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Car Forum / Honda Cars / June 2006Ping: Elle, Michael, Teggar...
On my "antique" '83 Honda Civic 1300 FE, I can find no reference on changing the timing belt other than an "inspection" at 60K (miles). I have the factory manual and owner's manual. The current belt is new but would I be correct to assume that 60K is a good time to change it out? BTW, I'm still driving it (in shakedown mode) and so far, all seems to be working after a nearly two year rehab effort... JT From the book side, neither the UK site's factory service manuals, Chilton's, nor Autozone.com's free online manuals specify an interval for the timing belt. The following say 60k miles for your Civic: www.gates.com and http://www.motorwatch.com/automotivebible/auto_motive_bible/TimingBelts.pdf These two site says it's the same for similarly aged Preludes and Accords. Wasn't 60k miles the standard for many makes of vehicles of this era? The timing belt sells for only $21 at Majestic. Perhaps it's a flimsier design appropriate for a smaller engine, but its fatigue life is shorter as a result? I suppose there's a good mechanical explanation for why the mileage interval is so short and why there's no time interval. I have been lurking at another Honda forum lately: http://www.honda-tech.com/ . If you want more of an explanation, you might register there and ask. I think it's free. Your project sounds like fun. Me, I'm happy having just installed three new bushings in the (older, more rusted) rear control arm of my 91 Civic within 1.5 hours (hurrah!). > On my "antique" '83 Honda Civic 1300 FE, I can find no > reference on [quoted text clipped - 11 lines] > > JT > From the book side, neither the UK site's factory service > manuals, Chilton's, nor Autozone.com's free online manuals > specify an interval for the timing belt. Thanks for confirming this. At my point in life, I have been known to overlook (forget) things. I ain't goin' nutz after all! > The following say 60k miles for your Civic: > www.gates.com [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > Wasn't 60k miles the standard for many makes of vehicles of > this era? I believe it is. Besides, it's about the same time that the water pumps tend to go belly up. > The timing belt sells for only $21 at Majestic. Perhaps it's > a flimsier design appropriate for a smaller engine, but its > fatigue life is shorter as a result? Good question but no answer from here... > I suppose there's a good mechanical explanation for why the > mileage interval is so short and why there's no time [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > installed three new bushings in the (older, more rusted) > rear control arm of my 91 Civic within 1.5 hours (hurrah!). It was a languishing project until last fall when gas prices pushed the $3 level after Katrina. The engine had already been swapped and all that remained was hooking all the stuff up. I got a price of $250 (a bargain) from a local independent shop to do that but when no progress was being made after the car being there for a couple of months, I took the task on my own. I am now driving the car on a regular basis and it's getting 30+ mpg at present. I am sure that some of the emissions stuff isn't working properly and probably a few hoses are hooked up wrong. But sooner or later, I nail down as much as I can and proudly be giving every gas station that I pass the single finger salute! I have about a grand (including the cost of the car + parts car) into this and I like the relatively simplicity compared to today's vehicles. Besides, it has neat racing side trim that was possibly installed by the original dealer here in town and the original radio still works fine... <G> JT > > On my "antique" '83 Honda Civic 1300 FE, I can find no > > reference on [quoted text clipped - 11 lines] > > > > JT > It was a languishing project until last fall when gas > prices pushed the [quoted text clipped - 28 lines] > > <G> Care to share a picture? Tegger might be willing to put it up at his site, or I'll throw it up at my site for a temporary period. > > It was a languishing project until last fall when gas > > prices pushed the [quoted text clipped - 32 lines] > up at his site, or I'll throw it up at my site for a > temporary period. Sure, I'll get a couple to you in the next day or so. They'll be small file size JPEGs. JT "Grumpy AuContraire" <Grumpster@GrumpyvilleNOT.com> wrote Elle >> Care to share a picture? Tegger might be willing to put >> it [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > They'll be small > file size JPEGs. Great! I'll make it the "Honda of the Month" at