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Car Forum / Ferrari Cars / July 2005Help - thinking of buying a 328
Many of you can probably remember this feeling, I am thinking about purchasing my first Ferrari and I am very nervous. The car would be driven very little throughout the year - as to be expected. I have been searching the net for guidance but perhaps some previous owners can help here. I have a decent income but I am not at all wealthy and would have to stretch my budget to finance a percent of this car. I am looking at a 1998 328 and I am looking for some guidance here. The car is in superb condition and has 9,500 miles on it. Asking price of $59,000. 5 speed manual. It has already had its 15,000 mile tune up. What else to I need to know ? According to the sales guy this car is steel body instead of aluminum (does that make sense to you guys ?) What are the advantages/disadvantages ? HP rating of 270 I believe - seems kinda low. How does it perform ? How does it handle onramps - skiddsh ? No power steering or breaks - how do you guys like that ? Every car I have owned has had PS/PB. Of course they won't let me test drive this car yet. Is the car somewhat dependable or will I have constant tune-ups and maintenance ? I also live in the north with 5 months of snow. Although my garage doesnt freeze, it isnt heated either. The auto insurance I checked on - not a problem. Would a Testarossa be a better choice ? I could also choose a Corvette/Viper/Lotus Help please, Is this purchase worth it or problematic ? Sorry for all the questions, just looking for a friendly previous owner. Thanks -Jeff >Many of you can probably remember this feeling, I am thinking about >purchasing my first Ferrari and I am very nervous. [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] >I have a decent income but I am not at all wealthy and would have to stretch >my budget to finance a percent of this car. I am looking at a 1998 328 No, you're not. >and I am looking for some guidance here. > >The car is in superb condition and has 9,500 miles on it. Asking price of >$59,000. GTB or GTS? Sounds high, by about 9K. Check out www.ferrarimarketletter.com. >5 speed manual. It has already had its 15,000 mile tune up. What >else to I need to know ? Tons... Original Ferrari V-8, Keith Bleumel. >According to the sales guy this car is steel body instead of aluminum (does >that make sense to you guys ?) Yes. >What are the advantages/disadvantages ? It's a body on frame design: None/weight. >HP rating of 270 I believe - seems kinda low. How does it perform ? How does >it handle onramps - skiddsh ? > >No power steering or breaks - how do you guys like that ? Every car I have >owned has had PS/PB. A 328 should have power brakes, iirc. >Of course they won't let me test drive this car yet. Shop somewhere else. >Is the car somewhat dependable or will I have constant tune-ups and >maintenance ? The most reliable and usable of the 3X8's by all accounts. >I also live in the north with 5 months of snow. Although my garage doesnt >freeze, it isnt heated either. > >The auto insurance I checked on - not a problem. > >Would a Testarossa be a better choice ? No. Not by any reasoned measure. >I could also choose a Corvette/Viper/Lotus You certainly could. >Help please, Is this purchase worth it or problematic ? I vote "Problematic": The dealer won't let you drive it and the low miles means it hasn't been used and probably not properly maintained. The 328 I was looking it is overpriced. Better deals can be found - with a few more miles. Great comments about the low milage. I didn't think about the fact that a car *needs* to be driven enough to keep rubber/fluids/pumps working properly. I find your comment about the 328 being the best of the 3X8 cars interesting because now I am finding a few 348s newer & cheaper with about 20K miles. Do you have an opion on the 348 ? Thanks to everyone else for the feedback. I do drive a Vette C5 now, but instead of buying a newer Vette, I am thinking about the used Ferraris. They have been my favorite car for as long as I can remember and I'm sure everyone here can understand that. I am ready to trade in newer faster technology for the exotic car of my dreams. So, I guess my choices are 328,348, 355 (wait a few more years) Thanks to all. >>Many of you can probably remember this feeling, I am thinking about >>purchasing my first Ferrari and I am very nervous. [quoted text clipped - 70 lines] > I vote "Problematic": The dealer won't let you drive it and the low > miles means it hasn't been used and probably not properly maintained. > Do you have an opion on the 348 ? It's a good bit more expensive to service than a 308 or 328 due to the engine being mounted north-south instead of east- west. It's also more modern, faster, and the handling is more, umm, well it's allegedly difficult at the limit but it may have more ultimate grip than a 328. Pay less now, pay much more at service time. You might still be in 328 territory but drive a few cars, get quotes on servicing, and see what you think. -Matt- "..." >> Do you have an opion on the 348 ? > [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > You might still be in 328 territory but drive a few cars, get > quotes on servicing, and see what you think. What he said . 