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Car Forum / Citroen Cars / May 2007ePetition on Parking Signage
Ladies and gentlemen I've just started this ePetition having been stung for a parking fine in Hackey, when I had no idea where the zone signs were, so asked a Community Support Officer what the zone time limits were.....and got told a load of cobblers. It was only then that I discovered that they can fine you if you wait for any length of time on a single yellow, even if that time is spent, say, trying to find out where the zone signs are! Quite obviously, councils would rather that you committed an offence and they collect a fine, than you didn't offend and their roads remained uncongested. Anyhow, I want to go back to the good old days when every yellow line had a sign that said "no waiting - 8am to 6pm" - not too much to ask, is it? http://petitions.pm.gov.uk/Parking-Signage/ We the undersigned petition the Prime Minister to Re-instate the requirement for all parking and waiting zones to have detailed signage Local authorities have been relieved of the requirement to indicate the time-limits and other conditions relevant to any specific restricted-stopping area (e.g. single-yellow line or loading zone) on a sign located at that zone, being permitted instead to provide only blanket signage for a controlled parking zone (CPZ), the onus being on the driver to find where the CPZ signage is. Drivers unfamiliar to an area are increasingly being fined due to being unable to find - or in some cases, properly interpret - the CPZ signage. This petition calls for the re-instatement of specific signage of all parking, stopping and loading restrictions, the onus being on the local authority to provide clarity to the driver such that the offences do not occur, rather than creating confusion and opacity which results in more offences (i.e. unwanted parking congestion) and fines (i.e. income for the councils). The cost of the improved signage to be hypothecated from parking fees and fines. .............And - pass it on to anyone else that you think might feel that creating an offence by concealing information is unethical. TF > Ladies and gentlemen > [quoted text clipped - 41 lines] > > TF The law requires signs at the beginning of parking zones which clearly state the restrictions in force. Repeater signs are also required for longer zones. If the signs are not there, or are obstructed by other street furniture, you should claim against the fine and be successful. I had to do this recently in Bath. The council were most upset when I was able to quote chapter and verse from the legislation whereas their "expert" didn't have the first clue :-) Page 79 of the Highway Code says "Yellow or red lines can only give a guide to the restrictions and controls in force and signs, nearby or at the zone entry, must be consulted". If there aren't any signs how can you consult them? If you were on a double line (whether it was red or yellow) then you're screwed of course because they are automatically 24/7. A single line of either colour, however, needs a sign with timings on to be meaningful. HTH  SignatureRegards Steve G ----- Original Message ----- From: "SteveG" <_@_._> > The law requires signs at the beginning of parking zones which clearly > state the restrictions in force. Repeater signs are also required for [quoted text clipped - 13 lines] > screwed of course because they are automatically 24/7. A single line of > either colour, however, needs a sign with timings on to be meaningful. Hi Steve Unfortunately the operative phrase is "or at the zone entry". City councils are using this as the final get-out, and while you are mirror-signal-manouvre-watchthetrafficlights-mindthatpedestrianonhismobile-w herethehellamI-shouldwehaveturnedleftbackthere-ing, you are also supposed to have spotted when you passed the cpz marker and made a note of the times thereon. I was in Hackney for the first time in 35 years, the first time driving, with someone shouting A-to-Z instructions at me, early on a Friday evening. Was I going to see where the CPZ markers were? There is, AFAIK, no written legislation to state how far you need to be into a CPZ before it is reasonable to expect repeaters (unless you know more - in which case, please elucidate!), hence Councils don't bother, because if they spend money on the signs, they reduce the income from the fines - a double-whammy on their funds. What I am more sore about is that, because I had no idea where the CPZ started - indeed, was not aware of being in one! - I actually asked a back-up bobby if I was OK on the single yellow, he consulted his watch and said "yeah, should be - it's after 6:30", but the zone actually operated until midnight. So much for that piece of local knowledge. If we let councils hide behind this kind of legislation for one type of fineable offence, it could be the thin end of a wedge - why not speed limits? Just put up one 50 sign at the start of a 10-mile stretch of mixed A-road, set up cameras, and watch the money flood in. Sorry if I sound bitter and cynical, but I am. And don't get me started on Planning Commitees, either! TF > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "SteveG" <_@_._> [quoted text clipped - 48 lines] > > TF Sorry, Tony, no idea what distance would be deemed suitable and can't find any reference to it anywhere. I'll have a chat to some knowledgeable folks tomorrow and see what they think. The speed limit one is, of course, easier to quantify. Repeaters are required for all speeds except 30mph and national speed limit. The spacing between repeaters is defined in legislation but is variable depending on the speed of the road. Good luck with the petition :-) SignatureRegards Steve G I'd sign your petition, but since I'm a Yank, I doubt if