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Car Forum / Honda Cars / December 20052005 Honda Civic LX gas mileage
When I picked up my Honda Civic LX that I just bought on 9/7/2005, it had a full tank of gas. I drove it over 400 miles, did a fill up, divided the gallons into the miles and it came out to 39 mpg. I thought this was great, since I had the AC on at various times, did more city driving than I normally do, etc. But, with my next fill up, less AC and less city driving it came out to only 37 mpg. Then 36 mpg with the next fill up. It keeps going down. The last fill up it was 32 mpg. I don't do fast start ups or slowing down and I drive the car at 60-65 mph on the highway with no AC. I now have 3,200 miles on it. I called the Honda dealer and asked them if they could check it out to see what the problem is. To my surprise, they said that the better gas mileage I was getting before was a fluke! What I am getting now is normal. They said there was nothing for them to check unless I start getting around 19 MPG or the service engine light comes on. They said the engine is run by computers so there is nothing for them to do. Is this right? Thanks, Roland > When I picked up my Honda Civic LX that I just bought on 9/7/2005, it > had a full tank of gas. I drove it over 400 miles, did a fill up, [quoted text clipped - 15 lines] > > Roland ------------------ Keep on dividing the distance traveled by the volume of fuel you put in . . That's your mileage. Don't overfill the tank past shut-off. That's covered in the Owner's Manual. 'Curly' I never overfill. I take the pump out on the first click. > I never overfill. I take the pump out on the first click. I always give it a one more chance. Sometimes they click off by mistake. But if that was the problem, you would get one high reading, follwed by a low reading. Over the course of many fillups, a gallon difference wouldn't be noticed. I suspect you were driving the car very gently at first, and you're just driving it harder now.  Signature--- Clarence A Dold - Hidden Valley (Lake County) CA USA 38.8,-122.5 No, I actually have slowed down on the highway. Recently I have been driving 55-60 mph on the highway. I guess the bottom line question I have is - is there any way to hook up the engine to the diagnostic or whatever it's called machine and have it tell you if the engine is tuned properly? To be specifc, what can cause the engine to not work efficiently? Clogged fuel injector, dirty fuel filter, air filter, etc? I know the car is brand new so, none of the engine parts should be dirty but, I don't know. It just doesn't make sense. I had a 2002 Dodge Caravan with a 4-cylinder engine and I averaged 24 mpg. Now I have this little compact car with an even smaller 4-cylinder engine and I only get 8 mpg more? Your mileage should decline as the weather cools. In a nutshell, the engine requires more fuel to achieve the same speeds etc. at lower temperatures. There is a fair amount of variation in these calculations, so it's important to watch the averages over several fillups for similar driving conditions and ambient temperatures. I have had seemingly freakish 46 to 47 mpg calculations yielded for my 91 Civic LX (manual transmission, no air conditioning) from the data twice in the past 1.5 years, once in each of the past two summers, whereas the average mpg is closer to 40 mpg. In July and August, for seven fillups, the mpg varied from 40 mpg to 45 mpg (45, 44, 41, 40, 45, 40, 41). I almost always put in over 8 gallons but rarely lately over 10 gallons. It does seem that I get better mileage if I don't drive as near to an empty tank as possible. (The fuel pump doesn't have to work as hard, reducing energy consumed to run it? That may be out in left field.) Also, I have read that driving until the tank is near empty permits the pump to pick up sediment at the bottom of the tank, which is generally not good for the engine etc. My mileage recently slipped a tad below 40, whence I remembered the weather had cooled and I hadn't checked my tire inflation pressure. Sure enough, all four were down 4 psi. This won't affect mpg a lot, from my experience, but my impression is it will be noticeable. So I'd say with your new car, keep collecting data; be aware that cold weather will affect mileage; and check your tire pressure at least once a month, particularly when seasons change. > No, I actually have slowed down on the highway. Recently I have been > driving 55-60 mph on the highway. I guess the bottom line question I [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > little compact car with an even