348 handling issues are there but only at speeds you shouldn't be doing on a public road. On the track may people seem to have had good luck with fitting spacers & widening the track a bit. I''ve never driven one so you should talk to people who have (www.ferrarichat.com). There is a dedicated band of very content 348 owners who wouldn't trade their cars. There are a few other gremlins i.e. the climate control panel that dies, costs over £400 and basically can't be replaced anymore because there are no new ones. That said there are people who have managed to fix these. The 348 engine is a peach - just expensive to service. The gearbox is also good but they changed the linkage to cables (from rods in the 328). These cables can bind when the car is worked very hard alledgedly making the gearshift very stiff. The 355 engine is clearly more highly stressed and does suffer from some unfortunate issues - i.e. a propensity to blow exhaust headers & chew up valves & guides. That said there are some cars/engines that just seem to be fine with both of these and have no issues. More worryingly there has been a spate of 355s bursting into flames (a UK chap on F'chat lost his 355 to this a couple of months ago). Something to do with the fuel lines. A few others report close calls & finding various leakes in the fuel system. These can all be rectified/modified & made safe so something to be aware of but not worry about - i.e. if you bought a 355 you'd want to get it checked out very quickly. Look here also for relative servicing costs: http://www.hamletcg.co.uk/qv/offers.htm - Dealer prices would be a good bit higher than these. These are also UK prices - servicing costs in the US seem to be higher still. I. Great information. Thanks to both of you. >>> Do you have an opion on the 348 ? >> [quoted text clipped - 45 lines] > > I. > There are a few other gremlins i.e. the climate control panel that dies, > costs over £400 ... which also happens in F355s :-(  SignatureJ.C. >The 328 I was looking it is overpriced. Better deals can be found - with a >few more miles. Great comments about the low milage. I didn't think about [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > >Do you have an opion on the 348 ? FORZA did an article on the "unloved" Ferrarii, you should find a copy (I have to run but I'll look it up later). I think the strakes are hideous and evocative of "the pig that proves the rule" that late-model TR. Iirc, their engines are rather fragile, the suspension tuning brittle ...and the interiors are delicate? >So, I guess my choices are 328,348, 355 (wait a few more years) As I understand it there's no choice between a 348 and a 355: The 355 is still the apotheosis of the Ferrari V-8 in many opinions and for very good reasons. Lately there's a gun metal gray 308 on a lot on my way to work each morning: It's quite inspiring. They are so beautiful. > Iirc, their engines are rather fragile, I thought 348 engines were pretty OK - its the 355s with the 5 valves & the exhaust headers made out of steel that's too thin that seem to have more problems. >the suspension tuning brittle Not heard this one at all ...and the interiors are delicate? Nor this >>So, I guess my choices are 328,348, 355 (wait a few more years) > > As I understand it there's no choice between a 348 and a 355: The 355 > is still the apotheosis of the Ferrari V-8 in many opinions and for > very good reasons. Upto a point. As they ar e getting older more & more of them are suffering header failure & valve problems. Was down at QV the other day & Mike was just loading 4 or 5 sets of 355 headers into his van to take them off for rebuilding. They rebuild them with heavier guage pipes. > Lately there's a gun metal gray 308 on a lot on my way to work each > morning: It's quite inspiring. They are so beautiful. Does ya good. I. >> Iirc, their engines are rather fragile, >I thought 348 engines were pretty OK - its the 355s with the 5 valves & the >exhaust headers made out of steel that's too thin that seem to have more >problems. Don't the 348 have cat related fire problems? >>the suspension tuning brittle > >Not heard this one at all ...Squirrely handling when you need it most. >...and the interiors are delicate? > >Nor this Someone else mentioned cheap controls, I've always thought there was way too much styrene in it for a Ferrari. ...and I did end the sentence with a question mark. >>>So, I guess my choices are 328,348, 355 (wait a few more years) >> [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] >just loading 4 or 5 sets of 355 headers into his van to take them off for >rebuilding. They rebuild them with heavier guage pipes. Hardly in the league with the TRs portliness and pig's-a.s ugliness. >> Lately there's a gun metal gray 308 on a lot on my way to work each >> morning: It's quite inspiring. They are so beautiful. > >Does ya good. It just sits there, with it's leather shrinking in the sun... Sits a bit nose high as well, I wonder what that's about. >>> Iirc, their engines are rather fragile, >>I thought 348 engines were pretty OK - its the 355s with the 5 valves & [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > > Don't the 348 have cat related fire problems? Not that I've heard. The current spate of 355 fuel system fires seems to be more of a concern right now. >>>the suspension tuning brittle >> >>Not heard this one at all > > ...Squirrely handling when you need it most. Only at speeds ya shouldn't be doing ona public road - and if you are going to track it then it can be sorted. >>...and the interiors are delicate? >> >>Nor this > > Someone else mentioned cheap controls, I've always thought there was > way too much styrene in it for a Ferrari. It is what it is - you either like it ....or not I suppose. >>> As I understand it there's no choice between a 348 and a 355: The 355 >>> is still the apotheosis of the Ferrari V-8 in many opinions and for [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > > Hardly in the league with the TRs portliness and pig's-a.s ugliness. yeah - but that has 12 cylinders & for some that makes all the difference. >>> Lately there's a gun metal gray 308 on a lot on my way to work each >>> morning: It's quite inspiring. They are so beautiful. [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > It just sits there, with it's leather shrinking in the sun... > Sits a bit nose high as well, I wonder what that's