that would do. I sympathize with you about your pettifogging bureauarcracy. We have to deal with a pettifoggingly incompetent government here in the states that is so frustrating that I pray for the day when all of the money-grubbing CEOs, politicians and presidents can shortened by a head with a guillotine. I'm sure since the French no longer use theirs, they wouldn't mind loaning us some of theirs. (Hmmm? I wonder what kind of guillotine Citroën would design?) Gene >> Ladies and gentlemen >> [quoted text clipped - 68 lines] > > HTH > I'd sign your petition, but since I'm a Yank, I doubt if that would do. I > sympathize with you about your pettifogging bureauarcracy. We have to deal [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > > Gene Hi Gene, Don't know about that, but you can bet it would have the smoothest suspension system in the world :-) SignatureRegards Steve G ~ Citroen Xantia owner/lover Steve, I too am an owner/lover a Citroën. A 1988 CXA 25 Prelude that has just turned 40,000 miles on the clock. It was originally sold here in Portland, Oregon and has stayed in the area ever since. I bought from a dairy farmer in southern Idaho where it had been sitting a garage for ages. It was my great good fortune to meet the man who worked for CXA, the company who imported the cars from Andre in Holland. He prepped my car for delivery when new and now he is maintaining it for me. Hi Gene, Don't know about that, but you can bet it would have the smoothest suspension system in the world :-) SignatureRegards Steve G ~ Citroen Xantia owner/lover > Steve, I too am an owner/lover a Citroën. A 1988 CXA 25 Prelude that has > just turned 40,000 miles on the clock. It was originally sold here in [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > Don't know about that, but you can bet it would have the smoothest > suspension system in the world :-) Gene, I'm a little envious of you. What a lovely car to own and drive and with such low mileage too :-) I have spent some time in the USA over the years but didn't know that Citroen were available there - I certainly never saw one. Happy motoring :-) SignatureRegards Steve G Steve, There are a few Cits here in the states. The DS was imported for a while then a company based in New Jersey called itself CXA and through Andre in Holland they imported new CXs from France and then altered them to US specs. There were only about 600 CXAs imported. They also imported a few XMs, but due to US government restrictions soon went out of business. So to this day US car makers are still using the same basic ideas to build cars that were developed in the 1920s. Amongst the things changed was 14 inch wheels and tires. Reinforce a rear beam and a few other changes that I can't remember. The boot on my car is shorter than some other cars because of the rear AC unit. There was another company that imported CXs via Sweden but I don't know how many of them there are here. There is a small group of us here Portland, Oregon who have CXs. Mine I believe is the only CXA whilst the others were imported from France. There are also a smattering of DS/ID sedans and breaks about plus 2CVs and the odd SM. I know of a 6 cylinder Traction in a storage shed along with an Ami, a DS and Panhard out near Wilsonville. I have a friend/mechanic in Seattle who has 2 CXs, one of which is out of commission as he hit a power pole during icy weather. He also has a 2CV Special back in New Jersey. Another friend in Vancouver BC has a couple of ID breaks and a DS and I believe a couple of 2CVs. Occasionally, those of us in the Portland area get together at a cafe with our cars and talk Citroën. Here is the link for the local club information: http://www.citroenclubsusa.org/index.htm Gene Gene S. Park wrote: > Steve, I too am an owner/lover a Citroën. A 1988 CXA 25 Prelude that has > just turned 40,000 miles on the clock. It was originally sold here in [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > Don't know about that, but you can bet it would have the smoothest > suspension system in the world :-) Gene, I'm a little envious of you. What a lovely car to own and drive and with such low mileage too :-) I have spent some time in the USA over the years but didn't know that Citroen were available there - I certainly never saw one. Happy motoring :-) SignatureRegards Steve G > Steve, > [quoted text clipped - 47 lines] > > Happy motoring :-) Many thanks for the info Gene. I'll take a look at the web site soon :-) SignatureRegards Steve G || I'd sign your petition, but since I'm a Yank, I doubt if that would || do. I sympathize with you about your pettifogging bureauarcracy. We [quoted text clipped - 11 lines] | Don't know about that, but you can bet it would have the smoothest | suspension system in the world :-) But the blade would be held in by 3 different sized Torex screws, and an impossible to get at bolt which was put in the wrong way round before the whole thing was assembled. SignatureRob >|| (Hmmm? I wonder what kind of guillotine Citroën would design?) >| Don't know about that, but you can bet it would have the smoothest >| suspension system in the world :-) > But the blade would be held in by 3 different sized Torex screws, and > an impossible to get at bolt which was put in the wrong way round > before the whole thing was assembled. You've never changed the alternator on a Saab 900, if you think the French are the worst for that... > || I'd sign your petition, but since I'm a Yank, I doubt if that would > || do. I sympathize with you about your pettifogging bureauarcracy. We [quoted text clipped - 15 lines] > impossible to get at bolt which was put in the wrong way round before the > whole thing was assembled. LOL :-) SignatureRegards Steve G
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