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Car Forum / Dodge / Dodge Trucks / August 2005My 2003 truck is rusting
My 2003 has rust. I had chrome wheel well covers put on by the dodge dealership where I bought the truck new. Also had moulded dodge mud flaps put on.Put these on to protect the truck from stone chips. Just a couple weeks ago, I took of the flaps off to clean them. Some sand got trapped inside the flaps and washed them. Then I decided to take the chrome wheel well covers of to see if anything needed cleaning. Found the paint was bubbling and peeling in two spots. About the size of a silver dollar. Where the holes were drilled to fasten the mouldings, the paint around them was rusting. My local dodge dealer (who didn't sell me the truck) took pictures of this and sent them out to the area rep. They tell me on Thursday, that Dodge will not fix the rust. Its not the fault of the truck. The installation of accessories is not covered. So who ever drilled the holes to install the guards will have to cover the problem. Had two estimates to have the four fenders pained about $1300. Now the shop foreman, where I bought my truck at Dodge City in Saskatoon, is going to talk to the same area rep. I know Dodge will tell him its not the trucks fault, that the holes should never been drilled. Question is: Dodge sells these mouldings through parts so how are you suppose to install them, screws come with them. Anyhow I know I'm going to be stuck with the painting. Got to get it fixed, can not have it get worse. I'm going to get the truck painted even if I have to pay for it. So, anybody out there, don't put those moulding on. Salt and sand gets between them and the paint. Friday, went out and drove a 2005 ford F250, crewcab. Very nice riding truck. Might have to go Monday and price it out. Dodge has really disappointed me, after 5 dodge trucks, maybe time to switch. dale Yonzie: The "Mopar" molded splash guards come with screws that have a sealer on the threads to prevent this very thing from happening. I would mention this to the dealer and he should mention this to their rep as well. If you would have installed aftermarket splash guards, I would say you are on your own, but since you installed Mopar accessories, they have an obligation to help you out. Mike > My 2003 has rust. I had chrome wheel well covers put on by the dodge > dealership where I bought the truck new. Also had moulded dodge mud flaps [quoted text clipped - 39 lines] > switch. > dale The splash guards were not the problem, I had the chrome wheel well trims installed by dodge and they were not mopar parts. So dodge won't do anything, I have to afte the dealership. So this afternoon, I talked to the shop foreman, and he is still waiting to hear from dodge. Here in Sask they mix salt and sand in the city for icy streets. Inside the moulded mud flaps, they were have filled with sand. This was far down enough that it did not touch any paint. I would recommend anyone who has any trims on, to take them off now and then to clean out any cunk. dale On 8/8/05 3:22 AM, in article 11fe91jdapeuo44@corp.supernews.com, "Mike Simmons" <mikesim@yhti.net> wrote: > Yonzie: > [quoted text clipped - 50 lines] >> switch. >> dale > The splash guards were not the problem, I had the chrome wheel well trims > installed by dodge and they were not mopar parts. > So dodge won't do anything, I have to afte the dealership. Ooops, sorry... I misread your OP. Mike > So this afternoon, I talked to the shop foreman, and he is still waiting > to [quoted text clipped - 80 lines] >>> switch. >>> dale > Friday, went out and drove a 2005 ford F250, crewcab. Very nice riding > truck. Might have to go Monday and price it out. > > Dodge has really disappointed me, after 5 dodge trucks, maybe time to > switch. > dale Dale, before you go to ford, take a 05 CTD for a spin. Roy > > Friday, went out and drove a 2005 ford F250, crewcab. Very nice riding > > truck. Might have to go Monday and price it out. [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > > Dale, before you go to ford, take a 05 CTD for a spin. Yea, that makes sence. Dodge screws him with damage that they caused with their parts and service so he punishes them by buying another and more expensive Dodge, yea, that will teach em, LOL.  SignatureIf at first you don't succeed, you're not cut out for skydiving On 8/8/05 6:42 AM, in article xrSdnX5Hv_yxzmrfRVn-hg@comcast.com, "Roy" >> Friday, went out and drove a 2005 ford F250, crewcab. Very nice riding >> truck. Might have to go Monday and price it out. [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > > Roy I got the cummins, I really like it and get good mileage. Today drove to Saskatoon, 80 mile trip from the farm, was reading around 21 mpg. I priced out a 2005, they want 18,000 diff with taxes. The trucks up here are around 59,000. With the new staff pricing incentive on 2005, it comes down to around 52,000. > Friday, went out and drove a 2005 ford F250, crewcab. Very nice riding > truck. Might have to go Monday and price it out. Yeah, by all means, trade in your truck because someone installed some fender trim incorrectly. Who exactly are you trying to spite here? It was not just someone, it was a Dodge dealership and they used Dodge performance parts. If they don't back up their work or parts, only an idiot would stick with them. SignatureIf at first you don't succeed, you're not cut out for skydiving > > Friday, went out and drove a 2005 ford F250, crewcab. Very nice riding > > truck. Might have to go Monday and price it out. > > Yeah, by all means, trade in your truck because someone installed some > fender trim incorrectly. Who exactly are you trying to spite here? > It was not just someone, it was a Dodge dealership and they used Dodge > performance parts. If they don't back up their work or parts, only an > idiot > would stick with them. Right... so instead of either fixing the problem and continuing on, or going back to the people who screwed up the installation and getting them to fix it (as they should - they're certainly at fault), he's going to take a bath on either selling or trading the truck, losing at least three times what it will cost to fix it. And while we're on the subject of fixing it, a $1,300 paint job? Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't the rust behind the trim, which is why he didn't notice it until removing the trim? If so, who really cares if it's an exact match or not... mask the area off, sand the rust away, shoot it with a good rust-inhibiting primer (out of a can), then put on a coat of 'close-enough' top coat, and put the trim back on. There... problem solved - for about $30 in materials and a few hours of work. But that aside - my original point was that getting rid of the truck is stupid. Sure, by all means, never do business with that dealer again. But getting rid of the truck impacts no one but himself. On 8/8/05 5:00 PM, in article DuRJe.2675$RZ2.880@newsread3.news.atl.earthlink.net, "Tom Lawrence" <tNlOaSwPrAeMnMcIeN5G@earthlink.net> wrote: >> It was not just someone, it was a Dodge dealership and they used Dodge >> performance parts. If they don't back up their work or parts, only an [quoted text clipped - 17 lines] > stupid. Sure, by all means, never do business with that dealer again. But > getting rid of the truck impacts no one but himself. Tom, I'm not going to put on the chrome mouldings back on after it gets painted. Today, I talked to bodyshop. They have to paint the whole fenders. The mouldings on the top edges rubbed the paint. I tried waxing the marks off,but they still show up. Its the salt and sand that gets into these mouldings, so I'm not going to take them off and put them back on during the winter when I wash the truck. The screws that they used to install these mouldings, were badly rusted. Had philip screw heads and some had to drill out. Next question????? What can a person do to protect that narrow piece of fender, the inside lip from stone chips?? Look at the Ford, some gm, they have a plastic trim factory installed around the wheel well. I had an 97 expedition with these on, had no problem with the paint or rust. <snippage> > Next question????? > What can a person do to protect that narrow piece of fender, the inside > lip > from stone chips?? Dale, Check out http://www.goline-x.com/other_uses.shtml or http://tinyurl.com/dbfte and go down the red listed 'other applications' and you will find "General Automotive; Jeep floorboards, Van interiors, wheel well undercoating, motorcycle fenders (underside), body panels as rock guard protection, etc" That was Line-X, this is Rino. http://www.rhinolinings.com/RL/main/protection/colorpicker.jsp or http://tinyurl.com/dggcp shows how they do simular, but will color match. SignatureFMB (only one B in FMB) > > It was not just someone, it was a Dodge dealership and they used Dodge > > performance parts. If they don't back up their work or parts, only an [quoted text clipped - 17 lines] > stupid. Sure, by all means, never do business with that dealer again. But > getting rid of the truck impacts no one but himself. It appears that we have both misread each others posts. I never suggested that he dump his vehicle and take a loss from doing so. What I said was that if DC is unwilling to protect it's customers from damage caused by one of its dealerships and he buys another one whenever, then all he is really doing is rewarding the company for screwing him over and encouraging it do it again. It looked to me like your post suggested that he just make and pay for the repairs himself and forget about it and stick with Dodge and the dealer. I can see in your response that this is not the case, but the entire company must take some blame here, not just the dealer and if they are unwilling to correct the problem that they caused.... SignatureIf at first you don't succeed, you're not cut out for skydiving > It appears that we have both misread each others posts. I never suggested > that he dump his vehicle and take a loss from doing so. No, I know that. The OP suggested that himself. > dealer. I can see in your response that this is not the case, but the > entire company must take some blame here, not just the dealer and if they > are unwilling to correct the problem that they caused.... That's akin to saying you'll never buy a John Deere tractor again, because the last time it was in the repair shop, they scratched it up. DC has absolutely nothing to do with the problems he is having... that responsibility lies solely with the dealership service department. Remember, this wasn't a warranty repair - this was the dealership installing an aftermarket part at the customer's request - no different than if a private shop did the same. The dealership is it's own business. Yes, they sell DC products, and represent DC for warranty purposes, but the work they do for profit is their work, and theirs alone. By all means, never go back to that dealership for service again, but to condemn the manufacturer, and to go further and dump the vehicle at a financial loss, makes absolutely no sense. > > It appears that we have both misread each others posts. I never suggested > > that he dump his vehicle and take a loss from doing so. > > No, I know that. The OP suggested that himself. That is not how I read it. What I thought he was saying is that with the way Dodge handled the situation, his next new truck may be a FORD, not that he was going to dump his current Dodge for a FORD tomorrow but I could be wrong. > > dealer. I can see in your response that this is not the case, but the > > entire company must take some blame here, not just the dealer and if they > > are unwilling to correct the problem that they caused.... > > That's akin to saying you'll never buy a John Deere tractor again, because > the last time it was in the repair shop, they scratched it up. LOL, that has no valid comparrison to it at all. > DC has absolutely nothing to do with the problems he is having... that > responsibility lies solely with the dealership service department. Which is a paid representitive of DC. > Remember, this wasn't a warranty repair - this was the dealership installing > an aftermarket part at the customer's request - no different than if a > private shop did the same. It most certainly is different. A private shop has no connection with the manufacturer at all and is not authorized by DC to do anything to the vehicle, very different than a dealership. > The dealership is it's own business. Yep, and part of their business is representing the manufacturer. The manufacturer is responsible for making sure that they are represented correctly and by people willing to stand behind their work, warranty or not. > Yes, they > sell DC products, and represent DC for warranty purposes, but the work they > do for profit is their work, and theirs alone. I do not agree, not when it comes to them making modifications on the vehicles that they are authorized by the manufacturer to perform service and warranty work on. > By all means, never go back to that dealership for service again, but to > condemn the manufacturer, and to go further and dump the vehicle at a > financial loss, makes absolutely no sense. I agree with not dumping the vehicle at a loss unless he intends to get rid of it before it becomes a worthless rusted hulk. As for condemning the manufacturer, they should be with the way they appeared to have handled the situation. They authorized this dealership service department to work on these vehicles and should put pressure on them to correct errors that they caused, not just blow off the customer like they seemed to have done. SignatureIf at first you don't succeed, you're not cut out for skydiving >> > It appears that we have both misread each others posts. I never > suggested [quoted text clipped - 18 lines] > > LOL, that has no valid comparrison to it at all. That is an _excellent_ comparison! >> DC has absolutely nothing to do with the problems he is having... that >> responsibility lies solely with the dealership service department. > > Which is a paid representitive of DC. DC does not pay the dealership a dime! Any profits the dealership earns are the result of sales by the dealer. >> Remember, this wasn't a warranty repair - this was the dealership > installing [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > manufacturer at all and is not authorized by DC to do anything to the > vehicle, very different than a dealership. No different than the dealership! By installing an aftermarket accessory, DC is take out of the loop and thus has no culpablity for the problem. Sorry if you can't/won't understand this. >> The dealership is it's own business. > > Yep, and part of their business is representing the manufacturer. When the dealership chose to sell/install an aftermarket part, the dealership no longer represents DC. The > manufacturer is responsible for making sure that they are represented > correctly and by people willing to stand behind their work, warranty or > not. The dealership does have an obligation to stand behind the work that they do, that's undeniable, but DC has no obligation whatsoever in this issue. >> Yes, they >> sell DC products, and represent DC for warranty purposes, but the work [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > and > warranty work on. You may not agree, but facts is facts! >> By all means, never go back to that dealership for service again, but to >> condemn the manufacturer, and to go further and dump the vehicle at a [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > these vehicles and should put pressure on them to correct errors that they > caused, not just blow off the customer like they seemed to have done. > >> > It appears that we have both misread each others posts. I never > > suggested [quoted text clipped - 20 lines] > > That is an _excellent_ comparison! Really???? How??? How does the improper installation of a part by someone that represents the manufacturer compare with a mechanic accidently scratching the vehicle? > >> DC has absolutely nothing to do with the problems he is having... that > >> responsibility lies solely with the dealership service department. [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > DC does not pay the dealership a dime! Any profits the dealership earns are > the result of sales by the dealer. Really???? Then I guess that your dealership does its warranty work for free and if not, then you are a P A I D representative.. > >> Remember, this wasn't a warranty repair - this was the dealership > > installing [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > > No different than the dealership! Of course you would say that Mike, you work for one but it is still not true. > By installing an aftermarket accessory, > DC is take out of the loop and thus has no culpablity for the problem. > Sorry if you can't/won't understand this. You are correct in that they have no legal obligation but they still have an obligation to their customers that the dealerships that carry their name will stand behind the work they do and if not, then DC is no better than their worst dealership and anyone that buys from them in that case is a fool. > >> The dealership is it's own business. > > > > Yep, and part of their business is representing the manufacturer. > > When the dealership chose to sell/install an aftermarket part, the > dealership no longer represents DC. LOL, as long as the dealership carries the manufacturers name on the sign outside and does the work on one of the manufacturers vehicles for whatever reason, it always represents the manufacturer which in this case is DC. > The > > manufacturer is responsible for making sure that they are represented [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > The dealership does have an obligation to stand behind the work that they > do, that's undeniable, but DC has no obligation whatsoever in this issue. DC does have an obligation to its customers if it intends on keeping them. The days of complete blind brand loyalty has for the most part come to and end. While it may still seem to exist in a limited way in here, in reality, many will and are doing what Dale is considering, IOW, screw me once, shame on you, screw me twice, shame on me. > >> Yes, they > >> sell DC products, and represent DC for warranty purposes, but the work [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > > You may not agree, but facts is facts! You are correct here Mike and "the facts is" that if the manufacturer is unwilling to help a customer resolve a problem with one of its representatives, then it no longer deserves that customers business. SignatureIf at first you don't succeed, you're not cut out for skydiving >> >> > It appears that we have both misread each others posts. I never >> > suggested [quoted text clipped - 56 lines] > Of course you would say that Mike, you work for one but it is still not > true. OK, you _know_ that this is not true, how? My simple minded little friend, I have a dealer warranty and policy guidebook in my office which is as thick as a NYC phone book. In it, it covers virtually every scenario a D/C dealer might encounter. I have over time, read this book from cover to cover. In this tome, it specifically states that D/C is not liable for any aftermarket accessories sold by the dealership. Further, the dealer agreement that every dealer _must_ sign specifically exempts D/C from any liability due to an error by the dealership. Legal minds have worked these things out over _many_ years! How is it then, that your knowledge is superior to those who actually _DO_ this for a living? Just because you _wish_ something is so _doesn't_ make it so. Now, why don't you go buy that Ferd you've been talking about and go annoy the snot of of that NG with your "superior" knowledge of the industry.... hmmmmmm? Mike >> By installing an aftermarket accessory, >> DC is take out of the loop and thus has no culpablity for the problem. [quoted text clipped - 51 lines] > unwilling to help a customer resolve a problem with one of its > representatives, then it no longer deserves that customers business. > OK, you _know_ that this is not true, how? My simple minded little friend, > I have a dealer warranty and policy guidebook in my office which is as thick [quoted text clipped - 11 lines] > > Mike Mike, are you referring to me to go and buy that ford and go and annoy some other news group? dale >> OK, you _know_ that this is not true, how? My simple minded little >> friend, [quoted text clipped - 24 lines] > other news group? > dale