my site and post some of the history you gave on it. I love the look of those older Civics. :-) > "Grumpy AuContraire" <Grumpster@GrumpyvilleNOT.com> wrote > Elle [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > post some of the history you gave on it. I love the look of > those older Civics. :-) I have to take new pictures as I have re-installed the original grill (which I found under the folded down rear seat). The paint is basically shot, the seats need to be re-done or replaced, (I know where there's a decent pair of Accord buckets) but the body is basically rust free. I'll write a brief history on how I acquired the car as well. Look for it this evening. JT > I have to take new pictures as I have re-installed the > original grill [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > well. Look for > it this evening. Great. I'll look for it and may have the photos and your history up at my Honda web site by Friday. > I'll write a brief history on how I acquired the car as > well. Look for > it this evening. JT's ride, by permission: http://home.earthlink.net/~honda.lioness/id17.html > > I'll write a brief history on how I acquired the car as > > well. Look for [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > > http://home.earthlink.net/~honda.lioness/id17.html Gee, it don't look to bad at all... Thanks Elle! JT > > > I'll write a brief history on how I acquired the car as > > > well. Look for [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > > JT That's a cool car - I've always wanted a 1st- or 2nd-gen Civic. Closest I've come was a 1st-gen Accord I bought in 1993 for $400 as a short-term replacement for my wife's VW Rabbit after someone ran a red light and broadsided her. Wish I still had that car - it was even painted that particular shade of light green that was common on a lot of 1st-gen Hondas. Dave > > > > I'll write a brief history on how I acquired the car as > > > > well. Look for [quoted text clipped - 16 lines] > > Dave First and second generation Civics are bringing good money on ebay. The last "good running" 2nd generation brought over $3K. I've seen 1st gen Civics (depending on mileage/condition) bring as much as $5K. The advantage with my car is that it is a Texas rust free body. Not one bolt was frozen... JT "Dave Garrett" <dave@compassnet.com> wrote about JT's 83 Civic, pictured at >> > http://home.earthlink.net/~honda.lioness/id17.html > That's a cool car - I've always wanted a 1st- or 2nd-gen > Civic. Closest [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > of 1st-gen > Hondas. I was looking for the timing belt replacement interval for JT's ( = Grumpy's) 83 Civic at the American Honda owner's link site. I never found the interval, but when the site asked for the color of the 83 Honda, it listed two: blue and red. This cracked me up. These Civics remind me of the snazzy looking new Coopers, which sell for a lot more than the $200-minus JT paid for his 83 Civic. ;-) >> From the book side, neither the UK site's factory service >> manuals, Chilton's, nor Autozone.com's free online manuals >> specify an interval for the timing belt. > > Thanks for confirming this. At my point in life, I have been known to > overlook (forget) things. I ain't goin' nutz after all! Your owner's manual specifies the timing belt change interval, as do all factory shop manuals. It is in the same maintenance table as all other maintenance items. That aftermarket sources do not specify a change interval speaks more to the quality (or lack thereof) of those sources than anything else.  SignatureTeGGeR® The Unofficial Honda/Acura FAQ www.tegger.com/hondafaq/ "TeGGeR®" <tegger@tegger.c0m> wrote Re the timing belt change interval for a 1.3L 1983 Civic-- > Your owner's manual specifies the timing belt change > interval, as do all > factory shop manuals. It is in the same maintenance table > as all other > maintenance items. Would you please find the page in the UK site's 1984-87 Civic factory shop manual that specifies the timing belt change interval? I don't see it here http://media.honda.co.uk/car/owner/media/manuals/WorkshopManualCivic84-87/62sb20 0/4-5.pdf or here http://media.honda.co.uk/car/owner/media/manuals/WorkshopManualCivic84-87/62sb20 0/4-7.pdf > "TeGGeR®" <tegger@tegger.c0m> wrote > Re the timing belt change interval for a 1.3L 1983 Civic-- [quoted text clipped - 14 lines] > > http://media.honda.co.uk/car/owner/media/manuals/WorkshopManualCivic84-87/62sb20 0/4-7.pdf Thanks for the backup Elle. I might be old, but I ain't senile yet.. JT (Whose neighbors might disagree on occasion..) > "TeGGeR®" <tegger@tegger.c0m> wrote > Re the timing belt change