about. Dead body in the trunk? Mikal? MIKAL?? has anyone seen Mikal? I. >>>> Iirc, their engines are rather fragile, >>>I thought 348 engines were pretty OK - its the 355s with the 5 valves & [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > >Not that I've heard. I could easily be wrong, I'm still working from memory (Random Recall mode). >The current spate of 355 fuel system fires seems to be >more of a concern right now. Please expound... >>>>the suspension tuning brittle >>> [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] >Only at speeds ya shouldn't be doing ona public road - and if you are going >to track it then it can be sorted. A performance car shouldn't turn on you when you need the performance, the basis of my lifelong dislike of Porchs. >>>...and the interiors are delicate? >>> [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > >It is what it is - you either like it ....or not I suppose. A contemporaneous Honda uses infinitely better plastics. Some said at the time that Ferrari would have been happy to flog the 348 unmodified but the NSX forced the re-design to the 355. >>>> As I understand it there's no choice between a 348 and a 355: The 355 >>>> is still the apotheosis of the Ferrari V-8 in many opinions and for [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > >yeah - but that has 12 cylinders & for some that makes all the difference. I'd rather have a 412. >>>> Lately there's a gun metal gray 308 on a lot on my way to work each >>>> morning: It's quite inspiring. They are so beautiful. [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > >Dead body in the trunk? It is Valhalla, NY... I have a decent Dino story about the place that will have to wait till tomorrow. > I could easily be wrong, I'm still working from memory (Random Recall > mode). [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > > Please expound... See http://www.ferrarichat.com/forum/showthread.php?t=55058 and http://www.ferrarichat.com/forum/showthread.php?t=32986 9 or 10 cars have gone up in the last year or so it seems. >>> ...Squirrely handling when you need it most. >> [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > A performance car shouldn't turn on you when you need the performance, > the basis of my lifelong dislike of Porchs. I've driven a 993 and a 996 & they are a lot lot easier to catch if/when the back goes than my 328 is. Still wouldn't have one though....well, maybe a 993.... >>>>...and the interiors are delicate? >>>> [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > > I'd rather have a 412. Only if it came from Arizona - horrendous rust-buckets. I. >> I could easily be wrong, I'm still working from memory (Random Recall >> mode). [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > >See http://www.ferrarichat.com/forum/showthread.php?t=55058 Perhaps the most insipid thread I've ever read on usenet... >and http://www.ferrarichat.com/forum/showthread.php?t=32986 ...And then I read this one. ..."sent" of [fuel] ... "bond fire" ... people who don't know which end of screwdriver does the work pontificating on repair procedures... I have no use for Ferrari Chat: Far too dominated by illiterates, baboons, liars and poseurs. >9 or 10 cars have gone up in the last year or so it seems. > [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] >back goes than my 328 is. Still wouldn't have one though....well, maybe a >993.... "a.s-engined, NAZI, slot cars". - P.J. O'Rourke >>>>>...and the interiors are delicate? >>>>> [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] > >Only if it came from Arizona - horrendous rust-buckets. I see a few around here fairly regularly, quite lovely. >>>>The current spate of 355 fuel system fires seems to be >>>>more of a concern right now. [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > > Perhaps the most insipid thread I've ever read on usenet... Whatever, it happened - if it was your pride & joy you'd probbaly be pretty gutted too - then again, maybe you wouldn't - but you should be. >>and http://www.ferrarichat.com/forum/showthread.php?t=32986 > > ...And then I read this one. ..."sent" of [fuel] ... "bond fire" ... > people who don't know which end of screwdriver does the work > pontificating on repair procedures... Not everybody can spell - it doesn't make them bad people. A useful pool of knowledge has come out of what seems to be an emerging trend. No doubt a few people have had their cars checkked and made safe as a result. > I have no use for Ferrari Chat: Far too dominated by illiterates, > baboons, liars and poseurs. Unsurprisingly enough it probably has no use for you either. Personally I've found it very useful & picked up some useful technical information. Today I drove 100 miles in convoy with about a dozen F-chatters to the Auto-Italia meeting. A good day out, a good good run up the motorway (which did my car no end of good) and met some very good & likeable people. No baboons, liars or poseurs, just people who've worked hard to acquire their toys & now enjoy them - you should try it, it'd good for you. >>I've driven a 993 and a 996 & they are a lot lot easier to catch if/when >>the >>back goes than my 328 is. Still wouldn't have one though....well, maybe a >>993.... > > "a.s-engined, NAZI, slot cars". - P.J. O'Rourke Very, very good driver's cars. Have you driven one? Very predicatable handling, very useable and quite quick enough. >>> I'd rather have a 412. >> >>Only if it came from Arizona - horrendous rust-buckets. > > I see a few around here fairly regularly, quite lovely. Maybe on the surface. personally I think they are boxy & pretty ugly - but each to their own. I. >> I have no use for Ferrari Chat: Far too dominated by illiterates, >> baboons, liars and poseurs. > > Unsurprisingly enough it probably has no use for you either. Good call. -Paul (Dates for a luncheon? or