No! T-Bone... he keeps saying he's gonna buy a Ferd.... I'm just encouranging him to do so..... I would _hate_ to see you buy a Ferd :^) Mike On 8/11/05 3:11 AM, in article 11fm5h7ghs5gq19@corp.supernews.com, "Mike Simmons" <mikesim@yhti.net> wrote: >>> OK, you _know_ that this is not true, how? My simple minded little >>> friend, [quoted text clipped - 29 lines] > > Mike No, gonna keep the dodge. dale > >> > It most certainly is different. A private shop has no connection with > > the [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > > OK, you _know_ that this is not true, how? Because like I said Mike, an independant shop does not have the DC name on the sign outside and is not normally authorized to make warranty repairs nor does it have the ability to sell new DC vehicles. > My simple minded little friend, > I have a dealer warranty and policy guidebook in my office which is as thick > as a NYC phone book. In it, it covers virtually every scenario a D/C dealer > might encounter. I have over time, read this book from cover to cover. Well good for you but what does this have to do with anything? I already said that DC was not financially obligated to correct non authorized dealer fuckups but they are or at least should be morally obligated to help the customer when one of their representatives screws up. Even if they don't pay for it themselfs, they should put pressure on the dealership that caused the problem to take care of it or at least make it look that way to the customer. > In this tome, it specifically states that D/C is not liable for any aftermarket > accessories sold by the dealership. IOW, they will not be held financially responsible and I already said that but the point is that they are still responsible for their own reputation and that comes from their dealer network. If they choose not to do so, then they should expect to lose customers. Perhaps that is why they could never get past #3, if they are still even that high. > Further, the dealer agreement that > every dealer _must_ sign specifically exempts D/C from any liability due to > an error by the dealership. Once again, this is a financial liability they are protecting themselves from and not the point of the argument. > Legal minds have worked these things out over > _many_ years! How is it then, that your knowledge is superior to those who > actually _DO_ this for a living? LOL, I am still waiting for you to make a point about what I said or are you confused? I said that a dealership is different than an independent because the dealership is connected to the manufacturer and the level of expectation of the customer will be higher at a dealership. This is the case whether you like it or not. > Just because you _wish_ something is so > _doesn't_ make it so. Now, why don't you go buy that Ferd you've been > talking about and go annoy the snot of of that NG with your "superior" > knowledge of the industry.... hmmmmmm? Even if I do buy a Ford (a much better looking truck), I will not leave. You would all miss me far to much :-) SignatureIf at first you don't succeed, you're not cut out for skydiving > Even if I do buy a Ford (a much better looking truck), I will not leave. > You would all miss me far to much :-) Nobody is leaving this newsgroup, I locked the damn door and no one is going till all the beer is gone :)) > DC does have an obligation to its customers if it intends on keeping them. > The days of complete blind brand loyalty has for the most part come to and > end. While it may still seem to exist in a limited way in here, in reality, > many will and are doing what Dale is considering, IOW, screw me once, shame > on you, screw me twice, shame on me. >>>> Yes, they >>>> sell DC products, and represent DC for warranty purposes, but the work [quoted text clipped - 11 lines] > unwilling to help a customer resolve a problem with one of its > representatives, then it no longer deserves that customers business. Tbone, you have said that very well. Damn, should hire you as my lawyer and take dodge city to small claims court. :)))) > > DC does have an obligation to its customers if it intends on keeping them. > > The days of complete blind brand loyalty has for the most part come to and [quoted text clipped - 19 lines] > Tbone, you have said that very well. Damn, should hire you as my lawyer and > take dodge city to small claims court. :)))) LOL, thanks Dale. SignatureIf at first you don't succeed, you're not cut out for skydiving >>> DC has absolutely nothing to do with the problems he is having... that >>> responsibility lies solely with the dealership service department. [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] >DC does not pay the dealership a dime! Any profits the dealership earns are >the result of sales by the dealer. What is considered "aftermarket"? I went in and spec'ed a couple of trucks online and there were several "factory" options available with notes that said "shipped with the vehicle for dealer installation." For example, nerf bars on a GM truck (Oh, leave me alone, I was just looking ;-) If the dealer is installing factory shipped items, are they covered under the original vehicle warranty at any dealership? And another question: Undercoating! This is a cash cow for a dealer. I have seen where undercoating will void a rust-through warranty because it may leave "pockets" where salt and other stuff can be trapped. But if the dealer does the undercoating prior to delivery, how would that affect my rust-through warranty? Greg >>> That's akin to saying you'll never buy a John Deere tractor again, >>> because [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > > That is an _excellent_ comparison! Yeah:)) and I own Jd equipment, combine, 3 tractors, weed wacker, Jd battery chargers, cordless drills, flashlites, swather, use Jd oil, filters, batteries, my dog has a john deere leash, etc. etc. and if anyone scratches my Jd 4440 tractor Iwill kick them in the nuts:)))) > That is not how I read it. That's because you don't read... >> Friday, went out and drove a 2005 ford F250, crewcab. Very nice riding >> truck. Might have to go Monday and price it out. >> Dodge has really disappointed me, after 5 dodge trucks, maybe time to >> switch. Now - tell me how that doesn't sound like he's going to trade his truck in on an '05 SD. > It most certainly is different. A private shop has no connection with the > manufacturer at all and is not authorized by DC to do anything to the > vehicle, very different than a dealership. So you think DC authorized the installation of some aftermarket fender trim? And if they didn't authorize it, then the dealership was acting independently, weren't they? Just like a dealer that installs a performance chip on a truck (and there are dealers that do that). Try getting DC to pay for engine damage with an aftermarket performance box on