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Car Forum / Driving, Maintenance, Tuning / Maintenance and Repair / March 200692 Cavalier No Spark
My Son's 92 Cavalier died. He told me he heard a pop, and the motor died. 2.2 L 4 cyl I discovered no spark at the plugs. The auto parts store told me cavaliers will go through Coils. I replaced both coils, with no luck. There is some sort of brain box that sits under the pair of coils. Is this an ignition module? Should I try that next? Any way I can test the module, before throwing more parts at the car? How would I test this type of coil? Thanks You need to scan it and see if you have cranking rpms, if not suspect crank sensor. > My Son's 92 Cavalier died. He told me he heard a pop, and the motor > died. [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > > Thanks I'm not sure how to scan for cranking RPMs. Where is the Crank Sensor located? You need a hand held scanner that plugs into the obd port, don't just plan on replacing the sensor this can be tough to access, have it checked out first. > I'm not sure how to scan for cranking RPMs. > Where is the Crank Sensor located? The box under the coils is an ignition module. Usually when they go bad one coil will have no spark and one will work. Your problem is probably elsewhere. > My Son's 92 Cavalier died. He told me he heard a pop, and the motor > died. [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > > Thanks  SignatureMike Walsh West Palm Beach, Florida, U.S.A. I checked for codes last night, using the flashing service engine light method...All I saw was 12 which means no codes stored. (I did let it flash the 12 3+ times). The Poping sound he heard concerns me...perhaps timeing belt? I don't know if it has a belt or a chain. I would think if it had a chain, it would make noise when trying to turn over the motor. How do I check to see if the belt went? One thing the diagnostic book I have said is to check and see if the injectors are working. It talks about an injector test light, which I don't have. If someone could outline the steps to diagnose this I'd be most grateful. The 2.2 is a pushrod engine with a chain driven camshaft. You can tell if the valve train is working by checking the compression. You could do a visual inspection by removing the valve cover or timing chain cover. If the injectors are working and there is no ignition the spark plugs should be wet with gasoline. If you can confirm that there is no spark and no fuel injection you probably have either a bad computer or bad crankshaft timing sensor. > I checked for codes last night, using the flashing service engine light > method...All I saw was 12 which means no codes stored. (I did let it [quoted text clipped - 13 lines] > If someone could outline the steps to diagnose this I'd be most > grateful. SignatureMike Walsh West Palm Beach, Florida, U.S.A. careful u might bend a good unbent valve doing a compression test if the cahin let loose it is a interference engine > The 2.2 is a pushrod engine with a chain driven camshaft. You can tell if the valve train is working by checking the compression. You could do a visual inspection by removing the valve cover or timing chain cover. > If the injectors are working and there is no ignition the spark plugs should be wet with gasoline. If you can confirm that there is no spark and no fuel injection you probably have either a bad computer or bad crankshaft timing sensor. [quoted text clipped - 20 lines] > Mike Walsh > West Palm Beach, Florida, U.S.A. > My Son's 92 Cavalier died. He told me he heard a pop, and the motor > died. [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > > Thanks if you are sure about nospark such that time coil should be replaced or weak voltage test ohm value of secondary & primary coils the coil value for 1/4 & 2/3 cylenders {are couple acting } must be the same if not one of the coils is partially burnt & do this test for wires note : you must incorporate length of wires in your measures for ohm test note : ignition module can not be seperate from ECM I'm sure that is not ignition module > note : ignition module can not be seperate from ECM Yes it can... > I'm sure that is not ignition module I'm sure that it is. Toyota MDT in MO if iyt cranks over real fast then there is a good chance the timing gears and chain took a dump and it's a common failure > My Son's 92 Cavalier died. He told me he heard a pop, and the motor > died. [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > > Thanks > > My Son's 92 Cavalier died. He told me he heard a pop, and the motor > > died. [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > if iyt cranks over real fast then there is a good chance the timing gears > and chain took a dump and it's a common failure Got nothing to do with it having no spark. Thanks to all who responded so far..... latest update: I ignored advice to not change the crank sensor until I tested it....I broke if off in the motor, and had to remove the oil pan to replace it....I was warned that it may be hard to remove.... THe new crank sensor didn't solve my problem... I have two new coils, a new crank sensor, and still no spark. I have compression, tested by sticking my finger in the plug hole. I found the section in an auto book about testing the ICM. I have battery voltage at the appropriate circut, as well as checking the resistance in the Crank Sensor circut. There is a millivolt test you can do on the circut, but didn't