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Car Forum / Ford / Ford Falcon / February 2004Gotta love cast iron heads
EFi 5l v8 boiled dry today, as I still haven't got around to changing the Coolant surge tank. allowed temperature gauge to get to just under the red zone, (the hi temp light and charm was going) before pulling over as it wasn't a safe place to do so. Let it cool, filled it up with 15 liters of water, no fucken worries. drove another 50k's without the cooling system pressurized and the temperature remained at 1/4. (28c outside) only time it started pissing out was when the car was off, for obvious reasons. If I was in any alloy headed car, today would of been a costly adventure. > EFi 5l v8 boiled dry today, as I still haven't got around to changing the > Coolant surge tank. [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > > If I was in any alloy headed car, today would of been a costly adventure. The weight saving for alloy heads is not worth the extra corrosion (think EF-EL I6) and warp probs with an overheat,......bring back iron heads!!!!! Jason The reason we have iron heads is to stop detonation with the lower octane fuel. The same shaped and compression in an iron head would ping at for example 10:1 but in an alloy head it wont. Alloy heads let heat out faster. So you don't get you hot spots like iron heads do. Alloy heads don't warp as much as said provided the head is made properly. I have alloy heads on my 351 Cleveland. Best thing I ever did to the engine. I can now run 11.2:1 compression on pump fuel. Brenden > > EFi 5l v8 boiled dry today, as I still haven't got around to changing the > > Coolant surge tank. [quoted text clipped - 17 lines] > > Jason > Alloy heads don't warp as much as said provided the head is made properly. I > have alloy heads on my 351 Cleveland. Best thing I ever did to the engine. I > can now run 11.2:1 compression on pump fuel. Boiled it dry again yesturday, still no issues, i expect to do it again today aswell, since its going to be 39 degrese here. I carry 25 Litres of water with me so its no big deal. Gotta love fortnightly pay and home loan repayments, I'm starting to crack much like my surge tank. I cracked the head in an EF i6 and it didnt even register as hot as this did, all because of a 25cent thermostat housing gasket. Mate, I wouldn't go doing it too often, just go buy a tank and put it on, If you keep at it your either going to crack one or both of the heads or start scoring the bores, It WILL end up costing you MORE than the cost of a new header tank. Don't forget the auto is cooled by the radiator also. > > Alloy heads don't warp as much as said provided the head is made properly. > I [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > head in an EF i6 and it didnt even register as hot as this did, all because > of a 25cent thermostat housing gasket. Payday, I simply cant get it untill then at all. > Mate, I wouldn't go doing it too often, just go buy a tank and put it on, > If you keep at it your either going to crack one or both of the heads or [quoted text clipped - 17 lines] > because > > of a 25cent thermostat housing gasket. >> Alloy heads don't warp as much as said provided the head is made properly. >I [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] >head in an EF i6 and it didnt even register as hot as this did, all because >of a 25cent thermostat housing gasket. Did you boil the EF donk dry too? if so the reason why the 6 doesn't go as high on the gauge is the temp sensor is located on the thermostat extension housing, radiated heat from the head doesn't reach it so it relies solely on the water temp - burst a hose and water is dumped quick enough presto, no water the measure the temp by and the gauge will likely sit in the blue! ahhh, that sounds reasonable. the v8 does register even with no water at all in it, which is good. > >> Alloy heads don't warp as much as said provided the head is made properly. > >I [quoted text clipped - 15 lines] > water is dumped quick enough presto, no water the measure the temp by > and the gauge will likely sit in the blue! sounds like you need to spend $5 on some epoxy tape > ahhh, that sounds reasonable. > [quoted text clipped - 23 lines] > > water is dumped quick enough presto, no water the measure the temp by > > and the gauge will likely sit in the blue! in an EF/EL generally cooling issues are caused by a leaky head gasket. My Mrs boiled our EL off the gauge 4 times without any issues. Cost me nothing over $200 to fix. Didn't even crack the head. I was surprised but I'd never seen an underneath a late mdl I6 before. They are a fairly robust head apart from the crappy heads bolts stretching over time. My EL's on it's 2nd replacement head gasket. 