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Car Forum / Ford / Ford Cars / October 2006

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1996 Lincoln Mark VIII Low Beams Replace

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tonyg7 - 16 Oct 2006 01:26 GMT
The mechanic working on my car, 1996 Lincoln Mark VIII LSC Diamond
Anniversary, presented me with a problem. The low beams do not work
and need to be replaced. He says that there are 2 sets of numbers by
the bulbs. The numbers are, L-95 and 1042. It also says DANGER
HAZARDOUS VOLTAGE. He also mentioned the "ballast" may need to be
replaced but
he  is afraid to test it since it had the warning posted. He said that
he
had never seen this before. Any ideas?

Can you tell me how to replace the low beam bulbs without shocking
myself? How do I drain the power from the low-beam ballast?

Thanks
zwsdotcom@gmail.com - 16 Oct 2006 01:37 GMT
> the bulbs. The numbers are, L-95 and 1042. It also says DANGER
> HAZARDOUS VOLTAGE. He also mentioned the "ballast" may need to be
> had never seen this before. Any ideas?

They are HID lamps. They are safe when not powered.
Sharon Cooke - 16 Oct 2006 04:18 GMT
> The mechanic working on my car, 1996 Lincoln Mark VIII LSC Diamond
> Anniversary, presented me with a problem. The low beams do not work
[quoted text clipped - 10 lines]
>
> Thanks

Since you have a Mark VIII, you really should sign up here: www.markviii.org
Lots of tech data ad fixes you can do.
tonyg7 - 16 Oct 2006 19:07 GMT
I already have and since this was a one year Annivesary edition, they
appear to be more complicated for some reason. Thanks
> > The mechanic working on my car, 1996 Lincoln Mark VIII LSC Diamond
> > Anniversary, presented me with a problem. The low beams do not work
[quoted text clipped - 13 lines]
> Since you have a Mark VIII, you really should sign up here: www.markviii.org
> Lots of tech data ad fixes you can do.
Sharon Cooke - 16 Oct 2006 21:07 GMT
Anniversary Issue? That's just "badge engineering" that has nothing to
do with the headlights. I got this from the Site (markviii.org) where
you said you had signed up: http://www.markviii.org/tech/Gen2HID.htm

> I already have and since this was a one year Annivesary edition, they
> appear to be more complicated for some reason. Thanks
[quoted text clipped - 16 lines]
>>Since you have a Mark VIII, you really should sign up here: www.markviii.org
>>Lots of tech data ad fixes you can do.
MasterBlaster - 16 Oct 2006 09:17 GMT
> The mechanic working on my car, 1996 Lincoln Mark VIII LSC
> Diamond Anniversary, presented me with a problem.

Aren't you supposed to present him with the problems?

> The low beams do not work and need to be replaced

Were they working before you gave him the car?

> He says that there are 2 sets of numbers by the bulbs. The numbers
> are, L-95 and 1042. It also says DANGER HAZARDOUS VOLTAGE.
> He also mentioned the "ballast" may need to be replaced but he is afraid to
> test it since it had the warning posted.

HIDs have been out for years. Hasn't he been upgrading his training to deal
with cars made since points ignition and manual-choke carbs?

> He said that he had never seen this before. Any ideas?

Never seen what; both low-beams out, HID lights, or warning stickers?

> Can you tell me how to replace the low beam bulbs without shocking
> myself? How do I drain the power from the low-beam ballast?

Isn't that what the "mechanic" is charging you $$$$$$ per-hour to do?
tonyg7 - 16 Oct 2006 19:10 GMT
Gee Master Blaster. I was trying to get some help for me to do the
work. All you did was berate a mechanic who was honest enough with me
to say he couldn't do the job and why.
Thanks

> > The mechanic working on my car, 1996 Lincoln Mark VIII LSC
> > Diamond Anniversary, presented me with a problem.
[quoted text clipped - 21 lines]
>
> Isn't that what the "mechanic" is charging you $$$$$$ per-hour to do?
MasterBlaster - 17 Oct 2006 11:49 GMT
> Gee Master Blaster. I was trying to get some help for me to do the
> work. All you did was berate a mechanic who was honest enough with
> me to say he couldn't do the job and why.

