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Car Forum / Honda Cars / January 2006Help Me Choose a New Car- Honda,Toyota, or VW?
I am new to this community but it seems like I might be able to get some decent feedback. I'm in the market for a new car. What I'm thinking about for now is a 2004-05 Honda Civic Hybrid, Toyota Matrix, or VW Jetta. I do about 50/50 city and highway driving. But the highway driving I do is mostly long-distances so good gas mileage is a major plus. Basically, I want something that is reliable and will last a long time with as little maintenance as possible. I'm not very car savvy, so I need some help. > I am new to this community but it seems like I might be able to get some > decent feedback. I'm in the market for a new car. What I'm thinking about [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > want something that is reliable and will last a long time with as little > maintenance as possible. I'm not very car savvy, so I need some help. If you want something reliable, then scratch VW off your list. Since you do 50% highway driving, I really don't think you'd be saving much, if at all, in the long run by buying a hybrid. The extra cost to buy a hybrid is not likely to be offset by the savings in refueling costs unless you do A LOT of driving, especially in the city. Therefore, the only logical choices for you (IMO) would be the non-hybrid Civic and the Corolla/Matrix. These should still get very good mileage on the highway. My folks took a trip in their 2004 Corolla (automatic) last fall and it did about 40mpg (yes, those are U.S. gallons). The Civic should get similar figures under similar conditions. > I am new to this community but it seems like I might be able to get some > decent feedback. I'm in the market for a new car. What I'm thinking about [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > want something that is reliable and will last a long time with as little > maintenance as possible. I'm not very car savvy, so I need some help. -------------------------- Stay away from VW if you don't like driving a 'loaner' all the time. On one of our Canadian driving shows they recently admitted they couldn't recommend vW because of serious long-standing electrical issues. Good for them! It's nice to know of a TV show will tell you the truth. Get Consumer Reports and see for yourself. Been there, done that. 'Curly' Corolla or a Civic. both are reliable to the point of being boring. >> I am new to this community but it seems like I might be able to get some >> decent feedback. I'm in the market for a new car. What I'm thinking about [quoted text clipped - 15 lines] > >'Curly' > Corolla or a Civic. both are reliable to the point of being boring. Pretty much. If driving a paid-for car that just works and doesn't break down makes you smile every time you get into it, Corolla or Civic. (Or used Lexus.) Drive each of them extensively, and buy the one you like. You will NOT go wrong. You may decide you like one car better but the other dealer better. If that happens, go with the dealer you like. But check out the service department first. To back up the claims of others here re the superior reliability of Toyota and Honda vs. VW, I strongly recommend perusing the April 2005 issue of Consumer Reports. They survey thousands of readers about the reliability of their cars (over many years and many models) and present the results in an easy to read format. That's what first hooked me on Hondas and Toyotas some 20 years ago. The Hybrids are still not cost justified, overall. So if you buy one, it's your contribution to the environment, but a loss to some charity that could use your donation of several thousand dollars. Consider waiting for the Honda Jazz/Fit to come out in the U.S. within about a year. Supposed to get 50 mpg on a conventional engine, IIRC. > I am new to this community but it seems like I might be able to get some > decent feedback. I'm in the market for a new car. What I'm thinking about [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > want something that is reliable and will last a long time with as little > maintenance as possible. I'm not very car savvy, so I need some help. > The Hybrids are still not cost justified, overall. So if you > buy one, it's your contribution to the environment, but a > loss to some charity that could use your donation of several > thousand dollars. i just like the idea of riding in the carpool lanes alone, which you can do in a prius, in california. > Consider waiting for the Honda Jazz/Fit to come out in the > U.S. within about a year. Supposed to get 50 mpg on a > conventional engine, IIRC. yup. toyota yaris, too. > Elle wrote: > > The Hybrids are still not cost justified, overall. So if you [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > i just like the idea of riding in the carpool lanes alone, which you can > do in a prius, in california. Understood. > > Consider waiting for the Honda Jazz/Fit to come out in the > > U.S. within about a year. Supposed to get 50 mpg on a > > conventional engine, IIRC. > > yup. toyota yaris, too. What's the engine displacement supposed to be for the U.S. Yaris? > What's the engine displacement supposed to be for the U.S. > Yaris? 