it, if you didn't go back to the installing dealer. >> The dealership is it's own business. > > Yep, and part of their business is representing the manufacturer. Yeah - part of their business is. But not EVERYTHING they do is backed by the manufacturer. Hell, I've seen GM/Ford trucks in my Dodge dealer's service department. Obviously, they're not representing DC when working on those vehicles - so why should this situation be different? > I do not agree I don't really care if you agree or not, Tom... I'm telling you the way it is (and Mike, who DOES THIS FOR A LIVING, is telling you the same thing)... the fact that you choose to ignore it and substitute your view of reality is, well... you. > not when it comes to them making modifications on the > vehicles that they are authorized by the manufacturer to perform service > and > warranty work on. If DC didn't authorize them to install those trim pieces (and I'm 99.99% sure they did not), then how can you hold DC responsible? Dealerships are INDEPENDENT from the manufacturer. Yes, they but product from the manufacturer, sell that product, and perform factory-authorized service on said product. DC specifically disclaims responsibility for any damage caused by the installation of non-authorized parts (read your warranty manual), and this is exactly the situation here. The dealership did the install, so THEY are responsible for the results - NOT DC. > of it before it becomes a worthless rusted hulk. As for condemning the > manufacturer, they should be with the way they appeared to have handled > the > situation. I'm not saying I support the way they handled it, either... I'm just not naive enough to expect anything different. > They authorized this dealership service department to work on > these vehicles Not to install non-factory parts, they didn't.... that's the part you're ignoring here. >> That is not how I read it. > [quoted text clipped - 36 lines] > thing)... the fact that you choose to ignore it and substitute your view > of reality is, well... you. Damn! Couldn't have said it better myself. Just because he doesn't agree, that makes it reality.... jeesh... I dunno why I waste my time... Mike >> not when it comes to them making modifications on the >> vehicles that they are authorized by the manufacturer to perform service [quoted text clipped - 23 lines] > Not to install non-factory parts, they didn't.... that's the part you're > ignoring here. > That's because you don't read... jeez Tom, are you having the same problem with Tbone that everyone else has? Well, thats because its YOU/US, not him, WTF are you thinking? > I don't really care if you agree or not, Tom... I'm telling you the way > it is (and Mike, who DOES THIS FOR A LIVING, is telling you the same > thing)... the fact that you choose to ignore it and substitute your view > of reality is, well... you. Tbone rejects reality and substitutes his own, just like mythbuster Adam. I'd just like to be a fly on the wall when Tbone hears this line, "I'm not fixing it because its your problem." His HUD would immediately display a list of culpable subjects, listed in order of availability. None of these would be "ME". A quick right click and a mid screen list of options such as "Blame", "point at", "indictate", "insinuate," would drop down from the subject, and a quick selection would allow him to place a degree of agression towards the subject. Once selected, the subject would have subheadings to choose from, one being "main issue", another being "diversion issue", and of course "off topic entirely". In order of selection, each one would be either the main tactic or a side tactic, and a neat little graphic with several buttons on it for quick selection would appear. Each button would be labelled so he could insert the topics at will. Across the bottom would be four big buttons, "opposition is full of sh.t, but I'm not sure how", "Sexual innuendo" (a pop up with selection buttons "hetero", "homo" "your mama" "your girlfriend/wife" would appear, with confirming buttons "OK" or "NOT OK, BUT DO IT ANYWAY" at the bottom) "Spin" (pop up with "Shaken" "stirred" "aw f.ck, what did I say anyway?", with "OK" and "Do it now before I feel like an a.s" at the bottom) and of course, "back pedal at warp factor ten Mr. Sulu". Ok, ran out of ideas, I'm hungry. Just remember, its US, not him, and everything in his little world will be AAAAAA friggin OK!!! SignatureMax Give a man a match, and he is warm for a short while. Light him on fire, and he is warm for the rest of his life. >> That is not how I read it. > [quoted text clipped - 64 lines] > Not to install non-factory parts, they didn't.... that's the part you're > ignoring here. On 8/10/05 5:10 PM, in article WPvKe.3841$Je.391@newsread2.news.atl.earthlink.net, "Tom Lawrence" <tNlOaSwPrAeMnMcIeN5G@earthlink.net> wrote: >> That is not how I read it. > [quoted text clipped - 19 lines] > for engine damage with an aftermarket performance box on it, if you didn't > go back to the installing dealer. Listen Tom: I talked about chipping the truck, the same dealer said not to do it and there be no warranty if something goes wrong. I had no problem with that. But when I bought wheel well trims, from them along with running boards, floor mats, bug screens, truck box mat, mud flaps, tailgate cap, door sills trim, door edge guards and a locking gas cap. THEY NEVER TOLD ME: Look Dale, yeah we will install these for you if you like, but you know those wheel well trims could give you problems later if you don't take them off every once in awhile and clean them so salt doesn't eat the paint away or If we drill holes on your truck, the paint will be damaged and will cause blah, blah blah Do you understand Tom what I'm getting at??? They, the dealer, never told me these were not a Dodge product and that Dodge would not warranty them if anything went wrong. I would like to know why dealerships sell these things and why Dodge lets them.