Sorry if it sounded that way, but you didn't say if that's why the car
was there in the first place, or if he just magically "noticed" that both
low-beams were out while doing other work.

Original quote:

> > > The mechanic working on my car, 1996 Lincoln Mark VIII LSC
> > > Diamond Anniversary, presented me with a problem.
> >
> > > The low beams do not work and need to be replaced

Perhaps it's just the way you worded it, but it sounded suspiciously like
those garages (in various anti-scam TV reports) that "happened to find" the
front struts leaking oil while they were doing some other work under the car,
and telling the owners they need to be replaced right away or the driver may
suddenly lose control of the car and crash. Of course, the "leaking" oil was
actually sprayed on the struts by the mechanic himself.

Is the following what you meant to say?

> > > The low beams on my car, a 1996 Lincoln Mark VIII LSC
> > > Diamond Anniversary do not work and need to be replaced.
[quoted text clipped - 3 lines]
> > > test it since it has a DANGER HAZARDOUS VOLTAGE warning
> > > posted on it, and he had never seen this before. Any ideas?
Bruce L. Bergman - 16 Oct 2006 17:55 GMT
>The mechanic working on my car, 1996 Lincoln Mark VIII LSC Diamond
>Anniversary, presented me with a problem. The low beams do not work
>and need to be replaced. He says that there are 2 sets of numbers by
>the bulbs. The numbers are, L-95 and 1042. It also says DANGER
>HAZARDOUS VOLTAGE.

 Okay, "new" Metal-Halide discharge headlamps.  They have been using
them in streetlights (the white ones*) and sports stadiums for decades
for better light color and a lot better energy efficiency in lumens
per watt, they are finally making the transition to cars.

 (* They use Metal Halide wherever appearance and color rendering is
an issue.  The orange-ish High Pressure Sodium lamps are even more
efficient and the lamps go a bit longer between changes, but that sick
orange color cast they give everything rules it out for some uses.)

 They develop a 2KV to 4KV DC pulse to get the lamp to strike, and
then the ballast supplies a current regulated AC arc voltage,
somewhere in the 80V to 150V range depending on the lamp capsule size.

 That is just barely inside the "Hazardous" range in my book, but
then again I deal with that stuff everyday, YMMV.  It's certainly
lower than the average operating voltages of the coil and sparkplugs
and nobody panics about working on them.

 You get nailed with that 4KV pulse and it'll certainly get your
attention and knock you on your a.s, but that's about all that'll
happen.  Unless you are really /trying/ to get hurt and get the
current to go arm-to-arm and zap your heart in exactly the wrong way.

> He also mentioned the "ballast" may need to be replaced but he is
>afraid to test it since it had the warning posted. He said that
>he had never seen this before. Any ideas?

 You replace the lamps and then try them again before even thinking
about replacing the ballast - lamps are a LOT cheaper than the
ballast, and they do wear out.  Worst case, if it wasn't the lamps now
they will go eventually, and you have spares in the glovebox.

 WARNING:  Read the handling instructions on the package before
removing the old lamps or installing the new, they are NOT KIDDING
about no fingers or other contaminants on the lamp envelope glass.
The oils from your fingers will cause the quartz glass to expand
unevenly and pop after a few hours of operation - and the hot glass
can melt into the plastic housing and lens and wreck them.

 Even if the old lamps were good, contaminate them and they're trash.
You can wash them off with Isopropyl Alcohol - usually...

 Second thing to check if they don't come on with new lamps is to
make sure the ballasts have power and ground - it might be a blown
fuse or bad lighting relay.

 Often those electronic ballasts have a safety circuit where if the
lamp doesn't fire off within a minute or two they shut down, and you
have to turn the power off again for a few minutes before it will try
a restrike.

 In light fixtures the bulb may only be good for 12K to 20K hours,
but the ballast often goes for 15 to 25 years and outlives many lamps.
If the automotive ballasts are properly designed and built I would
expect the same longevity out of them.

>Can you tell me how to replace the low beam bulbs without shocking
>myself? How do I drain the power from the low-beam ballast?