1.5L, 4-cyl, 106HP http://www.toyota.com/images/vehicles/future/yaris/pressrelease.pdf > Consider waiting for the Honda Jazz/Fit to come out in > the U.S. within about a year. Supposed to get 50 mpg on a > conventional engine, IIRC. "SoCalMike" <Mikein562athotmail@hotmail.com> wrote > > yup. toyota yaris, too. According to the press release, Yaris is only 34/40 mpg. Which is very unimpressive for such a small car. > > What's the engine displacement supposed to be for the U.S. > > Yaris? > > 1.5L, 4-cyl, 106HP http://www.toyota.com/images/vehicles/future/yaris/pressrele ase.pdf > > Consider waiting for the Honda Jazz/Fit to come out in > > the U.S. within about a year. Supposed to get 50 mpg on a [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > According to the press release, Yaris is only 34/40 mpg. Which is very > unimpressive for such a small car. Seems right for an unbroken in 1.5L. The Echo is 1.5 L I believe and gets about that. I thought the Fit/Jazz was dipping down to 1.4 or even 1.3 L in some countries. Thanks for the reference. >> Elle wrote: >>> The Hybrids are still not cost justified, overall. So if [quoted text clipped - 18 lines] > What's the engine displacement supposed to be for the U.S. > Yaris? 1.5, same engine as the scion xA/xB, and echo. in fact, its the echo's replacement. supposedly, the 1.5 has been in use for almost 20 years, in tercels and whatnot. > > The Hybrids are still not cost justified, overall. So if you > > buy one, it's your contribution to the environment, but a [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > i just like the idea of riding in the carpool lanes alone, which you can > do in a prius, in california. And you'll pay $5K or more for the privilege? I think California could be onto something--turn the HOV lanes into toll lanes...obviously, people are willing to pay for the privilege... > I think California could be onto something--turn the HOV lanes into toll > lanes...obviously, people are willing to pay for the privilege... California was not the pioneer. Virginia has allowed hybrids in HOV lanes for a few years... with disastrous results. Virginia is not extending the experiment when it expires July 2006. >> I think California could be onto something--turn the HOV lanes into toll >> lanes...obviously, people are willing to pay for the privilege... > > California was not the pioneer. Virginia has allowed hybrids in HOV > lanes for a few years... with disastrous results. Virginia is not > extending the experiment when it expires July 2006. what were the "disastrous results"? no way to tell a regular civic from a hybrid? > what were the "disastrous results"? Everyone went out and bought hybrids. The HOV lanes in Virginia got congested, making them just as slow as the regular lanes. Hence, there was no incentive to carpool either. Everyone was mad: hybrids, non-hybrids, especially carpoolers. That's why Virginia is ending the experiment when it expires in July this year. Because of Virginia's experience, California decided to cap the number at 75,000 registered hybrids and required 45 mpg to qualify. I still think it's a terrible idea. Think about this: 5 people in a Hummer saves more gas than 5 solo hybrids, but only causes 1/5 of the congestion. > Think about this: 5 people in a Hummer > saves more gas than 5 solo hybrids, but only causes 1/5 of the > congestion. Are you proposing that Hummers be allowed on highways ONLY IF they carry 5 people? Seems like gas prices still aren't high enough for folks to consider car pooling. > Are you proposing that Hummers be allowed on highways ONLY IF they > carry 5 people? This is my idealistic but impractical idea. Make the HOV lane requirement to be something like 60 mpg per person. So if you're in a 30+ mpg car, then you need 2 people. If you're in a large SUV, then you'll need 5 people. =) > Seems like gas prices still aren't high enough for folks to consider > car pooling. Numerous studies have been done on how high gas prices would have to climb before it would actually cause a change in driving habits (such as driving slower on freeways, carpooling). I think I have read that it would have to rise to about $5-6 for the majority of drivers to change their habits. >>> The Hybrids are still not cost justified, overall. So if you >>> buy one, it's your contribution to the environment, but a [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > > And you'll pay $5K or more for the privilege? more