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Car Forum / Ford / Ford Mustang / September 2004

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Hey all..new to group...

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Guess who? - 28 Sep 2004 04:37 GMT
This is my formal "Hello!" to the group..and my first post..
I recently purchased my first pony car..an 86 GT..and I am planning to
tweak it over the next several months and get it on the road as a
weekend driver next summer..
It's stock all the way except for the paint job (plum crazy) and the
tires and rims..and it's got a set of old traction bars bolted onto
the leaf springs which gives it some grab and stops the hop..
The interior is in excellent condition and only needs minor repair..
Of course since it was the first year for Ford to produce a "fuelie"
and they got experimental with the heads..it'll need some work to get
something respectable out of the 302 under the hood..but I plan on the
following upgrades before the spring..tell me what you think..
I am replacing the crappy air induction with a K+N cold air system..
I am replacing the stock throttle body..injector jets..and headers..
I am swapping the 86 factory heads with some 87 ones..this will
eliminate the high swirl turbo head issue while keeping it relatively
cheap..
I'm going to upgrade the ignition parts and advance the timing..and
that should make it a little more muscular for the spring..;)
I am also replacing all the exhaust parts from the headers back..
This is just a start..eventually I wanna replace the 302 with a 351W
and put underdrive pulleys..an electric fan..then work on the
suspension to top it all off...
I know the possibilities are endless..but money intake isn't..so I am
going with what I can afford and driving it in the meantime just for
the fun of it..
I have owned fast cars in the past (79 firebird 350 and an 87 Buick
Regal Turbo) but neither were as much fun..or turned as many heads as
my new baby does..
Anyway..I live to learn..and I am an easy guy to get along with..so
feel free to gimme a shout back..
Cheers..
Johnny
Garth Almgren - 28 Sep 2004 05:06 GMT
> This is my formal "Hello!" to the group..and my first post..

Howdy!

> Anyway..I live to learn..and I am an easy guy to get along with..so
> feel free to gimme a shout back..

SUB FRAME CONNECTORS!!

(Was that loud enough?) :)

Signature

/     Garth - '83 GL V6stang Hatch <Former MW #7>     \

|      My V6stang: http://www.v6stang.com/v6stang     |
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Guess who? - 28 Sep 2004 12:41 GMT
In The Year of Our Lord=-+->!! Mon, 27 Sep 2004 21:06:28
-0700,<-+-=Our highly esteemed and respected member=-+-> Garth Almgren
<nospam@v6stang.com> <-+-=Put forth this notion for all to ponder...

:> This is my formal "Hello!" to the group..and my first post..
:
[quoted text clipped - 4 lines]
:
:SUB FRAME CONNECTORS!!

:(Was that loud enough?) :)

~Lol...yup..loud and clear..
Planning to tie up the frame too..and since I have access to all sorts
of stainless I am planning to make my own (where it's feasable)
I work in the industrial supply business..so I have access to all
sorts of fasteners too..and as my budget allows I will replace the
stock stuff with titanium...
/begin  signature.exe
********************

Arguing on the internet
is like competing in the
Special Olympics.....
Even if you win..you are still
f.cking retarded!

********************

++ Send any e-mail to j_hempseed@hotmail.com ++
 
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Jim S. - 28 Sep 2004 06:19 GMT
>and it's got a set of old traction bars bolted onto
> the leaf springs which gives it some grab and stops the hop..

Really? How odd.

Jim S.
'82 Mutant
Guess who? - 28 Sep 2004 12:45 GMT
In The Year of Our Lord=-+->!! 28 Sep 2004 01:19:48 EDT,<-+-=Our
highly esteemed and respected member=-+-> "Jim S."
<someone@acomputer.com> <-+-=Put forth this notion for all to
ponder...

:>and it's got a set of old traction bars bolted onto
:> the leaf springs which gives it some grab and stops the hop..
:
:Really? How odd.

:Jim S.
:'82 Mutant

~I know..who knew???
lol..my point was this..the old traction bars are a tad bit redundant
nowadays..and will get in the way if I plan to add anything to the
rear suspension...but for the time being they serve a purpose...
I can't get the image of Homer Simpson using a pickaxe to punch holes
in the hood of his car and telling Ned Flanders that it "makes the car
go faster, Flanders!"..
And hey..if nothing else..at least you know I have a firm grasp of the
obvious! ;)

/begin  signature.exe
********************

Arguing on the internet
is like competing in the
Special Olympics.....
Even if you win..you are still
f.cking retarded!