1st one was done by Ford and this one was fixed be me. Brenden > > Alloy heads don't warp as much as said provided the head is made properly. > I [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > head in an EF i6 and it didnt even register as hot as this did, all because > of a 25cent thermostat housing gasket. You mean she did'nt even notice that! Jesus H Christ, show her were the f.cking gauge is! > in an EF/EL generally cooling issues are caused by a leaky head gasket. My > Mrs boiled our EL off the gauge 4 times without any issues. Cost me nothing [quoted text clipped - 21 lines] > because > > of a 25cent thermostat housing gasket. Yup, I was very pissed off. She doesn't pay attention to gauges. She only stops when she hears the BANG. She wonders why I won't let her drive my XB. Brenden > You mean she did'nt even notice that! > Jesus H Christ, show her were the f.cking gauge is! [quoted text clipped - 30 lines] > > because > > > of a 25cent thermostat housing gasket. > Yup, I was very pissed off. She doesn't pay attention to gauges. She only > stops when she hears the BANG. She wonders why I won't let her drive my XB. speaking of which you mentioned alloy heads for the clevo ?. I missed your answer > Brenden > [quoted text clipped - 35 lines] > > > because > > > > of a 25cent thermostat housing gasket. 218cc CHI 3V's (http://www.chiheads.com). These are the big version of the CHI's. I shall be getting a CHI manifold also. Bremdem > > Yup, I was very pissed off. She doesn't pay attention to gauges. She only > > stops when she hears the BANG. She wonders why I won't let her drive my XB. [quoted text clipped - 41 lines] > > > > because > > > > > of a 25cent thermostat housing gasket. Ta . should I sit down when reading the price ?. Im thinking of building another alloy block ford V8 and am drawn to a windsor but might think about a hybrid with boost . ( for the Austin) > 218cc CHI 3V's (http://www.chiheads.com). These are the big version of the > CHI's. I shall be getting a CHI manifold also. [quoted text clipped - 58 lines] > > > > > because > > > > > > of a 25cent thermostat housing gasket. Alloy block ??? you mean there's a drop in replacement alloy engine for my car?? :) "fully sick mate" > Ta . should I sit down when reading the price ?. > Im thinking of building another alloy block ford V8 and am drawn to a [quoted text clipped - 62 lines] > > > > > > because > > > > > > > of a 25cent thermostat housing gasket. Motor sport alloy block windsor , but I hope you don't think its only $1000.00 , better sit down if you do , then add another couple of things to build the donk , Im expecting over 10k in parts. Plus the LPG system and the inlet manifold will run maybe $900.00 . I use and recommend scat cranks and rods . > Alloy block ??? > [quoted text clipped - 81 lines] > > > > > > > because > > > > > > > > of a 25cent thermostat housing gasket. how do you convince your partner that this is a good investment ??? > Motor sport alloy block windsor , but I hope you don't think its only > $1000.00 , better sit down if you do , then add another couple of things [quoted text clipped - 87 lines] > > > > > > > > because > > > > > > > > > of a 25cent thermostat housing gasket. > how do you convince your partner that this is a good investment ??? why would I even mention the cost ?. its my toy. > > Motor sport alloy block windsor , but I hope you don't think its only > > $1000.00 , better sit down if you do , then add another couple of things [quoted text clipped - 100 lines] > > > > > > > > > because > > > > > > > > > > of a 25cent thermostat housing gasket. I think she'd have something to say about it, if she knew the cost :) > > how do you convince your partner that this is a good investment ??? > why would I even mention the cost ?. its my toy. [quoted text clipped - 103 lines] > > > > > > > > > > because > > > > > > > > > > > of a 25cent thermostat housing gasket. > I think she'd have something to say about it, if she knew the cost :) nah , she has every appliance known to man and woman , wants for nothing , so my toy doesn't count . some of us are not under the thumb. how's your bald spot ? > > > how do you convince your partner that this is a good investment ??? > > why would I even mention the cost ?. its my toy. [quoted text clipped - 121 lines] > > > > > > > > > > > because > > > > > > > > > > > > of a 25cent thermostat housing gasket. Sorry had to do an OS re-install. Yes, you should sit down. Best part of $4500 complete. They can cost quite a bit more depending on the components you want in them. Brenden > Ta . should I sit down when reading the price ?. > Im thinking of building another alloy block ford V8 and am drawn to a [quoted text clipped - 62 lines] > > > > > > because > > > > > > > of a 25cent thermostat housing gasket. I've give you a breakdown of the costs as I can remember them: 1) bare heads $2500 2) Roller rockers $495 3) Screw in studs $80 4) Guide plates $110 5) One piece valves $900 inc remachining to custom. Valves have a 25deg angle on them done by Competition Valves. 