whatever?) "Iain Miller" <donot@spam.me> wrote in message > Not everybody can spell - it doesn't make them bad people. A useful pool of > knowledge has come out of what seems to be an emerging trend. No doubt a few > people have had their cars checkked and made safe as a result. A friend of mine can't spell for crap, partly due to being taught via the "sight reading" method in poor appalachian schools. Still, he's built his own practice from scratch to the point that he has about nine cars, including a 993 Carrera 4 that is a great car... I know, many on here dislike the Porch, but I still respect 'em. I really enjoyed the beat-to-hell 924S SE I drove this weekend. Plus a russian friend once described the 993 thusly, which made me chuckle: "Look at from behind, is like woman in number one best position!" Crass, but funny. >Unsurprisingly enough it probably has no use for you either. Personally I've >found it very useful & picked up some useful technical information. Today I >drove 100 miles in convoy with about a dozen F-chatters to the Auto-Italia >meeting. A good day out, a good good run up the motorway (which did my car >no end of good) and met some very good & likeable people. Good for you! Sounds like a cool trip. > >>> I'd rather have a 412. > >> [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > Maybe on the surface. personally I think they are boxy & pretty ugly - but > each to their own. I kinda like the 412, but then I kinda like the 308GT4 too. Boxy, Bertone style stuff has a place in my heart even if there isn't much grace to it. I wouldn't want to maintain a 412 though, just looking at the Bosch injection (double the usual amount too) and seeing how they wired them makes me nervous. I foresee a lot of quality time spent with a multimeter when things are going bad intermittently. -Matt- "..." > A friend of mine can't spell for crap, partly due to being taught > via the "sight reading" method in poor appalachian schools. Still, > he's built his own practice from scratch to the point that he has > about nine cars, including a 993 Carrera 4 that is a great car... Zigackly (said Obelix) > I know, many on here dislike the Porch, but I still respect 'em. Likewise > I really enjoyed the beat-to-hell 924S SE I drove this weekend. Good for you > Plus a russian friend once described the 993 thusly, which made > me chuckle: > > "Look at from behind, is like woman in number one best position!" > Crass, but funny. Indeed :-) >>Unsurprisingly enough it probably has no use for you either. Personally > I've found it very useful & picked up some useful technical information. [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > > Good for you! Sounds like a cool trip. It was - apart from the bit where the Policeman shot out of the motorway service station (rest area) and pulled the Black 360 at the head of the line - booked him for doing 90 & I'd be surprised if he was. Claimed they had had "lots of phone calls" complaining about Ferraris weaving in & out of traffic. Nothing to do with us, we were just heading up the road in a fairly orderly queue - mind you, a line of a dozen or so Ferraris with assorted Tubis & Capristos does make a phenominal racket (!) I was following a 355 Spyder with Tubi & no cats on it & I could barely hear my car - and I had the roof off. I expect we might have frightened a few grannies! There was a 430 in the line as well which I followed for a while - makes an awesome noise. Kudos for best noise was a toss up between the 355 Spyder & a wicked looking black 355 challenge (and maybe a Maranello). Oh, and my car needs a new rad cap - it tossed a gallon of coolant out the overflow on the way up. Just as well I had a gallon can of water in the trunk with me - ho hum! Fortunately there was still another 4 gallons or so still in the system. Oddly enough it didn't really lose any on the way home - until I got home & stopped when it tossed half a pint or so- but then that was a more "even tempered/paced" trip without any stops or queuing. I think that when the thing gets really warm the cap just isn't holding the pressure anymore. >> >>> I'd rather have a 412. >> >> > I kinda like the 412, but then I kinda like the 308GT4 too. Boxy, Bertone > style stuff has a place in my heart even if there isn't much grace to it. I like the GT4 - but not the 412 - too much of a barge & always reminds me of a Lagonda. I saw a couple today - one was an Automatic - something inherently wrong about that! On the more positive side, a very clean 288 GTO was there - which is not something you'll see on your way to work every day. > I wouldn't want to maintain a 412 though, just looking at the Bosch > injection (double the usual amount too) and seeing how they wired them > makes me > nervous. I foresee a lot of quality time spent with a multimeter when > things > are going bad intermittently. Well quite... (!) 4 out of 5 of them that you see here are rotting pretty badly as well - they seem to suffer far worse than other Ferraris from either before or after. I. > I know, many on here dislike the Porch That is probably because: A) They've never owned or driven one, and/or. B) Their typical view of them is from behind, or from the pits while nursing a broken car. Both the F and P cars are generally great cars. ;) matt borland wrote: > "Iain Miller" <donot@spam.me> wrote in message > >>Not everybody can spell - it doesn't make them bad people. Wut dieu yew no. Eif yew kant spill yew r uh fuccing idyit. SignatureIt's a place where you will learn To face your fears, retrace the years And ride the whims of your mind Commanding in another world Suddenly, you hear and see This magic new dimension > Perhaps the most insipid thread I've ever read on usenet... .....and as an afterthought. F-chat is not usenet, its a privately owned, run and moderated web forum which, as far as I