********************

++ Send any e-mail to j_hempseed@hotmail.com ++
 
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Jim S. - 28 Sep 2004 21:54 GMT
Uh-huh.
Well, I think you should take a look under your car. I guarantee a surprise
or two.

Jim S.
'82 Mutant

> In The Year of Our Lord=-+->!! 28 Sep 2004 01:19:48 EDT,<-+-=Our
> highly esteemed and respected member=-+-> "Jim S."
[quoted text clipped - 33 lines]
>
> +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
trainfan1 - 28 Sep 2004 13:04 GMT
>>and it's got a set of old traction bars bolted onto
>>the leaf springs which gives it some grab and stops the hop..
[quoted text clipped - 3 lines]
> Jim S.
> '82 Mutant

Sounds like the suspension is already tweaked...

Rob
JS - 29 Sep 2004 03:53 GMT
Welcome to the group, Johnny.  There's lots to learn from this group if you
ask the right questions.

First off, congrats on the purchase.  Sounds like a great project/toy.

Beware - this is going to be long-winded... you may want to get a
sandwich...

As Jim S. is alluding to, there are no leaf springs on your car, and if
there are, you may be in for more than you bargained for.  I have seen
traction bars come stock on '83 GTs and such, and perhaps this is where
these bars came from.  Your shock setup should be 4 in the rear
(quad-shock) - 2 vertical and 2 horizontal to stop the hopping.  In stock
form, this does a pretty good job at stopping wheelhop, but not as good at
planting the wheels as the traction bars will do.

On the mods you have suggested, I offer the following:

Cold air intake - mostly eye candy.  If your car still has the air silencer
(remove the air box and check the fender well - if there's a black piece of
plastic there in the inner fender, that's it), remove it.  The stock air
system will flow adequately enough for a mostly stock engine, and would
probably be the last of my worries.  Without the air silencer, you're
already scooping up air from the significantly colder inner fender.

Injectors and throttle body - Your computer is designed to understand that
at this pressure, this much air comes in, and this much fuel should be
added.  there is no direct metering of the air.  Though some suggest it's
feasible and/or practical to make changes such as these, it may cause overly
rich situations that the oxygen sensor will not be able to compensate for.
The O2 sensor is in charge of keeping the A/F ratio in a range, but the
computer wil only adjust so much before it thinks the sensor is bad.  Larger
injectors will increase the amount of fuel going into the engine with no
significant increase in airflow - the throttle body and CAI kit aren't going
to yield that much greater flow.

The headers are a good idea - anything to remove exhaust restriction will
gain you top-end horsepower, but you may sacrifice bottom end torque.

Swapping the '86 heads with '87 ones doesn't seem like a very good swap.  At
the very least, get a pair of E7TE heads (available on the Mustang in 1988).
These heads were used through '93 (and perhaps '95) and were decent as far
as stock heads went.  '87 Mustang heads weren't much better than the '86's.

Note that the '86 was the only year with flat-top pistons, and there is some
valve clearance consideration to observe.

Personally, I would spend the time with the chassis first - stiffening up
the frame.  While it is feasible to make your own, make sure you use a thick
enough material to make it worth your while.  Spec out some units on the
market already before making your own.

A rear end gear swap will make your pony feel much more alive.  It'll cost
you more for gas, but it'll definately wake your car right up.

After you have the chassis set up the way you like (frame, braking - which
sucks on these cars to be honest, and suspension)... then it's time to play
with the engine.

Expect to either pay a lot to tune your speed density system or to convert
to a Mass Airflow system if you plan to make any large changes.  The heads
are a big stopping point in these engines.  Intakes, injectors, exhaust, etc
may yield you some, but a set of heads will do more with the stock
components than all of these combined, and with these components, even
better still.  Again, watch the valve clearance if you swap heads or cams,
or anything in the valvetrain.

This is where you ask yourself exactly what your goal is for the car, and do
what it takes to get you there.

Good luck in your quest...

JS

> This is my formal "Hello!" to the group..and my first post..
> I recently purchased my first pony car..an 86 GT..and I am planning to
[quoted text clipped - 29 lines]
> Cheers..
> Johnny
Guess who? - 29 Sep 2004 04:22 GMT
In The Year of Our Lord=-+->!! Wed, 29 Sep 2004 02:53:06 GMT,<-+-=Our
highly esteemed and respected member=-+-> "JS" <not@home.now> <-+-=Put
forth this notion for all to ponder...