(the wheel well trims that are not mopar) Dale > Do you understand Tom what I'm getting at??? I absolutely do, and you absolutely have a legitimate complaint. My only point here is, your remedy lies with this dealership. You shouldn't expect, nor will you get, any assistance from DC Corporate, since your problem was caused by the installation of non-factory-approved parts. I'm not saying it's right - I'm just saying that's how it is. > I would like to know why dealerships sell these things Because they can make a quick buck. > and why Dodge lets them. Again - you're under the misconception that the dealership is run by DC. They are not. They are an independent business entity that is in a contractual relationship with DC to sell and service their products. Any activities that they engage in, or any products they sell, not covered by that contract are their responsibility, and theirs alone. On 8/11/05 5:24 AM, in article SzGKe.4051$Je.3490@newsread2.news.atl.earthlink.net, "Tom Lawrence" <tNlOaSwPrAeMnMcIeN5G@earthlink.net> wrote: >> Do you understand Tom what I'm getting at??? > [quoted text clipped - 15 lines] > activities that they engage in, or any products they sell, not covered by > that contract are their responsibility, and theirs alone. Thanks everyone for your replys. I learnt a good lesson, kinga like buyer beware of what you do to your truck. Next time I will ask if its ok and get it in writing, before I add something Dale TehBoner wrote: > It was not just someone, it was a Dodge dealership and they used Dodge > performance parts. If they don't back up their work or parts, only an idiot > would stick with them. Nothing more to say after reading that they were not Dodge parts? On 8/9/05 11:59 PM, in article ddc4ul$fkl$1@domitilla.aioe.org, "Boxed" <wrapped@netscape.net> wrote: > TehBoner wrote: >> It was not just someone, it was a Dodge dealership and they used Dodge >> performance parts. If they don't back up their work or parts, only an idiot >> would stick with them. > > Nothing more to say after reading that they were not Dodge parts? Yes, but they still sell them and install them. > On 8/9/05 11:59 PM, in article ddc4ul$fkl$1@domitilla.aioe.org, "Boxed" > <wrapped@netscape.net> wrote: [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > > Yes, but they still sell them and install them. Then "they" represent the manufacturer of the trim, which should have come with stainless screws, sealant, and instructions. I can buy a cheap watch, a baseball cap, sunglasses, and die-cast toys at my local Dodge parts store too. "They" sell them. On 8/10/05 10:56 PM, in article ddelj7$qqs$1@domitilla.aioe.org, "Sparkle" <wrapped@netscape.net> wrote: >> On 8/9/05 11:59 PM, in article ddc4ul$fkl$1@domitilla.aioe.org, "Boxed" >> <wrapped@netscape.net> wrote: [quoted text clipped - 15 lines] > I can buy a cheap watch, a baseball cap, sunglasses, and die-cast toys > at my local Dodge parts store too. "They" sell them. The screws weren't stainless steel, they had philips heads and were all rusted As far as cheap dodge caps and toys, they sure as hell ain't cheap, maybe made cheap, but not cheap in price :))) > TehBoner wrote: > > It was not just someone, it was a Dodge dealership and they used Dodge > > performance parts. If they don't back up their work or parts, only an idiot > > would stick with them. > > Nothing more to say after reading that they were not Dodge parts? It really doesn't matter. They are an official representative of the manufacturer and were the ones who installed them. DC at the least should force this dealership to make the repairs, even at the dealerships cost. To simply dismiss it like they did shows their more concerned about a few more dollars over customer loyalty and if that is what they want.... SignatureIf at first you don't succeed, you're not cut out for skydiving On 8/8/05 7:18 AM, in article PYIJe.2487$RZ2.1546@newsread3.news.atl.earthlink.net, "Tom Lawrence" <tNlOaSwPrAeMnMcIeN5G@earthlink.net> wrote: >> Friday, went out and drove a 2005 ford F250, crewcab. Very nice riding >> truck. Might have to go Monday and price it out. > > Yeah, by all means, trade in your truck because someone installed some > fender trim incorrectly. Who exactly are you trying to spite here? No one Tom, just telling you what's happening. Like I said, the Ford was a lot better riding truck, had more room (talking about a F250 crewcab Lariat, I have a Laraime 2500). The rear flaps on my dakota made the wheel wells rust.The flap on the driver side fell off early on two years later the well on the passenger side was almost rusted thru the drivers side had no rust seems the flap caused more water & road salt spray to rust the well.Your better off without the flaps JMHO DAK 94 Dodge will fix it ... you may have to chew a little a.s ... but they'll take care of it. BTW, if you think switching to a Ford will fix this type of B.S. you are sorely mistaken. You will lose your a.s on the sale of the truck you have now ... and you'll pay an average of 5k more than a comparably equiped Dodge. I had a Ford truck a few years back. It had the 1 year/12000 mile warranty. I took the truck in for some issues with the brakes that were not wear related. The truck had 11750 miles on it. After leaving it with them for 3 days I went to pick it up and nothing was fixed. By the time I got back the dealer I had 12050 miles. They refused to fix it under warranty because I was over the 12k mark. I'd still own a Ford, just not from them. Craig C. On 8/8/05 5:42 PM, in article 1123544521.659322.147420@g14g2000cwa.googlegroups.com, "craig@metronet.com" > Dodge will fix it ... you may have to chew a little a.s ... but they'll > take care of it. BTW, if you think switching to a Ford will fix this > type of B.S. you are sorely mistaken. You will lose your a.s on the > sale of the truck you have now ... and you'll pay an average of 5k more > than a comparably equiped Dodge. They want 18000 difference on a new 05. > I had a Ford truck a few years back. It had the 1 year/12000 mile > warranty. I took the truck in for some issues with the brakes that [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > > Craig C. Hey...aren't that using galvanized panels on the truck doors now??? Just curious. Fred > On 8/8/05 5:42 PM, in article > 1123544521.659322.147420@g14g2000cwa.googlegroups.com, [quoted text clipped - 16 lines] >> >> Craig C. 18000.00 Canadian Dollars? What is that 25.00 USD? If so, that's a pretty good deal. Buy the Ford. I'm just trying to lighten the mood. (Everyone gets so worked up about the dumbest sh.t. Did you have any idea how explosive a discussion rust on YOUR truck would be?). :) Go Eagles! Craig C. > 18000.00 Canadian Dollars? What is that 25.00 USD? If so, that's a > pretty good deal. Buy the Ford. [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > > Craig C. But if it happened on my truck I would be just as pissed as Dale. Especially if DC won't help him. I bought a 95 Firebird convertible new and the dealership where I bought it promised to replace the optically distorted windshield. Well they did but with one much worse. Apprarently whoever supplied GM with windshields for the Firebird back then had a serious quality control problem. The dealership refused to put another one in it. I then appealed to GM who told me they always support their dealers. So to make a long story short GM was forced to buy the car back. There were other problems with the car that GM wouldn't fix. I haven't looked at another GM product since then. And I won't. Why? Because of the way I was treated by the Pontiac dealer and GM. And loking at GM's sales and financial info I don't believe I was the only one. Companies need to be held accountable for the actions of the dealers. After all the dealers are