 It will drain itself with the lights off for more than a half hour
or so, they build in bleed resistors on the high-voltage lines for
just that purpose.  If you're worried, leave the car overnight before
working on it.

   --<< Bruce >>--
tonyg7 - 16 Oct 2006 19:05 GMT
Thanks Bruce. I guess the mechanic is more or less a "shade tree"
mechanic.

> >The mechanic working on my car, 1996 Lincoln Mark VIII LSC Diamond
> >Anniversary, presented me with a problem. The low beams do not work
[quoted text clipped - 68 lines]
>
>     --<< Bruce >>--
Bruce L. Bergman - 17 Oct 2006 18:05 GMT
>> >The mechanic working on my car, 1996 Lincoln Mark VIII LSC Diamond
>> >Anniversary, presented me with a problem. The low beams do not work
[quoted text clipped - 9 lines]
>Thanks Bruce. I guess the mechanic is more or less a "shade tree"
>mechanic.

 I just received a big e-mail from you with three picture of the
lights, nothing too unusual there...

 The "Danger High Voltage" part is correct, but the "Must be serviced
by an authorized Ford dealer" part is, as usual, self-serving total
bullpucky to get everyone running to a dealer.

 This is NOT Rocket Science, you do NOT need a degree to do the work.
If you know what you're doing, anyone can do it - but you do need that
specialized bit of education first, and books can deliver it to you...

 (I do it everyday without the specific instructions for each light
fixture, because the lamp handling rules are universal.  And the
ballast hookups are generic and uniform, the wiring diagrams and any
special instructions are printed right on the label - they figure if
you got that far you just might have a clue or two.)

 First, you need to get the Haynes/Chilton/Ford OE Service Manual,
depending on what's available and if you can afford the Ford one.  The
Factory Manuals are usually more complete and correct, usually easier
to follow with more detailed troubleshooting tree charts, and usually
10X the price.  (But you can usually get most of your investment back
if you sell the car with the manual.)

 Read the instructions that come with the new lamps very carefully.
Follow the service manual procedures on changing the lamps to the
letter as to how to get it apart, how to handle the lamps, how to put
it back together, and how to test them if they still don't work.

 With the exception that if you read the Factory Manual you probably
don't need to buy all the megabuck "Special Service Tools" they call
for, which are often just relabled (and possibly slightly modified)
standard mechanic's hand tools.  This is the one time when proper
substitutions made with common sense are fine.

 The $500 Special Tester is probably just a good $100 digital
multimeter with the proper voltage range ratings, and if you make the
$100 investment on a good meter (BK Precision, Fluke or Simpson, among
others) you can use it on many other things for the next 25 years...
Or you can buy a cheapie that breaks on the second use - your choice.

 The basics:

* If it doesn't fit or turn don't force it, you're probably turning
the wrong way.  Lefty Loosy, Righty Tightie works 99% of the time -
but then they surprise you with that last 1%.

* With the exception of a click-lock detent on a bayonet ring (which
the book will warn you about) everything should move without applying
undue force.

* Keep your mitts off the lamp glass, use a clean paper towel or the
package insert wrapping to handle the lamps.  

* Wear work gloves, long sleeves and safety glasses, the lamp capsules
are pressurized with gases and can cut you up badly if they pop during
handling.  Put the dud lamps back in the packages before eventual
disposal in the trash, so people don't play with them.

* Clean off the lamp housing with a brush or rag before starting and
use canned air as a duster, you want to keep dirt out of the headlamp
assembly.  If you aren't going to finish in one session, stuff a clean
rag in the lamp hole of the housing so nothing falls or flies in.

 And if you get stuck, stop.  Come back here and ask what to do next
- the only dumb question is the one you did not ask.  But wait for a
consensus, sometimes the first answer out of the gate is WAY wrong
from someone who was flat-out guessing at the answer.

 (Or worse, giving you deliberate bad advice trying to get you to
/really/ break it, so they can sit there and laugh - and then get a
$1500 service call out of you to clean up the mess.  I've seen alleged
professionals do this in other newsgroups where DIY-ers are actively
discouraged, like alt.hvac for air conditioning techs.)