interval for a 1.3L 1983 Civic-- [quoted text clipped - 11 lines] > http://media.honda.co.uk/car/owner/media/manuals/WorkshopManualCivic84- > 87/62sb200/4-5.pdf Huh. Don't that beat all. You're right. Guess they started listing that somewhere between '87 and '90. SignatureTeGGeR® The Unofficial Honda/Acura FAQ www.tegger.com/hondafaq/ > >> From the book side, neither the UK site's factory service > >> manuals, Chilton's, nor Autozone.com's free online manuals [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] > -- > TeGGeR® I challenge you find *any* reference to timing belts in the 1983 Owner's Manual... JT (I ain't totally incapacitated yet..) >> >> From the book side, neither the UK site's factory service >> >> manuals, Chilton's, nor Autozone.com's free online manuals [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] > I challenge you find *any* reference to timing belts in the 1983 > Owner's Manual... Challenge not taken. Why on earth would Honda NOT include something like that? Especially in a day ('83) when people were les sused to fabric belts than they are now? SignatureTeGGeR® The Unofficial Honda/Acura FAQ www.tegger.com/hondafaq/ > The following say 60k miles for your Civic: > www.gates.com [quoted text clipped - 13 lines] > mileage interval is so short and why there's no time > interval. Number 1, Gates sells belts. Gee, do you think they might have a vested interest here? And number 2, the belt change interval has gone up over the years mostly because of advances in the belt material and construction. Nothing more. > On my "antique" '83 Honda Civic 1300 FE, I can find no reference on > changing the timing belt other than an "inspection" at 60K (miles). I [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > BTW, I'm still driving it (in shakedown mode) and so far, all seems to > be working after a nearly two year rehab effort... 60K was probably for the original belt. New OEM belts are much better made than those in 1983, and you can likely go by the modern 7yr/105K limit (provided the belt you buy is actually new and isn't just NOS). SignatureTeGGeR® The Unofficial Honda/Acura FAQ www.tegger.com/hondafaq/ On 6/6/06 7:46 PM, in article Xns97DAD38206597tegger@207.14.116.130, >> On my "antique" '83 Honda Civic 1300 FE, I can find no reference on >> changing the timing belt other than an "inspection" at 60K (miles). I [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > than those in 1983, and you can likely go by the modern 7yr/105K limit > (provided the belt you buy is actually new and isn't just NOS). The newer belt design is part of the reason they can go longer than 60k. The old timing belts have squared off teeth. The newer ones with longer change intervals are rounded off. I suspect that a new OEM belt for that car is still only good for 60k because of the teeth. > On 6/6/06 7:46 PM, in article Xns97DAD38206597tegger@207.14.116.130, > [quoted text clipped - 16 lines] > change intervals are rounded off. I suspect that a new OEM belt for that > car is still only good for 60k because of the teeth. I suspect that you are correct. JT >> The newer belt design is part of the reason they can go longer than >> 60k. The old timing belts have squared off teeth. The newer ones [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > > I suspect that you are correct. As do I. Earlier I hadn't thought of tooth design, but it makes a lot of sense. My own Integra has the rounded tooth design and originally had a 6yr/90K belt change interval. This has increased to 7/105 on account of belt improvements. I wonder if it would be possible on your '83 to retrofit (from the wreckers) rounded tooth pulleys from a later version of your motor and thus take advantage of extended belt life? SignatureTeGGeR® The Unofficial Honda/Acura FAQ www.tegger.com/hondafaq/ > >> The newer belt design is part of the reason they can go longer than > >> 60k. The old timing belts have squared off teeth. The newer ones [quoted text clipped - 17 lines] > -- > TeGGeR® It would be much more of a project than I wish to tackle. Since waterpump life is about the same as a belt change, I'll just bite the bullet and do it that way. Besides, the car will travel well less than 10K per year at the rate gas prices are rising... My engine is a CVCC and didn't they go away in '84? My current concern is the cracked boots on the lower ball joints. The joints are fine but I'm trying to find some sort of generic rubber to protect the joint as I'll bet that they are good for at least another 50K (miles). All other lower chassis rubber seems to be OK. JT |
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