like $25k. course, any 2-wheeler is allowed, and thats what ive been doing. for about $20k less. > I think California could be onto something--turn the HOV lanes into toll > lanes...obviously, people are willing to pay for the privilege... people are. this is the state that retards will pay $800/mo for a tahoe that has a cadillac badge. and i dont think just ANY hybrid is allowed into the lanes. so SUV hybrids are still assed out. In article <b79a26aae4003e0d3335ecc735722651@localhost.talkaboutautos.com>, > I'm in the market for a new car. What I'm thinking about > for now is a 2004-05 Honda Civic Hybrid, Toyota Matrix, or VW Jetta. Avoid VW like the plague. Toyotas also are more likely to fail emission tests after you have had them a few years. It seems as if they engineer them closer to the "edge" to maximize performance. Prious <sp> has a critical electrical problem, I have heard. Goes brain dead around 50k miles.... central computer. Yes, VWs are the plague. Have not been good for YEARS (and I currently drive a '65 Beetle, so I am not biased against the brand... just the crappy quality of the more recent cars).  SignatureKWW > In article > <b79a26aae4003e0d3335ecc735722651@localhost.talkaboutautos.com>, [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > > Avoid VW like the plague. > Toyotas also are more likely to fail emission tests after you have had them > a few years. It seems as if they engineer them closer to the "edge" to > maximize performance. I call bullshit on this one. Where is your proof of this? > Prious <sp> has a critical electrical problem, I have heard. Goes brain dead > around 50k miles.... central computer. If you're talking about the sudden shutdown, they issued a recall to apply a fix for that. When I have the time I will dig the information back up. It was a combination of reports on recalls, settlement for Govt lawsuit, and (undocumentable) discussions with various emissions test folks while getting my older cars tested (non-toyota) centering around the trends noticed in higher-emissions from older vehicles.... which, interestingly, fit well with the EPA and recall information I came across. Why didn't I "document it" at the time? Because I never have enjoyed the road feel of Toyotas and thus knew it would be a long time before I would ever consider one. To each his own. I like a firmer, more connected ride. Just like some might go for the old Misubishi electronic shifting (still used in Hyundai's) but it never felt "right" to me. SignatureKWW >> Toyotas also are more likely to fail emission tests after you have had >> them [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > If you're talking about the sudden shutdown, they issued a recall to apply > a fix for that. > I am new to this community but it seems like I might be able to get some > decent feedback. I'm in the market for a new car. What I'm thinking about [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > want something that is reliable and will last a long time with as little > maintenance as possible. I'm not very car savvy, so I need some help. honda or toyota. if you want really good mileage, wait for the toyota yaris- 40mpg. >I am new to this community but it seems like I might be able to get some >decent feedback. I'm in the market for a new car. What I'm thinking about [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] >want something that is reliable and will last a long time with as little >maintenance as possible. I'm not very car savvy, so I need some help. Many will warn you off the V-dub based on reliability. It's hard to go against that given the Consumer Reports results and a lot of word-of-mouth. But frankly, most any car today is pretty darn reliable, even if another might score "all reds" vs another being all "half black circles". Still, if you want the most reliable, it is the Toyota followed by (non-Hybrid) Hondas. Don't know if the hybrids have enough of a record yet. If you decide Matrix, also shop the Pontiac Vibe which is the same car from the same plant with just different body style. Might find it at a better price. They are both a nice combo of utility, reliability and mpg. > Many will warn you off the V-dub based on reliability. It's hard to > go against that given the Consumer Reports results and a lot of > word-of-mouth. But frankly, most any car today is pretty darn > reliable, even if another might score "all reds" vs another being > all "half black circles". The differences in reliability during the first few years may be minimal (although I know a few people with fairly new Crapslers that have had lots of problems with them already). But after, say, 5 years and/or 100,000 miles, Toyota and Honda continue to rank near the top. And I believe the OP said he does a lot of highway miles, so that is important. > Many will warn you off the V-dub based on reliability. It's hard to > go against that given the Consumer Reports results and a lot of > word-of-mouth. But frankly, most any car today is pretty darn > reliable, Not the VWs. Just ask any owner. >> Many will warn you off the V-dub based on reliability. It's hard to >> go against that given the Consumer Reports results and a lot of [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > > Just ask any owner. any ex-owner, ya mean :) when i was a watercooled vdubophile, there were a lot of people with high mileage cars. they were extremely pampered, though. 