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Car Forum / Ford / Ford Mustang / August 2006How is the 2005+ V6...Really.....
I'm shopping!! So my question is, how good of a performer is the V6 in the "fun to drive" category? I am looking automatic/Pony which from what I usnerstand has a similar suspension as the GT (rear swaybar etc) BTW.. Just as a point of reference as to where I am coming from, my daughter's 2003 Jetta is a hell of a lot of fun to drive! Handles extremely well on twisty backroads and while it is certainly no tire burner, it feels like you are going faster than you are. IOW lot's of fun to drive. I'm not interested in shaving 1/4 second off my 0-60 time but more interested in being able to step on the pedal and feel+hear the thing go. One other factor is that I maintain my own cars (Except for warranty) and I tend to keep my cars forever and baby them. Currently a 92 Caprice at 380,000 miles all original (except timing chain and front end suspension), a 2000 Dodge Caravan at 120,000 miles and running fine. My secret? Castrol GTX and a Wixx filter every 3k or so. Never more than 5k between changes. The above is my reason for leaning toward the GT because I have a gut feeling the motor/parts are maybe a little better supported? Wrongo? I dunno.... (Help me out here??) So, how about it guys and gals, does the V6 give enough "fun to drive" factor? Should I go for the rag top to compensate? Or Should I bite the *bullet* (pun intended) and go for a basic GT hardtop model? I'm looking at a 2007 V6 Pony/premium/ vista blue with White rally stripe. I saw a 2005 GT with only 3k on it, one owner at a dealer for $25k but I am suspicious. Carfax is clean...yada yada yada..... for all that's worth :) Again, I'm not interested in racing, but I HATE slow cars. In fact, I feel slow cars cause more accidents than faster, better handling ones. I attened a Bob Bonderaunt (sp? school back in the 80's and learned that most accidents are avoided by handling and power, not slamming on the brakes. Oh yea, I also get an X-Plan price, for whatever that's worth :( Any tips on how to use that? As you see I have many questions, but you know I am really steamed over this Toyota crap and want to support my American companies if I can. I also happen to LOVE the RETRO STANG : (44yo male here).... TIA!!!! > I'm shopping!! > > So my question is, how good of a performer is the V6 in the "fun to drive" > category? > I am looking automatic/Pony which from what I usnerstand has a similar > suspension as the GT (rear swaybar etc) I rented a V6/Auto/Vert while vacationing in WA last fall. Great car, fun to drive, very comfortable. Acceleration was acceptable, but nothing to write home about. Fortunatly, it doesn't take much to make the V6 a good performer. It's 4.0 vs. 4.6 liters. Not much. The V6 is "detuned" a little from the V8. Ford doesn't want the two to compete in the performance market. But a few simple bolt ons and a computer reprogram, and the performance would be pretty good. And get 25mpg! Maint is easier, and insurance is cheaper. The balance and weight are slightly better with the V6. Although, I would go for the 5 speed.  Signature.boB Arrived: 2006 FXDI, Red. 1997 HD FXDWG - Turbocharged Stolen 11/26/05 in Denver 1HD1GEL10VY3200010 CO License J5822Z 2001 Dodge Dakota QC 5.9/4x4/3.92 1966 Mustang Coupe - Daily Driver 1965 FFR Cobra - 427W EFI, Damn Fast. >> I'm shopping!! >> [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] > simple bolt ons and a computer reprogram, and the performance would be > pretty good. whot kind of bolt ons ? >>>I'm shopping!! >>> [quoted text clipped - 14 lines] > > whot kind of bolt ons ? Just simple stuff - headers, GT exhaust, cold air intake. I know the stock GT exhaust system will directly bolt in there. And you see them on e-bay pretty cheap. They add a bit of power and a better sound. If you really want to get some performance, bolt on a blower. Especially if you live at high altitude. Not long ago, I was seriously considering a V6 for a drag strip car. I live at 6,400' ASL. With headers and a blower, I would have more torque and hp than a GT without the blower. Altitude really sucks the power, and a blower puts it back. Signature.boB Arrived: 2006 FXDI, Red. 1997 HD FXDWG - Turbocharged Stolen 11/26/05 in Denver 1HD1GEL10VY3200010 CO License J5822Z 2001 Dodge Dakota QC 5.9/4x4/3.92 1966 Mustang Coupe - Daily Driver 1965 FFR Cobra - 427W EFI, Damn Fast. >>>>I'm shopping!! >>>> [quoted