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Car Forum / Dodge / Dodge Trucks / September 2006Pinion depth setting, 9.25
I've set up about 5 axles, a mix of Ford 9" and D44 and have the equipment, experience, and success rate ;^) The issue is I always have done a complete gear swap. I only plan to replace the bearings on my 98 since the R&P look fine and I caught the bearings early (beginning of some fretting on the carrier and pinion bearings). Since I am keeping the R&P, is it possible to use the same pinion depth shims for the new bearings (I'll replace the shims, just use the same pack thickness)? My reason for asking is that it usually is impossible to remove the new bearing once installed without destroying it should I need to adjust the shim pack further. I suppose I can measure the critical dimensions on the old pinion with the old bearing and make any adjustments for the new bearing being different, but since the old bearing is worn I might not get a good reading. Alternatively I could hone the new bearing or pinion so that I get a fit that is easier to remove but that is a pain... Any ideas? Thanks, -Bruce > I've set up about 5 axles, a mix of Ford 9" and D44 and have the > equipment, [quoted text clipped - 26 lines] > Thanks, > -Bruce Bruce, The 9.25 adjusts a lot like an 8.75 Mopar. If you're using the same gears but all new bearings you will need to at least check the pinion depth as the new bearings can be off a few thousandths then adjust if needed. Then set your lash and depth according to specs. Budd  SignaturePosted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com Thanks people! I checked the pinion depth and mesh pattern before removal so I have a good reference. I suppose I could just go for it and use a new shim of same thickness, then install and recheck the depth. If it comes up short, I could add shims behind the bearing race in the housing. If it comes up long I have a problem (50-50 chance)! I'm glad I read about the problems people are having with pinion bearings here. I started to get the "whine" that at first sounded like tires. I figured that at 70k my gears should still be fine but after reading about early failures I blocked up the rear and ran it unloaded and in gear...(ugh)! Just as a data point, the truck is a 98 w/70k miles (2wd, 5.8L, 1500) and has towed the occasional heavy load but in general has been treated well. The only other problem has been an annoying coolant leak at the thermostat housing. -Bruce > Thanks people! > [quoted text clipped - 17 lines] > > -Bruce As a further data point, has the fluid been changed at regular intervals? Roy > As a further data point, has the fluid been changed at regular intervals? > > Roy Maybe not as often as it should have, every 25K or so (two changes since new). -Bruce >> As a further data point, has the fluid been changed at regular intervals? >> [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > > -Bruce Thanks much for the info. Roy What's really odd, in my opinion, is the old 79 D-150 my son now drives has the 9.25 axle in it with over 400,000 miles on it, AFAIK. I put one set of outer bearings in it at just under 300,000, otherwise, untouched. So, what's gone wrong with that axle design since 79???? SignatureBudd Cochran John 3:16-17, Ephesians 2:8-9, Romans 3:23, 6:23 "Our Constitution was made only for a moral and religious people. It is wholly inadequate for the government of any other." (John Adams) > Thanks people! > [quoted text clipped - 17 lines] > > -Bruce SignaturePosted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com There is nothing wrong with the design Budd, what is wrong is the cost cutting in the parts (such as in the bearings) used to make them now. SignatureIf at first you don't succeed, you're not cut out for skydiving > What's really odd, in my opinion, is the old 79 D-150 my son now drives has > the 9.25 axle in it with over 400,000 miles on it, AFAIK. I put one set of [quoted text clipped - 23 lines] > > > > -Bruce Chinese bearings instead of US made Timkens? SignatureBudd Cochran John 3:16-17, Ephesians 2:8-9, Romans 3:23, 6:23 "Our Constitution was made only for a moral and religious people. It is wholly inadequate for the government of any other." (John Adams) > There is nothing wrong with the design Budd, what is wrong is the cost > cutting in the parts (such as in the bearings) used to make them now. [quoted text clipped - 28 lines] >> > >> > -Bruce SignaturePosted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com > Chinese bearings instead of US made Timkens? This is what I was