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Car Forum / Driving, Maintenance, Tuning / General Car Topics / June 2008spark plug in oil pan drain instead of bolt
Hi, My car had been leaking oil, and when I had it checked the guy drained the remaining oil, and then found that that the threading in the hole in the oil pan, where the oil drains out, had been partially stripped. The bolt was loose due to this, which is what had been causing the oil to leak. He couldn't find a long enough bolt that would reach the remaining threading, but instead found a spark plug that was the same size and had the same threading, and put it into the oil pan hole. This was necessary so that the oil could be replaced, but it seems dangerous to be driving around with the spark plug gap exposed to the oil in the oil pan, so I intend to get a longer bolt that will catch the remaining threading ASAP. Your thoughts about how dangerous the situation is? On Thu, 5 Jun 2008 14:19:26 -0700 (PDT), against all advice, something compelled "albert.mills@googlemail.com" <albert.mills@googlemail.com>, to say: > Hi, > [quoted text clipped - 14 lines] > > Your thoughts about how dangerous the situation is? Not at all, unless you think the plug will dislodge and let all the oil out. You don't think the plug is going to start sparking, do you?  SignatureLife is too short to play cheap guitars. > On Thu, 5 Jun 2008 14:19:26 -0700 (PDT), against all advice, > something compelled "albert.mills@googlemail.com" [quoted text clipped - 22 lines] > the oil out. You don't think the plug is going to start > sparking, do you? I hope he hasn't connected it to anything! :-D | Cheers, | | Andy. | | Improve Usenet: Killfile Google Groups | | http://improve-usenet.org/ | > Hi, > [quoted text clipped - 14 lines] > > Your thoughts about how dangerous the situation is? Go to a good parts store and buy a longer bolt to fit the drain. No real danger as far as the plug UNLESS the insulator gets hit and breaks off the ceramic and causes it to leak all the oil out. Now if you had connected the plug to the ignition...... SignatureSteve W. >> Hi, >> [quoted text clipped - 20 lines] > >Now if you had connected the plug to the ignition...... On the 4th of July, connect an ignition wire to the plug and your car will be part of the fireworks show. On a serious note, I would retap the hole and get an oversize plug. Or replace the oil pan. That sure beats having your oil drain and wrecking your engine. Going from SAE to METRIC (or vice versa) might allow the rethreading and not exceed the hole size greatly. >My car had been leaking oil, and when I had it checked the guy drained >the remaining oil, and then found that that the threading in the hole [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] > >Your thoughts about how dangerous the situation is? Just fix the damn thing. Drill and thread it for a larger bolt, or put a helicoil in it. It's an easy job, and the guy should have done it properly in the first place. The gap is not harmful... it's submerged in oil anyway. The problem is that the ceramic insulator will break and all your oil will run out on the highway. Which quick oil change place goobered the threads up anyway? --scott Signature"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis." Auto parts stores have replacement drain plugs. FYI: They also have drain plugs that are "over sized", "double" and "triple" over sized. They are usually marked with an O for over sized. OO for double over sized. OOO for triple over sized. On the end, they are the shape of a thread tap. No drilling, tapping, or helicoil as some one suggested. They also have a rubber plug with an installation/removal tool. As a last resort and depending on the car, some oil pans aren't to bad to R&R. If the ceramic on the plug gets dinged by a tossed rock from one of your tires, it can easily shatter letting all the oil out, killing your engine before you notice usually... I used to work in garages and they 'all' carried the self threading oversized oil plugs just for oil pans like yours, there is no way the boss would have let a jury rig like a spark plug in the hole go out the door, if we were out of stock a fast delivery would be arranged for the proper part. Mike 86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00 'New' frame in the works for '08. Some Canadian Bush Trip and Build Photos: http://mikeromainjeeptrips.shutterfly.com > Hi, > [quoted text clipped - 14 lines] > > Your thoughts about how dangerous the situation is? > If the ceramic on the plug gets dinged by a tossed rock from one of your > tires, it can easily shatter letting all the oil out, killing your > engine before you notice usually... at least use one of the shorty plugs. http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/2/21/67d2scd.jpg > > Your thoughts about how dangerous the situation is? To echo earlier statements, oversize self tapping drain plugs are available at NAPA. Have a reputable shop install it, as a good tech will be able to do it without leaving metal chips in the oil. Good luck, Ben > If the ceramic on the plug gets dinged by a tossed rock from one of your > tires, it can easily shatter letting all the oil out, killing your > engine before you notice usually... You have obviously never tried to get the ceramic out of the part that is encased in metal it is not as easy as you might imagine. He could break off the part of the ceramic that sticks out and the rest would probably last forever. They are designed to hold a lot more pressure than a little bit of oil pressing against it. -jim > I used to work in garages and they 'all' carried the self threading > oversized oil plugs just for oil pans like yours, there is no way the [quoted text