 |
 | Home | Contact Us | FAQ | Search & Site Map | Link to Us |
 | Sign In | Join | Other 45 Sites in Network |
Car Forum / Chevrolet / Chevrolet Trucks / March 2005Bigblock? Smallblock?
I have a 1990 Chevy Caprice. It has a 5.0 liter 305 according to the VIN and the block. Unfortunately, It doesn?t say if its a BB or SB. I was wondering if it would be a short block or big block. Finding parts on online auctions is difficult when you don?t know. Also considering upgrading to the 5.7L 350. From what I hear, it should work. The old engine is probably in too poor of condition to be rebuilt. What do you think? The car ran fine until one day I put the pedal to the metal. The sound of breaking metal and slipping timing was followed by silence. I coasted about 3 blocks before I used the parking brake to stop. Before that, it only made a slight ticking noise. I found out later that the ticking was the crankshaft hitting a broken rod. It wasn?t a tapping valve like people suggested. I also found a brownish-black sludge in the cylinder with the broken rod. It?s old over-heated coolant mixed with carbon buildup. I haven?t taken the entire engine out yet. The pistons, cam, crank, pan, and rods are the only thing attached to the block(besides the tranny). The engine is still in the car. It is actually sitting on the frame. Both mounts? rubber is completely gone. The only things that might be salvageable would be the block(if not cracked), the pistons(if not broken), valve springs and retainers, and the heads(if not cracked). Things wrong with the 305 5.0L: cracked intake manifold, bent rods (due to broken rod), possible cracked head, possibly had a blown head gasket, 1 broke rod (pushed it down about 2 1/2" with finger while other pistons stayed in place), 7 seized pistons(8th was completely broken from crank months before, apparently), stretched timing chain, cam timing off by 90 degrees, shattered cam thrust washer plate(don?t know the actual name. I?ts the bolted on plate behind the cam gear.), found about 4 1/2 quarts of pure coolant and water in oil pan(about 5 1/2 quarts of oil also found in the oil pan.) >I have a 1990 Chevy Caprice. It has a 5.0 liter 305 according to the > VIN and the block. Unfortunately, It doesn't say if its a BB or SB. I > was wondering if it would be a short block or big block. The abbreviation SB refers to small block. Your car has a small block. Al The 305 is a Small Block. The only Small block that has more cubic inches than a Big Block is a 400 which is bigger than the classis 396. If its under 400ci its a small block. We wont get into the 348/409 family. The 305 is one of the worst engines ever made. ALLOT of the 305 blocks were made on Mexico and were far below junk. They had a high sand content and the starter bolt holes liked to strip out. 350's are EVERYWHERE and a direct bolt in and lots more power without sacrificing economy. The only hitch might be the exhaust manifolds. Don't even bother considering 305 anything...not worth the time! 350, 400, even a 307 would be MUCH better >I have a 1990 Chevy Caprice. It has a 5.0 liter 305 according to the > VIN and the block. Unfortunately, It doesn't say if its a BB or SB. I [quoted text clipped - 29 lines] > found about 4 1/2 quarts of pure coolant and water in oil pan(about 5 > 1/2 quarts of oil also found in the oil pan.) > The 305 is a Small Block. The only Small block that has more cubic > inches than a Big Block is a 400 which is bigger than the classis 396. If > its under 400ci its a small block. Unless it's a 366, then it's a big block.;-) H We wont get into the 348/409 family. The > 305 is one of the worst engines ever made. ALLOT of the 305 blocks were made > on Mexico and were far below junk. They had a high sand content and the [quoted text clipped - 38 lines] > > found about 4 1/2 quarts of pure coolant and water in oil pan(about 5 > > 1/2 quarts of oil also found in the oil pan.) http://www.autoforumz.com/Chevrolet-Bigblock-Smallblock-ftopict103722.html > > Visit Topic URL to contact author (reg. req'd). Report abuse: > > http://www.autoforumz.com/eform.php?p=480953 Well if ya want to get into the truck blocks. >> The 305 is a Small Block. The only Small block that has more cubic >> inches than a Big Block is a 400 which is bigger than the classis 396. If [quoted text clipped - 56 lines] >> > Visit Topic URL to contact author (reg. req'd). Report abuse: >> > http://www.autoforumz.com/eform.php?p=480953 read the newsgroup name and get back to us > Well if ya want to get into the truck blocks. > [quoted text clipped - 60 lines] >>> > Visit Topic URL to contact author (reg. req'd). Report abuse: >>> > http://www.autoforumz.com/eform.php?p=480953 'Truck Blocks' does NOT refer to Light Trucks! It refers to the Medium Duty trucks! Educate before you get lippy! > read the newsgroup name and get back to us >> Well if ya want to get into the truck blocks. [quoted text clipped - 64 lines] >>>> > Visit Topic URL to contact author (reg. req'd). Report abuse: >>>> > http://www.autoforumz.com/eform.php?p=480953 >> The 305 is a Small Block. The only Small block that has more cubic >> inches than a Big Block is a 400 which is bigger than the classis 396. If >> its under 400ci its a small block. > >Unless it's a 366, then it's a big block.;-) Well you got me on this one. Who what & when was a 366 BB in a production vehicle? I am aware of bored & stroked GM 350's into 383's, but they are still small blocks. As the other poster stated the smallest BB that I am aware of is the 396 with the biggest SB being the GM 400, which is an outstanding motor in the 4-bot main configuration. Which by the way, highly sought after by dirt track racers.  Signature"Either kill me or take me as I am, because I'll be damned if I ever change..." The Marquis de Sade > >> The 305 is a Small Block. The only Small block that has more cubic > >> inches than a Big Block is a 400 which is bigger than the classis 396. If [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > 383's, but they are still small blocks. As the other poster stated > the smallest BB that I am aware of is the 396 The 366 is a truck engine found in C65's and others. Same block as the 396-402-427-454. Basically the same engine but heavier duty with extra oil capacity. H Partially wrong and somewhat right! The 366 is a Tall Block, always considered a 'Truck Block'. There is also a very rare 427 'Truck Block'. The same basic design for the standard Mark IV Big Block is used(with some differences) but the deck height is higher, the rids longer, taller compression height pistons, and longer rods. They were discontinued in the mid 70's or so. Both the 366 and 427 'Truck Blocks' were used exclusively in Medium Duty Chevy and GMC trucks. They CAN be shoe-horned into Light Trucks and passenger cars, but are expensive to build and find. Hood clearance can be an issue too. >> >> The 305 is a Small Block. The only Small block that has more cubic >> >> inches than a Big Block is a 400 which is bigger than the classis 396. [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] > Basically the same engine but heavier duty with extra oil capacity. > H >> >> The 305 is a Small Block. The only Small block that has more cubic >> >> inches than a Big Block is a 400 which is bigger than the classis 396. [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] >Basically the same engine but heavier duty with extra oil capacity. >H Huh, like I said you got me good on that one. Major knowledge hole in that area. What years were they available in? Signature"Either kill me or take me as I am, because I'll be damned if I ever change..." The Marquis de Sade > >> >> The 305 is a Small Block. The only Small block that has more cubic > >> >> inches than a Big Block is a 400 which is bigger than the classis 396. [quoted text clipped - 15 lines] > Huh, like I said you got me good on that one. Major knowledge hole in > that area. What years were they available in? Check this page...says it better than I could. http://www.nastyz28.com/bbcmenu.html H >>> The 305 is a Small Block. The only Small block that has more cubic >>> inches than a Big Block is a 400 which is bigger than the classis 396. If [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] >configuration. Which by the way, highly sought after by dirt track >racers. 