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Car Forum / Fiat Cars / May 2005Size and type of fitting on Bravo 1.8 drainplug?
Doing an oil change the weekend, what is the size/fitting of the drainplug on a 1.8 Bravo? Some think it's a 7mm allen key, others that it is something else entirely. Also, what size copper washer do I need? Hellraiser..........> think you'll find its a 10mm allen key, and you may be able to re-use the washer if its not damaged, if so get one from the dealer since any old washer will not do the job, it should be a copper or alloy one. steve. > Doing an oil change the weekend, what is the size/fitting of the drainplug > on a 1.8 Bravo? Some think it's a 7mm allen key, others that it is something > else entirely. Also, what size copper washer do I need? > > Hellraiser..........> What you doing on here Hellraiser? Deserting the forum or do you not trust Toms knowledge anymore ;) Conrad > Doing an oil change the weekend, what is the size/fitting of the drainplug > on a 1.8 Bravo? Some think it's a 7mm allen key, others that it is something > else entirely. Also, what size copper washer do I need? > > Hellraiser..........> > What you doing on here Hellraiser? Deserting the forum or do you not > trust > Toms knowledge anymore ;) > > Conrad LOL, no just posting a query :) Found out it was an 8mm allen key fitting, only to find the previous twat, sorry owner, used threadlock on the sump plug. I now need to get it somewhere accessible and lever it with what is commonly known as a FLTB (f.cking long tommy bar) :) You still need these cam locks? Hellraiser...........> Yeah, I have to get it done, but a bit short on the cash at the moment. If you are looking to get rid of the cam locks as you have had the work done, I'll have them for a reasonable price, otherwise I'll borrow them near the time if that is okay? Conrad > > What you doing on here Hellraiser? Deserting the forum or do you not > > trust [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > > Hellraiser...........> >> What you doing on here Hellraiser? Deserting the forum or do you not >> trust [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > > Hellraiser...........> I missed this one! What is the Cam Lock thread about? Nick ///// >> LOL, no just posting a query :) Found out it was an 8mm allen key >> fitting, only to find the previous twat, sorry owner, used threadlock on [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > > What is the Cam Lock thread about? Hi Nick, Conrad lives close to me and also has a 1.8 Bravo, I got the cam locking tools for when my belt was changed and have arranged to loan them to him. Been a while now, so I hope he gets the belt and tensioners done before they break..... Hellraiser.........> >>> LOL, no just posting a query :) Found out it was an 8mm allen key >>> fitting, only to find the previous twat, sorry owner, used threadlock on [quoted text clipped - 17 lines] > > Hellraiser.........> I'm assuming that we are talking about twin cam engines with variable input cam timing. Thus far I've not had to personally change a cam belt on these variable input cam timing models. I have the manuals so know quite well how to change the cam belt locking down the cam shafts. However, having change many cam belts on 'older' models I very curious and dubious about the need to lock the camshafts for a belt change. I'm told it is because there is not much slack or room for play in these later models, but I can't help think that if the engine is placed at TDC/BDC and the old belt is carefully removed (having marked all positions) then the extra lengthy step of expsosing and locking down the cams is an overkill. For sure you need to do this when rebuilding an engine, but stopping a good running engine, marking and removing a belt and replacing with a new belt should be no different to the same procedure used for a twin cam engine without variable input cam timing! ? If I'm missing something then please let me know! Nick ///// > I'm assuming that we are talking about twin cam engines with variable > input cam timing. [quoted text clipped - 20 lines] > > If I'm missing something then please let me know! It is possible to change the belt without the cam locks, but there are two problems with this - firstly, when the belt is removed the valve springs have a nasty habit of flicking the camshaft around and secondly the belt can be a bit of a bugger to get on, unless you have a 3rd hand to hold the two camshafts whilst weedling the belt it is not easy! The belt had originally been changed on mine without cam locking tools and I noticed when it was at TDC the one camshaft was slightly out, since it has been redone the engine is both quieter and also seems to rev more freely, so it's a double bonus I guess :) Hellraiser.........> >> I'm assuming that we are talking about twin cam engines with variable >> input cam timing. [quoted text clipped - 32 lines] > > Hellraiser.........> Hi Hellraiser Interesting to hear your views. I fully understand the tendency of the cams to back-off the lobes and move to a neutral position. However cam locking is not a problem. In the simple case an old cam belt with the same pitch can be used to lock the camshafts. A simple figure of 8 around the sprockets after the existing belt has be slid forward. Alternatively a more professional device can be used. Remember that on the older non variable timiing cam shafts this excessive locking down was never required. The bit I have trouble with is the slackening of the inlet cam shaft sprocket on the variator. Cam belts are made to sub mm tolerance so I can't see (on a belt replace when cam position is secured) why it is necessary to release the position of the inlet sprocket. We must be talking of much less than 0.5 degrees of tolerance. Even if the timing of inlet relative to exhaust was precise we still have the long belt run down to the crank spocket, which is on a much smaller radious, so the natural run-out of timing due to belt tolerances will surely be greater. Removing the cam cover (expensive gasket), bearing caps, special tools etc. seems a bit over the top IMHO. Nick ///// > Hi Hellraiser > [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > camshafts. A simple figure of 8 around the sprockets after the existing > belt has be slid forward. Wouldn't that make it difficult to fit the new belt? > Remember that on the older non variable timiing cam shafts this excessive > locking down was never required. [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > to the crank spocket, which is on a much smaller radious, so the natural > run-out of timing due to belt tolerances will surely be greater. Ah, the 1.8 has no variator so I can't give an opinion on that :) > Removing the cam cover (expensive gasket), bearing caps, special tools > etc. seems a bit over the top IMHO. There's only 2 bearing caps to remove (which come off quite easily), the cam cover gasket can be re-used (so long as no oil is leaking from it and it is in good condition - just crank it down a little tighter), and considering the potential for damage if it is done wrong, I think spending a few quid on some cam locking tools is a good idea. After all, the camshafts won't move at all when the cams are wedged! Hellraiser..........> > Wouldn't that make it difficult to fit the new belt? Not really as the locking belt sits on the rear side of the cam sprockets secured with buldog clips/clamps. > Ah, the 1.8 has no variator so I can't give an opinion on that :) The variator is where the problem occurs! > There's only 2 bearing caps to remove (which come off quite easily), the > cam cover gasket can be re-used (so long as no oil is leaking from it and > it is in good condition - just crank it down a little tighter), and > considering the potential for damage if it is done wrong, I think spending > a few quid on some cam locking tools is a good idea. After all, the > camshafts won't move at all when the cams are wedged! These caps secure the cams for sure. But this can be done with other cam lock clamps without necessitating the removal of the cam covers, gasket and bearing caps. Well one day I'll have to change my can belt on my Stilo Abarth, assuming I have it at 5 years/50K miles :-). On my Coupe 20V I've already had it replaced due to an auxilary belt failure (double poly-V belt = crap) which was ingested into the cam belt area and caused the cam belt to ride over the junk on the crank sprocket and throw the timing out. Fortunately my wife spotted the ecu warning light come on and stopped. On the Coupe the ECU warns if the camshaft to crank timing goes out of specification. Luckily prompt action meant no valves were bent. The car was recovered to the garage so I let them get on with it :-) Nick ///// |
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