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Car Forum / Chevrolet / Chevrolet Corvette / April 2006How NOT to sell a used car
If you were competing with Vette sellers from all over the country, would you photograph your car sitting amid melting snow? http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/2003-Chevrolet-Corvette-Z06-50th-Anniversary-Ed_W 0QQitemZ4627149423QQcategoryZ6168QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem Yes, I've been window shopping again.  SignatureAngelo > If you were competing with Vette sellers from all over the country, would > you photograph your car sitting amid melting snow? > > http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/2003-Chevrolet-Corvette-Z06-50th-Anniversary-Ed_W 0QQitemZ4627149423QQcategoryZ6168QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem > > Yes, I've been window shopping again. Somehow your point escapes me, most people know there is snow in Minnesota. My guess it that there are also Corvette buyers there even when it snows, has snowed, and/or will snow. Dad >If you were competing with Vette sellers from all over the country, would >you photograph your car sitting amid melting snow? > >http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/2003-Chevrolet-Corvette-Z06-50th-Anniversary-Ed_W 0QQitemZ4627149423QQcategoryZ6168QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem > >Yes, I've been window shopping again. More of a mystery, what does THIS mean: Will sell to Worldwide only. -- lab~rat >:-) Do you want polite or do you want sincere? > If you were competing with Vette sellers from all over the country, > would you photograph your car sitting amid melting snow? If he doesn't want to wait til summer to sell it he doesn't have much choice in Minnesota! >> If you were competing with Vette sellers from all over the country, >> would you photograph your car sitting amid melting snow? > > If he doesn't want to wait til summer to sell it he doesn't have much > choice in Minnesota! I realize they HAVE snow. I meant, photographing it in that setting reminds prospective buyers of the salt & crap that makes it melt. I doubt if I'd have anything but a beater out of the garage during the slush & corrosion season... SignatureAngelo > If you were competing with Vette sellers from all over the country, would > you photograph your car sitting amid melting snow? [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > -- > Angelo Yes I would. It is always adviseable to provide pictures of the car you are trying to sell. Are you suggesting that it would be better to list the car for sale, without pictures, when there is snow on the ground????? >> If you were competing with Vette sellers from all over the country, >> would [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > the car for sale, without pictures, when there is snow on the > ground????? Nooo...just that I'd take the pictures in a spot, or from an angle, that doesn't emphasize the snowmelt. Some people never let their Vettes get rained on. I'm not that extreme, but I think a Z06 deserves to be kept away from slush, gravel and road salt. Just as I wouldn't buy Vettes with nitrous systems or aftermarket wings, I would only consider a Rust Belt car that was put away (properly) for the duration of crappy weather. I lived in an area that only got snow one or two days a year when I had my C4, but I still used a "daily driver' all winter. If I were selling a used stove, I'd clean the oven and take the dirty pots & pans off the burners before snapping the pics That wouldn't be false advertising, just common-sense marketing. That's all I meant. OK? SignatureAngelo > If I were selling a used stove, I'd clean the oven and take the dirty pots > & pans off the burners before snapping the pics That wouldn't be false [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > -- > Angelo The "stove" looked pretty clean to me. And I expect snow in the winter. > Nooo...just that I'd take the pictures in a spot, or from an angle, that > doesn't emphasize the snowmelt. Some people never let their Vettes get > rained on. I'm not that extreme, but I think a Z06 deserves to be kept > away from slush, gravel and road salt. Why? > Just as I wouldn't buy Vettes with nitrous systems or aftermarket wings, I > would only consider a Rust Belt car that was put away (properly) for the > duration of crappy weather. I lived in an area that only got snow one or > two days a year when I had my C4, but I still used a "daily driver' all > winter. You can tell a Z06 that has had nitrous on it? You're a better man than I if you can look at a car or have a seller tell you it was stored properly and know it's true. > If I were selling a used stove, I'd clean the oven and take the dirty pots > & pans off the burners before snapping the pics That wouldn't be false > advertising, just common-sense marketing. You don't clean up after yourself until you get ready to sell it???? > That's all I meant. OK? Looks like we need to add rule number 76 to that list, "Don't buy a Corvette that has had it's picture taken by a snow bank". Just yanking your chain, I don't hold that kind of reverence to any object, least of all a car. They were made to enjoy driving, not just to be stored properly. None of the Corvettes I've owned were garage queens and some have been in some pretty bad snow storms. Why would anybody pay that kind of money to let it set and not enjoy driving it just so someone else can after its sold????? If I want to look at something beautiful I go to the mall and watch all of those bare midriffs that should be stored properly. You've touched on a subject that will never be answered. Some will drive them, some will just own them, others will beat hell out of them, still others will bring them back to life because to all of them they are a Corvette. Dad >> Nooo...just that I'd take the pictures in a spot, or from an angle, that >> doesn't emphasize the snowmelt. Some people never let their Vettes get >> rained