smaller 4-cylinder engine and I only > get 8 mpg more? > So I'd say with your new car, keep collecting data; be aware that cold > weather will affect mileage; and check your tire pressure at least once a > month, particularly when seasons change. id say with the new car... drive it. enjoy it. be glad you werent retarded enough to buy a hummer H2. > Elle wrote: > > So I'd say with your new car, keep collecting data; be aware that cold [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > id say with the new car... drive it. enjoy it. be glad you werent > retarded enough to buy a hummer H2. I only "get" this because recently one of my offline buddies was telling me how his boss had just bought a hummer. The boss paid over $40k for it. He says it gets 10 miles per gallon of gas. fueleconomy.gov says the 2006's get 16 mpg around town. Owning "things." Dear lord. > Your mileage should decline as the weather cools. In a nutshell, the > engine requires more fuel to achieve the same speeds etc. at lower > temperatures. > In July and August, for seven fillups, the mpg varied from 40 mpg to > 45 mpg (45, 44, 41, 40, 45, 40, 41). I almost always put in over 8 > gallons but rarely lately over 10 gallons. It does seem that I get > better mileage if I don't drive as near to an empty tank as possible. > (The fuel pump doesn't have to work as hard, reducing energy consumed > to run it? That may be out in left field.) The load on the fuel pump is virtually constant. It delivers fuel at pressure to the engine compartment where it is filtered and applied to the injector pump while the volume not required is returned to the tank. -- Graham W http://www.gcw.org.uk/ PGM-FI page updated, Graphics Tutorial WIMBORNE http://www.wessex-astro-society.freeserve.co.uk/ Wessex Dorset UK Astro Society's Web pages, Info, Meeting Dates, Sites & Maps Change 'news' to 'sewn' in my Reply address to avoid my spam filter. > Elle wrote: > > Your mileage should decline as the weather cools. In a nutshell, the [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > > The load on the fuel pump is virtually constant. The difference in pressure across a pump, among other things like flow rate and fluid density, is what determines the pump load. A higher head at the pump inlet reduces the amount of work it must do. Higher levels in the fuel tank translate of course to a higher head at pump inlet. Thus my proposal. Admittedly the difference may be negligible. The theory, with practical consequences in many applications and being a routine part of pump design, is correct. >> Elle wrote: >>> Your mileage should decline as the weather cools. In a nutshell, the [quoted text clipped - 21 lines] > theory, with practical consequences in many applications and being a > routine part of pump design, is correct. I did say "virtually constant" and you missed a significant factor (for in-tank pumps in the Honda/Rover cars) which is that the fuel is sucked into the pump without being replaced by air from the outside thus reducing the absolute air pressure in the tank. You can verify this by listening for the 'whoosh' of air into the tank when you undo the tank's filler cap. From time to time, the depression is great enough to activate the ingress of air through the filtered vent used as part of the emission controls. This causes a strange sort of 'groan' from the valve when the car is stationary and engine is off. Since the head at the inlet varies by only a few inches, I doubt that the difference in electrical load is measurable. SignatureGraham W http://www.gcw.org.uk/ PGM-FI page updated, Graphics Tutorial WIMBORNE http://www.wessex-astro-society.freeserve.co.uk/ Wessex Dorset UK Astro Society's Web pages, Info, Meeting Dates, Sites & Maps Change 'news' to 'sewn' in my Reply address to avoid my spam filter. > Elle wrote: > >> Elle wrote: [quoted text clipped - 24 lines] > > I did say "virtually constant" and you missed a significant factor Now it's "significant" huh. > (for in-tank pumps in the Honda/Rover cars) which is that the fuel is > sucked into the pump without being replaced by air from the outside > thus reducing the absolute air pressure in the tank. > You can verify this > by listening for the 'whoosh' of air into the tank when you undo the [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > ingress of air through the filtered vent used as part of the emission > controls. Contradicting your earlier statement. > This causes a strange sort of 'groan' from the valve when > the car is stationary and engine is off. > > Since the head at the inlet varies by only a few inches, I doubt that > the