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Car Forum / Honda Cars / January 2005CV joints on 97 Civic
I just got a call from a Goodyear shop who is doing my daughter's Civic's oil change. They said both front CV joints, i.e. axle boots, are bad and need replacing and want $289 each. I declined since I don't have $600. The car has 76k on it and drives perfect with no noise or vibration. Is their any way to test these yourself? Thanks guys. RonT > I just got a call from a Goodyear shop who is doing my daughter's > Civic's oil change. They said both front CV joints, i.e. axle boots, [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > The car has 76k on it and drives perfect with no noise or vibration. Is > their any way to test these yourself? listen for clicking during tight left/right turns. chances are, theyre snowing you. but since goodyear has had the car, maybe they did something to the joints? who knows. id take it to a dealer or a trusted independant mechanic for a second opinion. >> I just got a call from a Goodyear shop who is doing my daughter's >> Civic's oil change. They said both front CV joints, i.e. axle boots, [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > maybe they did something to the joints? who knows. id take it to a > dealer or a trusted independant mechanic for a second opinion. If the axle boots are bad it will be extremely obvious. There will be grease flung all over the place on the inside of the wheel and the wheel well. If they "did something" to the boots, such as slicing them with a knife, that too will be extremely obvious. All Goodyear had to do was take the OP out to the car and show him. It's not something even an inexperienced person would miss. CV joint boots fail for one reason only: NEGLECT.  SignatureTeGGeR? The Unofficial Honda/Acura FAQ www.tegger.com/hondafaq/ >CV joint boots fail for one reason only: NEGLECT. I've never heard about maintaining a CV boot. How do you do it? Dean >>CV joint boots fail for one reason only: NEGLECT. >I've never heard about maintaining a CV boot. How do you do it? You don't. There's no maintenance other than checking for rips. The trick is to replace the boot in before the CV joint loses lubrication. Usually inspecting them twice a year is enough. >>CV joint boots fail for one reason only: NEGLECT. > > I've never heard about maintaining a CV boot. That's exactly my point. Garages make a mint replacing axles because nobody ever checks the boots. > How do you do it? Real easy: http://www.tegger.com/hondafaq/rustybrakes/brakes4.html#cv SignatureTeGGeR? The Unofficial Honda/Acura FAQ www.tegger.com/hondafaq/ "Dean" <no.email @ papernapkin.net> wrote in message "TeGGer?" <tegger@istop.c0m> wrote: > >CV joint boots fail for one reason only: NEGLECT. > I've never heard about maintaining a CV boot. How do you do it? > Dean I'd avoid driving when the front tires, rotors or shafts are vibrating. And avoid unnecessary u-turns, driving in extreme conditions, or driving with badly installed boots. > "Dean" <no.email @ papernapkin.net> wrote in message > "TeGGer?" <tegger@istop.c0m> wrote: [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > avoid unnecessary u-turns, driving in extreme conditions, or driving with > badly installed boots. Extreme conditions? Like what? > "Burt Squareman" <catnip4sale@yahoo.com> wrote > > I'd avoid ...driving in extreme conditions, > Extreme conditions? Like what? Driving over water puddles full of caster oil or unknown chemicals, drying it out. Driving over crummy road surfaces, road salts or extreme climates. Protect your boots from the elements such as salts, solvents, ozone, etc. Wash with warm soapy water then spray a CRC brand medium silicone spray, i.e. not dry or too wet every six months. >> "Burt Squareman" <catnip4sale@yahoo.com> wrote >> > I'd avoid ...driving in extreme conditions, [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] >drying it out. Driving over crummy road surfaces, road salts or >extreme climates. Sounds like daily driving in 99.99999999999999999% of the world <g> >>> "Burt Squareman" <catnip4sale@yahoo.com> wrote >>> > I'd avoid ...driving in extreme conditions, [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > > Sounds like daily driving in 99.99999999999999999% of the world <g> Looks like I should park my car from November to April. > Driving over water puddles full of caster oil or unknown chemicals, > drying it out. Driving over crummy road surfaces, road salts or > extreme climates. Hahhahahh. Where do you live, man? ;-)) >> "Burt Squareman" <catnip4sale@yahoo.com> wrote >> > I'd avoid ...driving in extreme conditions, [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > etc. Wash with warm soapy water then spray a CRC brand medium > silicone spray, i.e. not dry or too wet every six months. Where do you get your info from? Silicone spray is a dumb idea, and will get on the brake pads eventually, with potentially disastrous results. CV joint boot cracking is due to: 1) Steering stresses 2) Steering during winter driving 3) Extreme driveshaft angles, such as what's present in some AWD vehicles. There is NOTHING you can do in normal use to prolong your CV joint boots' lives. All you can do is catch the cracking before it develops into an open split in the boot, and get them replaced. That's it. Inspection takes literally seconds. If you can't do it yourself, have your oil change monkey show the boots to you at your next oil change. SignatureTeGGeR? The Unofficial Honda/Acura FAQ www.tegger.com/hondafaq/ "TeGGer?" <tegger@istop.c0m> wrote in message > Where do you get your info from? Silicone spray is a dumb idea, GM's shop manuals for Corvettes recommend rubbing silicon grease into the weather-stripping once a year to prevent cracking and such. I'm sure they tested it. 87 Chevy Nova owners manual recommended spraying the weather stripping with silicone spray every 6 months. Pat Goss on Motorweek recommends silicone spray. Toyota dealer use