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Car Forum / Ferrari Cars / October 2004

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Barchetta Site - Ferraris by S/N

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TigerRace1 - 06 Oct 2004 00:18 GMT
Did you guys know that the detailed information of Ferrari by S/N is no longer
available on the Barchetta website? They have a link that supposedly explains
it, but I only get the first page. I can't get to page 2. Can anyone else?

http://www.barchetta.cc/All.Ferraris/events-stories/events/2004/nice-try/n
ice-try/index.html#_TOP

I loved this feature. This sux.

C.
Aaron - 06 Oct 2004 01:15 GMT
There's no link there....  A work in progress, perhaps?

   Aaron

> Did you guys know that the detailed information of Ferrari by S/N is no longer
> available on the Barchetta website? They have a link that supposedly explains
[quoted text clipped - 6 lines]
>
> C.
TigerRace1 - 06 Oct 2004 02:54 GMT
<<There's no link there...>>

Let's try this...

http://www.Barchetta.cc/All.Ferraris/All.Ferraris.html

On the home page there is a link on the right side of the page to the story
supposedly explaining what happened to the Ferraris by S/N pages. The title is:

Barchetta Serial Number Section is...

Can you find it with that?

C.
Aaron - 06 Oct 2004 03:01 GMT
> Let's try this...
>
[quoted text clipped - 8 lines]
>
> C.

Yeah, I found the page, but there's not link in the code to go to the next
page.  If you go to the story page, near the upper-right of the page there's
a little arrow pointing to the right.  I'm assuming that this is supposed to
be going to to next page, but the author of the page neglected to actually
insert a link in the HTML.

   Aaron
TigerRace1 - 06 Oct 2004 09:19 GMT
<<Yeah, I found the page, but there's not link in the code to go to the next
page.>>

Okie doke. Thought it might just be my browser. I guess I'll e-mail them.

C.
F2004: 15 of 17* - 11 Oct 2004 21:57 GMT
><<Yeah, I found the page, but there's not link in the code to go to the next
>page.>>
>Okie doke. Thought it might just be my browser. I guess I'll e-mail them.

...Whatever happened?
MC - 06 Oct 2004 06:00 GMT
> <<There's no link there...>>
>
[quoted text clipped - 10 lines]
>
> C.

Doesn't work.  Goes to a blank screen and hangs.  I use Mozilla, so
maybe things are different in POS Internet Explorer, I don't know.  And
maybe I don't have enough patience, but I did give it a few minutes.

They must be "in flux".

MC
MC - 06 Oct 2004 01:29 GMT
> Did you guys know that the detailed information of Ferrari by S/N is no longer
> available on the Barchetta website? They have a link that supposedly explains
[quoted text clipped - 6 lines]
>
> C.

I couldn't get anything either.  At first I thought it was just your
link was bad, because in your message it was split-lined, BUT ...
nothing doing at Barchetta.cc.  I've had suspicions over the last couple
years that they were kind of winding down with that site, I would always
get a page or two that led nowhere, but it does look like maybe they're
starting to offer paid subscriptions/memberships, and only those such
equipped can see the serial number section?

MC
TigerRace1 - 06 Oct 2004 03:02 GMT
<<I couldn't get anything either.  At first I thought it was just your link was
bad, because in your message it was split-lined, BUT ... nothing doing at
Barchetta.cc.>>

Not sure what you guys are getting. The link shows up on a couple of lines for
me too, but I can copy and paste it. Did you make sure to remove the space that
appears between the *n* and *ice* in the second *nice-try*?

<<it does look like maybe they're
starting to offer paid subscriptions/memberships, and only those such equipped
can see the serial number section?>>

I think that was the case in the recent past, but they have now pulled the
detailed info by s/n off the site completely and I want to know why. Try
looking for this story again. Please! <g>

C.
MC - 06 Oct 2004 06:05 GMT
> <<I couldn't get anything either.  At first I thought it was just your link was
> bad, because in your message it was split-lined, BUT ... nothing doing at
[quoted text clipped - 13 lines]
>
> C.

