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Car Forum / Ford / Ford Trucks / August 2007

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2007 F-150, SInking Brake Pedal

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LHA - 07 Aug 2007 19:16 GMT
Anyone experience this?

While holding my foot on the brake at a red light, after a few seconds, the
pedal will actually drop about another inch or so. The dealer says it's
normal but I think something is wrong.

LHA
Jeff Strickland - 07 Aug 2007 19:43 GMT
It's not normal. Well, it IS normal if the Brake Master Cylinder is not
working right.

The master cylinder has chambers inside, and the brake pedal is connected to
a piston that passes between these chambers. The piston has o-rings and
seals and stuff of that nature. If the pedal drops, then the o-rings and
seals are not working properly, typically as a result of wear, but I can't
imagine enough wear in an '07 truck for anything to not be working.

As a test, try pumping the brake pedal a few times to see if it comes back
up and becomes more firm. If so, then this confirms the master cylinder is
not working. As you continue to hold the pedal in the new position, and it
falls again, then this double confirms that the master cylinder is not
working properly.

As a practical matter, you should be in the habit of only holding enough
pressure on the brake pedal to keep the vehicle stationary.

> Anyone experience this?
>
[quoted text clipped - 3 lines]
>
> LHA
LHA - 07 Aug 2007 23:32 GMT
Jeff, thanks very much. This is what I suspected but the lazy service
department didn't want to deal with it. He told me it was due to some new
technology, sort of like "fly by wire" where the pedal isn't actually
connected to anything that manipulates the brakes, but simply sends and
electronic signal to something that is. That may or not be true but there is
no way the pedal should be getting soft just sitting at a light. The truck
only has 3000 miles on it and has done this since day 1.

And yes, the pedal pumps right back up. After about two minutes it will sink
again. If there is a problem, it's only a matter of time before something
goes wrong while trying to stop.

Thanks!

LHA

> It's not normal. Well, it IS normal if the Brake Master Cylinder is not
> working right.
[quoted text clipped - 21 lines]
>>
>> LHA
Jeff Strickland - 08 Aug 2007 00:08 GMT
There is a chance that the service writer could be correct then, but I had
no idea that the '07 F150 was a fly-by-wire. If it is even remotely
convenient, take your truck to a different dealership.

I don't know how a fly-by-wire brake system works, and there is a chance
that a sinking pedal is normal. But I also try to stay on top of this sort
of thing, and putting a fly-by-wire system in anything other than a luxury
or luxury sports car is beyond where I thought the technology had gotten to.
These systems (fly-by-wire) are generally held to high-end models where
space is at a premium. BMW has a few fly-by-wire models, but they do it
because they found it easier than the mechanical linkage that they would
need to employ otherwise.

I'm not trumpeting BMW, nor neglecting others, but I can't foresee the
reasons why a Ford F150 would be fitted with fly-by-wire, especially on the
braking system. Even BMWs fly-by-wire system is on the gas pedal not the
brake. I do not recall any instance where fly-by-wire was used on a
passenger car brake system. I'm not suggesting it is not feasable -- they
use fly-by-wire brakes on airplanes, and have for a long time -- but I've
not heard of them using it on a passenger car or light duty truck.

PS
I've read reports that people are not getting used to fly-by-wire gas pedals
very well. They (the fly-by-wire systems) seem to have a different feel that
people are not comfortable with.
My Name Is Nobody - 08 Aug 2007 04:30 GMT
> There is a chance that the service writer could be correct then, but I had
> no idea that the '07 F150 was a fly-by-wire. If it is even remotely
[quoted text clipped - 21 lines]
> pedals very well. They (the fly-by-wire systems) seem to have a different
> feel that people are not comfortable with.

Ford started "fly by wire" wire only electronic throttle in 2005 on the Ford
Super Duties, I am fairly certain that the brakes DO NOT use "fly by wire".
I don't believe the brakes are a system we will see changed to "fly by wire"
any time soon...
LHA - 08 Aug 2007 04:34 GMT
"My Name Is Nobody" <nobody@msn.com> wrote in message news:INaui.1947

> Ford started "fly by wire" wire only electronic throttle in 2005 on the
> Ford Super Duties, I am fairly certain that the brakes DO NOT use "fly by
> wire". I don't believe the brakes are a system we will see changed to "fly
> by wire" any time soon...

I'm going to take it to another dealer as Jeff suggested and insist it gets
fixed. It just doesn't feel right to me.
Joe - 08 Aug 2007 05:48 GMT
> "My Name Is Nobody" <nobody@msn.com> wrote in message news:INaui.1947
>
[quoted text clipped - 5 lines]
> I'm going to take it to another dealer as Jeff suggested and insist it
> gets fixed. It just doesn't feel right to me.

There's no such thing as "brake by wire".  Not yet anyway.  The ABS system
can (does) bleed the pedal down on one of my cars.  It's not supposed to at
a light, of course.  I don't have an 07 F150, so I don't know how the ABS
system was built on that.
Scott Van Nest - 13 Aug 2007 20:34 GMT
I have an 06 F150 with the 4.6L.  I do not get in a hurry driving this
truck.  Throttle response sucks.  I have read that the Mustangs are the same
and a work around exists to help the computer with the lag.

Scott
> There is a chance that the service writer could be correct then, but I had
> no idea that the '07 F150 was a fly-by-wire. If it is even remotely
[quoted text clipped - 21 lines]
> very well. They (the fly-by-wire systems) seem to have a different feel that
> people are not comfortable with.
 
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