am aware is run on a non-profit basis & is funded by sponsorship from interested companies who supply parts to the Ferrari community. Such companies clearly believe that its a well run and useful forum - indeed many of them (including the Ferrari UK parts people who hold all the stock of parts for older cars) often make useful contributions and provide helpful advise. When you've contributed something even 1% as useful to the Ferrari owners community do come back & let us know. Other than that, if you don't like it, I suggest you don't go there. I. >When you've contributed something even 1% as useful to the Ferrari owners >community do come back & let us know. Yes... The weeks long symposium on "what that little round hole in the bumper of my 512 TR is for" is absolutely riveting. >Other than that, if you don't like it, I suggest you don't go there. Shameless glad-handing and logrolling obscure the 1% that might be useful or informative. > It is Valhalla, NY... I have a decent Dino story about the place that > will have to wait till tomorrow. Is that like New York's answer to the Pine Barrens? MC SignatureIt's a place where you will learn To face your fears, retrace the years And ride the whims of your mind Commanding in another world Suddenly, you hear and see This magic new dimension >> It is Valhalla, NY... I have a decent Dino story about the place that >> will have to wait till tomorrow. > >Is that like New York's answer to the Pine Barrens? Formerly a nice blue collar suburb, now being McMansioned to death. >>>It is Valhalla, NY... I have a decent Dino story about the place that >>>will have to wait till tomorrow. >> >>Is that like New York's answer to the Pine Barrens? > > Formerly a nice blue collar suburb, now being McMansioned to death. I haven't seen anyplace yet that isn't, except for the horror-show ghetto that I myself lived in the last 12 years. SignatureIt's a place where you will learn To face your fears, retrace the years And ride the whims of your mind Commanding in another world Suddenly, you hear and see This magic new dimension > Mikal? MIKAL?? has anyone seen Mikal? Jesus H. Christ, Iain! Why try and COAX that prick in here? He's hard enough to exterminate as it is! MC SignatureIt's a place where you will learn To face your fears, retrace the years And ride the whims of your mind Commanding in another world Suddenly, you hear and see This magic new dimension > Many of you can probably remember this feeling, I am thinking about > purchasing my first Ferrari and I am very nervous. > > The car would be driven very little throughout the year - as to be > expected. Fine but its important to run it regularly to keep all the seals in tact. That means running the engine up to get some oil temperature & running all the fans & switches etc to keep everything moving. If you leave an old Ferrari electric window in the same place for 6 months don't be surprised if it doesn't feel like working afterwards! Don't suggest you drive it in the snow & salt is your enemy. > I have been searching the net for guidance but perhaps some previous > owners can help here. [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > $59,000. 5 speed manual. It has already had its 15,000 mile tune up. What > else to I need to know ? The mileage is low - low mileage cars command high prices but often cause far more problems than cars that have been used a bit. Your ideal 328 these days would have 25-30K on it & have records showing regular steady annual mileage. From what I know of US prices I'd say that is expensive. > According to the sales guy this car is steel body instead of aluminum > (does that make sense to you guys ?) Its steel > What are the advantages/disadvantages ? It rusts > HP rating of 270 I believe - seems kinda low. How does it perform ? How > does it handle onramps - skiddsh ? 0-60 in less than 6 secs, top end of about 163. Its a quick car but it probably wouldn't live with a Subaru WRX - but then that really isn't the point of it. Its not a big car & it drives like a go-cart. The steering on a good car is fantastic & very direct- some of them are getting a bit soggy . > No power steering or breaks - how do you guys like that ? Every car I have > owned has had PS/PB. Of course they won't let me test drive this car yet. No power steering makes it a bit heavy to park in tight spots (but the tyres arn't that fat - 205s on the front). Solution? Avoid parking in tight spots The brakes are servo assisted & pretty good for road use. Upgrades are possible if you wanted to track the car. > Is the car somewhat dependable or will I have constant tune-ups and > maintenance ? Highly reliable & pretty bomb proof BUT its a 16 year old car that hasn't been used much. You may have issues with decaying hoses etc that need to be replaced & maybe some issues with rubber trim & seals if they havn't been looked after. For low mileage and annual service should suffice. Service prices in the US do seem a tad steep though. US car cambelt interval is 5 yrs (Europe is 2 years). Unlike 348/355/Testa its NOT an engine out job - which makes it much less expensive to do. > I also live in the north with 5 months of snow. Although my garage doesnt > freeze, it isnt heated either. Not necessarily a problem. A dehumidifier is your friend if you live in a remotely damp climate. Better not to freeze it though! > The auto insurance I checked on - not a problem. Insurance is cheap & a nice bonus > Would a Testarossa be a better choice ? Much MUCH more expensive to maintain. The 328 is probably the least expensive modern Ferrari to run & maintain. Its not that different to a 308/308GT4 & Mondial but, because it came along after, there are probably fewer "bugs" in it. Things like oil changes & brakes are definitly DIY - even for a half competent home mechanic. > I could also choose a Corvette/Viper/Lotus