366 is a Chev truck motor... was available in 2ton trucks --- Elbert Clarke elbert.clarke@**adelphia.net remove ** to email > On Fri, 18 Feb 2005 13:11:28 -0500, ZombyWoof > <Zomby-Woof@Zappa.net> [quoted text clipped - 32 lines] > elbert.clarke@**adelphia.net > remove ** to email I don?t know what?s wrong with me. I just realized I posted this in the wrong section. I couldn?t figure out what happened to my post [AutoForumz editor: poster is referring to sections on AF's site]. At least it was in a Chevy section. I finally crawled under the car yesterday with a flaslight and removed the #8 piston. It is in worse condition than I thought last time. It turns out the con rod broke(as I thought). Then, the piston flew up and hit the head... HARD! It hit so hard that the piston bent~. The lower half of the piston is completely gone! Everything below the bottom oil-scraping ring is gone. The broken con rod then fell and became jammed up between the crankshaft and the bottom of the block. The block and crank is completely trashed. It doesn?t matter though. I?ve decided to build myself a low budget performance engine. I have already bought a 350 Chevy SB block from a ?92 camaro bored .030 over. It has already had $400 worth of work done to it. I?m getting it for about $225 after shipping. I?m getting an engine kit that comes with all new pistons, rings, rods, bearings, timing, gaskets, cam, rollers, oil pump, ect... I?m also going to get new rockers, pushrods, and springs. I already have some HUGE new 2.08 racing valves that I?m planning on using(if I can get them to fit). The heads, I might see if I can find some from the auto recyclers in good shape. Of course I can?t leave them in stock condition. I?m going to get the seats sized up to fit the valve size(by a machine shop). All of the porting and polishing work I will probably do myself. I don?t plan on taking off too much since the walls could be weakened too much. The only thing I haven?t figured out so far is the intake and exhaust manifolds. The completed engine is estimated to be well under $1000! > I don't know what's wrong with me. I just realized I posted > this in the wrong section. I couldn't figure out what happened [quoted text clipped - 28 lines] > and exhaust manifolds. The completed engine is estimated to be > well under $1000! :twisted: I?m going to post a question on the intake in the Chevy cars section. Snip > >Unless it's a 366, then it's a big block.;-) > > [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > configuration. Which by the way, highly sought after by dirt track > racers. 366 is a big block. Commonly used in industrial trucks, like beer and soda deliver trucks. (Been there, done that) HDS 396 mmmmmmmmmmm > We wont get into the 348/409 family. But a 'W' looks good in any frame ya stick it in...... Definatly!!! >> We wont get into the 348/409 family. > > But a 'W' looks good in any frame ya stick it in...... > Definatly!!! http://www.348-409.com/ http://wrench.vox.org/ > But a 'W' looks good in any frame ya stick it in...... SWEET!!! Love the all original 4dr, 4spd, 409...still has the generator!!! The red '65 Impala is awesome too! >> Definatly!!! > > http://www.348-409.com/ > http://wrench.vox.org/ > >> But a 'W' looks good in any frame ya stick it in...... > The 305 is a Small Block. The only Small block that has more > cubic [quoted text clipped - 83 lines] > abuse: > > http://www.autoforumz.com/eform.php?p=480953 UPDATE Another thing I can rub in my dads face! I told him it was probably a small block. I?ve decided not to use the original block any way. I took the oil pan off tonight. I found a little more than oil or coolant in the pan. No, not metal shavings. I found that one con rod had in fact broken. I did not know for a fact that the rod broke. But, I was right...unfortunately. It was broken into three pieces. My car racing neighbor was actually surprised to see the pieces. He said he only saw rods broken like that in cars equipped with NOS. Also, I forgot to mention in my first post that my car has an auto tranny. > The 305 is a Small Block. The only Small block that has more > cubic [quoted text clipped - 83 lines] > abuse: > > http://www.autoforumz.com/eform.php?p=480953 Ignore this. I messed up. Without entering the pissing match that "Hairy" n "Shades" are having I will tell you that the 305 is a SB or Small Block. The 5.7 litre or 350 engine is a direct bolt in and will serve you well when treated properly. The terms long block and short block refer to partially assembled engines of any displacement being either a Small or Big block of any size. A short block is partially assembled without heads and a long block is partially assembled with heads. Signature-- Mad-Dog '79 Chevy K-10 Slightly modified http://mad-dog16.tripod.com/ > I have a 1990 Chevy Caprice. It has a 5.0 liter 305 according to the > VIN and the block. Unfortunately, It