3000 mile oil changes with 20w50, etc. >If you decide Matrix, also shop the Pontiac Vibe which is the same >car from the same plant with just different body style. Might find >it at a better price. They are both a nice combo of utility, >reliability and mpg. They are essentially the same car, but made in different plants (Matrix in Canada, Vibe in the US). The Matrix / Vibe is something like a Corolla hatchback / wagon. Signature------------------------------------------------------------------------ Timothy J. Lee Unsolicited bulk or commercial email is not welcome. No warranty of any kind is provided with this message. > If you decide Matrix, also shop the Pontiac Vibe which is the same > car from the same plant with just different body style. surprisingly enough, last time i checked they were built in 2 different plants. vibe- NUMMI, fremont, california (same plant as tacoma) matrix- canada >> If you decide Matrix, also shop the Pontiac Vibe which is the same >> car from the same plant with just different body style. [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] >vibe- NUMMI, fremont, california (same plant as tacoma) >matrix- canada I stand corrected by both you and Timothy J Lee. It isn't like the old Corolla/Prism where they were both made in the Nummi (Fremont, CA) plant. But I do think they both (Matrix/Vibe) have been at/near the tops of the CR reliability charts. Totally agree with the extended drive comment from another poster. Any yeah, even with my original comments, I'm not partial to a VW, especially in its first year. How many of you really like the new dash layout and steering wheel in the Civic? I can't stand either. > surprisingly enough, last time i checked they were built in 2 different > plants. > > vibe- NUMMI, fremont, california (same plant as tacoma) > matrix- canada And the Corolla is built at both of these plants. i totally agree with everyone about VW's. i test drove one a few weeks ago. biggest POS i ever had driven. Signatureharrymay http://www.automotiveforums.com > I am new to this community but it seems like I might be able to get some > decent feedback. I'm in the market for a new car. What I'm thinking about [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > want something that is reliable and will last a long time with as little > maintenance as possible. I'm not very car savvy, so I need some help. As others have suggested the Honda Civic or Toyota Corolla/Matix are probably your best bets. However, check with your insurance agent regarding premiums. We found it significantly less expensive to insure a Honda Accord or Toyota Camry than the smaller cars. For us the total cost of ownership worked out lower for the larger Accord or Camry (nearly new) than for the smaller Civic or Corolla (new car purchase). Before you buy any car, be sure to take long test drives on the roads and at the speeds you typically drive. You may find that one car has some annoying trait (too noisy, too rough a ride, lousy radio) as compared to a comparable car. A test drive at night is also helpful. www.edmunds.com has lots of useful info. for car buyers. Good luck. Good point R.E. extensive driving! Also extensively drive the one they assign to you... not just the demo car. We drove one new car years ago and the AC seemed to be acting oddly. Too cold, and I noticed that the compressor sounded a bit weird. They checked it and immediately got another car from their storage lot (across town)... seems somebody had WAY overpressurized the AC during "prep". Another vehicle purchase we made, one of the vehicles seemed just a little weird when it went slowly over speedbumps at an angle. The subsequent rocking was not symetrical between one direction and the other. We liked the color but went with a different one instead ... this one did not have that suspension anomaly and it has lasted great at 159k miles and still going. (January special on previous model year "new" cars (less than 50 miles on any of them)... only 4 left.) SignatureKWW >> I am new to this community but it seems like I might be able to get some >> decent feedback. I'm in the market for a new car. What I'm thinking about [quoted text clipped - 18 lines] > > Good luck. |
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