, do you? FYI: your impression of xblazinlv is a little off base. He has typically proven to be wrong or off topic when he answers posts. OTOH, aaracuda answers posts with great knowledge from both intelligence and experience. If you get on his good side, he will basically fix anything for you from a remote keyboard. Noone on R.A.T. has a broader auto repair knowledge and experience base than him IMHO. The pissing match you witnessed was built up from xblazinlv's previous (useless) posts and acerbic replies when someone would call his "knowledge bluff". It's hard to believe a '99 4Runner could be a "$1000 vehicle", unless the body and frame are tweaked badly. Good luck with whatever you decide to do. BTW, I'm a Toyota dealer mechanic. Toyota MDT in MO (see?) Thanks. Thats basically the info I was looking for. The 4Runner has about 190,000 miles and some significant interior damage. Not a bad "knock around" vehicle, but definitely not one to put any serious $$ into. My primary objective (other than to get the light to stay off) is to learn a little more about ECM's. I figured this old 4runner I picked up would be a good bread board. Honestly, I didn't pay attention to who was posting what. His first reply seemed fairly relevant and then the nonsense started. I just don't feel like a public forum, especially one started by someone else, is the place to air out that kinda stuff. Exchange email addresses and go at it or just stick to the point and let the readers form their own opinions. Its not hard to figure out who has it and who just gets a rise out of trolling the ng's. I doubt CO emissions will be an issue. I think I burned around $50 worth of gas in this one this year. It mainly sits in the yard and hauls the lawn mower around. (My 2-stroke motorcycle on the other hand, has probably caused a few three eyed puppies to show up around the neighborhood.) I do, however, get your point. Were this a daily driver, I'd fix it right. Thanks again for the info. I may check into some aftermarket ECM's. Have a great holiday. > Honestly, I didn't pay attention to who was posting what. His first > reply seemed fairly relevant and then the nonsense started. I just [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > opinions. Its not hard to figure out who has it and who just gets a > rise out of trolling the ng's. Yeah, that's the way I feel basically. I've only been here for about a year and 99% of the time I've given good advice about the things I really know. Those 1% exceptions occur when someone is not only arrogant, but is dispensing advice that can waste time or lead to injury - to either the person working on his own car, or to the next poor soul he drives by when his dangerous car decides to auto-dismantle at speed. > I doubt CO emissions will be an issue. I think I burned around $50 > worth of gas in this one this year. It mainly sits in the yard and > hauls the lawn mower around. We're not talking about 1970 and older type emissions levels here anyway. "High" CO for your car could be 1% or 15 grams/mile. If your 3.4 is mechanically in tip top condition, but the convertor is 0% effective, you will be producing excessive CO, HC, and NOx levels especially under heavier loads, labeled such by new car testing/regulation done by the Feds in the EPA. Like aaracuda said, any emissions related codes are supposed to set when the perceived increase in emissions is a factor of 1.5 - which is really just constant calculations and tests done by the ECM then compared to known standards. The cat monitor on most cars is fairly accurate, if a little bit strict, and you can bet the cat has degraded if you get a P0420 on your 4Runner. FWIW, I don't see P0420s on that model from 1996 to present. You may just be lucky ; ) > (My 2-stroke motorcycle on the other hand, > has probably caused a few three eyed puppies to show up around the > neighborhood.) Oh, for cute!! > Thanks again for the info. I may check into some aftermarket ECM's. Probably more expensive than a used converter/pipe assembly. Like I said, these aren't known failure items (not in my experience anyway). Check the late model junkyards. The bodystyle and powertrain were basically the same up through 2002, though some subtle changes may have been made to the exaust system in the late '90s. > Have a great holiday. Thanks, you too! Toyota MDT in MO > If anyone SANE shows up here with an answer to my question, please > email me. My address is my username with all the caps took out. Thanks [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > controls and the vehicle will probably be used for nothing more that > pulling the next big buck out of the holler. have you checked the owner's manual? On my GM I'm pretty sure emissions stuff is 8 years/100k miles... And what I'd probably do then is just clear the code when it comes back if you're not driving it a lot. Legally, you can't change the thresholds. If the converter is bad, it needs to be replaced. Even if you could change the thresholds that is not a fix. Also you should know that a 1999 car needs a factory cat. there are no authorized aftermarket converters for obd2 cars. > I recently purchased Digimoto OBDII Vehicle Diagnostic Software. I have > a 1999 Toyot 4-Runner. The Check Engine light has been on for a few [quoted text clipped - 11 lines] > > Thanks, Just fix the problem. |
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