want my son turning over the motor while I was holding leads on the Crank Sensor. I also hooked my test light to one of the injectors and got flashing lights. The ICM is a $130 part, so I'd really like to know if it's bad before I replace it.... Any other ideas ...before I pull out my checkbook ? Thanks, > > > My Son's 92 Cavalier died. He told me he heard a pop, and the motor > > > died. [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] > > > Got nothing to do with it having no spark. > Thanks to all who responded so far..... > latest update: [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] > holding leads on the Crank Sensor. I also hooked my test light to one > of the injectors and got flashing lights. If your injectors are really being operated by the ECM while cranking, then it must be getting a reference signal from the ICM (purple/white wire). Whether it's a good, clean signal or not would be up to a scope to determine. I'm curious how you are determining that you have no spark. In general with GM DIS, if you have injector activity, then your coils should be receiving a control ground as well. On the 2.2 it's a bear to test the individual components and "wiring" between them while on the engine due to their location. But since you have done some parts shotgunning already, and assuming the newly replaced parts are good, it seems to reason that your ICM is bad given that the injectors are getting a signal. It's likely that the control transistor inside the ICM has failed and can't pass enough current to interupt the coil pack secondaries. > The ICM is a $130 part, so I'd really like to know if it's bad before I > replace it.... You could always grab one from a DIY junkyard for cheap or get a used one on ebay if money is tight. Without complete and proper diagnosis, your next step has to be an ICM. Luckily, it's a good bet. Toyota MDT in MO THanks to you all for responding. My experince with these sites, is usually after the first response, you get nothing. I'm checking for spark by sticking a screw driver in the various plug ends and watching while someone turns over the motor. Crude, but it's worked for me in the past. I never did test the plug wires, because they arn't that old, and I doubt they'd all fail at the same time. I should have started at the junk yard with this car, but the autoparts guy was positive it was a $40 coil. Then I found out there are two, and the shotgunning kind of snowballed from there. >On the 2.2 it's a bear to test the >individual components and "wiring" between them while on the engine due >to their location. This is true, I'm crawling under the car on the frozen minnesota tundra, because my garage holds another "car not running" project. > I'm checking for spark by sticking a screw driver in the various plug > ends and watching while someone turns over the motor. Crude, but it's > worked for me in the past. I never did test the plug wires, because > they arn't that old, and I doubt they'd all fail at the same time. You should keep the companion cylinder's plug wire attached while testing the other wire for spark. Each coil fires two plugs. If you test one wire with the other disconnected, you are testing an open circuit. The coil potential can still find a path to ground, but not the way the system was intended to operate. Some people use two of those cheap adjustable spark testers, one in each wire, then they connect the alligator clamps together when testing DIS coil output. > I should have started at the junk yard with this car, but the autoparts > guy was positive it was a $40 coil. Then I found out there are two, > and the shotgunning kind of snowballed from there. He didn't even look at your car, and may not be a particularly sharp diagnostician, otherwise there's a good chance he would be working on cars for a living. Sure, it's a generalization, but it's based on real world observation. He probably suggested that because his store sells alot of coils. Your coil part number fits most GM 4 and 6 cylinders, and has a healthy failure rate, so they are going to sell the hell out of them. Many techs replace good coils when replacing a bad ICM in case the coils had caused the ICM's early demise. > This is true, I'm crawling under the car on the frozen minnesota > tundra, because my garage holds another "car not running" project. Fun! Toyota MDT in MO Good to know about the companion wire. I did not realize that, but I did test em one at a time. I decided to find a cheap spark plug tester(s) after I read your last post. And this eveing I will test the plug wires. The way they wrap around the motor, it's not inconceiveable that they would all melt and short out, but i saw no visible signs of that. I knew better than to trust the kids at the auto parts store...But is was 5:00 Sunday evening, My son needed the car on Monday, and I was running out of options....Now a week later, I'm getting used to getting a ride everywhere. I have just enough mechanical skills to get in way over my head!...and why is it that "the houshold mechanic" loses his ride, when someone elses car breaks down? :-) Well, I'm back to square one. Still no spark, tested by pulling one wire at a time, sticking a screwdriver in it and laying it across the motor. To recap: No engine codes, New Crank Sensor, Used coil/ICM pack. I have compression (tested with my finger in the plug hole). The plugs are wet with gas (I did dry them before trying to start the car). I hooked a test