You could. You either "get" having a Ferrari or you don't. For many F owners the choice of a corvette,Viper, Lotus or a Ferrari isn't a choice. Besides that I suspect you are talking C5 etc which means you are comparing modern cars with a 16 year old car. Chalk & cheese. > Help please, Is this purchase worth it or problematic ? If you buy a good car and then budget to spend some on it to get it straight initially & then look after it right its definitly worth it - if you like that sort of thing. > Sorry for all the questions, just looking for a friendly previous owner. No problem - its what this place is for. Suggest you also check Google & go & read www.ferrarichat.com as well. I've had my 328 for 6 years & its not for sale :-) > Thanks welcome I. > even for a half competent home mechanic. I had a dream once that I was one of those ... then I woke up, put the oil plug somewhere my friend would find it and went inside to throw away my clothes. M Signature"Leave the gun. Take the cannoli." Pete Clemenza > Many of you can probably remember this feeling, I am thinking about > purchasing my first Ferrari and I am very nervous. [quoted text clipped - 11 lines] > $59,000. 5 speed manual. It has already had its 15,000 mile tune up. What > else to I need to know ? It needs a thorough pre-purchase inspection, by someone that is not the seller and is familiar with these cars. Save some cash for the hidden bits that haven't been put right yet. > HP rating of 270 I believe - seems kinda low. How does it perform ? How does > it handle onramps - skiddsh ? 0-60mph in about 6 seconds, the tires are small by modern standards so I suspect it might feel skiddish at the limit compared to more modern iron. It'll feel like a twenty year old exotic car. Hot for '88, interesting, fun, and different for '05. > No power steering or breaks - how do you guys like that ? Every car I have > owned has had PS/PB. Of course they won't let me test drive this car yet. Aside from tight parking lots manual steering feels great to me. > Is the car somewhat dependable or will I have constant tune-ups and > maintenance ? Properly maintained it should be very reliable, but maintenance is expensive by domestic standards, though somewhat cheap by exotic standards (355, Testarossa, Lambo, etc. cost more) > I also live in the north with 5 months of snow. Although my garage doesnt > freeze, it isnt heated either. Shouldn't be a big deal if proper precautions are taken. > Would a Testarossa be a better choice ? Totally different car and much more expensive to service. If $59k is tight you're not in Testarossa money. > I could also choose a Corvette/Viper/Lotus You could, but then you'd a)pass cars just like yours every day (Vette) b)drive a torque monster down the road sideways but still not have a Ferrari (Viper) plus it sounds like a vacuum cleaner c)have a fun exotic with disappointing GM trim bits (Esprit) or a killer track car with a Toyota engine (Elise) > Help please, Is this purchase worth it or problematic ? Only you can answer that one for yourself. Do you want it bad enough? > Sorry for all the questions, just looking for a friendly previous owner. Not an owner yet, but still planning on it... -Matt- "..." > Many of you can probably remember this feeling, I am thinking about > purchasing my first Ferrari and I am very nervous. Don't be nervous. If you want one, get one! > The car would be driven very little throughout the year - as to be expected. > [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > my budget to finance a percent of this car. I am looking at a 1998 328 and I > am looking for some guidance here. If you're going to have to reach a little, don't do it. Either that or take on a nice QV and take the strain off. Remember, this isn't your daily driver, and you're likely not going to use it enough to appreciate the differences. I was in the same place a decade ago when I bought my first one. I was shopping 328s and ended up with a 308GTS. As much as I use the thing I'm happy to have the car and the extra $25k I would have spent on the 328. > The car is in superb condition and has 9,500 miles on it. Asking price of > $59,000. 5 speed manual. It has already had its 15,000 mile tune up. What > else to I need to know ? Little high. Plenty on offer for less that that that have been driven. I'd be more concerned about a car that's not been used than a 30k mile example that's been out and about and has been properly maintained. > According to the sales guy this car is steel body instead of aluminum (does > that make sense to you guys ?) > What are the advantages/disadvantages ? The sales guy doesn't know the car. If you found a factory aluminum car you'd really have something! > HP rating of 270 I believe - seems kinda low. How does it perform ? How does > it handle onramps - skiddsh ? Believe me, if you've never driven one before, don't buy this one. I drove about 20 cars before I bought mine. > No power steering or breaks - how do you guys like that ? Doesn't even phase me. It's nice to DRIVE the car and not have the car DRIVE YOU! > Every car I have > owned has had PS/PB. Which will be part of the particular charm of owning it. It's different! Of course they won't let me test drive this car yet. Why not? If they're not letting you drive it, don't buy from them. Walk in, look the sales boy in the eye, say, I'm interested, I want to TD this car. If they give you the Heisman, tell them they lost a possible sale and move on. 328s are plentiful. It's not like you're buying a one off car worth millions. You can roll up to just about any Merc/BMW/etc dealer and TD a car worth far more than a 328 with nothing more than a valid DL. If you're not drivin', they're not sellin'. I'm guessing this isn't a dealer that usually sells Ferraris? > Is the car somewhat dependable or will I have constant tune-ups