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Car Forum / GMC Cars / February 2006Dex coolant
My 2000 Impalla head gasket was leaking coolant into the engine. went to the dealer, total cost of repair was $1030.00 new gasket.thermosat. labour... was thinking of a new Impalla 2006, but now not so sure about purchase. > My 2000 Impalla head gasket was leaking coolant into the engine. > [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > was thinking of a new Impalla 2006, but now not so sure about > purchase. It's unusual for a head gasket to be leaking. I assume it is some sort of V-6 engine? it a six On Wed, 16 Nov 2005 04:22:02 GMT, "« Paul »" <" « Paul »"@houston.rr.com> wrote: >> My 2000 Impalla head gasket was leaking coolant into the engine. >> [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] >It's unusual for a head gasket to be leaking. >I assume it is some sort of V-6 engine? unusual? more than half of the impala drivers I know got their head gaskets replaced. maybe unusual just for me. "« Paul »" <"=?x-user-defined?Q?=AB?= Paul =?x-user-defined?Q?=BB?="@houston.rr.com> wrote in message news:437AB449.7DF1EFA6@houston.rr.com... >> My 2000 Impalla head gasket was leaking coolant into the engine. >> [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > It's unusual for a head gasket to be leaking. > I assume it is some sort of V-6 engine? > unusual? > > more than half of the impala drivers I know got their head gaskets replaced. > maybe unusual just for me. That is really, really unusual. Rarely does a head gasket go bad on the 2.8-3.4 series or the 3.3-3.8. I would tend to disbelieve until backed up with test data: compression check, leakdown test, exhaust gases in the coolant, etc. Jake 2006 Impala's don't have the same engines as your Impala. The new ones are a 3.5 V6, 3.9 V6 and the SS has a 5.3 V8 with 300 + horsepower. Good Luck Harryface 05 Park Avenue, 32,391 91 Bonneville LE 304,498 but they still use the same dex-coolant... that stuff eats away at the gaskets. >Jake > [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] >05 Park Avenue, 32,391 >91 Bonneville LE 304,498 > My 2000 Impalla head gasket was leaking coolant into the engine. > [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > was thinking of a new Impalla 2006, but now not so sure about > purchase. Are you sure it wasn't an intake manifold gasket? GM 3.4 l V-6 engines are notorious for intake manifold gasket leaks causing coolant in the oil problems. John that is correct. a manifold gasket, leaking oil into the engine. what has GM done about the problem. >> My 2000 Impalla head gasket was leaking coolant into the engine. >> [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > >John I think you probably mean: "the intake manifold gasket was leaking coolant into the crankcase"? > that is correct. a manifold gasket, leaking oil into the engine. > what has GM done about the problem. [quoted text clipped - 13 lines] > > > >John >that is correct. a manifold gasket, leaking oil into the engine. >what has GM done about the problem. Completely redesigned the intake sealing surface and gaskets with the introduction of the 3.5L engine. Too early to tell if it is finally fixed. Hopefully it is for GM's sake.  Signature_________________________________________________________________ Dennis Smith -1971 Trans Am - 455 H.O. - M21 4speed - Cameo white/blue stripe- -1973 Trans Am - 455 - TH400 auto - Buccaneer red- -1984 Trans Am - 5.0 L - TH700R4 auto - Royal blue/silver aero- _________________________________________________________________ Will GM pay for the repairs ? what do they have to say about the Dex-coolant problem. >>that is correct. a manifold gasket, leaking oil into the engine. >>what has GM done about the problem. > >Completely redesigned the intake sealing surface and gaskets with the >introduction of the 3.5L engine. Too early to tell if it is finally >fixed. Hopefully it is for GM's sake. > Will GM pay for the repairs ? what do they have to say about the > Dex-coolant problem. You can ask, but it isn't likely that they will pay. As for the dex-cool, it's more a design/engineering problem with the manifold and gasket than a coolant problem. > that is correct. a manifold gasket, leaking oil into the engine. > what has GM done about the problem. This problem is over a decade old now and GM has tried many "fixes". Will the 3.5l engine have the problem? Only time will tell. John I guess if GM had a fix for the gasket.dex-coolant problem they would have done so by now. but I have not heard of any , so I figure it's not a good time to do a trade in for a new gm auto... >> that is correct. a manifold gasket, leaking oil into the engine. >> what has GM done about the problem. [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > >John >I guess if GM had a fix for the gasket.dex-coolant problem they would > have done so by now. > but I have not heard of any , so I figure it's not a good time to do > a trade in for a new gm auto... If the Dexcool is contributing to the degrading the gaskets, why is GM still using Dexcool? Their competitors seem to be doing fine with the green stuff. What is the value add, I guess is the question? "James C. Reeves" <jcnospam@nospam.com> wrote in message news:X-- > If the Dexcool is contributing to the degrading the gaskets, why is GM still > using Dexcool? Their competitors seem to be doing fine with the green > stuff. What is the value add, I guess is the question? The story that DexCool is at fault is largely an urban legend. There IS a problem, but it may not be DexCool > "James C. Reeves" <jcnospam@nospam.com> wrote in message news:X-- >> If the Dexcool is contributing to the degrading the gaskets, why is GM [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > problem, > but it may not be DexCool I see. Are there other advantages to DexCool? If so, I wonder why everyone