difference in electrical load is measurable. I haven't run numbers but I do /not/ maintain it's significant. I don't know. I raised it only as a possibility above. The possibility is in fact consistent with theory. Now I'm outta this exchange because I know a pig when I read one. You know what I'm talking about. Others who have read my posts here: Graham is the one. Open emails from him with caution. > Now I'm outta this exchange because I know a pig when I read one. > > You know what I'm talking about. > > Others who have read my posts here: Graham is the one. Open emails > from him with caution. I have never ever emailed a person at your e-address. Please show the headers of where I did or apologise for making false allegations! I do not give other correspondants Trojans or Viruses or any other nasties. SignatureGraham W http://www.gcw.org.uk/ PGM-FI page updated, Graphics Tutorial WIMBORNE http://www.wessex-astro-society.freeserve.co.uk/ Wessex Dorset UK Astro Society's Web pages, Info, Meeting Dates, Sites & Maps Change 'news' to 'sewn' in my Reply address to avoid my spam filter. > I did say "virtually constant" and you missed a significant factor > (for in-tank pumps in the Honda/Rover cars) which is that the fuel is > sucked into the pump without being replaced by air from the outside > thus reducing the absolute air pressure in the tank. You can verify this > by listening for the 'whoosh' of air into the tank when you undo the > tank's filler cap. One should note here that, as long as the tank is not vented to atmosphere, then the pressure due to the air above the fuel level in fact will be reducing (contrary to the implication above) as long as the fuel level goes down. Thus the pressure at the pump inlet will be even lower than if the tank were vented to atmosphere. With no venting, even more pump work is necessary than with venting. It's mere theory, and in this application out in left field, because the pump is such a low power device, raising say 1 gallon / hour a few psi, well less than 1 hp of motor power, I'd guesstimate with some rough calculations. >> I did say "virtually constant" and you missed a significant factor >> (for in-tank pumps in the Honda/Rover cars) which is that the fuel is [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > atmosphere, then the pressure due to the air above the fuel level in > fact will be reducing (contrary to the implication above) It isn't contrary - that is exactly what I said - "reducing the absolute pressure in the tank"! > as long as > the fuel level goes down. Thus the pressure at the pump inlet will > be even lower than if the tank were vented to atmosphere. Agreed. > With no venting, even more pump work is necessary than with venting. Agreed again. > It's mere theory, and in this application out in left field, because > the pump is such a low power device, raising say 1 gallon / hour a > few psi, well less than 1 hp of motor power, I'd guesstimate with > some rough calculations. Your figures are a bit adrift though. Yes I know they are guesses but since the pump needs to raise the delivery pressure at the filter so that the engine's FI is supplied with enough fuel at the most extreme of power demands and RPM, the volume at a guess is far higher than 1 gallon / hour. That fuel which isn't consumed by the FI injectors is returned to the tank through a pressure relief valve. So at 90 mph the engine will be burning around 3 gal / hr or more and that figure doesn't include the amount returned to the tank. Here are some figures to play with. The pump output pressure runs at 2.3 to 3.0 bar (that's about 33 to 44 psi). At 16volts it can deliver at nearly 60 psi. Figures taken from Haynes for my Honda engined Rover 216 16 valve 1.6 litre. How do those numbers run out at HP needed from the pump? SignatureGraham W http://www.gcw.org.uk/ PGM-FI page updated, Graphics Tutorial WIMBORNE http://www.wessex-astro-society.freeserve.co.uk/ Wessex Dorset UK Astro Society's Web pages, Info, Meeting Dates, Sites & Maps Change 'news' to 'sewn' in my Reply address to avoid my spam filter. > Elle wrote: > >> I did say "virtually constant" and you missed a significant factor [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > It isn't contrary - that is exactly what I said - "reducing the absolute > pressure in the tank"! You seemed to be implying this reduced the pump work. On the contrary, lower pressure on the fuel in the tank increases the pump work necessary to move it to the injectors, etc. That junk you posted did nothing more than bolster my original point, but in a manner that muddies the issue. > > as