Home | Contact Us | FAQ | Search & Site Map | Link to Us
Sign In | Join | Other 45 Sites in Network
HomeAnnouncements
Discussion Groups
By Brand
BMWChevroletDodgeFordGMHondaLexusMercedes-BenzNissanPeugeotToyotaVolkswagenOther Brands
By Topic
4x4 CarsRVsDrivingMaintenance & RepairCar AudioCollectible Cars
Country Specific
Australian ForumsUK Forums
ArticlesAuto InsuranceBuyingCars & TechnologyMaintenanceMiscellaneousSafety
DMV Resources
Related Topics
MotorcyclesBoatsMore Topics ...

Car Forum / GMC Cars / December 2004

Tip: Looking for answers? Try searching our database.

Toyota to surpass GM by 2007 in vehicles sold...

Thread view: 
Enable EMail Alerts  Start New Thread
Thread rating: 
mark575757@mailcity.com - 25 Dec 2004 03:57 GMT
http://biz.yahoo.com/ft/041221/6d163716_534c_11d9_b6e4_00000e2511c8_1.html

On Tuesday Toyota forecast that its sales will rise 7 per cent next
year, to 8.03m units. It also pledged to sell 8.5m units in 2006 - or
the same as GM.

Moreover, in the metrics that truly matter to investors, Toyota is
already way ahead. In the first nine months of this year, its profits
were almost as high as the "Big Three" US carmakers combined. Meanwhile
margins were about twice as big - not least because Toyota, unlike the
Big Three, has not offered hefty sales incentives in the US, where it
now holds a 12 per cent market share.
John Horner - 27 Dec 2004 06:54 GMT
> http://biz.yahoo.com/ft/041221/6d163716_534c_11d9_b6e4_00000e2511c8_1.html
>
> On Tuesday Toyota forecast that its sales will rise 7 per cent next
> year, to 8.03m units. It also pledged to sell 8.5m units in 2006 - or
> the same as GM.

This is why earlier this year I sold the last of the GM stock I had been
holding onto and bought Toyota ADRs.

The Toyota ADRs have appreciated nicely while the GM stock has continue to
slide.

Sad really, but the game is playing out and it is not playing out well for
the two remaining US based auto makers.

GM's only good news is that Ford will probably be out of the automobile
business before GM is. Both will keep making trucks for years to come, but
even there the news is not good.

Probably the only business hope for Ford and GM is to go through Chapter 11
reorgs like the airlines and jettison all of their historical pension and
healthcare liabilities along with union contracts.

Ugly stuff.

John
James C. Reeves - 27 Dec 2004 22:14 GMT
>> http://biz.yahoo.com/ft/041221/6d163716_534c_11d9_b6e4_00000e2511c8_1.html
>>
[quoted text clipped - 4 lines]
> This is why earlier this year I sold the last of the GM stock I had been
> holding onto and bought Toyota ADRs.

Me too.  The way GM treated me as a customer was what prompted me to sell my
GM stock.  I knew that any company that treats the customer as a ememy
rather than a partner is in for long term trouble.

> The Toyota ADRs have appreciated nicely while the GM stock has continue to
> slide.

Not surprised.

> Sad really, but the game is playing out and it is not playing out well for
> the two remaining US based auto makers.

Hopefully it isn't played out yet...although it's probably close.

> GM's only good news is that Ford will probably be out of the automobile
> business before GM is. Both will keep making trucks for years to come, but
> even there the news is not good.

Perhaps, but bad news for the US if either suffers that fate.

> Probably the only business hope for Ford and GM is to go through Chapter
> 11 reorgs like the airlines and jettison all of their historical pension
> and healthcare liabilities along with union contracts.
>
> Ugly stuff.

If it comes to that, I'll say!  Yikes!
MajorDomo@mailcity.com - 27 Dec 2004 22:37 GMT
I doubt that.  Toyota dealers are at the bottom of customer list
for good service.  Service is what keep customers coming back to
a dealership.

mike hunt

> >> http://biz.yahoo.com/ft/041221/6d163716_534c_11d9_b6e4_00000e2511c8_1.html
> >>
> >> On Tuesday Toyota forecast that its sales will rise 7 per cent next
> >> year, to 8.03m units. It also pledged to sell 8.5m units in 2006 - or
> >> the same as GM.
Mike - 28 Dec 2004 01:47 GMT
>I doubt that.  Toyota dealers are at the bottom of customer list
> for good service.  Service is what keep customers coming back to
> a dealership.
>
> mike hunt

  So tell us why you think their sales keep increasing. But lets recap what
was stated earlier. Toyota sales keep increasing every year. Toyota doesn't
need to discount vehicles like the american manufacturers to sell their
vehicles. Now you state that their service sucks. But the botom line is
their sales figures keep going up. Yep, sure sounds like you know what
you're talking about.

Go take your meds.