isn't using it in their new cars. > > "James C. Reeves" <jcnospam@nospam.com> wrote in message news:X-- > >> If the Dexcool is contributing to the degrading the gaskets, why is GM [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > I see. Are there other advantages to DexCool? If so, I wonder why everyone > isn't using it in their new cars. You haven't been paying attention. The Asians have been using coolant similar to Dexcool's OAT for quite some time, Ford and Chrysler are using a hybrid version of the Dexcool OAT inhibitor package also. > You haven't been paying attention. > The Asians have been using coolant similar to Dexcool's OAT for > quite some time, Ford and Chrysler are using a hybrid version of > the Dexcool OAT inhibitor package also. The big controversy seems to be about the use of the plasticizer 2-EHA as one of the components of Dexcool. A plasticizer softens plastics and apparently can do so with some of the seal materials in vehicles. None of the other OAT or HOAT type coolants use 2-EHA, it is unique to Dexcool. John > The big controversy seems to be about the use of the plasticizer 2-EHA > as one of the components of Dexcool. A plasticizer softens plastics and [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > > John 2-ethylhexylacetate is an oil soluble liquid. It is not, I believe, used in DexCool It is a solvent and would have a limited application as a plasticizer. We used to use it to dissolve very special compounds which wouldnt dissolve in much of anything else. It would certainly damage elastomeric seals, etc, if it were used in DexCool. It wouldn't be soluble in water. I suspect your 2-EHA may be 2-ethylhexanoic acid .It IS one of the Organic Acids which is patented to use in OAT technology. It would be used as the neutralized salt, not the acid form. Common plasticizers are usually things like 2-ethylhexyladipate or di-2-ethylhexylphthalate.These are added to plastics (like dashboards, etc) to keep them soft and pliant. When they cook out of the elastomer, this is that oily film you see on the inside of the windshield. > 2-ethylhexylacetate is an oil soluble liquid. It is not, I believe, used in > DexCool [quoted text clipped - 15 lines] > that > oily film you see on the inside of the windshield. There are numerous articles available which talk about the 2-EHA issue, such as this one in Motor magazine. http://gates.com/downloads/download_common.cfm?file=MOTORCoolantFeature.pdf&fold er=brochure John > There are numerous articles available which talk about the 2-EHA issue, > such as this one in Motor magazine. > > http://gates.com/downloads/download_common.cfm?file=MOTORCoolantFeature.pdf&fold er=brochure > > John Good article, thanks. If Ford, Honda, Toyota and Chrysler have all seemingly documented problems they found when testing DexCool and causing gasket failure problems in their engines (and GM seemingly having more than their fair share of gasket problems), do you think GM is looking at DexCool as part of the equation? wonder if gm will send me the $1035.00 I had to pay to replace the gasket in my Impalla 2000. the dex-coolant was leaking into the oil... >> There are numerous articles available which talk about the 2-EHA issue, >> such as this one in Motor magazine. [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] >their fair share of gasket problems), do you think GM is looking at DexCool >as part of the equation? > wonder if gm will send me the $1035.00 I had to pay to replace the > gasket in my Impalla 2000. the dex-coolant was leaking into the oil... This seems to be a design problem with the 3.4l family of V-6 engines more than a Dexcool problem. Whatever it is, you have a right to be furious with GM since whatever the problem is, they caused it. Millions of 3.4l V-6 engine owners have joined the never-another-GM-product club. John Same here, never again... not even as a gift.. The sooner GM files for chapter 11 bankruptcy the better. the quality of their auto products are pathetic. Now I figure GM is finally getting what it deserves... >> wonder if gm will send me the $1035.00 I had to pay to replace the >> gasket in my Impalla 2000. the dex-coolant was leaking into the oil... [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > >John > There are numerous articles available which talk about the 2-EHA issue, > such as this one in Motor magazine. http://gates.com/downloads/download_common.cfm?file=MOTORCoolantFeature.pdf& folder=brochure > John Of course there are... And in my previous posts I have mentioned some of the problems with an all purpose inhibitor for these types of systems. A 'science writer' apparently wrote this article. While I am no fan of DexCool, there are some chemical inaccuracies....And, the science is very complicated, even for the professional in these areas. 2-ethylhexyl acid, alone, is not normally used as a plasticizer. Its esters may be, but it is not a premier application. As the sodium or potassium salt, 2-EH acid is a 'soap'. Totally water soluble, and not likely to attack elastomers. The problem is more complicated than can be explained by trying to incriminate one single component. >>There are numerous articles available which talk about the 2-EHA issue, >>such as this one in Motor magazine. [quoted text clipped - 23 lines] > incriminate one single > component. OK, chill out. The spirit of my original response is this: Even though other makers are starting to use OAT technology for their vehicle coolants, they are not using the same formula as Dexcool and have objected strongly to the use of Dexcool in their non-GM vehicles. I was responding to a post which implied that all the automakers are going to a Dexcool style coolant, which is not the case. Personally I was surprised to find brown sludge in the coolant recovery bottle of our Olds minivan when it was still less than two years old and under 20,000 miles of