I pasted it in correctly, but it's still the same.  I have a feeling
they're just in the middle of redoing that section, and instead of
taking the whole web site down while they do it they're just doing it
"on the fly".  You could email or contact them, I suppose.  Or, if
they're local, I can go over there and terrorize their office and beat
the web guys and the editors with a garden hose (and a two by four -
it's an unbeatable combination!) until they get their sh.t together or
admit that they're a third-rate operation that couldn't program their
way out of a Hefty bag ....

You know, desperate times calling for desperate measures?

But that wouldn't be very nice.  I always loved that web site, until
they stopped putting in wallpaper-sized photos and went with the small
or "photo album" style galleries.  I hate when I can't get good stuff
for free any more.

MC

(disclaimer - take above with grain of salt)
J.C. - 06 Oct 2004 15:43 GMT
> Did you guys know that the detailed information of Ferrari by S/N is no longer
> available on the Barchetta website? They have a link that supposedly explains
> it, but I only get the first page. I can't get to page 2. Can anyone else?
>
> http://www.barchetta.cc/All.Ferraris/events-stories/events/2004/nice-try/n
> ice-try/index.html#_TOP

Nope. Page 1 ends with a caption saying "The clone turns up" and "Part
2", but there is no clickable link to it.

Signature

J.C.

F2004: 14 of 16* - 06 Oct 2004 21:37 GMT
>Did you guys know that the detailed information of Ferrari by S/N is no longer
>available on the Barchetta website? They have a link that supposedly explains
>it, but I only get the first page. I can't get to page 2. Can anyone else?
>
>http://www.barchetta.cc/All.Ferraris/events-stories/events/2004/nice-try/n
>ice-try/index.html#_TOP

Same problem, using Mozilla.

>I loved this feature. This sux.

When Kroyman split his car in Monterey there was much discussion, in
another forum as it merited precious little interest here, of the
provenance of his car, allegedly s/n 193.

Barchetta is still useful and accessible if one can devise the syntax
for the car at interest:

http://www.barchetta.cc/english/All.Ferraris/Detail/Formula/193.F399.99.htm
TigerRace1 - 07 Oct 2004 04:58 GMT
<<Barchetta is still useful and accessible if one can devise the syntax for the
car at interest:>>

My impression is that those pages aren't going to last.

BB,
Arachne
F2004: 14 of 16* - 07 Oct 2004 13:38 GMT
><<Barchetta is still useful and accessible if one can devise the syntax for the
>car at interest:>>
>
>My impression is that those pages aren't going to last.

...Been there since Monterey at least (at which time the s/n facility
was already restricted).
TigerRace1 - 07 Oct 2004 20:12 GMT
<<Barchetta is still useful and accessible if one can devise the syntax for the
car at interest:>>

My impression is that those pages aren't going to last.

C.
MC - 07 Oct 2004 05:02 GMT
> When Kroyman split his car in Monterey there was much discussion, in
> another forum as it merited precious little interest here, of the
> provenance of his car, allegedly s/n 193.

C'mon man - focus!  On at least two recent occasions I dished out some
feeble criticism of the guy, no substance, kind of like an MC blue plate
special.  Hell, I put his name in the title.  He's rich.  He imports
Ferraris.  But he can't drive.  He probably couldn't drive a Toyota
Corolla any better.

All vintage cars have a "museum piece" quality to me.  To see a rich guy
play Bumper Cars or Demolition Derby (or Jeep Days at Rincon) with a car
like that, I want to force a mandatory "qualifying period" for anybody
considering buying a fine vintage - or current - exotic.  (Anybody not
named Derek Bell, Stirling Moss, Elliot Forbes-Robinson, Hurley Haywood,
etc.)

And for something as holy as a past Ferrari F1 car - one whose seat back
might still carry a whiff of Schumi sweat, no less - there should be
written and track testing.  Grueling testing.  Maybe a
lease-instead-of-purchase deal (like they did with the F50).  I consider
cars like that to be treasures, not rich-man-toys that go to the highest
bidder/fattest wallet.  At least have a Skip Barber card with you when
you go to Barrett-Jackson.