long as > > the fuel level goes down. Thus the pressure at the pump inlet will [quoted text clipped - 16 lines] > of power demands and RPM, the volume at a guess is far higher than > 1 gallon / hour. Whatever "at a guess" means. Of course the flow varies. Why would you suggest otherwise, except to be a jackass? I don't work with absurd numbers such as 90 mph, but instead numbers for the typical driver in the U.S. You're not greeted with seriousness or patience by me, because of that vulgar email you sent. >> Elle wrote: >>>> I did say "virtually constant" and you missed a significant factor [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] > > You seemed to be implying this reduced the pump work. But I didn't say that. > On the > contrary, lower pressure on the fuel in the tank increases the pump > work necessary to move it to the injectors, etc. Agreed. > That junk you posted did nothing more than bolster my original point, > but in a manner that muddies the issue. [quoted text clipped - 21 lines] > > Whatever "at a guess" means. The same as your guess. > Of course the flow varies. Why would you suggest otherwise, except to > be a jackass? Ah, but the flow remains essentially constant. This is fact that you have failed to grasp. Any fuel at say 2.5 bar which is not consumed by the FI is returned to the tank. > I don't work with absurd numbers such as 90 mph, but instead numbers > for the typical driver in the U.S. > You're not greeted with seriousness or patience by me, because of that > vulgar email you sent. Show me the headers! In fact show me the email. And read more carefully what I have posted - you are trying to twist what I say to suit yourself. SignatureGraham W http://www.gcw.org.uk/ PGM-FI page updated, Graphics Tutorial WIMBORNE http://www.wessex-astro-society.freeserve.co.uk/ Wessex Dorset UK Astro Society's Web pages, Info, Meeting Dates, Sites & Maps Change 'news' to 'sewn' in my Reply address to avoid my spam filter. > Elle wrote: > >> Elle wrote: [quoted text clipped - 54 lines] > > Ah, but the flow remains essentially constant. Ah, but I wasn't attempting to do anything more than a back of the envelope calculation. You're being a jack. This is fact that you > have failed to grasp. Any fuel at say 2.5 bar which is not consumed by > the FI is returned to the tank. [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > > Show me the headers! In fact show me the email. Oh get all upset. I don't save such tasteless crap, sent in frustration by someone who can't defend his position. Others can believe me or not. > And read more carefully what I have posted - you are trying to twist > what I say to suit yourself. You're pathological. OK. Back to the gas mileage problem I'm having. Here is the list of mpg for each fillup by date. 9/13 - 38.7 9/17 - 36.6 9/23 - 39.3 9/25 - 37.1 10/1 - 34.7 10/5 - 35.5 10/8 - 33.0 10/14 - 35.2 10/18 - 33.3 10/23 - 34.0 10/31 - 32.2 11/07 - 31.5 3,600 total miles My driving is mostly highway, 60 mph, slow starts and stops.etc. The mpg should be higher. > OK. Back to the gas mileage problem I'm having. Here is the list of mpg > for each fillup by date. [quoted text clipped - 16 lines] > My driving is mostly highway, 60 mph, slow starts and stops.etc. The > mpg should be higher. Do you live north or south in the U.S.? Did you check your tire pressure? > OK. Back to the gas mileage problem I'm having. Here is the list of mpg > for each fillup by date. [quoted text clipped - 16 lines] > My driving is mostly highway, 60 mph, slow starts and stops.etc. The > mpg should be higher. This may have been mentioned already, but if the weather has been getting increasingly cooler where you are, that will decrease your mileage. Also, once it is broken in (after about 5000 miles), your mileage should improve, although likely not until next spring if you are in a winter climate. >> OK. Back to the gas mileage problem I'm having. Here is the list of mpg >> for each fillup by date. [quoted text clipped - 22 lines] > improve, > although likely not until next spring if you are in a winter climate. I also wonder about the fill up method. I buy most of my gas at one station, but sometimes I have to use a different pump. Some cut off earlier than others and it can be half gallon to 1 1/2 gallons too soon. I always go past the first and second automatic cut offs, slowly. SignatureKent Finnell From the Music City USA > I also wonder about the fill up method. I buy most of my gas at one > station, but sometimes I have to use a different pump. Some cut off earlier [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > Kent Finnell > From the Music City USA ---------------------------------- Why would you do that? Your new car came with an owner's manual that says you shouldn't. If you want the best results, you need to follow the Maker's instructions. 