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Car Forum / Citroen Cars / April 2006

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Xantia: Removing the front bumper to access the washer-bottle

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Stroller - 08 Apr 2006 12:06 GMT
I feel kinda daft asking this, but I'm posting here because surely one
of the wise heads on this group will be able to put me straight in no
time.

I bought a 1993 Xantia SX turbo diesel cheaply at auction a month ago
and the window washers don't work. Both front & rear washers are
affected and when I try to top up with water it runs straight out &
puddles on the floor underneath the car.

Any Xantia owners will know that the washer reservoir on this model is
behind the front bumper and looking in the bonnet all I can see is the
filler and determine that a hose disappears down to it. I can't see any
cracks in the reservoir itself when the car is raised on the ramp so
either it's the hose that's damaged, the bottle where they meet, or
maybe the hose has just come off.

So the sensible thing to do is remove the bumper & take a look.

The bumper is secured with three screws under its lower front edge, a
couple behind the fog-lights and one on each side, the latter being
accessed by removing a little cover under the wheel arch. This is the
dumb bit: having removed the cover & spent ages slackening one of the
side bolts, I just can't get it out. It'll unscrew until it's out about
a centimetre and a half but after that no amount of unscrewing will
shift it any further.

My father suggests that the bolt is off the end of its threaded section
and merely wedged in a narrow hole that leads to it, however I'm not
convinced by this argument as there is _no_ movement in the bolt _at
all_. If this were the case I would expect to be able to feel at least
the tiniest amount of play in it (wiggle) but it is rock solid in that
direction - tapping the bolt with a hammer & drift has no apparent
effect on it.

The only movement in this bolt is rotary, yet after initially observing
it with 1.5cm of thread exposed I was still racheting at it maybe as
much as an hour later with no further progress!! It's like the retainer
in the bumper, into which this bolt screws, has broken from its mount.
Is this possible? It seems to me that this would be more likely to
happen when the both was at its tightest, not when it was nearly out so
that doesn't make sense to me, either. Also, that would probably allow
play in other directions and, as I said, the both it solid except that
it'll twist & rotate freely.  

Having given up on the job and driven the car for a couple of days, I
looked at the bolt & found it to be in the same position - vibration
hasn't loosened it at all.

I'm the first to admit I'm an idiot, so if someone would kindly beat me
with a clue I'd be extremely grateful.

Stroller.
. - 08 Apr 2006 15:39 GMT
> I feel kinda daft asking this, but I'm posting here because surely one
> of the wise heads on this group will be able to put me straight in no
[quoted text clipped - 13 lines]
>
> So the sensible thing to do is remove the bumper & take a look.

I'd take the washer jets off and see if they are blocked, first ;-)
Adrian - 08 Apr 2006 16:51 GMT
. (-@-.com) gurgled happily, sounding much like they were saying :

>> So the sensible thing to do is remove the bumper & take a look.

> I'd take the washer jets off and see if they are blocked, first ;-)

<sigh>
Nice one, Dot.

>> Both front & rear washers are
>> affected and when I try to top up with water it runs straight out &
>> puddles on the floor underneath the car.
. - 08 Apr 2006 17:13 GMT
> . (-@-.com) gurgled happily, sounding much like they were saying :
>
[quoted text clipped - 4 lines]
> <sigh>
> Nice one, Dot.

the rear jets are worse, ime. has the OP described backtracking
over the system to see where wates /is/ rather than noticing where
it /ain't/ ? no.

>>> Both front & rear washers are
>>> affected and when I try to top up with water it runs straight out &
>>> puddles on the floor underneath the car.

perhaps the bottle is full, the jets are blocked and the breather
hose has become dislodged ??

to the OP:

is the washer motor turning ? pop the tube off the jets and try the
washers again, if there is water shooting into your face then the
jets are blocked and you've learned to not look down the barrel
of a hosepipe :-)

it's the cheapest least time consuming way of determining if the
jets are connected to the bottle, blocked, if the pump is fubar and
if you /really/ need to take the bumper off to get a closer look.
Stroller - 08 Apr 2006 18:29 GMT
>...
> to the OP:
>
> is the washer motor turning ?

Yes - I intended to mention this, but obviously got hung up in my own
diagnosis of the problem - it is quite audibly doing so.

> pop the tube off the jets and try the
> washers again, if there is water shooting into your face then the
> jets are blocked and you've learned to not look down the barrel
> of a hosepipe :-)

You'll be pleased to hear that I've pulled the tube off the jets (in
fact it was so tight that it took half the bleedin' jet with it) and no
water shot into my face or anywhere else. The tube is quite visibly dry.

Stroller.
Slim - 10 Apr 2006 21:46 GMT
It's a common problem for the flexible filler hose that goes through
the inner wing to crack, this will cause you to lose the water before
it gets into the washer bottle.

To check, try lifting the blue top and filling with water! does the
water pour out from inside the wheel arch?

My guess is yes it does.

If so, remove the front wheel and the plastic wheel arch liner, then
you will be able to see the washer bottle, if you then remove the front
indicator, it is possible to get your hand in and replace the filller
hose.

Not easy, but possible, Trust me!! I have done this job several times.

Regards
  Slim.
Stroller - 22 Apr 2006 16:45 GMT
> It's a common problem for the flexible filler hose that goes through
> the inner wing to crack, this will cause you to lose the water before
[quoted text clipped - 9 lines]
> indicator, it is possible to get your hand in and replace the filller
> hose.

Somewhat late, but I just wanted to say THANK YOU VERY MUCH for posting
this - you have saved me a very great deal of effort.

When I filled up with water it did indeed leak as you describe, but
quite slowly. I was trying to identify exactly where this was coming
from but since, thanks to your advice, I was able to access the pump I
decided to remove it to be sure the reservoir was empty. Sure enough, I
got a face full of soapy water.

So it seems that Dot was in fact on the right track, although his advice
alone would not have allowed me to identify the blockages in the hoses.
It seems that the leakage in the filling hose is quite small and only
noticeable when the reservoir was full up and this hose backed-up.

Having refitted the pump & removed the hoses I was able to identify that
it was working quite happily in response to both front & rear
washer-buttons so then followed the hoses through the car reconnecting
them.

The front hose is routed through a large rubber grommet in the front
bulkhead and has a joint in it before a second section of pipe takes a
somewhat contrived path into the engine bay. It was this at this joint
that that there was a blockage. The rear blockage was in one of the
connectors where the hose routes through the wiper-arm motor.

Thanks for the help,

Stroller.
Stroller - 08 Apr 2006 17:11 GMT
> > ... Both front & rear washers are
> > affected and when I try to top up with water it runs straight out &
[quoted text clipped - 4 lines]
>
> I'd take the washer jets off and see if they are blocked, first ;-)

So would I if it were not for the facts that both front & rear are
affected and that water is able to enter the washer bottle filler hose
but does not reach the inside of the reservoir.

Any clues on the removing the bumper thing? I'm hoping this is a common
problem and that someone can say "do it like this, you numptie".

Stroller.
 
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