light to one of the Fuel injector leads and it flashed. The junk yard told me they test the ICM/coil packs before putting them on the shelf. I do have battery voltage to the ICM. I havn't tested plug wires for resistance yet. Twice now between swapping parts, it fired a couple of times, and then nothing. Can I hook my test light between the plug and wire as a better test (perhaps for weak spark)? or is too much current generated.? I did do the spark test at night, so I'm pretty sure I have nothing. Would the Brain Box/Computer cause this sort of problem? Perhaps a broken wire somewhere? > Well, I'm back to square one. Still no spark, tested by pulling one > wire at a time, sticking a screwdriver in it and laying it across the [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > > I havn't tested plug wires for resistance yet. Two bad wires, one on each pack, *could* cause limited spark at all four plugs. > Can I hook my test light between the plug and wire as a better test > (perhaps for weak spark)? I wouldn't. Get a spark tester w/ adjustable gap and pigtail wire at the local parts store. They're cheap. > or is too much current generated.? Low current in a coil secondary collapse, but vey high voltage for a few milliseconds per spark event (assuming there are any). A standard test light is designed to work on about 12volts and draw about .25 amps. > I did do the spark test at night, so I'm pretty sure I have nothing. Probably right. > Would the Brain Box/Computer cause this sort of problem? As far as I know, no. It reads RPM info (which we can assume is available if your injectors are getting pulsed) and then sends back modified timing information (EST) to the ICM. The ICM has the capability of firing the coils without ECM input, but in a non-feedback, base timing kind of way. If the ECM detected EST issues, it should set a code 42 (I think it's 42 or 43 anyway). > Perhaps a broken wire somewhere? Yes. Check the ground wire specifically at the ICM. I think it is Black/White, but I'm w/out info at the moment. There are two main power wires to the ICM: B+ (Pink) and ground (Black/White) -- guessing at the colors here. Use a DVOM set to volts, and backprobe the Pink with the positive lead and the B/W with negative. Check for full battery voltage with key on, then have someone crank the engine and see what you have. It should not deviate more than about .4 volts from battery voltage. If you want to isolate one wire (I suggest ground) do this: positive probe on the B/W wire, neg probe on battery ground terminal. Look for a reading of < .3 volts while cranking car. You may want to get some piercing leads. I wouldn't worry too much about wire insulation integrity on a 1992 Cadaver. It's only time before it's going to be too expensive to keep running from a moneywise perspective anyway. Don't forget that if a wire tests good while backprobing or piercing, it doesn't mean that the connector female to male contact is sufficient. You can usually eyeball the connectors and tell if theyre OK, though. Green corrosion = bad. Loose female (tee hee) terminal also = bad. Toyota MDT in MO Finally got back to my little project. I tested the Plug wires, and found one that was suspect... I replaced em all. Battery voltage was 12+ volts at the connection to the ICM. I didn't want to lay under the car and test the voltage while it was being turned over.... I did find (I think) a connector by the injectors that had the same black and pink wire that is hooked to the ICM. I noticed the voltage drop to 8 volts while cranking. I tested one injector again (with the used ICM installed) it flashed my test light. Does the volatge drop mean I have a bad ground when turrning it over? Or is that normal? Perhaps the ground to the ICM is broken while turning the ignition. I guess I may have to crawl under the car and do the test at the actual ICM connection (black and pink wire). When you (Comboverfish) talked about isolating ground, did you mean running a ground wire from the battery to the black wire? I'm having a bit of trouble figureing out which wire in the harness (black & pink) actually runs to the ICM At least the weather here in Minnesota has been warm! Finally got back to my little project. I tested the Plug wires, and found one that was suspect... I replaced em all. Battery voltage was 12+ volts at the connection to the ICM. I didn't want to lay under the car and test the voltage while it was being turned over.... I did find (I think) a connector by the injectors that had the same black and pink wire that is hooked to the ICM. I noticed the voltage drop to 8 volts while cranking. I tested one injector again (with the used ICM installed) it flashed my test light. Does the volatge drop mean I have a bad ground when turrning it over? Or is that normal? Perhaps the ground to the ICM is broken while turning the ignition. I guess I may have to crawl under the car and do the test at the actual ICM connection (black and pink wire). When you (Comboverfish) talked about isolating ground, did you mean running a ground wire from the battery to the black wire? I'm having a bit of trouble figureing out which wire in the harness (black & pink) actually runs to the ICM At least the weather here in Minnesota has been warm! > Battery voltage was 12+ volts at the connection to the ICM. I didn't > want to lay under the car and test the voltage while it was being > turned over.... Like I said, get piercing leads and attach them