How do I store tires/tyres for a very long time???

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Lucas Jensen - 19 May 2004 07:09 GMT

I have some new, unused tires which recently went out of production.
Because they are so damn good I want to store them so that I can use
them in future.

The problem with rubber seems to be the fact that the softening agent
evaporates with time and makes the tire more hard and brittle. So how
can I prevent that from happening?

So far I have heard about the following solutions:

1. Put each tire in a polyethylene plastic bag and weld it so it
becomes air tight. Personally I know that polyethylene is not 100% air
tight itself as it lets air diffuse through the material very slowly
with time. The reason for this solution is to stop the evaporation of
softening agent so one gets an over saturated atmosphere within the
bag blocking for further evaporation. I don't know, but introducing a
vacuum in the bag might accelerate the evaporation and an over
pressure might maybe decelerate the evaporation. Any explanations?

2. Put all the tires in a box filled with talcum.

3. Coat every tire with silicone (using a silicone spray) and let them
hang from the ceiling fixed at only two points keeping the tire
completely circular.

Of course, all rubber should be stored cool, dry and dark (preferably
in a basement).

Anyone with hands-on suggestions, experience etc etc??

regards lucas

PS: Suggestions using liquid nitrogen does not apply :-)

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Larry xlax Lovisone - 19 May 2004 07:32 GMT

> Anyone with hands-on suggestions, experience etc etc??

I keep my sets of Rennsports stash in a cool dry place away from sun
light cocooned in clear plastic wrap... they will last 6 years from the
date of manufacture in this condition according to Metzeler...
http://www.fox302.com/index.pl?s=vf&user=netters2&category=ShopPics&file=Rennspo
rtsStash.JPG

Larry L
94 RC45 #2
Have a wheelie NICE day...
Lean & Mean it in every corner of your life...
If it wasn't for us the fast lane would rust...
V4'S are music to the seat of my pants...
1952 De Havilland Chipmunk...
Yank and bank your brains loose...
http://members.ebay.com/aboutme/-xlax-/
http://home.comcast.net/~netters2/
http://www.fox302.com/index.pl?s=vg&user=netters2

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Morten Becker-Eriksen - 19 May 2004 09:55 GMT

> > Anyone with hands-on suggestions, experience etc etc??
>
> I keep my sets of Rennsports stash in a cool dry place away from sun
> light cocooned in clear plastic wrap... they will last 6 years from the
> date of manufacture in this condition according to Metzeler...

I believe it was Metzler/Pirelli who did a test on some stored race tires.
3-4 years old. After the first two laps of scrubbing in there were no
difference in grip campared to fresh tires to be found. Don't know how they
compared as new rubber have different compound and construction but anyway,
that was the conclusion.

/MBE

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Hank Barta - 19 May 2004 16:50 GMT

In rec.motorcycles Lucas Jensen <lucasjensen@yahoo.dk> wrote:

> The problem with rubber seems to be the fact that the softening agent
> evaporates with time and makes the tire more hard and brittle. So how
> can I prevent that from happening?

I have never heard this before. That does not mean it is not true
;) but I would like to learn more about this. What I have heard
is that the rubber hardens due to cross linking of the carbon
chains. This results from heat cycling of the rubber compound. In
fact, for competition oriented street tires, an initial heat
cycling is recommended to prepare the tires for further use.
(http://www.tirerack.com/tires/tiretech/competition/heatcycletech.jsp)

Bad things for storage would be heat and sunlight that can attack
rubber along with ozone from electric motors. Moisture is probably
not good either. If you could seal them in something that would be air
tight (oxygen tight?), dry and dark you would probably maximize shelf
light. But my guess is that the same reactions that are described
in heat cycling would still take place at room temperature. If you
store the tires long enough, they would still deteriorate. But I
have no idea how long that would be.

OTOH, since tire and rubber technology are improving, it seems
unlikely that there will not be something better available down the
road (no pun intended. ;)

Signature

Hank Barta
'95 K75RT "BABY K"
beautiful sunny Winfield, Illinois

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Rick Cortese - 19 May 2004 17:38 GMT

> In rec.motorcycles Lucas Jensen <lucasjensen@yahoo.dk> wrote:
>
[quoted text clipped - 9 lines]
> cycling is recommended to prepare the tires for further use.
> (http://www.tirerack.com/tires/tiretech/competition/heatcycletech.jsp)

I worked as a chemist with several people that came out of the tire
industry, so hearsay more then direct knowledge about what they do in
the tire industry.

The proper term for 'softening' agents is "plastisizer" if you want to
look them up in a google search.

The term they used for plastisizers migrating to the surface of a tire
is "blooming" but anywhere other then the tire industry it would be
probably be defusion.