~~Hi JS..thanks for the pointers..as I have said it's my first
mustang..so as you can see I am still unfamiliar with the mechanics of
it..
I spose I assumerd it had leaf springs since I assumed this is where
one mounted traction bars..
And I understand the head swap issue..I knew the 86 had inherant
problems with the stock heads..but I figured the issues were resolved
by the following year..simply put 88 heads would be cheap to
acquire..and would solve the problems with the 86 heads..
It's a stopgap solution since I am hoping to drop the motor and
replace it in the relatively near future (next couple years)..
I also thought the idea to increasing horsepower was to increase air
flow and fuel intake rates..I have alot to learn.
I knew about the issue with the air silencer, and after pricing the
K+N cold air intake I came to the conclusion that it was somewhat
redundant when you consider the fact that the factory parts could be
modified if I desired to bring more air in without dropping 300 bucks
in the process..
I would not attempt to build my own sub frame..but after looking at
the strut tower systems out there I couldn't see why a good one
couldn't be fabricated for next to nothing.
I am opening up the diff in the next couple weeks and having a look at
the gear set, not sure what the ratio is but I want to see what
condition they are in anyway..and replacing the oil wouldn't hurt.
I am also thinking the trans oil pan gasket needs replacing as I seem
to have a slow leak..but I haven't yet discovered the source of the
leak.
Do you think it would be beneficial to increase the size of the
injectors and rails if I added a performance plenum and intake
manifold? Would this make the larger throttle body and a cold air
intake system more beneficial?
I appreciate the post..and I will be sure to float any upgrade ideas
here.
.if I am lucky I will get a reply like yours in the future so I may be
able to spend my money wisely..
And to sum it all up..I guess I want a mild upgrade in power..the car
is already lots of fun to drive..lets just say more pep..more fun!
But it isn't gonna be a drag strip monster..
So I will take your advice and work on the chassis, braking and
suspension before I get too hung up on power tweaks..
Johnny

:Welcome to the group, Johnny.  There's lots to learn from this group if you
:ask the right questions.
[quoted text clipped - 103 lines]
:> Cheers..
:> Johnny
Stuart&Janet - 29 Sep 2004 04:53 GMT
E7TE heads are '87 Mustang heads ( albeit truck heads).

BTW love your American Woman album, so why did you fire Randy Bachman ;^)  StuK

> In The Year of Our Lord=-+->!! Wed, 29 Sep 2004 02:53:06 GMT,<-+-=Our
> highly esteemed and respected member=-+-> "JS" <not@home.now> <-+-=Put
[quoted text clipped - 149 lines]
> :> Cheers..
> :> Johnny
TurboMike - 29 Sep 2004 05:22 GMT
FYI, the E7TE heads were used on the Mustang from 87-93 at least if not till
95.  The 87 head will not work on the 86 motor due to piston differences as I
understand it.  Someone correct me if I am wrong.

>E7TE heads are '87 Mustang heads ( albeit truck heads).

///Mike
TS #63
1993 BMW 525i
http://community.webshots.com/user/mpompe2
Pics of all the old cars - Newly updated
Stuart&Janet - 29 Sep 2004 06:08 GMT
I believe you need to put eyebrows on them or swap piston IIRC. StuK

> FYI, the E7TE heads were used on the Mustang from 87-93 at least if not till
> 95.  The 87 head will not work on the 86 motor due to piston differences as I
[quoted text clipped - 7 lines]
> http://community.webshots.com/user/mpompe2
> Pics of all the old cars - Newly updated
JS - 30 Sep 2004 03:36 GMT
Some piece of literature I read somewhere stated that '87 Mustangs used a
reivsed head, but that the Mustang took the truck design (E7TE) in '88.
However, I take real-world experience over a book any day.  Thanks for the
correction.

JS

> E7TE heads are '87 Mustang heads ( albeit truck heads).
>
[quoted text clipped - 181 lines]
>> :> Cheers..
>> :> Johnny
Jim S. - 29 Sep 2004 07:03 GMT
> Do you think it would be beneficial to increase the size of the
> injectors and rails if I added a performance plenum and intake
> manifold? Would this make the larger throttle body and a cold air
> intake system more beneficial?

I think you're getting a bit ahead of yourself here. Tune up the engine and
leave it stock, especially if you are serious about  the 351.  Doing the
above will provide a minimal gain for your performance dollar.

Concentrate your dollars on non-engine modifications for now.  Exhaust,
subframe connectors,  brakes, & suspension mods are important now,  and more
so in  the  future

I suggest you tune up the engine and put a new exhaust on it.  Then, wait a
little while and spend some time getting to know the car and  figure out
exactly what the car can do, and what you want it to do.

Jim S.
'82 Mutant
 
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