>> >> http://biz.yahoo.com/ft/041221/6d163716_534c_11d9_b6e4_00000e2511c8_1.html
>> >>
>> >> On Tuesday Toyota forecast that its sales will rise 7 per cent next
>> >> year, to 8.03m units. It also pledged to sell 8.5m units in 2006 - or
>> >> the same as GM.
James C. Reeves - 29 Dec 2004 01:53 GMT
>I doubt that.  Toyota dealers are at the bottom of customer list
> for good service.  Service is what keep customers coming back to
> a dealership.
>
> mike hunt

Dunno...never owned a Toyota personally.  I do know several people that do,
but they don't seem to complain at all about service or support...at least
not that I've noticed.
MelvinGibson@mailcity.com - 29 Dec 2004 15:39 GMT
That should tell you a lot about surveys.  I have owned a hell of
a lot of different domestic and foreign vehicles in my time.  I
only ever had one that was problematic, yet I see surveys that
suggest one brand is supposedly 'better,' based on the ONE
somebody complained about, that they had owned.  Such surveys
never seem to quantify those that are serviced properly or not.
Surveys of older models do not distinguish between those
purchased new or used.  One who buys a used vehicle can never
know for sure how it was used or abused, or if it was maintained
properly or not.  Naturally if they have problem, they blame the
manufacture, never the previous owner(s)

In our business we service thousands of just about every brand of
vehicle, every week.  Vehicles that are driven to higher
mileage's, is shorter periods of time, than by the average new
car owner.  What we see is virtually little difference among
brands, other than style and price, when given proper preventive
maintenance.  Every manufacture today is building good vehicles.
Just as every manufacture today is building some of them that are
not so good, on occasion.  That is why they all have a warranty.
To chose a new vehicle of one brand over an other based on the
one that somebody else owed several years ago is a bit foolish in
my opinion.  

For me the most important thing I look for is good dealer
service.  The difference in the drive home price from dealer to
dealer of the same brand is generally similar.
The attitude of the dealership toward me as a customer was the
reason I switched from Lexus, to a domestic luxury brand, in 1999
after owning several Lexus'.  

mike hunt

> >I doubt that.  Toyota dealers are at the bottom of customer list
> > for good service.  Service is what keep customers coming back to
[quoted text clipped - 5 lines]
> but they don't seem to complain at all about service or support...at least
> not that I've noticed.
James C. Reeves - 30 Dec 2004 03:04 GMT
I agree, finding a dealer with a top notch service center is the way to go.
Mark - 30 Dec 2004 14:33 GMT
On the mews last night they were saying that it will be in 2009.
>I agree, finding a dealer with a top notch service center is the way to go.
mark575757@mailcity.com - 31 Dec 2004 13:24 GMT
> On the mews last night they were saying that it will be in 2009.

2009 was for the US market for passing D.C.  By 2007 Toytota will be
the worlds largets auto manufacturer.  And actually statistically there
is a good chance that it will be 2006.

GM's CEO when told of this was quoted as saying he doesn't doubt it
will happen.  I'll try and find the link to his exact quote in the
Detroit Free Press newspaper.

Because GM's world wide (and US) market share has fallen in 18 of the
past 20 years and will again fall this year and probably next, Toyota
should overtake GM in 2006 instead 0f 2007.

What does this say about GM, will they admit how badly they've been
mismanaged into producing junk?  Do we need another 'Road to
Redemption' campain which not only admits bad quality, but also poor
management and laziness?
John Horner - 31 Dec 2004 20:18 GMT
> What does this say about GM, will they admit how badly they've been
> mismanaged into producing junk?  Do we need another 'Road to
> Redemption' campain which not only admits bad quality, but also poor
> management and laziness?

It is all very sad.   One of the many things Toyota has not done is to
distract itself with crazy schemes like buying, then selling EDS, buying,
then selling Hughes and so on.  Toyota has been absolutely relentless in
focus and execution.   Toyota also does not play the game of endless
executive hiring, firing, promotion and demotion with which the inbred
Detroit high paid "talent" pool wastes time and money on.

Toyota's is an impressive business performance.

John
MelvinGibson@mailcity.com - 31 Dec 2004 20:57 GMT
Toyota does not have to deal with US corporate tax laws or US
tort laws.  GM pays million in US federal Corporate taxes.
Toyota does NOT pay a penny in US federal Corporate taxes on the
millions it makes annually on the cars and truck they sell in the
US that they import, or assemble here in the US.  You never see
the shark lawyer suing a Japanese corporation in the US.  That is
because they can only be sued in Japan and their tort laws are
not as nuts as those in the US.  Toyota also pays their employees
less, provides less desirable benefits and pensions even thought
their vehicles cost 20% to 30% more than the similar size and
equipped GM models.  Even when Toyota does assemble some cars in
the US like the Camry, they assemble them primarily of lower cost
parts imported from places like China, not from parts made mostly
in the US as does GM.   In the not too distant future Toyota will
import the Tacoma from Mexico and stop making it in the GM/Toyota
plant in California.  How long do you think Toyota will assemble
the Camry in the US of Chinese parts when they get their new
Chinese plant finished?  It will be cheaper to build the Camry in
China rather than making the part there and bringing them to the
US for assembly as they do now.  We in the US better soon wise up
and buy American or everything we buy will be made overseas,
including all of the domestic brands.  You don't think GM and
Ford will go out of business, when they too can build for less in
China as well, do you?

mike hunt

> Toyota's is an impressive business performance.
>
> John
 
Sign In
Join
My Latest Posts
My Monitored Threads
My Blog
My Photo Gallery
My Profile
My Homepage

Start New Thread
Enable EMail Alerts
Rate this Thread



©2008 Advenet LLC   Privacy Policy - Terms of Use
This website includes both content owned or controlled by Advenet as well as content owned or controlled by third parties.