silicone grease as a preventative measure to reduce squeaks at the sway bar bushings. >and will get on the brake pads eventually, with potentially disastrous results. Spray on a cotton rag or sponge and rub small apllication on trim. > CV joint boot cracking is due to: > 1) Steering stresses > 2) Steering during winter driving > 3) Extreme driveshaft angles, such as what's present in some AWD vehicles. Rubber breaks mainly due to surface cracks that develop into rips when rubber dries up and looses its elasticity. Extreme steering only aids it. Silicone spray would help CV boots. > There is NOTHING you can do in normal use to prolong your CV joint boots' > lives. All you can do is catch the cracking before it develops into an open > split in the boot, and get them replaced. That's it. > Inspection takes literally seconds. If you can't do it yourself, have your > oil change monkey show the boots to you at your next oil change. <snip> > Rubber breaks mainly due to surface cracks that develop into rips when > rubber dries up and looses its elasticity. Extreme steering only aids > it. Silicone spray would help CV boots. Burt, trim and sway bars are no comparison at all with CV joint boots. Neither of the former are subject to the sort of flexing that CV joint boots are. CV joint boots split from steering, cold, and driveshaft angles, period. If you want to wipe silicone on the boots, be my guest. But all it's going to do is make you feel better. SignatureTeGGeR? The Unofficial Honda/Acura FAQ www.tegger.com/hondafaq/ "TeGGer?" <tegger@istop.c0m> wrote > <snip> > CV joint boots split from steering, cold, and driveshaft angles, period. CV joint boots split from steering, cold, or driveshaft angles only after premature aging induced by heat cycling, oil contaminants or Ozone, to name a few. As boot materials improve mechanical damage will become a leading cause of boot splits. CV joint is a heat sink for the brake rotor. CV boots are asked to go from below freezing temperatures to, at times, very high temperatures. The boots (and all plastic and rubber parts) become more brittle and less pliable from heat cycling. Ozone is a chemical element that destroys boots by dry rot. Ozone is every- where and causes oxidation, or slowly burns, at a greater rate than oxygen. My concern with silicon based product is that some grade may attract dirt and will act like sandpaper when the pleats of the boot compress and flexes. Dupont use Hytrel for boots. Neoprene, thermo plastic elastomer (TPE) and other elastomers are common in most cars. If compatibility is a concern then simply wash it off with mild soap and water, avoid using solvents that could breakdown the boot. > My concern with silicon based product is that some grade may attract dirt and > will act like sandpaper when the pleats of the boot compress and flexes. water, oil, mud, etc will do the same thing, though. attract dirt, and voila! >I just got a call from a Goodyear shop who is doing my daughter's >Civic's oil change. They said both front CV joints, i.e. axle boots, [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] >The car has 76k on it and drives perfect with no noise or vibration. Is >their any way to test these yourself? If the boots have been torn for any length of time the CV joints are toast. You can just replace the boots but it's better to replace the driveshafts. See also: http://www.tegger.com/hondafaq/faq.html#CVjoints Call theses guys for price. http://www.raxles.com and have your local mech installed. Heard they have good quality axles. Estimate labor at $75-100 per side. mextex1@webtv.net (Ron Truitt) floridly penned in news:20835-41DCB2F1- 233@storefull-3172.bay.webtv.net: > I just got a call from a Goodyear shop who is doing my daughter's > Civic's oil change. They said both front CV joints, i.e. axle boots, [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > The car has 76k on it and drives perfect with no noise or vibration. Is > their any way to test these yourself? The price they're quoting sounds like the joints themselves are bad and they want to replace the whole axle. This means the boots were split and grease was flung around all over the place in the wheel wells. At 76K you're likely still running on the OEM joints. Be wise to keep them if at all possible. If never allowed to go bad (never allowing the boots to split), they last the life of the car. Did they actually show you the problem? It's one of those blindingly obvious, very visible things. SignatureTeGGeR? The Unofficial Honda/Acura FAQ www.tegger.com/hondafaq/ I had the axles replaced on my Accord a couple of years ago at an independent Honda repair place for about $400. They offered to replace the boots, but I choose the more expensive route because I plan on keeping the car for a very long time. If money is an issue just do the boots and save for joints when they fail. It might be a long time, if ever. The LAST time I went to Goodyear, for a state safety inspection, the guy was quoting me prices on brake jobs. BEFORE he had even seen the car. Being the handy sort of guy I declined their generous offer to fix my brakes after, surprise!, they failed inspection. You can imagine how PO'ed I was when I started the job and quickly realized that there was absolutely nothing wrong with the brakes. I don't know what this Goodyear shop, but from my point of view you already have two strikes against you, 1st you went to a Goodyear shop, 2nd you let them do work. <lol> My favorite kind of place is a small independent place that relies on word of mouth advertising. My Honda repair guy only works on Hondas and is usually backed up a day or two. Its worth the wait because he is dead honest. So my advise is to ask the Honda owners you know where they get their cars fixed. Dean >I just got a call from a Goodyear shop who is doing my daughter's >Civic's oil change. They said both front CV joints, i.e. axle boots, [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > >RonT >The LAST