clipped - 25 lines] > > > > Your thoughts about how dangerous the situation is? ----== Posted via Pronews.Com - Unlimited-Unrestricted-Secure Usenet News==---- http://www.pronews.com The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! >100,000 Newsgroups ---= - Total Privacy via Encryption =--- >> If the ceramic on the plug gets dinged by a tossed rock from one of your >> tires, it can easily shatter letting all the oil out, killing your [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > bit of oil pressing against it. > -jim You have obviously not had many engines towed to you for a head removal because the owner snapped the ceramic while installing his own plugs, allowing the center to fall into the piston area. Mike 86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00 'New' frame in the works for '08. Some Canadian Bush Trip and Build Photos: http://mikeromainjeeptrips.shutterfly.com > allowing the center to fall into the piston area. New name for cylinder? ;) >> allowing the center to fall into the piston area. > > New name for cylinder? ;) LOL, well it is a piston area when something is in the way of the piston movement I guess, cylinder implied a void, like a cylinder in a block.... Sounded right at the time anyway. ;-) Mike 86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00 'New' frame in the works for '08. Some Canadian Bush Trip and Build Photos: http://mikeromainjeeptrips.shutterfly.com > >> allowing the center to fall into the piston area. > [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > > Sounded right at the time anyway. ;-) Sorry, couldn't help it................ >You have obviously not had many engines towed to you for a head removal >because the owner snapped the ceramic while installing his own plugs, >allowing the center to fall into the piston area. > >Mike You just make that one up? I've broken all kinds of spark plugs over the years and not one bit fell through into a combustion chamber. And I'm a professional - it happens. I'd be more concerned with the outward ceramic breaking off and shattering the inside part and then having a leak through cracked ceraminc. All this assumes the original poster isn't messing with all of you with something as dumb as this. P On Jun 6, 5:15 pm, cse...@mts.net wrote: > >You have obviously not had many engines towed to you for a head removal > >because the owner snapped the ceramic while installing his own plugs, [quoted text clipped - 14 lines] > > P I've seen a plug blow a center electrode OUT of the ceramic. >> You have obviously not had many engines towed to you for a head removal >> because the owner snapped the ceramic while installing his own plugs, [quoted text clipped - 14 lines] > > P Not at all, I guess folks I know are better klutzes than you. I am only talking 4 or 5 since the 60's, but still.... There was a thread in this group (rec.autos.tech) in the last year or two about one snapping and the core falling into a V8. He could use an easy out easy on it, but had to pull it apart to get the ceramic core. You have a point about the troll, but man I have seen and done some wicked jury rigs sometimes to get home.... Mike 86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00 'New' frame in the works for '08. Some Canadian Bush Trip and Build Photos: http://mikeromainjeeptrips.shutterfly.com > You have a point about the troll, but man I have seen and done some > wicked jury rigs sometimes to get home.... I think my "finest" was the night I was out on my paper route (300-ish papers, delivered over roughly the same number of road-miles, even though I never got more than a hundred miles from home in a straight line) The PCV hose that normally attaches to the top of the valve cover came adrift partway through the run one night. Not sure of how or why, only that it did. (Here's where I reconstruct as best I can guess) This resulted in a light spritz of oil out the open hole - where it impacted the bottom of the air cleaner, collected enough to drizzle down the horn of the air cleaner, and finally drip onto the exhaust manifold - directly under the comb that held the plug wires. Predictably, an under-hood fire resulted. And was discovered when said fire ignited the spark plug wires, causing the engine to cease running. At that point, I was stranded probably 6 miles from the nearest habitation, in the middle of the night, in "no service" land, with all four plug wires burned through. Things look rough for our "hero", don't they? Right about now is when the voiceover saying "Tune in next week for another chapter of our exciting tale, same bat-time, same bat-channel" should kick in, I'm thinkin'! :) Ahhh, but Don carries (among other things) a wad of honest-to-god-came-off-a-hay-bale baling wire in the trunk (intended to wire up exhaust system if one of the many car-swallowing potholes on the route gets a lucky bite), and several chunks of baling twine, and a roll of duct tape reside in the floorboards of the back seat. And he has more than a passing familiarity with elecricity... After some cutting and cobbling, I managed to finish the route and get downtown to the parts store - With baling wire chunks as conductors, supported away from the various under-hood metalwork by roadside twigs lashed together with baling twine and duct tape. I don't ever want to have to do it again, but at least I know it's possible! :) SignatureDon Bruder - dakidd@sonic.net - If your "From:" address isn't on my whitelist, or the subject of the message doesn't contain the exact text "PopperAndShadow" somewhere, any message sent to this address will go in the garbage without my ever knowing it arrived. Sorry... <http://www.sonic.net/~dakidd> for more info > >> You have obviously not had many