expecting based on what I read. The bearing at the yoke end of the pinion shaft is/was a Timken. I haven't pulled the carrier bearings of the case yet but I'd wager they are Timken as well. -Bruce I also rebuilt my rear axle recently for this problem and was very surprised to pull out failed TIMKEN bearings. I bought the complete bearing set from local hi-lo/ oreilly auto parts place for around $100. It's the National / Bower BCA brand and everything went together fine with great input and assistance from this group and especially Tom Lawrence. I just wished I could have found a reasonable priced locker unit to put in the housing instead of the stock single track unit. I just didn't have the $450 that most places wanted. My truck is a '98 1500 quad cab with 81K miles on it. Sounds just like yours, pulled a few trailers, but nothing near abuse. As far as changing fluids, they've all been serviced regularly, but I've never seen bearing failure like this in anything I've owned. We also have a 2000 Durango with 52K on the clock. I guess it'll be next. Curtis > Chinese bearings instead of US made Timkens? > [quoted text clipped - 31 lines] >>> > >>> > -Bruce <LOL> If you're referring to my old 79 and it's 9.25" diff, it was originally a BLM truck for the State of Colorado, went thru two more owners then I got it at just under 250,000 miles. The engine was overhauled ( actually, just a nickel rebuild, rings, bearings and a valve job) and then with 2000 miles on the new parts, towed/hauled an estimated 12000 lbs over Vail Pass near Denver Colorado in late 1999. Nope, it was never abused . . . . SignatureBudd Cochran John 3:16-17, Ephesians 2:8-9, Romans 3:23, 6:23 "Our Constitution was made only for a moral and religious people. It is wholly inadequate for the government of any other." (John Adams) >I also rebuilt my rear axle recently for this problem and > was very surprised to pull out failed TIMKEN bearings. [quoted text clipped - 58 lines] >>>> > >>>> > -Bruce SignaturePosted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com Sadly, it appears that even though Timken bearings are still being used (as seen by others posts here), cost cutting to keep the contract has degraded their quality as well. QC is expensive and cutting it down a notch can save significant $$$$ but their is a cost to doing it as seen with the increased failure rate or these rears. I can only hope that the replacement ones they sell to the open market are still of the same quality that they built their reputation on in the past but I have my doubts. SignatureIf at first you don't succeed, you're not cut out for skydiving > Chinese bearings instead of US made Timkens? > [quoted text clipped - 30 lines] > >> > > >> > -Bruce I'll still buy Timken and other US brands as often as I can to keep our money here and not in foreign pockets. I just bought Timken bearings from Car Parts for the rear axle of my Lebaron. The quality looks excellent to me. SignatureBudd Cochran John 3:16-17, Ephesians 2:8-9, Romans 3:23, 6:23 "Our Constitution was made only for a moral and religious people. It is wholly inadequate for the government of any other." (John Adams) > Sadly, it appears that even though Timken bearings are still being used > (as [quoted text clipped - 53 lines] >> >> > >> >> > -Bruce SignaturePosted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com > I'll still buy Timken and other US brands as often as I can to keep our > money here and not in foreign pockets. On this point we completely agree. > I just bought Timken bearings from Car Parts for the rear axle of my > Lebaron. The quality looks excellent to me. I need to buy some replacement bearings in a month or two as well so thanks for the heads up. It looks like I will buy Timken as well. SignatureIf at first you don't succeed, you're not cut out for skydiving > Chinese bearings instead of US made Timkens? Pulled my Dexter axle apart today. Outer wheel bearings are made in Russia, inners are Chinese. Wonder if the grease came from Iran? Al <LOL> Dey's just dino squeezins. SignatureBudd Cochran John 3:16-17, Ephesians 2:8-9, Romans 3:23, 6:23 "Our Constitution was made only for a moral and religious people. It is wholly inadequate for the government of any other." (John Adams) >> Chinese bearings instead of US made Timkens? > > Pulled my Dexter axle apart today. Outer wheel bearings are made in > Russia, inners are Chinese. Wonder if the grease came from Iran? > > Al SignaturePosted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com ><LOL> > >Dey's just dino squeezins. The ones that existed