text clipped - 20 lines] > If you really want to get some performance, bolt on a blower. Especially if you >live at high altitude. By the time you do all that you've passed the cost of buying a GT. >>>>>I'm shopping!! >>>>> [quoted text clipped - 30 lines] > > By the time you do all that you've passed the cost of buying a GT. To say nothing of voiding the warranty on your new car. And just imagine how much more power you would have if you did that to the GT... >>>>>>I'm shopping!! >>>>>> [quoted text clipped - 34 lines] >And just imagine how much more power you would have if you did that to the >GT... Yeah exactly. > >>>>>I'm shopping!! > >>>>> [quoted text clipped - 34 lines] > And just imagine how much more power you would have if you did that to the > GT... Nothing voids your entire warranty... just what part they can show was caused by your aftermarket parts... Some dealerships are jerks... some are very cool... mine was very cool... I had my TPS replace under warranty even though my N20 kit was hooked up to it! In plain sight! And I still had the numbers from the track on the windshield and my helmet in the back seat! LOL! Warrantys are important.. but I think some people put to much emphasis on them... do you get rid of your car as soon as it's out of warranty???? >> "Mrs Ken Ehrett" <yanks@olg.com> wrote in message >> > By the time you do all that you've passed the cost of buying a GT. [quoted text clipped - 14 lines] > on them... do you get rid of your car as soon as it's out of > warranty???? Irrelevant, for instance the turbo diesel engine and transmission in my 2005 Superduty's replacement cost far exceed $20,000, it carries a 100,000 mile warranty. My dealer's service manager too USED to be vary liberal with his warranty work, he is even a authorized Banks dealer (he was installing Banks kits on new vehicles). Then Ford started overriding his warranty approvals, now if you make modifications, you get a denial right off the bat, and it's an uphill battle from there. Besides, if you can afford to blow up your new cars engine, all while voiding your warranty, you could certainly afford to buy and insure the V-8 GT. Yes Warranty's are very important, and valuable The relevant thing here is most people would like to keep their new car warranty valid for the full term of the warranty. > >> "Mrs Ken Ehrett" <yanks@olg.com> wrote in message > >> > By the time you do all that you've passed the cost of buying a GT. [quoted text clipped - 31 lines] > The relevant thing here is most people would like to keep their new car > warranty valid for the full term of the warranty. The beauty of the blown motor is we'll have a "spare" motor to rebuild this winter... We picked up a used 4.0L motor with less than 10,000 miles on it for a whopping $900!!! LOL! Hell, I could have afforded to by TWO GT's if I really wanted to! As I mentioned before I bought the V6 on principal... I would rather spend a few thousand dollars building up my V6 than give the dealership one extra penny just because they happen to have a GT in stock! So the guys that have blown their motors in their GT's... I guess they should have waited and bought a GT500???? LOL >> >> "Mrs Ken Ehrett" <yanks@olg.com> wrote in message >> >> > By the time you do all that you've passed the cost of buying a GT. [quoted text clipped - 50 lines] > So the guys that have blown their motors in their GT's... I guess they > should have waited and bought a GT500???? LOL If you prefer half-assed hot rods to factory engineering, that's your thing, so be it, but it is not cheaper, better or more reliable. If you exceed the design specifications of any parts you are going to break them, if you like doing that, have at it. I think it is foolish and a waste of money. If you prefer half-assed hot rods to factory engineering, that's your thing, > so be it, but it is not cheaper, better or more reliable. If you exceed the > design specifications of any parts you are going to break them, if you like > doing that, have at it. I think it is foolish and a waste of money. In my day, we drove what they gave us. And we LIKED it that way! Not much of a hot rodder, are you Mr. Nobody? Signature.boB Arrived: 2006 FXDI, Red. 1997 HD FXDWG - Turbocharged Stolen 11/26/05 in Denver 1HD1GEL10VY3200010 CO License J5822Z 2001 Dodge Dakota QC 5.9/4x4/3.92 1966 Mustang Coupe - Daily Driver 1965 FFR Cobra - 427W EFI, Damn Fast. > If you prefer half-assed hot rods to factory engineering, that's your > thing, [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > > Not much of a hot rodder, are you Mr. Nobody? On the contrary, Mr. .boB I've done more hot rodding than most, converted automatic cars into manuals, put engines in cars that they never came in, converted from carburetor to EFI, modified rear-end housings, put a 671 blower on a 351 Cleveland (without a kit) and finally got it right, (My cousin still has the car), and blown up and repaired/replace more engines transmissions and rear-ends than I can count. What I learned from all that, is it is damn near impossible to backyard engineer better than factory engineering! Insisting that you can buy a new V-6 Mustang and have it out perform and V-8 GT for less money without addressing the warranty and reliability issues is disingenuous, besides, it is foolish to bastardize a brand new car. <SNIP> > What I learned from all that, is it is damn near impossible to > backyard engineer better than factory engineering! > > Insisting that you can buy a new V-6 Mustang and have it out perform and V-8 > GT for less money without addressing the warranty and reliability issues is > disingenuous, besides, it is foolish to bastardize a brand new car. Who said anything about "backyard" engineering? We are talking well engineered package from Vortech (or other reputable company). My engineer buddies (from Ford btw...) were very impressed with the Vortech setup! Nothing 'bastardized" about it at all... Running the standard Vortech kit should really not affect the car reliability... if you start pushing things by swapping pulleys or screwing with the tune.. then yes, you run the risk of a problem... But if you use the kit as designed there should be no issue... heck, the Shelby CS6 (V6) does in fact come with a warranty! They are using the Paxton kit which is really a rebadged Vortech! I suppose the guys at Shelby are a bunch of backyard hick engineers! LOL! Again.. the prices difference between my V6 and what a GT would have cost me was $8000... again... I will not argue that point... it was $8K.. period! Spend $5000 on the V6 and it will out peform a stock GT... and be VERY RELIABLE! Take the extra $3000 and invest it... Consider that your warranty! A perfectly good, lightly used 4.0L can be had for under $1000! \\ > <SNIP> >> What I learned from all that, is it is damn near impossible to [quoted text clipped - 17 lines] > is really a rebadged Vortech! I suppose the guys at Shelby are a bunch > of backyard hick engineers! LOL! Are you really that thick? How did you blow up you first engine? "Backyard" engineering wasn't it? > Again.. the prices difference between my V6 and what a GT would have > cost me was $8000... again... I will not argue that point... Yet you still keep trying too... LMFAO it was > $8K.. period! Spend $5000 on the V6 and it will out peform a stock > GT... and be VERY RELIABLE! Take the extra $3000 and invest it... > Consider that your warranty! A perfectly good, lightly used 4.0L can > be had for under $1000! > Are you really that thick? How did you blow up you first engine? > "Backyard" engineering wasn't it? No... it's called DRAG RACING... Bad things can happen when you DRAG RACE... We are talking about two completely differenent things here. We are talking about a heavily moddifed car that pushes the limits at the track... vs a much more mildly modded car for use as a daily driver. We were not talking relibility of race cars... On N20 my car was pushing close to 500 ft/lbs of torque... of course something was going to break! That was a given! LOL! It was just a matter of time! There is a moment at the tree when you simply throw caution to the wind and go for it... and sometimes when you do that stuff breaks... It's all part of racing... Now my car is set up a lot more milder... The N20 is gone and I'm running a Vortech.. The car is now at 313RWHP/290RWTQ... in this configuration it is very reliable... If it wasn't reliable do you think Shelby would be building the CS6's? (They are using a Paxton blower) Especially since it comes with a WARRANTY???? The CS6 is a perfect example (although VERY OVERPRICED!) of an improvement of your beloved factory engineering... Perhaps you should call them up and tell them to quite bastardizing those Mustangs! LOL! > If you prefer half-assed hot rods to factory engineering, that's your thing, > so be it, but it is not cheaper, better or more reliable. If you exceed the > design specifications of any parts you are going to break them, if you like > doing that, have at it. I think it is foolish and a waste of money. LOL! Factory engineering... I have enough friends in the automotive engineering field that will tell you "factory" engineering means a bean counter watching over your shoulder to make sure you keep the cost to a minumum!!! Factory engineering has nothing to do with better or more reliable (as long as it makes it through the basic warranty period! LOL!)