doesn't say if its a BB or SB. I [quoted text clipped - 29 lines] > found about 4 1/2 quarts of pure coolant and water in oil pan(about 5 > 1/2 quarts of oil also found in the oil pan.) > Subject: Bigblock? Smallblock? > From: BadBow99S10 <UseLinkToEmail@AutoForumz.com> [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > I have a 1990 Chevy Caprice. It has a 5.0 liter 305 according to the > VIN and the block. Unfortunately, It doesnt say if its a BB or SB. I Small block = 305 and a short block is the block, with a crank, pistons and cam and nothing else. My advice is to ck with a dealer for pricing on a 350 "replacement engine and compare that to a junk yard 350. You will still have to get an intake manifold but they are cheap. That should cost you $1200-$1500, so you can decide if you are going to keep the car for a long time and if the rest of the car is worth it. As for me, I've owned my '70 Blazer since '78 and will go to the grave when they pry my cold dead fingers off-----wait a minute---That's for my guns, not my Blazer! > I have a 1990 Chevy Caprice. It has a 5.0 liter 305 according to the > VIN and the block. Unfortunately, It doesn't say if its a BB or SB. I [quoted text clipped - 29 lines] > found about 4 1/2 quarts of pure coolant and water in oil pan(about 5 > 1/2 quarts of oil also found in the oil pan.) >My advice is to ck with a dealer for pricing on a 350 "replacement engine >and compare that to a junk yard 350. You will still have to get an intake [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] >go to the grave when they pry my cold dead fingers off-----wait a >minute---That's for my guns, not my Blazer! Exactly what he needs can be found brand spankin new for $1,469.90 http://www.gmpartsdepot.com/store/product1.aspx?SID=2&Product_ID=516&Category_ID=74 The 10067353 universal 4 Bolt main block 350 is a brand new long block used to cover most GM applications from 1970-1985. It is our lowest priced 350 and is great as a small block replacement or V-8 retrofit into any vehicle. This brand new crate engine comes with a GM nation wide warranty and is covered for 3 years or 50,000 miles when used in applicable GM vehicles. Check out our Warranty Information for full details. The specs of the motor are as follows: ·(4) Bolt main block with a (2) piece rear main seal. ·Cast Iron Crank. ·LT/LT4 Powdered Metal connecting rods. ·Cast Pistons, (dished). ·Hydraulic flat tappet cam, (.383 intake / .401 exhaust) and a 112-degree lobe separation. ·Cast Iron Cylinder heads with a 76cc combustion chamber. (Non vortec design) ·8.5:1 compression ratio. ·Left or Right hand dipstick. ·(4) Quart oil pan. ·Timing tabs for a 6 ¾ or an 8 balancer. Now that being said; if I was keeping the car and had an extra 2-grand to throw at it I would go with a ZZ4 350CI 355HP HO Engine with Aluminum Heads for $3,779.00. This can be found at the following URL http://www.gmpartsdepot.com/product1.aspx?SID=2&Product_ID=456&Category_ID=2& >> I have a 1990 Chevy Caprice. It has a 5.0 liter 305 according to the >> VIN and the block. Unfortunately, It doesn't say if its a BB or SB. I [quoted text clipped - 33 lines] >> Visit Topic URL to contact author (reg. req'd). Report abuse: >http://www.autoforumz.com/eform.php?p=480953 Signature"Either kill me or take me as I am, because I'll be damned if I ever change..." The Marquis de Sade I opted for #12355345, 300hp motor, that cost around $2200 cus I wanted more power (but not so much that I had to buy premium gas)! I am VERY pleased, one of my better moves. Although my 70 blazer looks stock, I have "upgraded" a 78 disc brake front end, power booster, the 300hp crate motor, 700R4 trans, ltd slip rear and 40gal gas tank. I did the engine and trans at the same time ('98) and was able to keep the drive shafts the same by moving the tc back 5/8-3/4 and the engine mts 1" forward. I had to drill 18 new holes in the frame but otherwise, I'd had to change both frt and rear drive shafts and relocate my 4wd shifter and console. It works real well and again, I'd highly recommend the replacement "crate motor" to anyone who's keeping the vehicle for some time. LD > The 10067353 universal 4 Bolt main block 350 is a brand new long block > used to cover most GM applications from '1970-1985. It is our lowest [quoted text clipped - 13 lines] > to throw at it I would go with a ZZ4 350CI 355HP HO Engine with > Aluminum Heads for $3,779.00. This