and > maintenance ? Plan on spending a couple of grand on getting it set up right and then just enjoy it. > I also live in the north with 5 months of snow. Although my garage doesnt > freeze, it isnt heated either. Move! > The auto insurance I checked on - not a problem. I'm sure, if you only can drive 7 months out of the year I'm not surprised! > Would a Testarossa be a better choice ? Run away!! Too much car, too much deferred maintenance, declining values. The early TRs are the 412s of the 21st Century! > I could also choose a Corvette/Viper/Lotus You could also buy a Toyota... > Help please, Is this purchase worth it or problematic ? Are you prepared to splash out for something you'll use once a week at best? Are you prepared to live with a car devoid of basic creature comforts? Are you prepared to own a car you're not likely to take/enjoy long journeys with? Are you prepared to have fun? If all answers are yes, buy it. If you hesitate or answer no to any, don't. > Sorry for all the questions, just looking for a friendly previous owner. Hopefully you've found a few here! T308 SignatureLIVERPOOL FC - European Champions 1977, 1978, 1981, 1984, 2005 <The early TRs are the 412s of the 21st Century!>> Ooh, I'm gonna tell! C. > Many of you can probably remember this feeling, I am thinking about > purchasing my first Ferrari and I am very nervous. No need to be. You're about to experiment something great! I'ver owned a 328 GTS and I still miss it. > The car would be driven very little throughout the year - as to be expected. > [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > my budget to finance a percent of this car. I am looking at a 1998 328 and I > am looking for some guidance here. GTB our GTS? The latter is preferable, particularly if you drive it only in the spring/summer. > The car is in superb condition and has 9,500 miles on it. Asking price of > $59,000. 5 speed manual. It has already had its 15,000 mile tune up. What > else to I need to know ? Don't know about the US prices, but it seems quite high. Here (France) a good 328 is about 40,000 euros ($49,000). The mileage is very low, 328s usually have around 30,000-40,000 miles. > According to the sales guy this car is steel body instead of aluminum (does > that make sense to you guys ?) > What are the advantages/disadvantages ? A 328 is steel made, except for the front and engine hoods. Look at them carefully, they tend to distort. The obvious disadvantage of steel is rust. Beware of salt!!! Places to look at: the sills below the doors, the window seals (particularly the small windows behind the doors), the windshield frame. > HP rating of 270 I believe - seems kinda low. How does it perform ? How does > it handle onramps - skiddsh ? The power may not be outrageous compared to modern sports cars, and it's true you won't compete with a Sub or an M3 at traffic lights. But it's a Ferrari, which says all: it's all in the way it delivers the power and uses it. It's hard to define. Let's just say that, when you drive a Ferrari, you FEEL that it's been designed and built by people who know everything about performance. For instance, the power curve is very linear (as opposed to a Porsche - oops, did I mention the cursed name?). It's an engine you must rev (red line at 7,500 rpm), but it instantly answers to your right foot, and you'll become totally addicted to pushing it to the red line on each gear. As for handling, it behaves like a kart. A bit skiddish on the wet, but easily manageable. > No power steering or breaks - how do you guys like that ? I loved it (except of course in town, where maneuvering is a pain in the a.s)! And it DOES have power brakes (but no ABS, except on latter models). Brakes might be the only real weak point in this car. The front is very light, and front wheels tend to quickly block in emergency situations. > Every car I have > owned has had PS/PB. Of course they won't let me test drive this car yet. Find another dealer. NEVER buy a car without test driving it, particularly a 15-year sports car. > Is the car somewhat dependable or will I have constant tune-ups and > maintenance ? Ferrari maintenance is expensive, but the 328 is one of the "cheapest". I never had any major problem with mine. > Would a Testarossa be a better choice ? Definitely not. More expensive to buy and maintain, and less convenient in everyday use. > I could also choose a Corvette/Viper/Lotus But it wouldn't be a Ferrari. This car will ensure you unlimited pleasure. SignatureJ.C. Hello Jeff, This question comes up now and again--merit/demerit of an older Ferrari. I went through this 6 yrs ago and chose a 328 over a new Vette (similar initial outlay). You can search this group for past postings and find some similar discussions. One point I'll make here is about the economics. Very often when somebody finds out I own a Ferrari they'll look at me funny and say something like, "I heard that Ferrari oil changes cost $500, is that true?" Not quite that much (but more than a Chevy...partly because the 328 crankcase is so damn big). What I tell people is that the higher maintenance cost for a Ferrari is *more* than offset by the nil depreciation. An extra bonus, in Arizona my 328's annual license renewal is now less than $100 (my wife's new minivan is $600!). Bottom line, when I figure my total cost of ownership (depr, maint., license, insurance) for my 1987 328 and compare to what I estimate it would have been for a new 2000 Vette, I find the 328 is slightly cheaper to own. This is based on a 2-3k miles/yr usage rate. In a nutshell: most people focus and fret about maintenance cost on an older car but tend to underestimate the depreciation factor in owning a new car. Food for thought. But regardless of financial arguments, you have to decide what you like...no bargain to make a compromise choice and be unhappy with