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Car Forum / Ford / Ford Trucks / May 20051999 Ranger 2.5 4cyl pings???
I have a 1999 Ford Ranger 2.5 with 55k miles that pings under load. It started all of the sudden with a new tank of gas about 3 tank fulls ago. I have always run middle grade (89) with no problems. At first I thought it was a bad tank of gas, but has persisted with fresh fill ups. It idles a little rougher when cold and hesitates some but when warmed up, seems ok. It may seem strange but when I drive to work in morning, it rarely pings. When I drive home (same route) in the late afternoon, it pings persistently. Weather related? (Colder air in morning, warmer in afternoon!) The check engine light has not come on... If the check engine has NOT come on, does that mean all sensors are working? I am currently running a can of Berryman B12 with premium gas as an initial inexpensive try to remedy. Anybody have any ideas? > I have a 1999 Ford Ranger 2.5 with 55k miles that pings under load. It > started all of the sudden with a new tank of gas about 3 tank fulls [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > are working? I am currently running a can of Berryman B12 with premium > gas as an initial inexpensive try to remedy. Anybody have any ideas? Get the error codes read. A failed knock sensor will cause this and will not turn on the CEL. Hi Jim V! Thanks for the response. I was told by dealer and Autozone that if the "check engine light" doesn't come on, it won't record any codes?? I also forgot to mention that the truck has a new "mass air flow" sensor about 6 months ago. I already tried cleaning the maf filament wires with contact cleaner. > Hi Jim V! Thanks for the response. I was told by dealer and Autozone > that if the "check engine light" doesn't come on, it won't record any > codes?? I also forgot to mention that the truck has a new "mass air > flow" sensor about 6 months ago. I already tried cleaning the maf > filament wires with contact cleaner. They are wrong. Some codes are just recorded including the knock sensor. Many times the code gets logged in, but because it doesn't meet x-criteria, no CEL (Check Engine Light) Some codes require 2 or 3 times of certain conditions to set the light, until then they can be listed under "pending codes" in many scan tools  SignatureStephen W. Hansen ASE Certified Master Automobile Technician ASE Undercar Specialist > Hi Jim V! Thanks for the response. I was told by dealer and Autozone > that if the "check engine light" doesn't come on, it won't record any > codes?? I also forgot to mention that the truck has a new "mass air > flow" sensor about 6 months ago. I already tried cleaning the maf > filament wires with contact cleaner. Thanks Stephen! Typically will dealerships scan the codes for free or do they charge? Will they even do it without the CEL on? Autozone won't scan codes unless CEL is on! > Thanks Stephen! Typically will dealerships scan the codes for free or > do they charge? Will they even do it without the CEL on? Autozone won't > scan codes unless CEL is on! Dealers don't to anything for free. Tell autozone it's been coming on intermittantly. They'll read it. Pinging is pre ignition. Something is starting the combustion burn before is suppose to. Sometimes it is caused by carbon build-up in the combustion chamber, a run-rite fuel tune is suppose to burn out the carbon. http://www.run-rite.com/industry/products01a.htm We sell it at our store, and I do believe it helps. I would start with a good tune up, and go from there.. SignatureStephen W. Hansen ASE Certified Master Automobile Technician ASE Undercar Specialist >> Thanks Stephen! Typically will dealerships scan the codes for free or >> do they charge? Will they even do it without the CEL on? Autozone won't >> scan codes unless CEL is on! >> > Dealers don't to anything for free. Tell autozone it's been coming on > intermittantly. They'll read it. Thanks for all the replies!! I have since switched to premium gas and will add a fuel cleaner additive for a couple tankfulls. The pingng does now seem to have stopped and the truck seems to run pretty well when up to normal operating temp. BUT the engine hesitates when cold!! The check engine light has never come on, so the emission system/sensors are probably ok. Does this sound like carbon build-up in the combustion chamber? I have read about a "water trick" where you take a warm engine and rev it while you take a vacuum line and feed water into the intake which supposedly helps break down the carbon build-up??? Is this safe??? I have called my local dealer and he wants $107 to clean the fuel injectors and from what he says, it sound very familiar to the water method... Fuel filter was changed maybe 7500 miles ago. Still has original plugs and wires but isn't scheduled to get new plugs and wires until 100k. It only has 55k... Any ideas?? Thanks! -mike Take it to a shop and have them do the "fuel tune" That's what it's called at Firestone. The question is of liability. If you try this water trick and it tears up your engine, who pays? The "Fuel tune" by "run rite" has had extensive research done by Texaco.. Anyway, it they screw up you car you have a good chance of some reimbursement. SignatureStephen W. Hansen ASE Certified Master Automobile Technician ASE Undercar Specialist > Thanks for all the replies!! I have since switched to premium gas and > will add a fuel cleaner additive for a couple tankfulls. The pingng [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] > > Thanks! -mike > Take it to a shop and have them do the "fuel tune" That's what it's > called at Firestone. The question is of liability. If you