can be found at the following URL http://www.gmpartsdepot.com/product1.aspx?SID=2&Product_ID=456&Category_ID=2& > >> I have a 1990 Chevy Caprice. It has a 5.0 liter 305 according to the > >> VIN and the block. Unfortunately, It doesn't say if its a BB or SB. I [quoted text clipped - 33 lines] > >> Visit Topic URL to contact author (reg. req'd). Report abuse: > >http://www.autoforumz.com/eform.php?p=480953 >I opted for #12355345, 300hp motor, that cost around $2200 cus I wanted more >power (but not so much that I had to buy premium gas)! I am VERY pleased, [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] >time. >LD Glad that someone other then myself has followed this route with similar results. I really want to get my hands on a ZZ4 to drop into my S-10 when the 4.3 sh.ts the bed. At least that is the dream, but the wife would probably kill me if I start one more mechanical project. I've got to get the `72 Vette & my Chopper done before I start anything else other then a divorce. >> The 10067353 universal 4 Bolt main block 350 is a brand new long block >> used to cover most GM applications from '1970-1985. It is our lowest [quoted text clipped - 57 lines] >> >> Visit Topic URL to contact author (reg. req'd). Report abuse: >> >http://www.autoforumz.com/eform.php?p=480953 Signature"Either kill me or take me as I am, because I'll be damned if I ever change..." The Marquis de Sade > I opted for #12355345, 300hp motor, that cost around $2200 cus I wanted more > power (but not so much that I had to buy premium gas)! I am VERY pleased, [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > time. > LD ---------- I did the same for my 89 Chevy, but went ahead with the standard 350, and changed it over to a roller cam/roller rockers and a compcam, for about the same price. Figure I got around 300 hp. It was so easy to do (with some minor knuckle busting here and there), that I'm surprised more people don't do it. As long as your ride is in great shape, you would still be way a'head of the game if you had to have a shop do it. A 2005 version of my truck is in the 45,000.00 range for Pete's sake! With a new interior and paint job, it would still be cheaper by thousands. HDS It is a small block and like one of the other posters said you would be ahead of the game to just get a crate motor and change it out. > I have a 1990 Chevy Caprice. It has a 5.0 liter 305 according to the > VIN and the block. Unfortunately, It doesn't say if its a BB or SB. I [quoted text clipped - 29 lines] > found about 4 1/2 quarts of pure coolant and water in oil pan(about 5 > 1/2 quarts of oil also found in the oil pan.) Hi, Sorry about your engine. What a mess. Your engine or any other engine from 400 cu in on down is a small block. 400s are rare. A short block is one without the heads and intake. Big blocks are from old 396's up. The bb block is a huge motor in appearence. The heads are about twice the size of the small block. There is no mistaking them. Big blocks seem hard to find. There is an abundance of 350's in many places. Check your local news paper for engines. Make sure that the heads or block are not cracked. Over heating on a sb Chevy can easily crack heads. Get a reciept from the seller stating that the blocks or heads are not cracked. This way you can get your money back if they are. Pretty much all the small blocks parts are interchangable. For a good rebuilder engine you should pay around $50.00 and up. A good source is your "thrifty ads" or equivalent. These are the ads that people run to sell personal and odd stuff usually under $500.00. Fridays, Saturdays, and Sundays are your best bet. Good luck to you. Jessie > I have a 1990 Chevy Caprice. It has a 5.0 liter 305 according to the > VIN and the block. Unfortunately, It doesn’t say if its a BB or SB. I [quoted text clipped - 29 lines] > found about 4 1/2 quarts of pure coolant and water in oil pan(about 5 > 1/2 quarts of oil also found in the oil pan.) > Hi, > Sorry about your engine. What a mess. Your engine or any [quoted text clipped - 88 lines] > pan(about 5 > > 1/2 quarts of oil also found in the oil pan.) Thanks. That answers my question. I already have my 350 block on the way. I?ve already paid $107.50($227.50 after shipping) for my block. I think I?m going to use SB 350 caprice heads(modified) and the intake as well. I might decide to get another vehicle in the next few days. If I do, I might