MC
Tifosi308 the Serial Number Geek - 07 Oct 2004 05:33 GMT
I clicked through, no problem.  Here's the page about the car in question.

1757GT 60/mar/11   *** 5th ***
250 GT SWB Berlinetta Competizione, alloy, LHD engine no. interno - 274 F
Red  No side vents, no brake ducts
Date Result Event Driver # Reference
60 - Vittorio De Micheli, I "FI 131131"
60  1st Coppa Gallenga Vittorio De Micheli    
60  1st  Predappio Rocca della Camine Vittorio De Micheli      
60  3rd OA Coppa Fagioli Vittorio De Micheli    
60/jul/24 dnf Trieste-Opicina hillclimb Vittorio De Micheli #190  
60  1st IC Coppa Cantoni Brescia Vittorio De Micheli    
61 1st IC Coppa Borzachini Vittorio De Micheli      
61  2nd OA San Benedetto Aqua Viva Vittorio De Micheli      
61  1st IC Coppa Fagioli Vittorio De Micheli #280    
61  2nd IC Alghero Scala Piccada Vittorio De Micheli    
61/jul/23 7th IC Trieste-Opicina hillclimb Vittorio De Micheli #236 T-O p281
62  2nd IC Predappio Rocca della Camine Vittorio De Micheli #30    
62  1st IC San Baronto Vittorio De Micheli      
62 - Prince of Liechtenstein - silver/tan  
67 - Erwin Eckert, Windischbrugg, CH - Grand Garage Erwin Eckert  
67/mar - Larry Dent, Auburn, IN, USA - member of the Ford Mk 4 Le Mans pit crew

69/oct/30 - Ervin Williams, Hickory, NC, USA  
71 - Don Fong, Atlanta, GA, USA  
75 - still with Fong, with original engine but apart, all windows plexiglass,
sliding, no vent windows, exterior with Monza style gas cap,  dashboard in
black wrinkle, dull aluminum trim around the windows.  
7. - Carl Reinhard, Marietta, GA, USA - $25,000 incl. restoration  
78 - restored by Don Fong  
85 - new alloy nose of body redone by Robbie Robinson, Woodstock, GA, USA;  The
original alloy body was saved and is visible in the photos taken when the car
was purchased and picked up by Mike Sheehan of European Auto Sales.  
86/nov16 - inspected in great detail by Sam Smith, agent for Mike Sheehan,
European Auto Sales.  Engine block, timing cover stamped #1757 GT.  Many trim
pieces inscribed with # 1757.  Original transmission was stolen and replacement
transmission case came from another car but was a ribbed cage alloy gearbox.
Alloy body was original from doors back but nose and hood were new, fitted with
alloy riveted fuel tank and outside filler cap.  
86/nov/18 - Mike Sheehan's EAS, Costa Mesa, CA, USA  
86/dec/04 - Kenji Sasamoto, J  
87/feb - completely restored by EAS, Costa Mesa, CA, USA  
87/oct/05 - flown to Japan by Japan Air lines  
87/oct  Monte Miglia, Japan Kenji Sasamoto  
90/nov/18  TI Ferrari Festival, Circuit Aida, J Kenji Sasamoto  
95/apr/08 1st IC Concours d'Elegance Japan, class 2 Kenji Sasamoto  
95/aug/18-20  Monterey Historic Races Kenji Sasamoto #10  
96/apr/23-27  Tour Auto Sasamoto/Uyeno  
96/aug/16-18  Monterey Historic Races Kenji Sasamoto  "25 56"
97/jan/25  Cavallino Classic Kenji Sasamoto  
98/sep/22-23  2nd Neko Historic Automobile Festival, Japan Kenji Sasamoto  
99/jun/06  Ferrari Club Japan, 10th Anniversary Meet, Suzuka Kenji Sasamoto
 
Note:
In 1997 a second car turned up, obviously owned by Romano Bernardoni of
Bologna, Italy, which claimed to be 1757GT. This car is regarded as a replica
and it is said to be built on a Ferrari 250 GTE 2+2 chassis 2757GT renumbered
to 1757GT and using engine s/n 1653GT (250 GT PF Coupe).