try this > water trick and it tears up your engine, who pays? The "Fuel tune" by > "run rite" has had extensive research done by Texaco.. Anyway, it they > screw up you car you have a good chance of some reimbursement. at 55,000 you should not need a injector clean at all. the water trick is for cleaning the cly it self. do not do the water if you do not know exactly what you are doing as major damage is possable. also at that milage there will be no build up in the cyl. you don`t need either one. KB SignatureThunderSnake #9 Warn once, shoot twice 460 in the pkup, 460 on the stand for another pkup and one in the shed for a fun project to yet be decided on Thanks everybody! OK, the saga continues... I have run 2 cans of B12, no help. I have replaced both O2 sensors, seems to run smoother, a little more power but pinging persists. It won't ping on premium gas as much, but I read where that is not good for an engine designed to run on 87 octane. I have run 89 (mid grade) for over 20k miles with no pinging, then all of the sudden, it pings. Others have mentioned the egr valve....I removed the hose from the top of the egr valve with engine running and engine continued to run with no change in rpm. Wasn't it supposed to stall? Help? Help? >OK, the saga continues... I have run 2 cans of B12, no help. I have >replaced both O2 sensors, seems to run smoother, a little more power [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] >continued to run with no change in rpm. Wasn't it supposed to stall? >Help? Help? Potentialy stupid question here, but have you checked the ignition timing? *CAN* you check it at all?? (Not sure if your igntion has a dist or not...) No distributor... All electronic ignition. ford uses a combination of erg and ignition timing to stop predetionation but the 2.5L. is a Mazda design more (I believe) and I have found many don't use the egr, just timing and engine design. to test the egr you will apply vacuume and that will open the egr valve and kill the motor at idle but that will only check one of many things on the egr system. best would be to run a engine running self test, witch check the whole system, usually passes if the check engine light is out > No distributor... All electronic ignition. OK, last 2 days it hasn't pinged, I can't explain why, but I haven't driven much though... Could it be that it took a couple days of driving for the computer to re-learn, since I disconnected the battery for 20 minutes? Here is what I find interesting though.... When I started the cold engine, after resetting the computer for the O2 sensor replacement, it ran perfect cold without any hesitation. The next morning I started it cold again, and it hesitated until up to normal operating temp. (which is what it did prior to O2 sensor replacement) I know that the O2 sensors aren't a part of the equation because it is still in open loop until normal operating temp anyway and the computer was probably running some basic pre-programmed calculations until it had a chance to re-learn......BUT does the fact that it ran perfect after a reset mean that there probably isn't a carbon build up problem but rather some sensor misreporting info to the computer? Also, how long does it typically take for the computer to re-learn after a rest? OK, last 2 days it hasn't pinged, I can't explain why, but I haven't driven much though... Could it be that it took a couple days of driving for the computer to re-learn, since I disconnected the battery for 20 minutes? Here is what I find interesting though.... When I started the cold engine, after resetting the computer for the O2 sensor replacement, it ran perfect cold without any hesitation. The next morning I started it cold again, and it hesitated until up to normal operating temp. (which is what it did prior to O2 sensor replacement) I know that the O2 sensors aren't a part of the equation because it is still in open loop until normal operating temp anyway and the computer was probably running some basic pre-programmed calculations until it had a chance to re-learn......BUT does the fact that it ran perfect after a reset mean that there probably isn't a carbon build up problem but rather some sensor misreporting info to the computer? Also, how long does it typically take for the computer to re-learn after a rest? not sure disconnecting the battery for a couple days will reset the adaptive sratigy, It didn't clear the codes in the shop a couple weeks ago. We use a scan tool to reset fuel trim. could be wrong. in 1996 OBDII has a good memory to it, but I could be wrong > OK, last 2 days it hasn't pinged, I can't explain why, but I haven't > driven much though... Could it be that it took a couple days of driving [quoted text clipped - 11 lines] > but rather some sensor misreporting info to the computer? Also, how > long does it typically take for the computer to re-learn after a rest? When I started the cold engine, after resetting the computer for the O2 sensor replacement, it ran perfect cold without any hesitation. The next morning I started it cold again, and it hesitated until up to normal operating temp. (which is what it did prior to O2 sensor replacement) I know that the O2 sensors aren't a part of the equation because it is still in open loop until normal operating temp anyway and the computer was probably running some basic pre-programmed calculations until it had a chance to re-learn......BUT does the fact that it ran perfect after a reset mean that there probably isn't a carbon build up problem but rather some sensor misreporting info to the computer? As of today it is pinging pretty much more than ever! Here is what it does... >From a cold start in the