... it has to do with the bottom line! $$$$$... How many people in this group keep their Mustang 100% stock? How many take their car to the dealership for EVERYTHING? Oil changes, air filters, brakes, mufflers????? Stock does not automatically mean better! As far as half-assed... I'll assume that was directed at my car... LOL! When was the last time a national publication did a feature on your car? Hmmmm.... How many car shows have you won? Got any time slips from the track? The fact is there is room for improvement from the factory... If you're happy with your car, that's wonderful! Good for you... Personally I view working on my car as a hobby and chose to spend my money on it... Nothing foolish about it... it's a very satisfying hobby at that! LOL! >>>>>I'm shopping!! >>>>> [quoted text clipped - 22 lines] > > By the time you do all that you've passed the cost of buying a GT. Not around here. You're talking about no more than $6K. Around here, the GT's go for about $10K more than the similar V6. The dealerships have plenty of V6's to choose frome, they're having a tough time selling them. But the GT's sell themselves. They don't stay on the lot very long. Some of them get sold before delivery. The V6 gets 25mpg; at least, my rental did. And you know how I drive a rental. Gas pedal only has two positions - up and down. Plus, your insurance is cheaper. Besides, I thought it would be fun to have a hot rod V6. Take it to the drag strip and smoke the new GT's :) Imagine them looking over at you and saying, "Oh, that's just a wimpy V6/auto." Nothing like a little stealthy power. Signature.boB Arrived: 2006 FXDI, Red. 1997 HD FXDWG - Turbocharged Stolen 11/26/05 in Denver 1HD1GEL10VY3200010 CO License J5822Z 2001 Dodge Dakota QC 5.9/4x4/3.92 1966 Mustang Coupe - Daily Driver 1965 FFR Cobra - 427W EFI, Damn Fast. >>>>>>I'm shopping!! >>>>>> [quoted text clipped - 28 lines] >themselves. They don't stay on the lot very long. Some of them get sold before >delivery. That's your area. In my area the add-on's put me up to GT prices. > The V6 gets 25mpg; at least, my rental did. My Mach 1 gets 24 mpg on highway and about 22 in city driving. >And you know how I drive a rental. Actually no. :) > Gas pedal only has two positions - up and down. Plus, your insurance is cheaper. Can't comment on the insurance because I'm paying Cobra prices. > Besides, I thought it would be fun to have a hot rod V6. Take it to the drag >strip and smoke the new GT's :) Imagine them looking over at you and saying, "Oh, >that's just a wimpy V6/auto." Nothing like a little stealthy power. Reminds me of an 04 GT who tried to intimidate me one evening last spring. Rode my tail for about 5 miles until we got onto the Beltway. He passed me and then got stuck behind a slow moving van. I got around him just as he floored it. Suffice it to say he kept well back and three lanes over until we parted company. He might have had what he thought was a bad-a$$ GT but it was no match for a Mach 1. > Besides, I thought it would be fun to have a hot rod V6. Take it to the drag > strip and smoke the new GT's :) Imagine them looking over at you and saying, "Oh, > that's just a wimpy V6/auto." Nothing like a little stealthy power. Trust me, it is! LOL! Funny... I show up at the track and everyone walks past and doesn't give me a second thought since i'm obviously a V6.. no fogs and single exhaust... then I make a pass and the next thing you know everyone comes over and wants to know what's under my hood! LOL!!! Same thing happens around town... come up from behind me... see the single exhaust and think "AH! A V6.. easy target!" Seems my muffler drowns out the Vortech's whistle or they don't listen for it... either way they're usally pretty shocked when they get spanked... LOL! Was at a local car show 2 weeks ago.. Guy comes up to me... "I've heard stories about this car... it's a V6 and it goes like Hell!" LOL! Sorry for the crossposts. I just realized it. >>>>>I'm shopping!! >>>>> [quoted text clipped - 30 lines] > > By the