moderate weather use (No. California). Something GM did with that vehicle was certainly less than optimum. I flushed everything out, bought a new Stant radiator cap (GM is recommending the aftermarket Stant instead of the original AC-Delco part!) and refilled with Prestone's version of Dexcool. So far at 60,000 miles it hasn't sludged up again. Luckily I maintain our vehicles carefully and noticed the brown goo in the coolant recovery tank. Most people would believe the five year service interval and never give it a close look! John > I was responding to a post which implied that all the automakers are > going to a Dexcool style coolant, which is not the case. That is NOT what I posted, please go back and reread from the post where Mr. Reeves erroneously states that other manufacturers are still using "green" coolant (they aren't). >> I was responding to a post which implied that all the automakers are >> going to a Dexcool style coolant, which is not the case. > > That is NOT what I posted, please go back and reread from the > post where Mr. Reeves erroneously states that other manufacturers > are still using "green" coolant (they aren't). I wonder how many formulas we need. It seems to have gotten overly complicated for the average owner to deal with. One has to ask how and why. > I wonder how many formulas we need. As many as there are different requirements set forth by the OEMs. > It seems to have gotten overly > complicated for the average owner to deal with. You should try it from a shop owners perspective. > One has to ask how and why. (Q) How? (A) Buy from the OEM, then you'll be assured that it meets their requirements. (Q) Why? (A) Smaller, lighter, more exotic alloys, higher output per liter, smaller cooling systems, increased maintenance intervals, etc, etc, etc. I put GO-5 in my 95 Dakota 22 months ago, no problems so far... > I wonder how many formulas we need. It seems to have gotten overly > complicated for the average owner to deal with. One has to ask how and why. Many of the automakers seem hell bent on specifying custom fluids for their vehicles. VW, for example, has a mind-numbing set of custom specification for motor oils for their various vehicles. At least they have an approval process which third parties can go through. Why they can't engineer their vehicles to work well with the common European oil specs (A3, B3, etc.) is a mystery. G-05 coolant seems to be the closest thing to an emerging new standard as it is approved by Daimler-Chrysler and Ford for worldwide use. Traditionally, GM was a leader in lubricant standardization with Dexron from transmissions and a highly active involvement in the API standards setting process for motor oils. The latest SM/GF-4 specifications for motor oils are the current result of this process and are still called for by most US market vehicles .... except for the Germans. German auto makers seem to love special oil approvals. Honda has it's own unique auto tranny fluid which is only sold at dealers. They also have a unique Power Steering fluid and claim that only Honda brand anti-freeze will do for the cooling system. All of this has also led the aftermarket to come out with dubious products and dubious claims like all purpose automatic transmission fluid and all-vehicle coolants. Frankly I do not believe these claims, even when made by respected brands like Pennzoil and Prestone. Somewhere along the line the keep-it-simple mantra has been forgotten! John > OK, chill out. The spirit of my original response is this: Even though > other makers are starting to use OAT technology for their vehicle [quoted text clipped - 16 lines] > > John I definitely agree with you on some issues. GM has done a shitteaux job on a lot of things in the last few years, DexCool being one of them. They have so many different engine issues that it is hard to keep control of them. I just had to replace the plenum on our 3800 Gen II, and am pissed.. Sorry assed engineering, worse customer support. We are near to the point to buy a new car and I am caught with few alternatives. I cannot support crappola GM product development with more money down the drain. And I consider Ford a four letter word. I dont want any more shi**ing computer modules, or engines that fall apart, or gaskets that leak, or plastic plenums that decompose, etc. I want a quiet and economical car that is comfortable on the road. I dont want to have to pay $2-3000 for a dammittohell transmission overhaul before I get 100k on it. Nor do I want 48 microprocessors integrated into everything including the sunvisors, vents, etc. I dont want any more leaking air conditioning compressors, or weak sister alternators. Just a simple quiet smooth running car. And if GM cant do it, they can close every factory in the whole world and go fishing as far as I am concerned. > I definitely agree with you on some issues. GM has done a shitteaux job > on [quoted text clipped - 33 lines] > fishing > as far as I am concerned. And you win one of GM's computer controlled speed sensitive auto volume control radios for the great suggestion to make things simple. >>>There are numerous articles available which talk about the 2-EHA issue, >>>such as this one in Motor magazine. [quoted text clipped - 35 lines] >bottle of our Olds minivan when it was still less than two years old and >under 20,000 miles of moderate weather use (No. California). Something I have experienced the same on a buick century. Also found a very thick layer of sludge in the opening of the radiatorcap. nast y stuff if you ask me. I'll take the green stuff thank you. This car was 2 years old. average miles. amazing >GM did with that vehicle was certainly less than optimum. I flushed >everything out, bought a new Stant radiator cap (GM is recommending the [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > >John |
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