engines towed to you for a head removal > >> because the owner snapped the ceramic while installing his own plugs, [quoted text clipped - 21 lines] > two about one snapping and the core falling into a V8. He could use an > easy out easy on it, but had to pull it apart to get the ceramic core. Well if he had to use an easy out then obviously he twisted the metal part of the spark right in two. When that happens I can believe the ceramic pieces might fall into the engine. But if the OP were to just break off the external ceramic part then the rest of the ceramic aint going nowhere. And he won't need an easy out to remove it either. > You have a point about the troll, but man I have seen and done some > wicked jury rigs sometimes to get home.... [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > 'New' frame in the works for '08. Some Canadian Bush Trip and Build > Photos: http://mikeromainjeeptrips.shutterfly.com ----== Posted via Pronews.Com - Unlimited-Unrestricted-Secure Usenet News==---- http://www.pronews.com The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! >100,000 Newsgroups ---= - Total Privacy via Encryption =--- >>>> You have obviously not had many engines towed to you for a head removal >>>> because the owner snapped the ceramic while installing his own plugs, [quoted text clipped - 26 lines] > the external ceramic part then the rest of the ceramic aint going nowhere. > And he won't need an easy out to remove it either. You are talking to an offroader here, I 'know' how hard those rocks that get tossed by the tires when driving on gravel roads, hit things. That twangggg noise by the ear is real unnerving as a rock takes a chunk out of a roll bar or punches through my 'glass fender top, even though the fender is rubber under coated. I learned way back to keep my elbow 'inside' the window opening also.... And ceramic shatters.... Anyhow, I am sure the OP has it figured that some of us think it is a no no to use a spark plug for a drain plug. >> You have a point about the troll, but man I have seen and done some >> wicked jury rigs sometimes to get home.... [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > http://www.pronews.com The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! >100,000 Newsgroups > ---= - Total Privacy via Encryption =--- > You are talking to an offroader here, I 'know' how hard those rocks that > get tossed by the tires when driving on gravel roads, hit things. That [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > > I learned way back to keep my elbow 'inside' the window opening also.... So your point is what? Doesn't sound like any of that would gain you any particularly useful knowledge regarding how difficult it is to break the ceramic part of a spark plug that is surrounded by metal. > And ceramic shatters.... The part of the ceramic encased in steel doesn't shatter easily. If you were to crawl under the OP's car with a hammer and small chisel you would find that it is easier to punch a hole in the oil pan than shatter the ceramic inside the plug. -jim > Anyhow, I am sure the OP has it figured that some of us think it is a no > no to use a spark plug for a drain plug. [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > > http://www.pronews.com The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! >100,000 Newsgroups > > ---= - Total Privacy via Encryption =--- ----== Posted via Pronews.Com - Unlimited-Unrestricted-Secure Usenet News==---- http://www.pronews.com The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! >100,000 Newsgroups ---= - Total Privacy via Encryption =--- >> You are talking to an offroader here, I 'know' how hard those rocks that >> get tossed by the tires when driving on gravel roads, hit things. That [quoted text clipped - 16 lines] > > -jim LOL! Ya right, tell that to all the folks that have snapped them off with spark plug wrenches! Man you are too much. So the long and the short of it is 'You' would do this repair and think it was safe right? Mike >> Anyhow, I am sure the OP has it figured that some of us think it is a no >> no to use a spark plug for a drain plug. [quoted text clipped - 14 lines] > http://www.pronews.com The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! >100,000 Newsgroups > ---= - Total Privacy via Encryption =--- > >> You are talking to an offroader here, I 'know' how hard those rocks that > >> get tossed by the tires when driving on gravel roads, hit things. That [quoted text clipped - 19 lines] > LOL! Ya right, tell that to all the folks that have snapped them off > with spark plug wrenches! Man you are too much. Anyone who has done that knows that makes the spark plug useless but doesn't cause a leak. I'm beginning to doubt you have ever even seen a sparkpug. The part that extends from the metal casing is easy to break. Break off all your spark plugs in your engine and you won't create a compression leak because the part encased in metal will still be intact. > So the long and the short of it is 'You' would do this repair and think > it was safe right? I said what I said. You claimed rocks or something would break the porcelain and create a leak. I said you obviously never attempted breaking the part of the ceramic inside a spark plug to intentionally break the seal. -jim > Mike > > [quoted text clipped - 16 lines] > > http://www.pronews.com The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! >100,000 Newsgroups > > ---= - Total Privacy via Encryption =--- ----== Posted via Pronews.Com - Unlimited-Unrestricted-Secure Usenet News==---- http://www.pronews.com The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! >100,000 Newsgroups ---= - Total Privacy via Encryption =--- |
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