time you do all that you've passed the cost of buying a GT. Hardly.... not talking superchargers. A SCT tune, CAI and duals with a 4:10 gear will run around 1500. None of that will void your warranty, except the tune..and all you have to do is load the stock tune back in it before the trip to the dealership. It'll make the v6 launch just as well as a GT. Around here theres a 5-6k price difference.... > >>>>I'm shopping!! > >>>> [quoted text clipped - 22 lines] > > By the time you do all that you've passed the cost of buying a GT. There was an $8000 difference between my V6 and a GT. Yes, it was $8000... I will not argue that point... where I live the markup was around $3000 with no baragining! PERIOD! For $8000 I can build up a V6 that can run down the GT... As far as warranty... I don't worry about it since my warranty was up in just over a year... Or if you are so inclined just keep all your stock parts... A guy in town put a rod through his block on his GT with a 150HP shot of N20... put it back to stock and got it covered under warranty... Personally I don't think that's right... but that's another story... LOL! With simply bolts on like a tune, CAI and exhaust my V6 was at 200RWHP... so figure around 240HP at the crank... so 20HP less than my 2002 GT... BTW.. I had my car service a few time with the bolt-on's... heck I even had my TPS replace with my N20 kit hooked up! The dealership never questioned me once... they just did the warranty work with no hassles! LOL! I'm 3 weeks into my love affair with my new '06 V6 auto/Pony in Vista Blue. http://community.webshots.com/photo/552115954/2555699010093714059SPTFfB# The Pony pack is one heck of a bang for the buck! I can't imagine not including it though I'm glad so many don't... my car now stands out that much more! The Pony grill work look as if it came right of a '67 GTA. I'm sure the upgraded suspension and wheel/tire combo helps the handling. The Vista Blue is very sharp and a lot of folks comment that they love the color. The only thing I wish I had added is the upgraded interior. I have the leather, which is very nice, and the side air bags saved me 5% on my car insurance. It's just that the black plastic looks a bit toy-ish. The car has plenty of get-up and go though it is an automatic so there isn't the instant response, as I would imagine you would get from the standard. You won't HATE this car. For my point of reference, I'm coming of a 2000 Honda Accord. A great car that I have passed down to my daughter. Is it "Fun to Drive"? I've put over 2500 miles on mine in 3 weeks! I find any reason to drive it. My new favorite phrase is, "Anyone need anything at the store?". I feel like I'm 17 again with my first car. My first car was a '72 Pinto. Though the cars are no comparison, the feeling is the same. When I opened the hood after owning so many front wheel drives with transverse engines it was like seeing a long lost friend. I'm not sure if it will make any difference in servicing the engine but it was just nice to see it looking at me instead of looking off to the side. I live in New Hampshire so I went with the hardtop. I'm not sure how the winter is going to be. The last rear-wheel drive I owned was a '75 Caprice Classic. I think the weight of that car kept it on the road in the snow. I'm a bit nervous about the Mustang in the snow. Short answer... is it fun... IMHO... Hell Yeah! Should you get one? Hell Yeah again! Test drive first! Fun for me may be hell for you. Al > I'm shopping!! > [quoted text clipped - 68 lines] > > TIA!!!! > I'm 3 weeks into my love affair with my new '06 V6 auto/Pony in Vista Blue. > [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > including it though I'm glad so many don't... my car now stands out that > much more! The Pony grill work look as if it came right of a '67 GTA. I'm I'm looking for the same color! What kind of a deal did you get if I may ask? Was the dealer negotiable or are they playing "sticker price" again? Also, I am looking at getting a white rally stripe on the car. Is that an option or dealer installed? If I find one on the lot without the stripe, can I have the dealer install one and will it be the same as the factory or is it a hack like dealer installed sunroofs (in my experience anyhow)? Thanks for your responses. BTW PowerBlock TV just had a commercial for Flowmaster muffler (resonator? the thing at the end, not in the middle) for the V6!! Under $200.00 so there must be people tinkering with the