take my time and make the 350 .030 motor into a 383. Thank you everyone. "Jessie Herrera" <herreraj@mail.sdccu.net> wrote in message Your engine or any other engine > from 400 cu in on down is a small block. > Big blocks are from old 396's up. Now, there's a contradiction for you. Hi, It's not a contradiction. They made them that way. I'm not a chevy engineer. Small blocks are 262, 283, 327, 302, 305, 350, and Small block 400 (they look just like the 350.) The 302 was in the early Z28s The 400 was a siamese motor. There was no room between the cylinders. They got no proper cooling although the cranks are used for sb 383's. The bib blocks were 366?, 396, 402, 409, 427, and 454. They also make a truck block that is 427 and 454. These are taller that their car counterparts. The big blocks are much larger than the small blocks. Even the 400. I hope this helps you. Jessie > "Jessie Herrera" <herreraj@mail.sdccu.net> wrote in message > [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > > Now, there's a contradiction for you. > Hi, > It's not a contradiction. They made them that way. I'm not a chevy [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > I hope this helps you. > Jessie I'm no expert on this either, but wasn't the first small block in '55 a 265, not a 262? And you've listed the 409 as a big block. I believe it was part of the engine family that started with the 348 in '58. My memory is getting fainter about all this, but I believe I'm right on those two points. Garrett Fulton >>Hi, >>It's not a contradiction. They made them that way. I'm not a chevy [quoted text clipped - 19 lines] > http://www.newsfeeds.com The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! 120,000+ Newsgroups > ----= East and West-Coast Server Farms - Total Privacy via Encryption =---- You are. >:|"Jessie Herrera" <herreraj@mail.sdccu.net> wrote in message >:|news:42240FE9.7040000@mail.sdccu.net... [quoted text clipped - 15 lines] >:|of the engine family that started with the 348 in '58. My memory is getting >:|fainter about all this, but I believe I'm right on those two points. there also was a 262 V8... they also forgot the 307. and the 366 was also a truck block. you're right about the 409 W motor.. different era completely. -Bret >:|Garrett Fulton >:| >:|----== Posted via Newsfeeds.Com - Unlimited-Uncensored-Secure Usenet News==---- >:|http://www.newsfeeds.com The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! 120,000+ Newsgroups >:|----= East and West-Coast Server Farms - Total Privacy via Encryption =---- > >:|> Jessie > [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > > >:|Garrett Fulton Lets not forget the 348W, with out which there wouldn't have been a 409 for the beach boys to sing about., or the very first Chevy v-8 90 degree over head valve engine, the 288 cid. Whitelightning > > >:|> Jessie > > [quoted text clipped - 11 lines] > > Whitelightning Hey, thanks for mentioning the 288. I didn't know about that one and was skeptical till I looked it up. Way before my time. Still, both W engines and the 288 are irrelevant in a Bigblock-Smallblock discussion. H > Hi, > It's not a contradiction. They made them that way. I'm not a chevy [quoted text clipped - 18 lines] >> >> Now, there's a contradiction for you. Like I said, I'm not a Chevy engineer. Why they do the things they do I don't know. I will say though that I am very impressed by some of the user's knowledge of Chevy history. That's what these boards are all about. There were some very good responses. I learned something by reading all responses. Some good, some bad. I am also let down about some user's lack of knowledge or the uninformed/misinformed users. I have a K5 Blazer and a Cheyenne C20 4x4 (350-350). I also have a Dodge Power Wagon (440-435) and an Attex Super Chief 500 6 wheeler that is also amphibious. I also have a 1981 Porsche 911 with a big bore kit and a 67 Sunbeam sportscar with the small block Ford (very fast). Any way, Thanks for the input. Keep the faith. Look forward to reading all your input in the future. Jessie |
Reply to this Message |
 Sign In
 Join
 My Latest Posts My Monitored Threads My Blog My Photo Gallery My Profile My Homepage Start New Thread Enable EMail Alerts Rate this Thread
|
©2008 Advenet LLC Privacy Policy - Terms of Use
This website includes both content owned or controlled by Advenet as well as content owned or controlled by third parties.