'Curly' >> I also wonder about the fill up method. I buy most of my gas at one >> station, but sometimes I have to use a different pump. Some cut off [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] > > 'Curly' First of all, it's NOT a new car, it's not even a Honda. However I've owned 3 Honda, among other cars. I've filled them up all the same way, other wise you cannot get an accurate mileage calculation. The Maker's instructions are for maker's benefit, not necessarily for the consumers. For what it's worth, I never spill a drop. Tell me, Curly, why did you send me private email to bitch at me? If you want to lecture me, do it in the group. Then I can respond in a manner that won't make me look some sort of wild man when I tell you to go teach your grandma to suck eggs. I'll be 65 by the end of the month and I don't need lectures from someone who calls himself "Curly Q. Links" and is probably 1/3rd my age or less. SignatureKent Finnell From the Music City USA > First of all, it's NOT a new car, it's not even a Honda. However I've owned > 3 Honda, among other cars. I've filled them up all the same way, other wise > you cannot get an accurate mileage calculation. ---------------------- My gas station gives me a receipt with the VOLUME of fuel printed right on it. I can fill my tank half-full and be way more accurate than somebody who goes by 'tankfull' divided by mileage. Tankfull isn't a measurement of any credibility. ie: my cousin got a big dent in his 'tank' now his gas mileage is crappy. --------------------- > The Maker's instructions are for maker's benefit, not necessarily for the > consumers. For what it's worth, I never spill a drop. ------------------- I didn't say you spilled anything, but Honda says you can mess up the EGR system by filling the canister full of liquid fuel. Aside from that you're breaking some FIRE CODE rules, and you could spill a lot of fuel down the municipal sewers or parkade on a hot day. That's why manufacturers are required to tell you not to overfill. ++++++++++ Any firefighters like to help with this point ??? ------------------- > Tell me, Curly, why did you send me private email to bitch at me? If you > want to lecture me, do it in the group. Then I can respond in a manner that > won't make me look some sort of wild man when I tell you to go teach your > grandma to suck eggs. ------------------------ I must have clicked the wrong 'reply' button, sorry. My reply was in the group too. I must have clicked on 'both'. -------------------- > I'll be 65 by the end of the month and I don't need lectures from someone > who calls himself "Curly Q. Links" and is probably 1/3rd my age or less. --------------------- Whatever. I walked in half-way thru the end of the discussion . . . . . just thought you were asking for advise about how to correctly figure out the mileage on a Honda. > Kent Finnell > From the Music City USA > I also wonder about the fill up method. I buy most of my gas at one > station, but sometimes I have to use a different pump. Some cut off > earlier than others and it can be half gallon to 1 1/2 gallons too soon. > I always go past the first and second automatic cut offs, slowly. Different pump cutoffs would balance out over time. If you clicked off a gallon too soon, the mileage would show too high for that tank, but the next tank, when you replaced that missing gallon, would be much lower. Those two would average out. Instead of tracking just the mileage on a tank, track the gallons put in for each fill. Over a period of time, you can look at the mileage across multiple fillups, making the automatic cutoff immaterial. You could put in one gallon, or "five dollars worth" on each visit, and over time, you could still get an accurate mpg rating. http://www.rahul.net/dold/clarence/Honda_Mileage.htm Signature--- Clarence A Dold - Hidden Valley (Lake County) CA USA 38.8,-122.5 > OK. Back to the gas mileage problem I'm having. Here is the list of mpg > for each fillup by date. [quoted text clipped - 16 lines] > My driving is mostly highway, 60 mph, slow starts and stops.etc. The > mpg should be higher. im not seeing a problem, especially if its got an A/T. youre getting an average 35mpg... what kind of mileage are you expecting? a solid 40mpg, regardless? on an engine that isnt broken in? in the middle of fall, going into winter? take it back to the dealer, and