Home | Contact Us | FAQ | Search & Site Map | Link to Us
Sign In | Join | Other 45 Sites in Network
HomeAnnouncements
Discussion Groups
By Brand
BMWChevroletDodgeFordGMHondaLexusMercedes-BenzNissanPeugeotToyotaVolkswagenOther Brands
By Topic
4x4 CarsRVsDrivingMaintenance & RepairCar AudioCollectible Cars
Country Specific
Australian ForumsUK Forums
ArticlesAuto InsuranceBuyingCars & TechnologyMaintenanceMiscellaneousSafety
DMV Resources
Related Topics
MotorcyclesBoatsMore Topics ...

Car Forum / Ford / Ford Mustang / July 2009

Tip: Looking for answers? Try searching our database.

5.0 HO Mass air meter and injectors

Thread view: 
Enable EMail Alerts  Start New Thread
Thread rating: 
frog - 03 Aug 2003 21:08 GMT
Can anyone tell me what the stock injectors are in an 88 Cougar? Are
they 19's? I have converted my son's mustang to mass air and it will
barely run. The car was originally a 2.3 L and it was converted two
years ago with an 88 Cougar 5.0.

I just installed the mass air meter, computer and harness. It still has
the stock throttle body and injectors form the Cougar.

Car also seems to start with a fairly high RPM and then comes down to
500 and of course stalls shortly there after. It doesn't seem to idle at
all. I have also noticed some light backfires into the TB.

Any ideas would be greatly appreciated.

DaveT

89 LX 5.0 AOD
JS - 03 Aug 2003 22:20 GMT
Stock '88 Cougar has 19lb injectors.

Here's what I'm wondering though.

You took the wiring harness off of a 90 something with an A9L computer.
This would almost definately be a Mustang 5.0 H.O. computer and wiring
harness.

You put that harness onto an '88 Cougar engine and EFI system.  If I
remember correctly... and I could be *way* off base here... the 1988 Cougar
5.0 engine was *not* an H.O.  I have a parts '88 Cougar 5.0 and I'm pretty
sure it's just a standard (non H.O.) 5-liter.  If this is in fact true, and
you tried to put a computer on that was set up for an H.O., you would most
likely have problems.

H.O. engines have a different firing order... 1-3-7-2-6-5-4-8 by memory.
The non-H.O. starts out 1-5.  The problem here is that the injectors are
supposed to be fired when the intake port is giong to be open and drawing
air in.  If your cam is a non-H.O. grind, you will be spraying fuel onto a
closed valve on the power stroke.  You won't get a proper air and fuel
mixture.... you could get some backfiring out of the throttle body perhaps
due to a bit of ponding of fuel.  Considering that you used the entire
harness from the '90, that would take care of the thermactor wiring change
that was needed, the speed sensor wiring addition, and the fuel pump relay
monitor #2 wiring addition.  The car ran and idled before, so I'd rule out
EGR + IAC at least for preliminary.  I'd start with the things you changed.

Again, I'm not a mechanic.  I've read a book on fuel injection (specifically
the EEC-IV system that you're running but it also covers fuel injection
theory) but that's about it.  It makes sense to me though.  I'm pretty sure
the injectors are timed with the valvetrain to spray gas only when needed.
Some cars have crank sensors, I believe the TFI module takes care of that on
these cars, but I'm not sure.

How would I proceed?  First thing I'd do, scan the codes to see what the
computer is trying to tell you.  Perhaps you missed a plug... or a wire in
the harness is broken.  If that doesn't lead you anywhere, I'd check the MAF
to ensure that it seems to be working properly.  Voltage changing for more
air coming in... which is hard if the car won't stay running, but you can at
least ensure that it's varying.

You've removed the vacuum line from the MAP sensor, correct?  The car will
not run correctly with the vacuum hooked up to the MAP sensor anymore.  This
was the way it was on speed density cars, but on mass air systems, it needs
to measure the ambient air pressure.

After all of that, perhaps you could try test wires to swap the injector
order.  Obviously there isn't enough wire in the harness to put the #3
injector plug to the #5 injector, so you'll have to improvise, but I'd try
to transpose the injector firing order to trick the computer into thinking
it's running an H.O. engine when really it isn't.

Or you could find a computer set up for a mass air non-H.O. and try it, but
that might cost a bunch more.

Just my non-professional opinion...

JS

> Can anyone tell me what the stock injectors are in an 88 Cougar? Are
> they 19's? I have converted my son's mustang to mass air and it will
[quoted text clipped - 13 lines]
>
> 89 LX 5.0 AOD
89lxmustang - 26 Jul 2009 21:01 GMT
i just got a 88 ho motor from a 88 mustang gt and if the motor came out of a
88 mustang and was a 5.0 ho do u know if they have the maf connection becouse
i red that coolcats page and it said u cant do anything to a 88 5.0 motor
exept throttle body and filter but i dont know if thats just for a couger
motor. and it said something about a speed density computer setup???

>Stock '88 Cougar has 19lb injectors.
>
[quoted text clipped - 60 lines]
>>
>> 89 LX 5.0 AOD
orangespawn50@webtv.net - 03 Aug 2003 22:30 GMT
what car did you get the wiring harness from? if the wiring harness is
from an H.O motor & the motor is not an H.O then the firing order is
diferent  & it will not run correct

//Jeff

http://community.webtv.net/orangespawn50/doc
5.0bob << - 03 Aug 2003 23:12 GMT
>Can anyone tell me what the stock injectors are in an 88 Cougar? Are
>they 19's? I have converted my son's mustang to mass air and it will
[quoted text clipped - 13 lines]
>
>89 LX 5.0 AOD

Here is a quote from the cool cats website.This may answer
your question.

For Converted or Transplanted 5.0 HO Cougars

This section is for converted or transplanted 1987-88 HO 5.0 motors
ONLY. It is not intended for the stock Cougar/Thunderbird 5.0 motor.
Any attempt to convert a stock non-HO motor to mass air can result in
serious damage to the engine

Follow the link below for more info.

http://www.coolcats.net/tech/advanced/massair.html
frog - 04 Aug 2003 01:10 GMT
Crap knew that I'd forget something important. I have an HO cam in it.
It has the 1-3 firing order now. The only thing that is original on this
car is the lifters, rocker arms, crank and rods.

Here's everything.

Bored 30 over
HO intake but stoke Throttle body (I just haven't changed it yet)
HO cam
E7TE heads
90 Harness
90 Mass Flow meter

The motor was run with the stock Cougar intake, harness (speed density,
cam and heads for 2 years, but it ran really rich and had poor fuel
milage (IMO).

Bob I haven't read the CoolCats site as of yet but........

Thanks

DaveT
JS - 04 Aug 2003 04:39 GMT
> Crap knew that I'd forget something important. I have an HO cam in it.
> It has the 1-3 firing order now. The only thing that is original on this
[quoted text clipped - 18 lines]
>
> DaveT

Then my next suggestion would be oxygen sensors, perhaps the MAP sensor that
I'd mentioned earlier, etc.

If you changed the cam and the computer all at the same time, cam timing
could be off, ignition timing could be off, etc, causing severe running
issues and backfires as well.

What was the sequence of events since the last time it ran good?

JS
 
Sign In
Join
My Latest Posts
My Monitored Threads
My Blog
My Photo Gallery
My Profile
My Homepage

Start New Thread
Enable EMail Alerts
Rate this Thread



©2009 Advenet LLC   Privacy Policy - Terms of Use
This website includes both content owned or controlled by Advenet as well as content owned or controlled by third parties.