 As for me, I'm an Electrician not a Mechanic, but "HID lights is HID
lights" and I admit it up front when I'm extrapolating.  And I know to
stop and look up the answer when I hit a stumper.

   --<< Bruce >>--
Sharon Cooke - 17 Oct 2006 19:25 GMT
> The mechanic working on my car, 1996 Lincoln Mark VIII LSC Diamond
> Anniversary, presented me with a problem. The low beams do not work
[quoted text clipped - 10 lines]
>
> Thanks

With the battery disconnected for a few seconds, there's no shock, no
"drain" (it's a starter/igniter on the bulb, not some huge capacitor).
The HID capsule is held in by the igniter (big cube thing), and the
igniter is held to the headlamp fixture by screws with filled heads.
Here's how to make the new style HID capsule (only one now made) work in
the late '95-'96 LSC HID headlamp fixture:
http://mywebpages.comcast.net/wviands/storage/car/hids/hid.html

P.S.: get a mechanic that works on Lincoln Mark VIII cars.
Bruce L. Bergman - 18 Oct 2006 06:25 GMT
>> The mechanic working on my car, 1996 Lincoln Mark VIII LSC Diamond
>> Anniversary, presented me with a problem. The low beams do not work
[quoted text clipped - 16 lines]
>
>P.S.: get a mechanic that works on Lincoln Mark VIII cars.

 $160 for each lamp?  That's nucking futs - even though it's better
than $600 for the lamp and ballast as a unit for the 1996.  The lamp
modification on that page looks like a sensible way to go.

 I can get a garden variety 35W 50W or 70W HID enclosed lamp capsule
like that with a ceramic plug-in base for around $30 - $40.  A regular
"Edison medium screw base" HID lamp in that range is around $30
normally, $20 on sale.  You can buy them at Home Depot.

 I can see paying $70-ish for a custom color spectrum output, but you
only need that for certain lighting duties like Photography.

 I thought the US Department Of Transportation solved that long ago
when they required standardized headlamps for cars - they first
settled on standard sealed beam lamps, hence the DOT markings.  Which
carried over to halogen sealed beams, then halogen capsule lamps...

 Initially each car maker wanted to make all their lamps proprietary
so you had to buy from them, which would cause price and supply
headaches.  Just like the one above, matter of fact.

     --<< Bruce >>--
Sharon Cooke - 18 Oct 2006 14:06 GMT
>>>The mechanic working on my car, 1996 Lincoln Mark VIII LSC Diamond
>>>Anniversary, presented me with a problem. The low beams do not work
[quoted text clipped - 39 lines]
>
>       --<< Bruce >>--

The Sylvania/Ford HID capsules for the Lincoln Mark VIII are proprietary
and unique to that car model only. Every other carmaker - including Ford
on later cars - uses some kind of HID capsule that has an AC-powered
ballast, while the Mark VIII ballast is DC-powered. The replacement Mark
VIII HID capsules are now over $200 each, and may go even higher, while
the more 'standardized' HID types sell for $50~$60 each OTC. I converted
my ’94 Mark VIII to HID (had to, couldn’t see the road at night) back in
’00 using a setup made for the ’96 LSC. It’s worked well for 6+ years
and I’ve never had to replace anything on it. When I bought the setup, I
also invested in a couple of spare HID capsules for about $70 each, so
I’m not concerned about the current price.
As far as standardized headlamps go – the old sealed beams – you can
also blame Ford for tampering with that idea, since the first production
car in the world with plastic (composite/Lexan II) headlamps was the
1984 Lincoln Mark VII. The watchdog agency of NHTSA was sold a bill of
goods on this, where Ford pointed out that the headlamp lens was the
same stuff used in jet fighter plane cockpits. What Ford DIDN’T tell the
NHTSA (and they were “too busy” to check) was that the cockpit canopies
on the fighter planes are replaced every 12~18 months as part of routine
maintenance procedures. Automotive night lighting in this country
suffered for may years after the allowance for non-sealed beam plastic
headlamps was written into the 108 regulations, and only in the last 5
years or so has lighting gotten back to an acceptable safe level for
most vehicles.
 
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