thats what theyre going to tell you. then when you leave, theyre going to laugh at you. > OK. Back to the gas mileage problem I'm having. Here is the list of mpg > for each fillup by date. [quoted text clipped - 16 lines] > My driving is mostly highway, 60 mph, slow starts and stops.etc. The > mpg should be higher. I threw your data into Excel. It works out to an average 35 mpg, 65 miles/day. Roughly, the greater the number of days between fillups, the worse your mileage. You don't tell us how many gallons each fillup was, so it's difficult to infer this, but periods when you go longer between fillups may indicate less highway driving (and less miles), therefore more short, low-mileage trips. Your two lowest mileage days were both Mondays; unless you work weekends, your weekend driving may be affecting your overall mileage. --Gene >> OK. Back to the gas mileage problem I'm having. Here is the list of mpg >> for each fillup by date. [quoted text clipped - 28 lines] > > --Gene Good job, Gene. It would be interesting to see the number of miles related to each fill up. I've kept an Excel spreadsheet on my last 3 cars, including 2 Hondas. I don't believe in the "evening out" theory from the two anal retentive OCD victims. SignatureKent Finnell From the Music City USA > including 2 Hondas. I don't believe in the "evening out" theory from the There should be some that are below reality, and some that are above reality. Eventually, the average of the miscalculated averages should be close to true. If you divide the number of miles by the number of gallons that you put in, and that number of gallons is low, because the pump clicked off too early, then the mpg that you think you got that time should be higher than it really is. Occasionally, you can fill the tank the rest of the way, and get a low calculation, but I don't know how you would consistently get a low calculation, and never get a high calculation. If someone is measuring "miles between fillups", where the gallons used on those fillups isn't observed, or "days between fillups", then there is very little connection with reality. Tracking the number of gallons that you put in each time, whether a "fillup" or not, and tracking the mileage, should give correct results. Signature--- Clarence A Dold - Hidden Valley (Lake County) CA USA 38.8,-122.5 >> including 2 Hondas. I don't believe in the "evening out" theory from the > > There should be some that are below reality, and some that are above > reality. Eventually, the average of the miscalculated averages should be > close to true. yup... you want LOW mileage? try going from LA to laughlin over the mountain passes in a 1.6l civic CX 5spd with the A/C cranked. i was in 2rd and floored going up most of the hills, and hitting 100 on the flats in 4th/5th, but only when someone was in front to "lead the way" that got me an all time record breaking low 24mpg. My all time low was also around 24mpg. Going flat-out from Montreal to Boston along the i93. I did about 450km before having to gas up, doing 160km/hr up the hills/mountains and about 190km/hr on the straight or downhill. When going up, it was common for the Pick-ups to hog the left lane, so I had to pass them on the right (In 3rd gear and since we were both doing about 160km/hr, they were also probably going flat-out). I made it to Boston from Montreal in less then 3hrs. It was thee nicest drive I've ever had, since it was in October and the leaves were turning and there was next to no traffic (until I got into Boston...what nightmare). Pars 98 Civic Hatch > >> including 2 Hondas. I don't believe in the "evening out" theory from the > > [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > > that got me an all time record breaking low 24mpg. OK. It's been a while since I lasted posted to this thread. I think I may have found something but, it does'nt make any sense. I last reported on 11/7 that I drove 307 miles on 9.7 gallons = 31.5 mpg. I noticed that the tank was very full - a tiny bit of gas spilled out. I guess you would say I topped it off, which everyone says you should not do. Then, I fill up the car on 11/14, 480 miles and 11 gallons = 43.6 mpg. This time I did not top it off. On 11/21, 395 miles it stopped filling at 11.7 gallons so, I decided to top it off but what happened next was very strange. It did not click again till about 12.5 gallons. I thought this was strange as it normally clicks off after 1/10th of a gallon added. I turned on the gas pump again and it went up to 13.7 or 14.? or something - sorry I didn't mark it down. The manual says 13.2 gallons is the tank capacity so when I went over it I thought something was strange about this gas pump. Today, 12/1, 496 miles on 11 gallons. Thinking back to my last fill up, I thought I would top it off and it did what it's supposed to do, click off at each 1/10th of a gallon. I kept adding gas, I had to start and stop at each 1/10th of a gallon added, and go it up to 12 gallons. No gas came out so, I probably could have topped off more but, I stopped. 