before the world was created according to your book? beekeep Ah, look who's injecting religious content. . . . . SignatureBudd Cochran John 3:16-17, Ephesians 2:8-9, Romans 3:23, 6:23 "Our Constitution was made only for a moral and religious people. It is wholly inadequate for the government of any other." (John Adams) > On Thu, 28 Sep 2006 05:56:32 -0600, "Budd Cochran" <mr-d150@preciscom > SPAM.net> [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > > beekeep SignaturePosted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com How about explaining it Mr. Corrections? Where exactly did all that oil come from? SignatureIf at first you don't succeed, you're not cut out for skydiving > Ah, look who's injecting religious content. . . . . > [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > > > > beekeep No. SignatureBudd Cochran John 3:16-17, Ephesians 2:8-9, Romans 3:23, 6:23 "Our Constitution was made only for a moral and religious people. It is wholly inadequate for the government of any other." (John Adams) > How about explaining it Mr. Corrections? Where exactly did all that oil > come from? [quoted text clipped - 13 lines] >> > >> > beekeep SignaturePosted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com Then once again, you don't do what you say you will. Imagine that.. SignatureIf at first you don't succeed, you're not cut out for skydiving > No. > [quoted text clipped - 15 lines] > >> > > >> > beekeep > Then once again, you don't do what you say you will. Imagine that.. I kinda think he didn't bite. Roy >> No. >> [quoted text clipped - 17 lines] >> >> > >> >> > beekeep The sad thing is I wasn't even trolling. I just wanted to see if even once he would stand up to his word. I guess he did in the past but anymore...... SignatureIf at first you don't succeed, you're not cut out for skydiving > > > Then once again, you don't do what you say you will. Imagine that.. [quoted text clipped - 23 lines] > >> >> > > >> >> > beekeep >The sad thing is I wasn't even trolling. I just wanted to see if even once >he would stand up to his word. I guess he did in the past but anymore...... He was a hoot years ago and could mentally spar with the best of them. Now he seams to have run out of ammo. Maybe we should take up a collection and get him some Aricept. beekeep Yah got it in one, Roy. SignatureBudd Cochran John 3:16-17, Ephesians 2:8-9, Romans 3:23, 6:23 "Our Constitution was made only for a moral and religious people. It is wholly inadequate for the government of any other." (John Adams) >> Then once again, you don't do what you say you will. Imagine that.. > [quoted text clipped - 23 lines] >>> >> > >>> >> > beekeep SignaturePosted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com Yea, sure he did, LOL! SignatureIf at first you don't succeed, you're not cut out for skydiving > Yah got it in one, Roy. > [quoted text clipped - 25 lines] > >>> >> > > >>> >> > beekeep >How about explaining it Mr. Corrections? Where exactly did all that oil >come from? Mute point. Everytime he opens his mouth he makes it clear that he was just trolling and doesn't believe half the stuff he says. Hell he can't even keep his stories strait half the time. It just goes to show the not only is the mind a terrible thing to waste, its a terrible thing to loose as well. beekeep > Mute point. Everytime he opens his mouth he makes it clear that he was > just [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > the mind > a terrible thing to waste, its a terrible thing to loose as well. Well, fortunately it wasn't a "moot" point, with a "straight" story about how terrible it is to "lose" one's mind. >> Mute point. Everytime he opens his mouth he makes it clear that he was >> just [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] >Well, fortunately it wasn't a "moot" point, with a "straight" story about >how terrible it is to "lose" one's mind. Spellen ain't my 4tay. beekeep > I've set up about 5 axles, a mix of Ford 9" and D44 and have the equipment, > experience, and success rate ;^) [quoted text clipped - 17 lines] > Thanks, > -Bruce The manufacturing tolerances of the pinion bearings are way tighter than the choices you have for pinion depth shims, IOWs, the bearings are made closer to size than you can account for with a .001" pinion shim. Replace the bearings and use the shim that's in there now. You could hone out a new rear bearing to use to check pinion depth, but I wouldn't install it permanently, you'd risk it spinning on the pinion gear and causing unwanted damage. |
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