first, then run extension leads out from under the car and then test -- if you feel the need to get out from underneath. > I did find (I think) a connector by the injectors that had the same > black and pink wire that is hooked to the ICM. I noticed the voltage > drop to 8 volts while cranking. I tested one injector again (with the > used ICM installed) it flashed my test light. You'll save yourself time with a wiring diagram. Go to the library and make copies from the GM factory wiring schematic. If the GM book isn't available, the Mitchell or Motor publications are adequate. If your library is particularly progressive, then they may have service info on CDROM or DVD from one of the above companies. > Does the volatge drop mean I have a bad ground when turrning it over? > Or is that normal? Perhaps the ground to the ICM is broken while > turning the ignition. Voltage drop means the difference in voltage in one circuit when compared to actual system voltage. IE, if you do my first suggested measurment across the two ICM wires, there should be nearly the same voltage there as if you were to measure across the battery terminals. Taking it a little further, let's say you see 8.2 volts there while cranking, and then you test the battery terminals while cranking and see 8.5 volts. That isn't a significant amount of voltage drop. (The voltage in that instance is just plain too low to start a car, so you would want to charge the battery and inspect the battery terminals for tightness and corrosion). Example 2: You read 8.2 volts cranking at the ICM and 10.5 volts at the battery. NOW you have either a power or ground feed issue in the ICM wiring. Example 3: 10.4 volts at the ICM cranking, and 10.5 volts at the battery. No problem with the wiring or battery in this instance. The above is a quick test to see if you are barking up the wrong tree regarding the ICM. If there is a significant voltage drop, then reread what I said about checking the ground side voltage drop with a DVOM. I think I explained it as clearly as I can. Otherwise I can only suggest you get someone to help you that is already familiar with DC voltage diagnosis. If you don't know why you are doing the tests or what to expect, you may misinterpret a poorly executed test (probe not making contact, DVOM set to wrong scale, etc) and run around in circles indefinately. > I guess I may have to crawl under the car and do the test at the actual > ICM connection (black and pink wire). Sounds like what I was saying. See above regarding piercing leads and extensions. > When you (Comboverfish) talked about isolating ground, did you mean > running a ground wire from the battery to the black wire? I'm having a > bit of trouble figureing out which wire in the harness (black & pink) > actually runs to the ICM See above regarding acquiring a quality, accurate wiring diagram. You *could* tie in a ground wire and *see* if that fixes the problem, but that's not what I said. That method will lead you down the path of butchering your car for a lack of understanding. The simple fact is that, despite the difficult location of this set of suspected components, a decent mechanic would have the basic cause of no spark located in under 30 minutes real time. A diagnosis would probably cost about one hour of flat rate. Furthermore, if the mechanic installed a part that he suggested as bad and there *still* was no spark, he would be confident enough in his (proper) diagnosis to exchange the part for another *working* part. It's not uncommon to get bad electrical parts brand new out of the box. I can only imagine that that percentage of failed parts is much higher when buying from the junkyard. Toyota MDT in MO First off Thank you for all the help given. I really do appreciate it. Your explanations have been very clear, I just don't know the terminology. > Like I said, get piercing leads and attach them first, then run > extension leads out from under the car and then test -- if you feel the > need to get out from underneath. I figured out what pierceing leads were, but didn't pick up on attaching them to an extension wire. I thought you meant I could test the circut at the wireing harness. > Voltage drop means the difference in voltage in one circuit when > compared to actual system voltage. I'm virtually positive I'm in the right circut. I do have a wireing diagram as well. I didn't know that to test the voltage drop I had to compare battery voltage drop as well. > Taking it a little further, let's say you see 8.2 volts there while > cranking, and then you test the battery terminals while cranking and [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > cranking, and 10.5 volts at the battery. No problem with the wiring or > battery in this instance. The motor turns over just fine, so I didn't suspect the battery or terminals. I was pretty sure I understood about voltage drop. I just didn't know if it pointed to wireing or the components. I think I'll find example 2 will explain my situation. Then I test which wire is suspect using the prevously mentioned method. > The simple fact is that, despite the difficult location of this set of > suspected components, a decent mechanic would have the basic cause of > no spark located in under 30 minutes real time. Yup I understand a "real mechanic" could find this problem rather quickly. I probalby should have had the car towed in a week ago. Some of the reason is money, some is pride, and more is pure stubbornness. The