The hearsay part:

Often componets of tires are based on $$$ vs. best performance. You may
end up with a plastisizer or other componet that isn't as compatible as
it could be, isn't soluble in the rubber/migrates to the surface fast,
because it is cheaper. Thinking is it only has to last for the life of
the tire instead of being put in a catacomb somewhere to be used after
the next ice age.

There are UV stabilizers and anitoxidants in tire rubber that are
incompatible with tire rubber and are intended to migrate to the surface
where they do the most good.

Q.C. on tires isn't what it could be. Examples given were ~you specify a
20 minute cure time in the mold, mold operator goes to lunch and leaves
the tire in for an hour which results in a hard/brittle tire. Most line
supervisors have a production quota to meet, so you may see that 20
minute cure slip to 18 minutes.

IMO: The sealed plastic bag you guys are talking about for storage is
spot on: Keeps out UV and ozone. The tire surface and air inside the bag
should become saturated with the chemicals which will slow down further
migration out of the rubber.

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Hank Barta - 19 May 2004 23:08 GMT

In rec.motorcycles Rick Cortese <ricortes@earthlink.net> wrote:

> I worked as a chemist with several people that came out of the tire
> industry, so hearsay more then direct knowledge about what they do in
> the tire industry.

I suppose that's all we'd get since the details would likely be
jealously guarded secrets. Nevertheless, the info you provided makes
a lot of sense and sounds like the truth.

Won't that get you banned from Reeky? ;)

thanks,
hank

Signature

Hank Barta
'95 K75RT "BABY K"
beautiful sunny Winfield, Illinois

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Daniel J. Stern - 19 May 2004 23:39 GMT

> The proper term for 'softening' agents is "plastisizer" if you want to
> look them up in a google search.

And the correct spelling of the term is "plasticizer" in the US,
"plasticiser" everywhere else, if you want to look them up in a Google
search and actually get results.

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John Ings - 21 May 2004 03:58 GMT

>IMO: The sealed plastic bag you guys are talking about for storage is
>spot on: Keeps out UV and ozone. The tire surface and air inside the bag
>should become saturated with the chemicals which will slow down further
>migration out of the rubber.

Herewith a war story:

A friend of mine removed all six tires and wheels from his 50 X 12
mobile home and stored them underneath the back of the home which
overhung the bank of a small creek. All six were shielded from direct
sunlight by the trailer siding. When he went to retrieve them four
years later to move the mobile home, the bottommost wheel was found to
be completely immersed in the mud and water of the creek bank because
of the weight of the other wheels on top.

When he replaced the wheels and towed the trailer over a couple of
thousand miles, five tires blew out and had to be replaced at one time
or another during the trip. The only tire that didn't blow out? You
guessed it... the one that was sunk in the mud.

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Dirk G. Straka - 21 May 2004 08:34 GMT

Hi John,

thus spoke John Ings:
[...]

> When he replaced the wheels and towed the trailer over a
> couple of thousand miles, five tires blew out and had to
> be replaced at one time or another during the trip. The
> only tire that didn't blow out? You guessed it... the one
> that was sunk in the mud.

IOW: Bury them at the slue of the river. *hugh* I've spoken.

Greets, Chotfin - chief of the flatfoot indians

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Rex B - 19 May 2004 21:13 GMT

||I have some new, unused tires which recently went out of production.
||Because they are so damn good I want to store them so that I can use
[quoted text clipped - 29 lines]
||
||PS: Suggestions using liquid nitrogen does not apply :-)

HD trash bags, tied shut, stored in dark, cool dry place.
Anything more has a steeply diminishing return. That is, just the above will
give you 95% of the perfect result, the other 5% would not be detectable without
precision equipment (driver, car, and tming equipment).

Texas Parts Guy

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Charlie Gary - 20 May 2004 00:31 GMT

<<Snip>>

> 3. Coat every tire with silicone (using a silicone spray) and let them
> hang from the ceiling fixed at only two points keeping the tire
> completely circular.

Whatever you do, don't do this. Some rubbers are softened by silicone.
Besides, how much fun would it be to ride on tires lubed up with silicone?
Could be fun getting the bead to stick to the rim when you air it up.

Signature

Later,

Charlie

Fix the e-mail address and it will get to me

There are about 100 different sorts of insects in Mexico that some people
eat on purpose.

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Charles Soto - 20 May 2004 00:46 GMT

With a rope. Hung on a tree. Lots of fun for kiddoes!

Charles

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Margaret M. - 21 May 2004 09:28 GMT

> With a rope. Hung on a tree. Lots of fun for kiddoes!

Best answer I've ever seen on Reeky!
Kudos, Charles.
Mag

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