that. The 328 is quick enough for me but if you lust for power then maybe have to go with a modern sports car. Ted. > Many of you can probably remember this feeling, I am thinking about > purchasing my first Ferrari and I am very nervous. [quoted text clipped - 42 lines] > > -Jeff Thanks Ted. I drive a Corvette C5 now. I understand your comments about awesome power vs the Ferrari mystique. I am also (more seriously) considering a 355. I will start a new thread. > Hello Jeff, > [quoted text clipped - 72 lines] >> >> -Jeff Thanks for all of your advice. I think my day of obtaining my first Ferrari is getting very very close. I found a 328 GTS with mileage and a price that works perfect for me. The hard part now is that it is in a different part of the country. It would sure be a bummer to fly out, be disappointed and have to return. I also don't want to buy it just because I flew all that way. I have the CarFax report. I am requesting belt change date and mileage since change. Somebody mentioned the clutch. How do I test a *wearing* clutch. - Just by too much motion towards the floor before release ? What else do I look for, any spots that rust early ? Also, should I drive this car 1,000 miles home or rent a truck/trailer ? I know that is a personal question that only I can really answer but I am nervous about this car breaking down or getting stone chips half way home and being bummed out. Thanks again. I am very excited but don't want to make a hasty decision. > Many of you can probably remember this feeling, I am thinking about > purchasing my first Ferrari and I am very nervous. [quoted text clipped - 42 lines] > > -Jeff > Thanks for all of your advice. I think my day of obtaining my first Ferrari > is getting very very close. > I found a 328 GTS with mileage and a price that works perfect for me. > The hard part now is that it is in a different part of the country. It would > sure be a bummer to fly out, be disappointed and have to return. I also > don't want to buy it just because I flew all that way. Plan on staying overnight. See the car, sleep on it (literally) and then decide. If you don't want to stay a day, leave a deposit and decide when you get home. > I have the CarFax report. I am requesting belt change date and mileage since > change. > > Somebody mentioned the clutch. How do I test a *wearing* clutch. - Just by > too much motion towards the floor before release ? If the clutch is going, you'll feel it when you drive it. Have you ever driven a 328 before? > What else do I look for, any spots that rust early ? Bottom of the doors. Duffin can tell you about that. > Also, should I drive this car 1,000 miles home or rent a truck/trailer ? Transport it. No matter how much you think the car's right and ready for a journey, you're better off having your first driving experiences close to home. 100 miles maybe, 1000 miles, no way. I > know that is a personal question that only I can really answer but I am > nervous about this car breaking down or getting stone chips half way home > and being bummed out. The car will break down, sometime. Hopefully in your garage or driveway. You will get stone chips, you might get door dings, hell, you might bend it on something. It'll happen. If the thought of those events scare you, you shouldn't buy the car. Remember, it's a car, not a piece of china. sh.t will happen to it. T308 SignatureLIVERPOOL FC - European Champions 1977, 1978, 1981, 1984, 2005 > Thanks for all of your advice. I think my day of obtaining my first Ferrari > is getting very very close. Nikola, I'm happy for you. But I don't think there's anybody in those other groups, just to let you know. I mean, if that's suddenly where all these new names are coming from, somebody has to let them know that THIS is where it's at - though it's a kitchen with a bit of heat, if they know what I mean. M Signature"Sendai eyes are notorious for depth-perception defects and warranty hassles, among other things." If you do a pre-purchase inspection at a Ferrari dealer (or knowledgeable independent exotic car dealer) they would be able to assess how much adjustment is left in the clutch--to determine roughly what % life is remaining. They can also do a compression/leakdown test so you can be sure the engine is strong along with and extensive laundry list of checks on the car. Or if the car you are looking at has a complete service history, you can gauge clutch life remaining from this based on 30k miles/clutch. I had mine done at the same time as the last major service (27k miles)...on the 328 the clutch job isn't too terrible since engine does not have to drop out. $1700 covers the entire clutch job including new throw-out bearing. Clutches begin slipping at end-of-life, until slipping begins you don't experience any other symptoms of a clutch nearing the end. The 328 is actually rather reliable for an exotic, but if you have doubts about the service history then having it transported might be the cautious approach. But if the service history is solid, and you don't mind being cramped for a long trip, go for it. Ted. > Thanks for all of your advice. I think my day of obtaining my first > Ferrari is getting very very close. [quoted text clipped - 64 lines] >> >> -Jeff A sincere thanks to all the advice given here. I found a car I liked in Miami (in the middle of its major tune up) and purchased it. An awesome car and a dream come true. Thanks again > Many of you can probably remember this feeling, I am thinking about > purchasing my first Ferrari and I am very nervous. [quoted text clipped - 42 lines] > > -Jeff NikolaTesla wrote: <<A sincere thanks to all the advice given here. I found a car I liked in Miami (in the middle of its major tune up) and purchased it.>> Excellent! Congratulations! Any details you'd care to share? C.
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