time I went to Goodyear, for a state safety inspection, the guy was >quoting me prices on brake jobs. BEFORE he had even seen the car. Being the >handy sort of guy I declined their generous offer to fix my brakes after, >surprise!, they failed inspection. You can imagine how PO'ed I was when I >started the job and quickly realized that there was absolutely nothing wrong >with the brakes. My favorite moment was when one such shyster told me I needed new shocks. I told him that if he could replace the shocks, I'd give him the car. The car was an Austin 1300 which uses a hydraulic suspension and doesn't HAVE shocks! >I don't know what this Goodyear shop, but from my point of view you already have >two strikes against you, 1st you went to a Goodyear shop, 2nd you let them do >work. <lol> My favorite kind of place is a small independent place that relies >on word of mouth advertising. I second the motion! Look for an owner operated place that's in as obscure a location as possible. Such outfits cannot depend on walk-in business and must trust to satisfied customers to advertise their presence. > My Honda repair guy only works on Hondas and is >usually backed up a day or two. Its worth the wait because he is dead honest. > >So my advise is to ask the Honda owners you know where they get their cars >fixed. Or check with a local car club. John Ings wrote: >>The LAST time I went to Goodyear, for a state safety inspection, the guy was >>quoting me prices on brake jobs. BEFORE he had even seen the car. Being the [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > The car was an Austin 1300 which uses a hydraulic suspension and > doesn't HAVE shocks! That's like the time a guy at Midas told me that my '93 Accord needed new struts. Hello? My car has shocks and springs, not struts. Needless to say, I never went back there and have been going to a private Honda mechanic for the last few years. > I had the axles replaced on my Accord a couple of years ago at an > independent Honda repair place for about $400. They offered to > replace the boots, but I choose the more expensive route because I > plan on keeping the car for a very long time. If the CV joints are original (OEM) then best thing you can do is keep them and replace the boots only, provided the previous boots had not ever been allowed to split and leak. Those OEM CV joints will literally last forever, so well are they made. SignatureTeGGeR? The Unofficial Honda/Acura FAQ www.tegger.com/hondafaq/ >> I had the axles replaced on my Accord a couple of years ago at an >> independent Honda repair place for about $400. They offered to >> replace the boots, but I choose the more expensive route because I >> plan on keeping the car for a very long time. >If the CV joints are original (OEM) then best thing you can do is keep them >and replace the boots only, provided the previous boots had not ever been >allowed to split and leak. that's easier said than done. The labor of replacing just the boots is the same as a complete CV job. It's cheaper to just let the boots last as long as they're going to and replace the boots and the CV joints together. >Those OEM CV joints will literally last forever, so well are they made. >>If the CV joints are original (OEM) then best thing you can do is keep >>them and replace the boots only, provided the previous boots had not [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > It's cheaper to just let the boots last as long as they're going to > and replace the boots and the CV joints together. I didn't say "cheaper", I said "best". SignatureTeGGeR? The Unofficial Honda/Acura FAQ www.tegger.com/hondafaq/ >that's easier said than done. The labor of replacing just the boots is >the same as a complete CV job. But what are you replacing them with? The argument is that the original shafts are of far better quality than rebuilts, so even though the labor costs are the same or even a bit more, it's better to replace a cracked but not yet leaking boot on an original shaft than exchange them for rebuilts of questionable quality. >It's cheaper to just let the boots last as long as they're going to and >replace the boots and the CV joints together. I would do that if I knew the shafts had already been replaced with rebuilts before, or I knew the CV joints were starting to make noise at full lock. >I just got a call from a Goodyear shop who is doing my daughter's >Civic's oil change. They said both front CV joints, i.e. axle boots, [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] >The car has 76k on it and drives perfect with no noise or vibration. Is >their any way to test these yourself? You can get under the car and check the boots yourself. Very easy to do. It sounds to me as if the price you are being quoted is for them to replace the entire axle, nust just the boot. ------------ Alex On another note years ago I had a torn boot and money was a major issue, (read NONE <lol>) I borrowed a few dollars and replaced the boot myself. I took the axle out of the car cleaned and repacked the joint and put it all back together. It lasted for three years and 30K miles until I sold the car to buy my first Honda. Dean >I just got a call from a Goodyear shop who is doing my daughter's >Civic's oil change. They said both front CV joints, i.e. axle boots, [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > >RonT Thanks fellas. I'm going to do a close inspection of the car before I do anything. My daughter had taken it in while I was at work so the Goodyear shop was after her for the work. Maybe they figured nobody would check the car out. RonT Same thing happened to me a few months ago. Due to my not keeping an eye open for tears or rips in the CV boots, I let my CV joints get to the point that they were crunching in slow turns. If they've been like that a long time, you probably DO need new CV joints, but $600 is bullshit. I had both sides of mine done - axles and all - for $360. |
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