on. I'm not that extreme, but I think a Z06 deserves to be kept >> away from slush, gravel and road salt. > > Why? Rust (unless you like detailing after every time you drive in the slop), chipped paint (unless you go for bras/touch-up paint), and glop getting sucked into all those cooling ducts and grilles. >> Just as I wouldn't buy Vettes with nitrous systems or aftermarket >> wings, I [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > > You can tell a Z06 that has had nitrous on it? Referring there to racing mods that are in the ads. Would only buy a stock engine. > You're a better man than I if > you can look at a car or have a seller tell you it was stored properly > and > know it's true. If a very-low-miles car runs great, has no leaks and no dried-out rubber bits, I conclude it's been put away properly. >> If I were selling a used stove, I'd clean the oven and take the dirty >> pots >> & pans off the burners before snapping the pics That wouldn't be false >> advertising, just common-sense marketing. > > You don't clean up after yourself until you get ready to sell it???? That WAS a poor example. Maybe I should have said "If I were selling an abused mule, I wouldn't photograph it next to the stick I beat it with." >> That's all I meant. OK? > [quoted text clipped - 17 lines] > and > watch all of those bare midriffs that should be stored properly. point taken > You've touched on a subject that will never be answered. Some will drive > them, some will just own them, others will beat hell out of them, still > others will bring them back to life because to all of them they are a > Corvette. > > Dad SignatureUsing Opera's revolutionary e-mail client: http://www.opera.com/mail/ ROFL.... See inline comments. >>> Nooo...just that I'd take the pictures in a spot, or from an angle, that >>> doesn't emphasize the snowmelt. Some people never let their Vettes get [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > chipped paint (unless you go for bras/touch-up paint), and glop getting > sucked into all those cooling ducts and grilles. If you look at the pictures, you see a clean car, clean interior, no mud, slush, water spray behind the wheels, not mud, slush, dirt on the carpets, and so on. The car is right in front of the garage door and there is a Ford Explorer or F150 in the drive. In 3 years, there has been 8013 miles put on, or least than 3000 per year. A car like this, I could put 8000 a year on and never hit snow. So to me, it says he drives it little, it is not a daily driver, odds are he does not drive in snow normally (hard to be never - service, maintenance, caught out, etc.), and your fears are unfounded. Rust. Grossly over-rated. Yes, we see C2 and C3 Corvettes with rusted out frames. But it isn't a huge percentage, maybe 25% or less. And that may be grossly over-estimating. But these cars are 30 and 40 years old! In their initial years, they were driven as daily drivers, often as the only car. After all, they were just a car. Salt on the roads in winter was a lot more intense, because no one knew or cared about environmental impact at the time. Today, a car like this is the second, third, or fourth car. It may be a daily driver, but usually only in good weather. They are frequently toys, taken out only on good days. Yes, it could rust out. Will you still have it in 20 years when it does? >>> Just as I wouldn't buy Vettes with nitrous systems or aftermarket >>> wings, I [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > Referring there to racing mods that are in the ads. Would only buy a stock > engine. To each his own. Some will only buy an automatic, others only a manual. Some only a one-owner, others don't care. Some only a red or blue car, others only a black, with still others a silver. That is one reason they make so many varieties of cars, so you can buy the kind you want. Are you saying that people should only advertise the kind you want, and if it isn't, they are not allowed to advertise? >> You're a better man than I if >> you can look at a car or have a seller tell you it was stored properly [quoted text clipped - 11 lines] > That WAS a poor example. Maybe I should have said "If I were selling an > abused mule, I wouldn't photograph it next to the stick I beat it with." This implies fraud. Are you suggesting the seller is selling an abused, snow-driven, salt-eaten, rust-bucket car and trying to prevent it is mint? I don't see that in this ad. I see a typical winter driveway with snow melting on the drive where it has been cleared, and a Corvette that has been pulled out of the garage to be photographed for an eBay ad. > ROFL.... > > See inline comments. Snipped most of what we already know. >>> You don't clean up after yourself until you get ready to sell it???? >> That WAS a poor example. Maybe I should have said "If I were selling an [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > been > pulled out of the garage to be photographed for an eBay ad. When I traded in my '98 I removed all the mods, about $3,500 worth. The guy that bought it always liked mine and thought he was getting one that was untouched. When he found out it was mine I sold him all of the mods and helped him put them back on. In other words he bought the stick I beat it with. So much for knowing if a car has been changed or raced because he watched me do it for 5 years. Now about that stored properly, I stored a '51 Chevy by driving it into an empty chicken coupe and removing the battery. Three years later I returned with a battery, pulled the choke out, pumped it and started it up with no problem. My only hitch was the clutch was stuck fast to the flywheel which broke loose about half way home, had to start it in gear and shift without the clutch. By the way it was on a dairy farm well populated with fast, furry, feline mouse traps. Drove it home 40 miles and then drained the oil and half the gas and started taking it to the car shows and parades. Car is still in a private collection and has a whopping 30,000 