morning, it hesitates until warm. When warm, it runs somewhat rough (not bad) but definately not like when I bought it at 32k miles. After it is warm (closed loop) it pings on inclines, under load and sometimes just going down the freeway! There is distinct power loss now and sometimes the engine stumbles and stalls while going down the road (not often) but the engine always starts right back up after a second or two! I had to replace the MAF about 7500 miles ago because it wen't bad (shop ripped me off!) I have since cleaned the MAF again, replaced both O2 sensors and run 2 cans of B12 in tank, all to no avail! I have called 2 local Ford dealers and spoke to 2 different service bozos. These guys just tried to blame it on the local gas, said they couldn't troubleshoot because of no "check engine light" and tried to rush me off the phone! Is it possible the MAF wen't bad again? And cleaning it is not helping because it is malfunctioning? If I disconnect it and the engine runs better, does that mean it needs to be replaced? HELP HELP HELP mike2711@yahoo.com wrote in news:1115915558.011313.177310 @g14g2000cwa.googlegroups.com: > When I started the cold engine, after resetting the computer for the O2 > sensor replacement, it ran perfect cold without any hesitation. The [quoted text clipped - 32 lines] > > HELP HELP HELP how many miles now and have the plugs,wires, fuelfilter? been changed. KB SignatureThunderSnake #9 Warn once, shoot twice 460 in the pkup, 460 on the stand for another pkup and one in the shed for a fun project to yet be decided on 56k miles, plugs and wires aren't scheduled to change until 100k. fuel filter was changed about 6k ago... mike2711@yahoo.com wrote in news:1115948156.259238.139390 @f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com: > 56k miles, plugs and wires aren't scheduled to change until 100k. fuel > filter was changed about 6k ago... without a real time scanner I couldn`t really do a good guess even. KB SignatureThunderSnake #9 Warn once, shoot twice 460 in the pkup, 460 on the stand for another pkup and one in the shed for a fun project to yet be decided on If anyone is interested... I took it to a shop for a diagnostic, and all sensors checked out fine. Mechanic says plugs, wires need to be repaced, and fuel injectors need to be cleaned. He says there is evidence of substantial carbon build up. After he does all this, it runs much, much better. It no longer hesitates when cold and it runs much smoother. BUT it pinged all the way home! After talking to the mechanic, he suspects it may be the coolant temp sensor that is misreporting. I went to Napa and picked one up for $20. I replaced the old one and drove it for 30 minutes. Very little pinging, if any, and if I did hear any, it was barely audible. ;good; So I think we found the culprit. My wife had a 2001 Jetta and we had to change the coolant temp sensor twice in that car. Thanks to everyone for all their help! A good tech with a scan tool should have looked at the coolant temp, although I've not fought a pinging problem for the temp sensor, it does cause hard starts. Now for my advice. Go to Ford and buy a coolant temp sensor. put it away until you have this problem again. I put two NAPA sensors in my ford truck and one in my Mom's Taurus. The truck lasted a year each. The Taurus about 6 months. I learned. Napa's sensor is a plastic tip, Ford is a brass tip. Also, Stick with Ford EGR valves! Steve > If anyone is interested... I took it to a shop for a diagnostic, and > all sensors checked out fine. Mechanic says plugs, wires need to be [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > the culprit. My wife had a 2001 Jetta and we had to change the coolant > temp sensor twice in that car. Thanks to everyone for all their help! Thanks Steve! On Thu, 12 May 2005 09:32:38 -0700, mike2711 rearranged some electrons to form: > Is it possible the MAF wen't bad again? And cleaning it is not helping > because it is malfunctioning? If I disconnect it and the engine runs > better, does that mean it needs to be replaced? I doubt the engine will run better if you disconnect the MAF. Have you tried some different gas? SignatureDavid M (dmacchiarolo) http://home.triad.rr.com/redsled T/S 53 sled351 Linux 2.4.18-14 has been up 17 days 18:36 I read something about cleaning the wire in the mass airflow sensor that was supposed to stop the pinging. However, if you drive it long enough while pinging, engine damage will occur. It happened to me with my Ranger with a 3.0 V-6. I put larger tires on the truck and it started pinging. I presume it was the extra load on the engine due to the taller tires effecting the overall gear ratio. I noticed the coolant had turned brown. I drained it, flushed the radiator, then about 4 months later it was brown again. Combustion gases were getting in the coolant. The pinging (preignition) probably cracked the head or took the head gasket out. Ron >I have a 1999 Ford Ranger 2.5 with 55k miles that pings under load. It > started all of the sudden with a new tank of gas about 3 tank fulls [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > are working? I am currently running a can of Berryman B12 with premium > gas as an initial inexpensive try to remedy. Anybody have any ideas? Thanks for the replies! I have cleaned the MAF sensor, in fact the sensor itself is only a few months old. I took the truck to a local auto parts store to scan the trouble codes. There were none! Am I to assume that all the sensors are working properly? Is it possible that it just simply needs a tune up. It isn't scheduled to have one till 100k and it only has 55k. |
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