last time I took a car in for a suspected wireing problem, it was three hours of shop time and no solution. Thanks again for all your help. I tried the volatage test again. I found the battery was bad. Replaced the battery, and still No Spark. I tested the leads to the ICM and (with the new battery) the voltage droped to 10.8 volts while cranking. The battery dropped to 10.8 volts while crankning as well. If I understand correctly, this means the voltage to the ICM is correct. No corosion on the ICM connectors. I suspose that it's possible I have two bad ICM's? would there be a test I could do with one or more of the coils removed? To make sure the ICM is actually getting voltage? I would guess since no spark on any plugs, or at the coils (tested with a spark tester). That no voltage is getting to the coils. > I tried the volatage test again. I found the battery was bad. > Replaced the battery, and still No Spark. [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > while crankning as well. If I understand correctly, this means the > voltage to the ICM is correct. Yes, that shows you that all available voltage is making it to the point where you were testing while under a load (the task of attempting to fire the coils). And 10.8 volts is fine as a system voltage during cranking. > No corosion on the ICM connectors. I suspose that it's possible I have > two bad ICM's? It sure is. > would there be a test I could do with one or more of the coils removed? > To make sure the ICM is actually getting voltage? As I remember, the coils have terminals that mate with the ICM when you secure them into place. If you took off a coil, you could connect a test light across the two exposed terminals on the ICM, then crank the engine and look for the light to flash rapidly. Don't confuse the light 'dimming' with flashing. If it's staying on all of the time and dimming with every compression stroke of the engine, then that indicates a bad ICM. Actual flashing of the test light indicates a good ICM (for the most part). > I would guess since no spark on any plugs, or at the coils (tested with > a spark tester). That no voltage is getting to the coils. What needs to happen is a *break* in voltage at the coil negative terminal for just the right time duration to create a spark. You can test for B+ supply to the coils. One of the two terminals for each coil should have B+. The other terminal for each coil is the negative feed that is triggered off by the ICM when spark is commanded. That is how a functioning ICM is capable of flashing a test light. Toyota MDT in MO I Tested for B+ at the coil terminal. I had B+ volatage. However turning the car over did not flash the test light. The opposite terminal if I understand correctly is an intermitant ground, used to fire the coil. I also tried connecting the test light to battery + to see if the ground terminal ever worked. This didn't flash the light either. So, i know that the ICM is getting volatge. But do I know the ICM is bad if there is No ground (on the other termial)? I think you were saying that the brain box is only used to time the spark. The coil should flash without the brain box connected. Wouldn't the computer need to tell the ICM when to create Ground which would fire the coil? With only two leads into the coil, how does the ICM tell one side or the other of the coil to fire? > I Tested for B+ at the coil terminal. I had B+ volatage. However > turning the car over did not flash the test light. [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] > With only two leads into the coil, how does the ICM tell one side or > the other of the coil to fire? If I explained it again, I would be repeating myself. It sounds like you have a bad ICM again, assuming all of your test results are valid. I think if you reread the last half dozen or so posts it will become clearer. I don't know how else to explain the system any clearer. If I'm missing something, then I do apologize. Toyota MDT in MO Sorry, I have read all the posts several times. I didn't really need to know how two leads into the one coil could fire two seperate plugs from the same coil, I was just curious. You've been more than patient with me and taught me a great many things about diagnosis. If the brain box is truly not needed to generate a spark except for timing. Then the Crank Sensor must tell the ICM when to fire. I will get a new used ICM over lunch, and try it this evening. > Sorry, I have read all the posts several times. I didn't really need to > know how two leads into the one coil could fire two seperate plugs > from the same coil, I was just curious. Each coil fires both of it's wires at the same time. Each of the two coils therefore fire twice as often as needed, but it is really not a significant waste of energy. The cylinder that doesn't need spark is not under compression, and draws very little current from the coil. > You've been more than patient with me and taught me a great many things > about diagnosis. Not a problem. I just can't say anything new at this point. To go further would be for me to physically test the system in person and see if there was anything either of us were overlooking. > If the brain box is truly not needed to generate a spark except for > timing... Well, you definately wouldn't want to drive around on ICM timing alone! It is only used to get the engine running. The ECM sees that the engine is spinning faster than ~ 400 RPMs, *then* it tells the ICM