on it, never been repainted. On top of that it is a rust belt car, Ohio and Michigan, before the advent of precoated steel. The first owner lived in town and seldom drove it and when he did he cleaned it top to bottom. I'm still glad I'm not buying a mule from the rust belt, especially an abused one. What was the stick for??? Dad >> ROFL.... >> [quoted text clipped - 37 lines] > > Dad I think it's an attention-gitter. (but you knew that already.) Now, since I answered your question, here's one for you. Once and awhile, just for chuckles, I go and RTFB. Low and behold here's a warning that says not to start the car by pushing it or bulling it, lest ugly things happen to the CATconvertor. Warning for the C4 is very specific. For the C5, it just says that push-starts won't work and may damage the vehicle. What's this all about? -- PJ '89 HookerCar '02 e-blu 6-spd coupe >> ROFL.... >> [quoted text clipped - 37 lines] > > Dad I think it's an attention-gitter. (but you knew that already.) Now, since I answered your question, here's one for you. Once and awhile, just for chuckles, I go and RTFB. Low and behold here's a warning that says not to start the car by pushing it or pulling it, lest ugly things happen to the CATconvertor. Warning for the C4 is very specific. For the C5, it just says that push-starts won't work and may damage the vehicle. What's this all about? SignaturePJ '89 HookerCar '02 e-blu 6-spd coupe > Once and awhile, just for chuckles, I go and RTFB. Low and behold here's > a warning that says not to start the car by pushing it or pulling it, lest [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > > What's this all about? I have no idea as pushing or pulling a car to start it went out in the 70's. My guess would be that you would mess up the computers mind and the resulting wetting of its pants (convert with fuel) would be a problem. What's your thoughts? Dad >> Once and awhile, just for chuckles, I go and RTFB. Low and behold here's >> a warning that says not to start the car by pushing it or pulling it, lest [quoted text clipped - 11 lines] > > Dad I've not thought seriously about push-starts since the arrival of urethane bumper covers. It just "seemed" wrong but in the back of my mind, I had it tucked away as a 'contingency.' Before today, if I had a dead 'vette at the top of a hill, I'd have tried to coast to a start if there wasn't an available jump. For the C5 my intuition told me, that 25 mph in second or third gear equaled a guaranteed start. --wrong! Until today, if someone asked how the C4 (auto) would push-start, I'd have said that the rear pump in the tranny made that happen. --wrong! Just checked the shop manual--there is no rear pump in a 700R4. Wonder when that vanished? Am still puzzled though about that statement in the '89 manual. Wonder what failure mechanism actual leads to trashing of the catalytic converter during a push-start. The statement that triggered the initial post was: Page 3-1: "NOTICE: Do not push or tow this vehicle to start it. Under some conditions this may damage the catalytic converter or other parts of the vehicle. Also, this vehicle has a 12 volt battery... " I just eye-balled the book again and found this: Page 5-4: "Do not push or tow this vehicle to start it. This may result in unusually high catalytic converter and exhaust system temperatures which under extreme conditions may ignite interior floor-covering material above the converter." Without the injectors firing I don't know how that 'flood of fuel' reaches the CAT. Any clues? My bad. I should have remembered that the first rule in the age of computers is to never read the book!! (:-o -- PJ '89 Hookercar '02 e-blu coupe Here's a few reasons why push starts won't work. Normally, you push start a car cause the battery's dead: 1. Electric fuel pump 2. Electric fuel injection 3. Electric ignition 4. Computer controlled everything It won't work - experience talking.. I had a dead battery and tried to start a 1990 Honda in a parkade. figured I would get it rolling cause the parkade had an incline. After some futile pushing and jumping into a rolling car, I finally realized that I needed a boost. >>> Once and awhile, just for chuckles, I go and RTFB. Low and behold >>> here's a warning that says not to start the car by pushing it or pulling [quoted text clipped - 58 lines] > PJ > '89 Hookercar '02 e-blu coupe > ...Just as I wouldn't buy Vettes with nitrous systems or aftermarket wings, What's wrong with an aftermarket wing? I have one and it sets my car apart from all other Corvettes around here. I've had a lot of compliments and not one negative comment about it. > If you were competing with Vette sellers from all over the country, > would you photograph your car sitting amid melting snow? > > http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/2003-Chevrolet-Corvette-Z06-50th-Anniversary-Ed_W 0QQitemZ4627149423QQcategoryZ6168QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem > > Yes, I've been window shopping again Anybody else notice the For Sale sign at the entrance to the driveway? Can you say, "Divorce Sale" TomC '90ZR1 #792 One pair slightly used metal wheel Roller Skates with shiny key > Anybody else notice the For Sale sign at the entrance to the driveway? > Can you say, "Divorce Sale" The sign looks like it's across the street to me. Jon, or somebody so disguised, wrote the following at or about 4/22/2006 5:49 PM: >> Anybody else notice the For Sale sign at the entrance to the driveway? >> Can you say, "Divorce Sale" > > The sign looks like it's across the street to me. Look closer. The horizontal arm is pointing TOWARDS the road as viewed FROM the 'Vette owners home/driveway, etc. I've never seen one of those "Century 21" 4x4 posts that was not set that way. If it was pointed towards his house I might tend to agree. Back to basics though... It's Minnesota, for cripes sake, they only have about four months of the year without snow!<g>
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