496 miles at 12 gallons is 41.3 miles to the gallon. Your probably thinking I must have been doing more highway driving when I get the better gas mileage but I'm not. I drive about 15 (13 highway, 2 city) miles each way to work each day. If I need to go to the grocery store or department store, they are only a mile away. On Friday and Monday each week I drive 25 miles each way, mostly highway, to pick up and drop off my children at school (they live with me each weekend). My house is only a mile from any highway entrance. So, as you can see, I drive mostly highway each week. I'm going to keep topping off my tank, checking for when it first clicked off and how much extra gas I pumped in before I stopped, and of course the gas mileage. Roland > OK. Back to the gas mileage problem I'm having. Here is the list of mpg > for each fillup by date. [quoted text clipped - 16 lines] > My driving is mostly highway, 60 mph, slow starts and stops.etc. The > mpg should be higher. you know that gas has a seasonal fluctuation of calorific value don't you? this translates to lower mpg's as calorific value drops for the winter. add to that the fact that the current ethanol formulations reduce calorific value still further and suddenly you think the car's not working right. reality is, the gasoline market's not working right. > I did say "virtually constant" and you missed a significant factor > (for in-tank pumps in the Honda/Rover cars) which is that the fuel is > sucked into the pump without being replaced by air from the outside > thus reducing the absolute air pressure in the tank. You can verify this > by listening for the 'whoosh' of air into the tank when you undo the > tank's filler cap. Intake 'whoosh'? I had the exact opposite experience, couple decades ago, when I used to work as a gas attendant. I went to open the gas cap, the owner of the vehicle is standing right beside me. As soon as I open the tank, the remaining fuel burst's out and totally drenches me in gas. The owner smirks, and says, "oops, I should have warned you about that". Pars > From time to time, the depression is great enough to activate the > ingress of air through the filtered vent used as part of the emission [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > Since the head at the inlet varies by only a few inches, I doubt that > the difference in electrical load is measurable. > dirty but, I don't know. It just doesn't make sense. I had a 2002 Dodge > Caravan with a 4-cylinder engine and I averaged 24 mpg. Now I have this > little compact car with an even smaller 4-cylinder engine and I only > get 8 mpg more? yup. my 98 CX hatch averages around 30. if youre getting 32, thats pretty good for a brand new car. might get better... who knows? I don't think waiting for the pump to click off on it's own is an accurate fill-up method, unless you're using the exact same pump and your able to keep the flow constant. My method is to fill-up until the gas is about to overflow from the nozzle, which makes for easy spillage if you're not paying attention. Also, the filling stations will be switching to winterized gas, which will reduce the fuel economy by about 5%. Are you filling up with premium or regular gas? and which filling station are you using? Personally, I favor Esso for Regular gas and Shell for Premium gas. Pars > No, I actually have slowed down on the highway. Recently I have been > driving 55-60 mph on the highway. I guess the bottom line question I [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > little compact car with an even smaller 4-cylinder engine and I only > get 8 mpg more? My '05 Civic LX coupe with automatic transmission delivers between 23 and 25 mpg in-town driving. Freeway driving will produce low 30's; so I'd say you're doing good 32 mpg. > When I picked up my Honda Civic LX that I just bought on 9/7/2005, it > had a full tank of gas. I drove it over 400 miles, did a fill up, [quoted text clipped - 15 lines] > > Roland -- Tp, -------- __o ----- -\<. -------- __o --- ( )/ ( ) ---- -\<. -------------------- ( )/ ( ) ----------------------------------------- No Lawsuit Ever Fixed A Moron... |
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