acting on behalf of these companies. Bob Go Cowboys!! I was actually just bitching about how out-of-hand some posters on this NG get. I, too, would be good and pissed about this situation with DC. Not so pissed, however, to take a bath on trading my truck in for another vehicle. Cowboys? BWAhahahhahh ahhahah ahahahahahah hahahaha The only thing more used up than the 'new and improved' QB, is the coach. :) Craig C. Very likely the ONLY Eagles fan in Dallas. On 8/10/05 12:07 PM, in article QeudnYL4WKwV32ffRVn-3w@texas.net, "Bob M" <ram1220@vzavenue.net> wrote: >> 18000.00 Canadian Dollars? What is that 25.00 USD? If so, that's a >> pretty good deal. Buy the Ford. [quoted text clipped - 25 lines] > > Go Cowboys!! As of Monday, I'm still waiting to hear from Dodge City in Saskatoon, as to what the dodge rep will do. I did not threaten, or cursed anyone out. Just told them we got a problem and it's not my fault. The wife has a 2001 Envoy, bought from North Battleford (where I live close by) GM dealer. They have been very good and have had good service. I have had good service from my local dodge dealer, one mechanic is a friend. Anyhow, couldn't make a deal from the salesman back in 2003, and went to Saskatoon and got a better deal. I have had good service done there too. I still would take my truck there, both dodge dealers. Nothing built today is 100%. Everyone has had problems of some sort with their brands. dale >18000.00 Canadian Dollars? What is that 25.00 USD? If so, that's a >pretty good deal. Buy the Ford. [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > >Craig C. Never mind rust. I was worked up because I'm being forced to get new front and rear bumpers on my 3500 as the result of a guy kissing the backend of my truck with a Ford Taurus. He hit me hard enough to shove me into the vehicle in front of me even though I was stopped with my foot still on the brakes and the wheels locked. No other damage except the bumpers and the electrical connector on the trailer hitch. My wife had backed into something a couple of years ago and put a one inch scratch on the rear bumper. When I told her about the accident, I told her I was getting the rear bumper replaced so she wouldn't have to feel guilty about scratching "MY" truck anymore. ;-) On 8/10/05 3:32 PM, in article pbskf198e6340cj32vrhicappjcccg78ou@4ax.com, >> 18000.00 Canadian Dollars? What is that 25.00 USD? If so, that's a >> pretty good deal. Buy the Ford. [quoted text clipped - 19 lines] > I told her I was getting the rear bumper replaced so she wouldn't have > to feel guilty about scratching "MY" truck anymore. ;-) Craig, you better of had a dozen roses with you when you said that to your wife:))) 18,000 cdn is $14,857 us On 8/10/05 10:01 AM, in article 1123688096.793491.326800@g43g2000cwa.googlegroups.com, "craig@metronet.com" > 18000.00 Canadian Dollars? What is that 25.00 USD? If so, that's a > pretty good deal. Buy the Ford. [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > > Craig C. Dale, There are times when common sense applies and this is one. Yes, the installer should have known better, but so should you. Anytime the paint and or the zinc coating is violated, you risk this problem. When I received my 2004, the first thing I did was put the truck up on jack stands and looked for all those things the factory didn't paint and properly protect. The factory had done a pretty good job in comparison to both Ford and GM and it still took me 3 days to dissassemble, paint and reinstall. Ultimately the vehicle is yours. You bought it and you also bought all the problems or advantages that come with it. Step up to the mirror and address the guy you see and tell him to assume responsibility for his actions. Furthermore, if you use this as justification to switch to Ford and a clearly inferior product, you are in denial. Steve > My 2003 has rust. I had chrome wheel well covers put on by the dodge > dealership where I bought the truck new. Also had moulded dodge mud flaps [quoted text clipped - 39 lines] > switch. > dale Ok Steve: what would you put on your truck to protect it from stone chips? Like you got to have mud flaps, so you have to drill a couple of holes to install them, right. How about protecting the wheel well lips. Do you leave the metal bare and use touch up the paint once in awhile for any chips??? I'm asking these questions because I'm going to get it painted and not putting anything back on. I have the mopar running boards, they are ok and they are mounted to the underside. They help prevent damage to the rocker panel. Fmb, suggested xliner, will look into that. As for assuming responsibility for my actions, you are wrong on that part. Dodge sold me the wheel well covers, even though they weren't mopar, and installed them for me. Like if they told me not to put them on and why, I would of never had them put on. Yesterday, the sales manager told me that they now realize they should be taken off once in awhile and cleaned. They are finding out I'm not the only one having trouble. Only mine the paint started to lift and surface rust is showing up. And also, they are still installling them. And I'm not in denial, Ford trucks are not an inferior product. On 8/9/05 10:59 PM, in article ddc1j6$6qj$01$1@news.t-online.com, "Steve Lusardi" <stevenospam@lusardi.de> wrote: > Dale, > There are times when common sense applies and this is one. Yes, the [quoted text clipped - 54 lines] >> switch. >> dale > Ok Steve: what would you put on your truck to protect it from stone chips? > Like you got to have mud flaps, so you have to drill a couple of holes to [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > > Fmb, suggested xliner, will look into that. Dale, Ditto on the Rhino lining. Several trucks at the local 4x4 jamboree have had it sprayed on rockers, wheel wells, or complete underside of body and it looks good and lasts forever. Denny >> Ok Steve: what would you put on your truck to protect it from stone >> chips? [quoted text clipped - 16 lines] > had it sprayed on rockers, wheel wells, or complete underside of body and > it looks good and lasts forever. That would work well down low. but he had wheel opening moldings on it that seem to be the problem. Those things were always a problem, probably why most makers don't offer them. Roy Go Pats!! > Denny > Ok Steve: what would you put on your truck to protect it from stone chips? > Like you got to have mud flaps, so you have to drill a couple of holes to [quoted text clipped - 21 lines] > > And I'm not in denial, Ford trucks are not an inferior product. Personally I would clean out the wheel wells real good and use bed liner inside them. On the outer lip areas use some clear chip guard spray. It sprays over the paint and prevents chipping. As for installing the molding. DON'T use screws. Buy some good 3M trim tape, clean the area with some alcohol