V6's as well. >> I'm 3 weeks into my love affair with my new '06 V6 auto/Pony in Vista >> Blue. [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > > I'm looking for the same color! The color is very nice and seems to change wth the light. It also reminded me of the '67 blue mustangs I have seen. > What kind of a deal did you get if I may ask? > Was the dealer negotiable or are they playing "sticker price" again? The dealer was negotaible but you need to be prepared to walk... for real! Here's the best part of the story... My wife bought the car for me and drove it into the driveway with a big red bow on it! Here is how the negotiations went... She went to the local dealer behind by back with a print-out of exactly what I wanted (I'm a project manager, I make lists, I'm very specific and detail oriented - it sure payed off this time!). The dealer had a Pony but not in Vista Blue. He found (on the computer) a Vista Blue Pony just outside of Boston (about 50 miles away). The car in Boston some options the local dealers stock pony didn't - leather interior, side air bags. Basicly my wife informed the dealer that she would buy the car in Boston for the some price as the car on the local dealers lot FOR THE SAME PRICE. The dealer wasn't having any part of it until my wife, who had no emotional ties to this car, calmly thanked the dealer for his time and headed for the door. She WAS going to leave. She made it about ten steps before the dealer stopped her with a, "Okay, what will it take to make this deal today?". She sat down, pointed to the invoice slip for the Vista Blue Pony with leather interior and side air bags and said, "I want this car for that price." pointing to the car on the local dealers lot. After a few seconds he said, "Alright" He was going to charge her to deliver it and she was having no part of that. The other thing that my wife did (she's a real estate agent so she knows sales) was bypassed the sales person on the floor and asked for the manager right away. So what I believe got her a good deal was the fact that she went in ready to buy the right car at the right price on the spot but was ready to walk if it all wasn't to her liking. > Also, I am looking at getting a white rally stripe on the car. > Is that an option or dealer installed? Can't help you with this one. Try someone else on this board or these other forums. http://www.mustangforums.com/m_498638/tm.htm http://www.allfordmustangs.com/forums/showthread.php?p=484662 Maybe start your own thread here. There are places on the internet that sell them but there is no way on God's green earth i would ever attempt a stunt like this at home: http://www.baltimorestreetmods.com/05stanggraph.htm http://www.autotrimdesign.com/Shopping%20Pages/Installation%20Information/Custom %20Graphics/ATD-FRDMSTNGGRPH12/Ford%20Mustang%20Rally%20Stripes%203%20Installati on%20Notes.htm The only thing that I have read on some of the other boards is that pained on stripes are better than vinyl. I have no idea about this but maybe something to do a bit of research on before having someone lay some vinyle on your new car and trim it up with an exacto knife. > If I find one on the lot without the stripe, can I have the dealer install > one and will it be the same as the factory or is it a hack like dealer [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > the thing at the end, not in the middle) for the V6!! > Under $200.00 so there must be people tinkering with the V6's as well. > > I'm 3 weeks into my love affair with my new '06 V6 auto/Pony in Vista Blue. > > [quoted text clipped - 21 lines] > the thing at the end, not in the middle) for the V6!! > Under $200.00 so there must be people tinkering with the V6's as well. I would avoid the dealership for stripes... I personally do not like the factory stripe... especially the way they do the holes for the washer nozzles.. I found a local sign shop that does a lot of truck and stuff... Did a complete custom job on my car... There are a LOT of people tinkering with the S197 V6! There is a lot of aftermarket support also!!! Surprisingly a number of performance shops I know of that were strictly V8 shops are starting to support the 4.0L! To see just how carried away the tinkering can get check out my car at: http://www.tammyandjohn.com/Mustang/Screaming/Mustang.htm or so see a wide rang of 4.0L cars check out the forum at: http://american-speed.com/collective/forums/ |
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