6) Springs $220 7) Retainers $110 8) Single groove collets $69 9) Spring cups ARP $96 10) Arp washers $40 Keep in mind stock rocker covers won't fit anymore. Brenden > Sorry had to do an OS re-install. > [quoted text clipped - 82 lines] > > > > > > > because > > > > > > > > of a 25cent thermostat housing gasket. > Sorry had to do an OS re-install. > > Yes, you should sit down. Best part of $4500 complete. They can cost quite a > bit more depending on the components you want in them. Ill be doing a little better than that , but 3300 is still not cheap :_) > [quoted text clipped - 79 lines] > > > > > > > because > > > > > > > > of a 25cent thermostat housing gasket. $3300 isn't bad. I've checked out both Cleveland alloy head manufacturers AFD and CHI. They both say complete heads for around the $3300 mark. Thing is they aint complete. For $3300 you get heads/valves and average springs,retainers and collets. They you need guides/screw in studs and rollers to complete the heads. :) Brenden > > Sorry had to do an OS re-install. > > [quoted text clipped - 84 lines] > > > > > > > > because > > > > > > > > > of a 25cent thermostat housing gasket. > $3300 isn't bad. I've checked out both Cleveland alloy head manufacturers > AFD and CHI. They both say complete heads for around the $3300 mark. Thing > is they aint complete. > > For $3300 you get heads/valves and average springs,retainers and collets. > They you need guides/screw in studs and rollers to complete the heads. :) yes but one of my clients is a very large motor reconditioner so I can get a small break . > Brenden > [quoted text clipped - 100 lines] > > > > > > > > > because > > > > > > > > > > of a 25cent thermostat housing gasket. > The reason we have iron heads is to stop detonation with the lower octane > fuel. [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > > Brenden Interesting,...I wouldn't have thought ally-alloy would make that big a difference....live and learn My 351c unkown oversize, prolly 10 thou (< 10000ks on engine) pings on WOT (held in 2nd>FMX) at any rpm with max mechanical set at 28 degrees with no vac adv at all..- idle 10 deg on LRP. sh.ts me big-time. Times for uP controlled programmable ign install...try again after ditching the first time due cross-firing in dizzy- cap.. Jason > My 351c unkown oversize, prolly 10 thou (< 10000ks on engine) pings on WOT > (held in 2nd>FMX) at any rpm with max mechanical set at 28 degrees with no > vac adv at all..- idle 10 deg on LRP. > sh.ts me big-time. Times for uP controlled programmable ign install...try > again after ditching the first time due cross-firing in dizzy- cap.. Try a tank of Optimax in it. It's about the only fuel I can run my Chev on now without resorting to stuff all advance. Are you sure the timing marks are correct on the balancer? Pat. > > My 351c unkown oversize, prolly 10 thou (< 10000ks on engine) pings on WOT > > (held in 2nd>FMX) at any rpm with max mechanical set at 28 degrees with no [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > > Pat. Yeah, I'll try some Optimax. The HBal' is new,..so I think its OK. With todays crappy LRP programmable ignition is the way to go. I had problems with the rotor offset required to make the PIg work,...plus picking up the oil-pump drive was a proper bastard (aching back from leaning over for hours) as the the new OP drive shaft has a deviation. Is your Chev donk std compression (allowing for any increase due to rebore)? Jason > > > My 351c unkown oversize, prolly 10 thou (< 10000ks on engine) pings on > WOT [quoted text clipped - 20 lines] > > Jason The new balancer I installed about a month ago was out by 2 deg - or more likely the pointer was out. We run programmable electronic ignition with a locked dizzy - 8deg at idle and 35 at 3500rpm tapering to 40 at 5000rpm. It spends most of it's time between 3000 and 3500 rpm since it is in a boat. Rotor offset was also a problem but we modded the points plate so we could rotate them a bit. It doesn't crossfire at all. It's a stock 350 with older style corvette heads but since we have never opened it up we have no idea on the compression. When we first got it we were running it on super, then LRP but then it seemed that the consistency of the LRP wasn't there - pinging on some tanks and not on others. Then we ran it on Avgas a few times but this year we have just run it on optimax and had no troubles. I didn't want to retard the timing as it drops too many ponies right at the revs it needs to pop a skier out quickly. My father has built himself a nice XE ESP with a 351 and top-loader (saving for the Tremec) that gets taken for fangs around Eastern Creek mostly. It was rebuilt with 10.5:1 compression and had the hardened valve seats fitted to run on optimax. 207 rwkw was the latest figure but they did have some mild pinging and had to retard it a bit. I'm not sure on the ignition numbers although it runs a standard XE dizzy. AFAIK BP ultimate is also 98RON but I have yet to try it (no BP here in Wagga). Regards - Pat. Regards - Pat. > AFAIK BP ultimate is also > 98RON but I have yet to try it (no BP here in Wagga). It is, and so is Mobil Synergy 8000. Caltex "Vortex" is not, however - it is 95 (96?) RON. Cheers, Matt > The reason we have iron heads is to stop detonation with the lower octane > fuel. [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > have alloy heads on my 351 Cleveland. Best thing I ever did to the engine. I > can now run 11.2:1 compression on pump fuel. where did you get the heads from ? url ? cost ? > Brenden > [quoted text clipped - 22 lines] > > > > Jason
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