that it must use EST timing info from the ECM to time the coil outputs. If you had said that the car *almost* starts every time you crank it, but doesn't remain running, we might have needed to investigate the bypass and EST wires. Since it isn't producing *any* spark during cranking, I was focusing on that issue. Then the Crank Sensor must tell the ICM when to fire. Yes. Look on your wiring diagram. The crank sensor is wired directly to the ICM. The ICM then sends a square wave reference signal to the ECM so that it knows engine speed also. > I will get a new used ICM over lunch, and try it this evening. Good luck, hope it works out. Toyota MDT in MO >Each coil fires both of it's wires at the same time. thanks for the explanation. It's raining tonight so I didn't get much time to play. I did hook up the new used ICM with the same result, Didn't start. I havn't actually tested if there is spark yet. I could have wet plugs, but I suspect it would have aat least fired. One thing you said earlier is puzzeling... >What needs to happen is a *break* in voltage at the coil negative >terminal for just the right time duration to create a spark. Doesn't a break in voltage mean that the ground goes to open to cause the spark? When I tested ground terminal of the previous ICM it was open (it wouldn't light my test light with the test light on B+) Does the ICM need to be grounded through the motor? I wouldn't think so since both B+ and a ground are supplied. > It's raining tonight so I didn't get much time to play. > I did hook up the new used ICM with the same result, Didn't start. I > havn't actually tested if there is spark yet. I could have wet plugs, > but I suspect it would have aat least fired. That sucks. I tend to think at this point that I'm missing something. I will think more about it because this has me curious. > One thing you said earlier is puzzeling... > > >What needs to happen is a *break* in voltage at the coil negative > >terminal for just the right time duration to create a spark. The ICM sends ground to the coil until it needs it to create spark -- at that point it cuts ground momentarily and the coil induces that stored energy from it's primary winding into it's secondary winding which results in a spark at the sparkplug. > When I tested ground terminal of the previous ICM it was open (it > wouldn't light my test light with the test light on B+) It's possible that the coil negative terminals are supposed to be open until the point where the engine is being cranked / run. I would have to 'reverse engineer' the system with an oscilloscope to figure out details like that. I don't have any factory GM literature on the basic operational strategy of the system. > Does the ICM need to be grounded through the motor? I wouldn't think > so since both B+ and a ground are supplied. No, but the ICM case may be grounded for one reason or another anyway. The supply ground is where the internal electronics get their ground path, if you look at the schematical sketches drawn inside the ICM in the wiring diagram. (at least on my diagram - it's a Mitchell) Toyota MDT in MO > It's raining tonight so I didn't get much time to play. > I did hook up the new used ICM with the same result, Didn't start. I > havn't actually tested if there is spark yet. I could have wet plugs, > but I suspect it would have aat least fired. I emailed a regular R.A.T. poster who is extremely knowledgable about domestics and has GM dealer experience. He told me that, despite my schematic which clearly shows the Black/White wire supplying ground to every function inside the ICM, he is certain that they get ground through the ICM case to the block. IOW, he is sure that my wiring diagram is inaccurate on that count. You weren't testing for spark with the ICM unbolted or otherwise off the engine, were you? He told me he has fixed a couple no starts by sanding the rust and corrosion off of the engine block and the ICM mating surfaces on GM DIS systems just like yours. I would try that suggestion before going any further. Toyota MDT in MO Happy days! The beast is running! I crawled under it to remove the ICM and clean up the contacts, only to discover I had installed the original ICM instead of the new used one. It was dark, and slight rain, but I wanted to at least try the new used coil. I grabbed the wrong one. That's my excuse. I did sand the contact areas on the ICM and block before I tried again today. I have learned many things through this ordeal. 3 month old plug wires aren't necessarily good. The same goes for a 3 month old battery. I now know how to test if a battery has enough output even if if turns over the motor easily. Never assume you know what's wrong when you are diagnosing (I should have found the bad plug wire with one of the first tests). Don't replace parts without finding out they are bad first...I knew this one but the ASSuming deal convinced me I was right. To recap: 1bad plug wire; 1 bad battery; two bad ICM's I am indebted to you comboverfish. Thank you for your patience, and shareing your knowledge. I feel like I just completed a school mini-couse. Hans I > Happy days! The beast is running! > [quoted text clipped - 23 lines] > > Hans Glad to hear it! In all fairness to the battery, it may have just needed a complete and proper charge. Most 3 month old batteries, regardless of how cheap, are still in working order. Happy motoring. Toyota MDT in MO |
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