and use a solid strip of tape applied to the edges of the molding to seal it to the body. That way dirt/salt cannot get behind it and cause problems. Mud flaps are installed the same way, then one stainless screw on top and bottom, then clear sealant around both screws. The big thing is ANY rust MUST be removed and treated before you do anything. Either grind it all off or cut out and replace it. Leaving anything behind and you WILL regret it. Dale, All the late model cars use VERY light guage sheet steel to save weight. However, all the sheet metal is coated at the factory before final paint. Chips in the paint will not cause rust. Simple touchup paint suffices. Obviously any chips that deform the metal has the potential to damage the coating. This coating is also applied to the flooring panels as well. I think any holes drilled or punched anywhere on the vehicle is a risk and should not be done. The mudflaps on my '04 CTD are factory flaps and do not mount to the sheet metal. They have special fasteners that mount to the plastic polypropolene inner fenders. Some of the responders have mentioned Rhino liner and other similar products. Yes, they are very good, but they add a lot of weight and they have the potential to create cavities that can collect water without detection because of poor bonding due to oil and grease not properly cleaned first. My comment about Ford is only partially correct. I apologize. Ford has no equivelent to the Cummins. The Power Stroke isn't even in the same league. However, I wasn't thinking about their gas engines. The Ford V8s are much better that the Dodge competition. Maybe the Hemi will prove itself, but I'm not buying one yet. > Ok Steve: what would you put on your truck to protect it from stone chips? > Like you got to have mud flaps, so you have to drill a couple of holes to [quoted text clipped - 97 lines] >>> switch. >>> dale Steve, I have never seen factory installed flaps. All the dodge trucks sitting in lots have: no mud flaps on them or rubber mud flaps with the dealers name printed on apiece of stainless steel attached to the flap. These flaps, each have 4 hex head screws holding them on. Quess what, they had to drill holes on the truck wheel well lip to put them on. Today I seen a customers Ford f350, have chrome wheel well mouldings. Just like the ones I had on, but instead of screwing them on, they had some sort of a clip holding them in place. Steve, I would like to know more about these mud flaps you have, them don't get screwed on. What''s a ctd, cummins turbo diesel???? dale On 8/10/05 2:42 PM, in article dddors$vhl$03$1@news.t-online.com, "Steve Lusardi" <stevenospam@lusardi.de> wrote: > Dale, > All the late model cars use VERY light guage sheet steel to save weight. [quoted text clipped - 118 lines] >>>> switch. >>>> dale Dale, I said factory flaps, not factory installed. I installed them and simply followed the directions that came with them. I have an '04 3500 dually with the Cummins. There are no holes in the sheet metal front or back. I believe I still have the installation directions. I will look for them and make copies if you like, but these are Dodge rubber mud flaps. Now, I also have a set new in the box of Husky brand that I bought and I'll give them away free because of the same problem. Steve > Steve, I have never seen factory installed flaps. All the dodge trucks > sitting in lots have: no mud flaps on them [quoted text clipped - 163 lines] >>>>> switch. >>>>> dale Oh, ok, have to check out the duallys. I had gotten factory flaps, they were the moulded ones, not the flat black rubber ones. They have the ram head logo on them and they were in the Dodge asseriories brochure. They had to have holes drilled to be screwed. Two holes on the painted surface drilled and couple holes drilled into inside black plastic liners. That's ok, don't bother looking. I will use the same flaps because the holes are already drilled. When I get the truck painted, the holes will be not a problem. On 8/12/05 3:24 PM, in article ddj416$ad2$05$1@news.t-online.com, "Steve Lusardi" <stevenospam@lusardi.de> wrote: > Dale, > I said factory flaps, not factory installed. I installed them and simply [quoted text clipped - 173 lines] >>>>>> switch. >>>>>> dale > Ok Steve: what would you put on your truck to protect it from stone chips? > Like you got to have mud flaps, so you have to drill a couple of holes to [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > I'm asking these questions because I'm going to get it painted and not > putting anything back on. http://www.topoftheline.com/paintprotectiontape.html I've never seen this stuff, just happened to have the site bookmarked. On 8/10/05 11:28 PM, in article ddenfv$seb$1@domitilla.aioe.org, "Sparkle" <wrapped@netscape.net> wrote: >> Ok Steve: what would you put on your truck to protect it from stone chips? >> Like you got to have mud flaps, so you have to drill a couple of holes to [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > > I've never seen this stuff, just happened to have the site bookmarked. That looks like a good way to protect the paint. > On 8/10/05 11:28 PM, in article ddenfv$seb$1@domitilla.aioe.org, "Sparkle" > <wrapped@netscape.net> wrote: [quoted text clipped - 16 lines] > > That looks like a good way to protect the paint. Yes and no. Not all that noticeable on the rocker but looks like crap any place imo. Just put on some good wax and get a bottle of touch up paint. Hell, it is a truck. Next those clear plastic seat covers will be back.<G> Roy > Just put on some good wax and get a bottle of touch up paint. Hell, it is a > truck. Next those clear plastic seat covers will be back.<G> > > Roy > > Will they be heated? Bob >> Just put on some good wax and get a bottle of touch up paint. Hell, it >> is a truck. Next those clear plastic seat covers will be back.<G> >> >> Roy >> > Will they be heated? Yup, if they are on Mike's seats. <VBG< Roy > Bob On 8/11/05 2:10 PM, in article j76dnZ2dnZ2w207DnZ2dnVgtZt-dnZ2dRVn-y52dnZ0@texas.net, "Bob M" <ram1220@vzavenue.net> wrote: >> Just put on some good wax and get a bottle of touch up paint. Hell, it is a >> truck. Next those clear plastic seat covers will be back.<G> [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > > Bob Here we go again :))) On 8/11/05 7:02 AM, in article RcudnZ2dnZ1Ismq0nZ2dnfTRZt-dnZ2dRVn-zZ2dnZ0@comcast.com, "Roy" >> On 8/10/05 11:28 PM, in article ddenfv$seb$1@domitilla.aioe.org, "Sparkle" >> <wrapped@netscape.net> wrote: [quoted text clipped - 23 lines] > > Roy Right, I remember those clear seat covers. Dad had a 63 galaxie 500. Didn't need seat belts, in hot weather your a.s was stuck on and you were not going to go anywhere. Winter time, Doctors were happy. Everyone was getting hemorrhoids,freeze your a.s on that plastic :))) |
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