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Car Forum / Ford / Ford Focus / April 2008

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Focus 2.0 TDCi warm start saga (long)

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Paul Giverin - 16 Apr 2008 22:01 GMT
An update on the unusual engine problem I've been having with my 2.0
TDCi Focus (Pug engine). Someone might find it helpful in the future:-

About this time last year the car developed an intermittent problem when
the engine was started within 15-30 minutes of having been shut down.
The engine would start but idle roughly at about 600 rpm. It wouldn't
respond to throttle inputs and there were plumes of black smoke from the
exhaust. The dealer said there were no fault codes but changed the EGR
valve anyway.

The problem happened a couple of more times but throughout the summer it
was fine. Come winter, the problem re-occurred. I took it to the dealer
who did a PCM update on the ECU. This didn't make any difference.
Luckily the problem happened while at the dealer so the technician could
see the problem for himself.

They took the car in for a week and ran lots of tests under the
direction of Ford Tech services. They authorised a new set of modified
injectors (at £1000/set). When I got the car back it sounded like a
tractor. The dealer said that this was probably the result of the
modified injectors and was the price to pay for having the original
problem fixed. Unfortunately the original problem was not fixed and the
car went back in again.

Ford sent out a field engineer to look at the car. Apparently they can
switch off each injector in turn and calculate the performance of each
one. For reasons I'm not sure of, the performance is expressed as RPM.
All four injectors should be within a few RPM of each other. On mine,
injectors 1 & 3 were 300 RPM down on the other two. So two of the new
injectors (Siemens) were defective. That would account for the tractor
like clatter at low revs.

They also replaced the throttle body. The technician had wanted to
replace it on its first workshop visit but Ford wouldn't authorise it.
The technician showed me the problem with it. The butterfly is spring
loaded open but when pushing it fully closed, sometimes it would stick
in this position. The Ford field engineer authorised its replacement
second time round.

I now believe that the throttle body was the cause of the warm start
problems and that the original injectors were fine. Its now had six new
injectors. Thank God its under warranty.

Finally, when it was in for its first visit, the technician had said how
awkward the glow plugs were to get out. I asked if it was worth me
paying for a new set for him to fit, being as they were out already. He
said it wasn't worth it as they looked fine and they were there for
emissions reasons more than anything else. When it was in for its second
strip down, the technician felt that the 7mm flats of the glowplugs were
looking a bit chewed up by now so he fitted a new set FOC.

The car is sounding quiet again now and the next week or so will tell if
the warm start problem is finally fixed. Fingers crossed.

Signature

Paul Giverin

British Jet Engine Website:-    www.britjet.co.uk

My photos:-  www.pbase.com/vendee

Tim.. - 16 Apr 2008 22:54 GMT
> An update on the unusual engine problem I've been having with my 2.0 TDCi
> Focus (Pug engine). Someone might find it helpful in the future:-
[quoted text clipped - 48 lines]
> The car is sounding quiet again now and the next week or so will tell if
> the warm start problem is finally fixed. Fingers crossed.

If the throttle butterfly sticks closed then this would indeed create black
smoke and no responce to the throttle.

Tim.
Paul Giverin - 16 Apr 2008 23:09 GMT
>If the throttle butterfly sticks closed then this would indeed create black
>smoke and no responce to the throttle.

Indeed but if it was completely closed, how would the engine get any air
at all?

Do diesels have an ICV or bypass valve?

Signature

Paul Giverin

British Jet Engine Website:-    www.britjet.co.uk

My photos:-  www.pbase.com/vendee

Mrcheerful - 16 Apr 2008 23:30 GMT
>> If the throttle butterfly sticks closed then this would indeed
>> create black smoke and no responce to the throttle.
[quoted text clipped - 3 lines]
>
> Do diesels have an ICV or bypass valve?

proper diesels don't have a throttle valve or any electrics at all, those
are some of their delightful features I used to think
Tim.. - 17 Apr 2008 17:09 GMT
>>If the throttle butterfly sticks closed then this would indeed create
>>black
[quoted text clipped - 4 lines]
>
> Do diesels have an ICV or bypass valve?

No.

Many do have a vaccum or electrically operated throttling valve(s) for the
purposes of increasing swirl at low speed, brake servo vacuum and/or
improving EGR performance.

They never shut 100%, and given a diesels ability to suck hard it would get
enough air to run on tickover even if it smoked like a bugger.

Tim..
Chris Game - 18 Apr 2008 11:38 GMT
> They never shut 100%, and given a diesels ability to suck hard it
> would get enough air to run on tickover even if it smoked like a
> bugger.

Diesel engines suck, shock!

Signature

Chris Game

"Drawing on my fine command of language, I said nothing."
-- Mark Twain

Adrian - 18 Apr 2008 11:41 GMT
Chris Game (Chris Game <chrisgame@example.net>) gurgled happily, sounding
much like they were saying:

>> They never shut 100%, and given a diesels ability to suck hard it would
>> get enough air to run on tickover even if it smoked like a bugger.

> Diesel engines suck, shock!

Yep, they then squeeze, bang and finally blow, before sucking again.
Don McC - 18 Apr 2008 21:54 GMT
> Yep, they then squeeze, bang and finally blow, before sucking again.

That's one way to describe the operation of a four-stroke internal combustion
engine.

--
Don
DervMan - 19 Apr 2008 10:10 GMT
>> Yep, they then squeeze, bang and finally blow, before sucking again.
>
> That's one way to describe the operation of a four-stroke internal
> combustion
> engine.

*must... not... rise to the bait...*

:)

Signature

The DervMan
www.dervman.com


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