This car was seen by Wouter Brand in 2000 on Monaco plates "X 989".

In July 2000, this car was offered for Lit. 850mio (approx. $450,000) by the
Jaguar dealer of Bologna, Italy

Further history about this second car is not confirmed, but Romano Bernardoni
is currently arrested (2004).

MC - 07 Oct 2004 07:08 GMT
> I clicked through, no problem.  Here's the page about the car in question.

And what are you, some kind of Barchetta.cc secret agent?  You promised
to teach me all the secret handshakes ....

:-(

MC

"Do you pick your feet in Poughkeepsie?"
Tifosi308 the Serial Number Geek - 08 Oct 2004 02:12 GMT
MC wrote...

>And what are you, some kind of Barchetta.cc secret agent?  

Well, I have provided them data and photos in the past.  Perhaps I have a free
pass.

T308
(Secret Barchettaman....)
TigerRace1 - 08 Oct 2004 10:23 GMT
<<Well, I have provided them data and photos in the past. >>

So have I. They were even going to add my Challenge car to their database.

C.
F2004: 14 of 16* - 07 Oct 2004 13:40 GMT
>I clicked through, no problem.  Here's the page about the car in question.

Clicked through *what*?

That can't be part two of the story...

[s/n info snipped]
F2004: 14 of 16* - 07 Oct 2004 13:39 GMT
>> When Kroyman split his car in Monterey there was much discussion, in
>> another forum as it merited precious little interest here, of the
[quoted text clipped - 5 lines]
>Ferraris.  But he can't drive.  He probably couldn't drive a Toyota
>Corolla any better.

SEE the aaf thread "Ferrari 1999 F1 Car Breaks In Two At Monterey
Historics!!!"  Just you & I, bemoaning the lack of interest, and Tiger
chastising you for something, iirc.

A Ferrari F1 car broke like a Kit-Kat bar and aaf went into hiding.

...Meanwhile a thread about Corvette dash fur went into triple digits.

>All vintage cars have a "museum piece" quality to me.  To see a rich guy
>play Bumper Cars or Demolition Derby (or Jeep Days at Rincon) with a car
[quoted text clipped - 10 lines]
>bidder/fattest wallet.  At least have a Skip Barber card with you when
>you go to Barrett-Jackson.

I'll trump you:  At least have a Skip Barber card before pulling your
POS Taurus into traffic.
TigerRace1 - 07 Oct 2004 20:09 GMT
<<All vintage cars have a "museum piece" quality to me.  To see a rich guy play
Bumper Cars or Demolition Derby (or Jeep Days at Rincon) with a car like that,
I want to force a mandatory "qualifying period" for anybody considering buying
a fine vintage - or current - exotic.  (Anybody not named Derek Bell, Stirling
Moss, Elliot Forbes-Robinson, Hurley Haywood, etc.)>>

You've apparently not seen Stirling  Moss race lately. His style hasn't changed
from when he was a professional. I refer you to the Monterey Historics of 1999
where Moss took out three cars including the Le Mans winning DBR-1 that he was
driving.

http://gtv2000.georgecogps.com/monterey99/moss.html

Note, that is Dad in one of his Devin SSs (blue car with white stripe) avoiding
Moss going into Turn 2. AutoWeek tried to blame Dad for forcing Moss into the
dirt in Turn 2. I wrote them a rather lengthy letter correcting their
misapphrehension.

This topic is being discussed in Ferrari Chat too:

http://ferrarichat.com/forum/showthread.php?s=a24c5fb5dc34b6f670aff60a267b
e868&t=32696&page=1&pp=20

<<And for something as holy as a past Ferrari F1 car - one whose seat back
might still carry a whiff of Schumi sweat, no less - there should be written
and track testing. >>

Schumi doesn't sweat, but I get your meaning. <g>

C.
 
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